Skip to comments.Pleas for help come too late as half-ton man dies in Mexico
Posted on 10/08/2008 6:11:41 AM PDT by South Hawthorne
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Have you got some kind of reference for this, somewhere on the web?
I’ve taken care of patients that were 600+ pounds, and in the hospital they lost weight on 1800 cal diets. Of course, physical therapy took place twice a day, consisting of activities such as getting up into a chair, rolling over in bed, passive/active movement of legs. Most of the patients hated p.t. with a passion.
To make a statement like, “You are dead wrong” just seems to me to be rather extreme, and I’d like to have some sound theory/research to back that up.
The only way to loose fat is to turn it into muscle and/or feed muscle. Exercise. Every bit counts.
About 4 years ago, I lost about 80 lbs. I now have a BMI of 23...but...keeping the weight off is literally hell on earth. I **must** weight and measure every crumb. Literally! Even one small Oreo cookie over my allotted 1,200 calories a day is enough to put on weight the very next day. This regimen also includes vigorous mountain biking and skiing 5 times a week.
Every day I wake up and the first thing I thing about is how hungry I am, how hungry I will be, and how much work and **determination** it will take just to get through the next 24 hours. I dread family and social events because of the food involved.
Some weeks ago I went to our local medical school library and did some research on hunger and weight loss. The only thing that works is surgery. Those having surgery have the best chance of losing weight and keeping it off.
By the way, there is a new operation called a vagotomy, that snips the vagus nerve as it exits the stomach. It is a 20 minute laporoscopy operation and the patients leave the hospital an hour after the operation and go back to work the next day. Unfortunately, I was not able to find any papers published by the surgeons doing this operation and only read about in the popular press. The surgeons are located in San Francisco and Pittsburgh.
Anyway...Here it is morning,..and I have another day of facing constant hunger and only 1,200 calories to feed it. I **know** from experience that any more than that and I will gain weight. There are more than 15 hunger hormones that drive weight gain, metabolism, and hunger and it is **very** hard to trick Mother Nature.
If there is food in heaven, I will turn around and go to hell. Hell could not be worse.
I have visions of a conveyor belt bring food non-stop to Michael Moore. "Moore, Moore, Moore, I need Moore!" He would shout.
I am betting you are not fat.
By the way, how many of these patients maintained their weight loss 10 later?
Please read post #43.
Count carbs not calories. If you are restricting your 600lb patients to 1800 calories like you say, how do you know if they are getting enough carbs if the diet isn't carefully calculated to ensure they do?
If they aren't getting enough carbs, they won't loose weight even if you cut "calories" to 1000. Calories can be anything. pure fat if you like.
If they don't get enough carbs, their livers will just make sugar from protein.
Wow, you have my sympathy.
It doesn’t completely support what Nathan said, but formerly fat people have a much harder time staying at a normal weight than normal weight people. Not only do their metabolisms plummet, but they are literally driven insane by their bodies. http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/05/08/healthscience/snfat.php?page=1
Unfortunately, the only way nonsurgical, reliable way to get thin is to not to get fat.
Sorry if that was depressing, but at least you know you’re not a freak...
When the liver makes sugar, it always makes more than the body needs. The extra insulin this triggers the pancreas to make, stores this extra sugar as fat.
Then, next time their sugar gets too low (from a diet too low in carbs lets say) this again triggers the liver to make sugar from protein, which is always too much, and again the pancreas makes more insulin to compensate, storing the excess sugar as fat.
The fat keeps building up, even on a 1000 calorie diet.
Normally you'd eat say, a ham sandwich 30g carbs, a bowl of vegetable soup-15 carbs, a salad- 0 carbs (except for what's in the dressing), a piece of fruit- 15 g carbs.
That's 60 g total carbs, a little lean but enough if you sit at a desk.
By the way, I was normally thin ( BMI 21 to 23) until I was in thirties, and then gradually gained weight. It wasn't until I was forty that I was diagnosed as having hypothyroidism ( very common in middle aged women). Of course the thyroid is under control but ever since then hunger and fat has been a daily fight.
Unfortunately, you are correct. The best defense against obesity is never to become fat. I don't know why doctors don't do thyroid testing routinely on all patients. It's not an expensive test.
Now, lets compare that to a say, a big mac,-44g carbs, medium fry-16g carbs, a small coke, 39 g carbs =99g carbs. That’s 35g too much, and will drive your blood sugar up. You pancreas will produce more insulin, which works to reduce blood sugar to a normal level, storing the rest as fat.
s it up further, requiring insulin to get it back down.
Thank you, Nathan.
Perhaps adjusting my diet somewhat will help with this daily, constant, painful hunger.
By the way, I eat 6 meals a day. It seems to help more than eating only 3 times a day. I once tried dividing the 1,200 calories into hourly portions but that was worse than eating 6 times a day.
oops,- “ for a type one diabetic, sugar levels are cumulative, requiring insulin to get it back down
Wow, good for you!
Maybe the processed American food diet has an effect on all these hunger hormones? Plus, if you are cynical enough, it’s not impossible to rationalize that it would be in a food producer’s advantage to keep up hunger levels.
If you have a glucose meter it will help you figure out your carbs to lifetyle easier. generally you want to keep your blood sugar between 4.0-7.0 before meals, and between 5.0-10.0 two hours after meals. But 55-60g carbs per meal is about average. Just eat balanced meals, count the carbs. If you are eying up that ice cream, cut carbs somewhere else. (just don't make a habit of eating only ice cream, LoL! )
But eating only salads won't do you much good either. No carbs! That will make your liver produce the blood sugars you need instead, which always makes too much--- blah blah blah. Just try get your carbs from healthier sources, starchy foods like rice, potatoes, whole wheat breads, cereals, legumes, etc. without adding fats to it.
Very interesting. FWIW, I had an ED for over a decade and had to go through a lot of therapy to learn how to eat properly. All ED types struggle with obsession on food and eat very junky diets, even anorexics.
After going through a lot of therapy to stop thinking about food, I eat when I’m hungry, and my body pretty much asks for lean proteins and complex carbs, few diet foods and few junk foods. No salads as a meal but no M&Ms either. Good to know you confirm this observation.
My therapist was a true bulimic though. She would steal food and binge on it constantly. For her, the only thing that worked was going on the Grey sheet diet (which is NO carbs). Different folks, different strokes.