No So Fast! How about that citizenship “President-elect” Obama?

The Independent View ^ | November 15, 2008 | By Matthew Weaver

[library user]

A new challenge to Senator Barack Obama’s citizenship was filed November 12th in California demanding that the court stop certification of the election results until the state’s secretary of state can ascertain from Senator Obama his legal qualification to be a candidate for President.  This 18 page petition is a quick read.  It offers a good summary of what is at stake and the questions that surround Senator Obama’s citizenship.

A few points:

• Petitioners Ambassador Dr. Alan Keyes, Dr. Wiley S. Drake, Sr., and Markham Robinson, establish their standing to file the petition as members of the American Independent Party, for which Drs. Keyes and Drake were presidential and vice-presidential candidates on California’s ballot, respectfully.  (This is a technical point that doomed some other lawsuits.)
  
  
• Petitioners note that Senator Obama has not provided proof of his citizenship eligibility despite repeated requests during the primary and general election campaigns.
  
  
• Petitioners note that action in at least 10 states is underway challenging Senator Obama’s eligibility.
   
• Petitioners note that the 2007 birth certificate offered by Senator Obama is of questionable credibility for several reasons, including that it is a copy of suspect authenticity and that it does not detail actual birth location.
  
  
• Petitioners note that the only person claiming witness to Senator Obama’s birth is his own paternal grandmother who claims he was actually born in Kenya, then the British East African Protectorate of Zanzibar.  Other records and recollections of family members suggest either Queens Hospital or Kapiolani Hospital in Hawaii.  The disclosed Registry of Live Birth is a short-form of the birth certificate that does not state whether Obama was born in Hawaii or that his birth was subsequently registered there within the year following birth as then allowed by state law.
   
• Petitioners note that around 1967, Senator Obama moved to Indonesia with his mother and new stepfather.  Records indicate that once in Indonesia he adopted his stepfather’s name and citizenship.  Since dual citizenship was not allowed by Indonesian law, and U.S. law and treaty obligations required respect of this, Mrs. Obama-Soetoro had to relinquish her minor son’s U.S. citizenship.  Elsewhere, they note that if he later recovered it, and no records apparently substantiate this, it would by law be as a “naturalized” citizen, not a “natural born” and, thus, ineligible for the office of President under the Constitution.
  
  
• Petitioners also note that in 1961 what is now known as Kenya was then the British Protectorate of Zanzibar which, if he was born there as his paternal grandmother claims, he would be a British citizen based on his father’s citizenship.
   
• Petitioners also note that in 1981 Senator Obama traveled to Pakistan, which was then banned by the U.S.  Since he could not legally travel with a U.S. passport, they question whether he used  one of his other passports:  Indonesian, Kenyan, or British.  (Interesting point is that the petitioners state affirmatively that he had other passports.)

I am curious to see how this case fares in the courts.  The question of Senator Obama’s citizenship and constitutional eligibility have never been settled.  In fact, Senator Obama has resisted at every step to release his birth certificate and other relevant records that would resolve this matter.  That he has fought this suggests the information is at least embarrassing, if not disqualifying.

On August 14, 2008, I wrote a detailed article, What is Obama’s Citizenship?, where I explored some of the questions about Senator Obama’s citizenship.  I asked eight questions (seven pertinent to this discussion) that are still substantially unanswered today:

1. Are you now a U.S. citizen?
    
2. Have you ever held as a youth or adult, citizenship in another country?
    
3. Did you ever possess or travel using, at least in part, the passport of another country?  (E.g., while in Indonesia, visiting Pakistan, Kenya)
   
   
4. Did you renounce any foreign citizenship, and when, and do you now hold solely U.S. citizenship today?
    
5. Can you confirm or deny your name change as a youth from Barack Hussein Obama II to Barry Soetoro when you were adopted by your step-father?
    
6. Did you legally reclaim your birth name?  When and how?
    
7. Why did you not list your adopted name Barry Soetoro on any forms associated with your legal profession or others that ask for any other names you have ever used?  Have you now or will you update these records?

In regards to questions 1-4, Senator Obama’s own Web site says he was, through his father, a British citizen and that this British/Kenya citizenship “automatically expired August 4, 1982.”  That it “expired” doesn’t explain if he had passports and used them, nor does it address his potential Indonesian citizenship or how these were reconciled with his U.S. citizenship, especially where laws and treaties prohibited dual citizenship.

So, when will we see proof that Senator Obama is or is not a constitutionally eligible citizen?  Before or after he takes office?  As Keyes et al note, the latter will cause “irreparable harm in that an usurper will be sitting as the President of the United States, and none of the treaties, laws, or executive orders signed by him will be valid or legal.”

[BenLurkin]

bttt

[mountainlion]

The rats are such liars and Hippocrates. Kerry has not released his military papers to the public but he sure made a big deal of Bush's military papers. Clinton never released his medical papers. John McCain released 1000 pages of medical which was more than BO released. With the rats in power don't expect any law to be used against them.

[Guenevere]

I still want to know...

..although you should expect some naysayers to show up (yes, right here on FR) ...

..claiming it's irrelevant or a moot point.

Regardless, some of us still care about the Constitution.

[RepublitarianRoger2]

It's so bizarre to me that this guy even got to the point of actually being elected President of the United States of America, for crying out loud, without having to provide 100% verifiable proof of citizenship!

Shouldn't that be one of the very first things that a person should need to absolutely provide (and when I say absolutely, I mean without a single shadow of a doubt) before he is even eligible to be put up as a candidate at all?

Some screening process we have. Sheesh.

[hosepipe]

Hmmmm.... is America too corrupt to care?...

[beezdotcom]

Given that Keyes is involved, this starts to move this issue away from the kook fringe (somewhat).

(And, it would be fitting if Keyes were able to make something happen here, given his dismal attempt to run against 0bama in Illinois is one of many issues that let 0bama get this far in the first place.)

[JudgemAll]

This could be a trap mean to seal his righteousness, a sort of minireichtag for fairness doctrine.

That being said, he is an emotional betrayer and alien of America and unfit for Presidency. It’s a good direction of the questions.

His terrorist friends like Bill Ayers should not be parading around freely like this without citizens arrest. Free hand outs and perverted gratuitous communist terrorism is the issue, not guns of self employment and self government.

[FatherofFive]

THIS IS ABSOLUTLEY AMAZING NEWS! I’M SURE THE MSM WILL SEND HUNDREDS OF REPORTERS TO COVER THIS STORY! /s

[TLI]

He is The One.

Thou shalt not question thine The One.

He is The One He has been waiting for.

Thou must go forth and chant O-Ba-Ma and blasphime no more.

[Just mythoughts]

I can't wait until some Bill (I am god) Riley type, asks Biden if he has seen Bama’s real hidden birth certificate.... Or even that Axelrod guy that ran his campaign... he has to know the citizenship status. Wonder what Raham’s reaction would be if he were asked if he had personally seen the hidden birth certificate.... Talk about people coming unhinged... I would make certain Raham does not get asked this at a dinner table with steak knives as part of the place setting.

And also ask that former financier now policy wonk $ORO$ who bought a paid for this office of president.....

[GeorgiaDawg32]

forget it..they’re off trying to figure out if Sarah Palin didn’t return a skirt she didn’t ask for that was paid for by the RNC..THAT to THEM is news..

[moondoggie]

He may be "legal" and all of this may not be a disqualifier, but, to my knowledge, every other person running for President has had to provide a birth certificate.

We have a RIGHT to see his, IMO.

[SatinDoll]

A trap? I think not.

There are now 17 lawsuits in 12 states contending that Barack Obama must provide evidence that he is a natural born citizen of this nation.

He, Barack Obama, and the Democratic Party, have retained 3 law firms to dispute the issue. This seems excessive if he has nothing to hide or fear.

This situation could be solved with the presentation of his Hawaiian birth certificate, called a Certificate of Live Birth. Most likely he doesn’t have one of these.

However up until 1972 a baby born in a foreign nation could be registered in Hawaii using a document called a Certification of Live Birth, which is NOT a birth certificate. Most likely, Barack Obama has one of these.

Phillip Berg supposedly has Stanley Anne Dunham’s medical records (he couldn’t get her son’s, Barack Obama’s, records). Dunham never gave birth within the United States. She delivered a son, 1961, in Mombassa, Kenya, and a daughter, 1970, in Djakarta, Indonesia.

I just don’t understand why upholding the Constitution is so damn difficult nowadays!

[newheart]

I am convinced that this needs to be pursued as far as it can be. But I have to confess there is something that makes me nervous about this. Two words: President Biden.

The irony is astonishing that, potentially, a sitting president might have to step down over falsely representing his provenance, only be replaced by a plagiarist.

[Pravious]

“Given that Keyes is involved, this starts to move this issue away from the kook fringe (somewhat).”

Well, the key is that our lovely court system ruled that we-the-sheeple do not have the legal right to question the citizenship of a candidate. However, as someone on the ballot (at least in California), that would presumably give Keyes greater standing to argue the point.

Good luck to him.

If Obama has nothing to hide, why not just provide the proof and be done with it (unless he’s so arrogant he just feels insulted that his word should even be questioned... well, actually that probably IS the answer).

[ritewingwarrior]

Why would Biden be President if the votes for Obama are invalidated then McCain won right?
While this case should be pushed through immediately it wont be, liberal judges will say its immaterial.

[They'reGone2000]

Nothing to see here....please move along.

[ridesthemiles]

Some screening process we have. Sheesh.”

Screening was the responsibility of the DNC, as I have ascertained.

They either didn’t do a thing or the group at the top- Howard Dean, etc, knew his status all along.

They all have STONEWALLED this issue, which tells me more and more that he is NOT a qualified candidate.

[bronxboy]

This is a non-starter folks. It makes Republicans look like idiots. If there was anything to find, Hillary would be president.

[cripplecreek]

It makes Republicans look like idiots.

Then why aren't the democrats and media using it?

[missnry]

... So, when will we see proof that Senator Obama is or is not a constitutionally eligible citizen? ...

The fact that Americans are not up in arms about Obama not producing this most basic document is alarming. I even sent letters to both my Senators asking them why Obama has not produced his birth certificate. For the first time in all my correspondence with a congressman I have received NO RESPONSE from them. That is unheard of. Something is absolutely wrong about this.

[Allegra]

They all have STONEWALLED this issue, which tells me more and more that he is NOT a qualified candidate.

Yes, I've pretty much stayed out of all of this up to now, but the more requests that are made for that birth certificate with no response, the more suspicious it appears.

Anyone who is a natural-born U.S. citizen should have no trouble producing a copy of their COLB.

[RepublitarianRoger2]

That’s part of the problem. The group that is fronting the candidate should not be the one screening him. It’s like having a corrupt corporation launch an internal investigation into allegations of its own corruption.

[Arkinsaw]

..claiming it's irrelevant or a moot point.

How about claiming its an utter waste of time?

You think that Alan Keyes is going to prevent the President-elect of the United States from taking office? He can't even get himself into a debate when he runs for President.

You folks seem to be under the impression that the court system is favorable to conservative or Republican arguments. It is not.

Your own party people are not even going to be in favor of going down this road.

Everyone is free to file whatever lawsuits they wish and avail themselves of the court to make a point. I am cool with that.

But anyone who actually expects these cases to proceed, and who actually expects Obama to be prevented from taking office is going to be sorely disappointed. Just as disappointed as those who were sure Clinton was going to be convicted by the Senate. Just as disappointed as those who were absolutely sure the polls were all wrong. There is not going to be any Merry Fitzmas or magic wand.

I am cool with it as long as it doesn't distract from, or harm, the recapture of the Republican Party, its reconstruction, and victory at the ballot box in two years.

Victory at the ballot box in two years is the actual solution to the problem that you can believe in. Going to the courts may be interesting, but is not going to actually change things.

[jetson]

The citizens of this country that still believe in the Constitution need to ban together and start a nation wide protest ( with the aide of a lawyer) to not comply with laws. We need to draw attention to the fact we are becoming a country with no laws. It would be a sacrifice on the part of the protester but we have to weigh the consequence of what we are becoming. Examples would be to not comply with the courts, the IRS, the DMV or any form of law enforcement. Do not comply on the grounds that there are no laws in this country and if there were why are there illegal aliens taking our jobs, why is Barak Obama president without showing he is a citizen as lay ed out by the constitution, how could John Kerry run for president being he acted against our government when he was a military officer,why aren't politicians and big businessmen jailed for committing obvious crimes and on and on. When millions of cases like this hit the news the government would have to act. ( hopefully)

[ridesthemiles]

(And, it would be fitting if Keyes were able to make something happen here, given his dismal attempt to run against 0bama in Illinois is one of many issues that let 0bama get this far in the first place.)”

When the Supremes declare that NObama is not eligible, then that means that he was also not eligible to even be the Senator from Illinois.

Wonder if that is why he answered PRESENT so often on voting?
The issues/laws where he actually voted yes or no might be ones that were overwhelming in one direction of the other, thus his vote would not be a swing vote.
I have never tried to find that data, and am not good at searching.

Since he is ONLY President-elect- what right does he have to be already making a “weekly” radio address?

The Media just cannot carry his water enough, can they???

[Arkinsaw]

I just don’t understand why upholding the Constitution is so damn difficult nowadays!

Nowadays?

The system has not shared our view of the Constitution in at least a century. One should not be surprised that it won't on this issue either.

[newheart]

Why would Biden be President if the votes for Obama are invalidated then McCain won right? While this case should be pushed through immediately it wont be, liberal judges will say its immaterial.

I think you have answered your own question. The court system can delay this till after the inauguration, after which, I would expect that the succession clause of the constitution would apply, making Biden president.

[Arkinsaw]

When the Supremes declare that NObama is not eligible, then that means that he was also not eligible to even be the Senator from Illinois.

Do you actually believe that the US judicial system is going to end up declaring Obama ineligible? What odds do you give it?

I give it zero.

[cripplecreek]

Victory at the ballot box in two years is the actual solution to the problem that you can believe in.<

Pretty much the attitude the GOP took toward ACORN over the last several years. That worked out well didn't it?

[TruthWillWin]

Non-starter? A lot of noise on this and it’s getting louder. A simple BC produced by Obama would make this go away, why does he refuse to do this?

[hamburglar]

>>>I am convinced that this needs to be pursued as far as it can be. But I have to confess there is something that makes me nervous about this. Two words: President Biden. <<<<<

Yes Bidens a Liberal and a jerk, but at least hes not a MARXIST/Socialist!

[Charles Martel]

It makes Republicans look like idiots.

****

Then why aren't the democrats and media using it?

That's a very good observation. Ordinarily, the media would jump on an issue like this in a heartbeat, if it meant a chance to ridicule Republicans. Their silence speaks volumes.

[Arkinsaw]

Pretty much the attitude the GOP took toward ACORN over the last several years. That worked out well didn't it?

If McCain, and the party, had come out against the bailout like 90% of the American people, he would be President-elect today. By a landslide that no double-voting in Philly would have been able to effect.

The courts are simply not going to declare Obama ineligible. I suspect that you could carry a wheelbarrow full of Kenyan citizenship documents up there and that the courts would turn a blind eye. We do not own the court system.

People are welcome to file suit to make a point. But its a fool's game to actual expect an outcome where Obama is not inaugurated. Not going to happen.

It's also a bad idea to sit around hoping for unicorns when there are only two years to retake a party, repair it, and win some seats. That is route to actually minimizing Obama.

[cripplecreek]

That's a very good observation. Ordinarily, the media would jump on an issue like this in a heartbeat, if it meant a chance to ridicule Republicans. Their silence speaks volumes.

The democrats have a long history of wanting us to be under global control. Creating a situation to allow foreign born presidents would be a fine start.

[cripplecreek]

It’s too bad more Americans don’t have the manhood to stand and demand that the constitution is obeyed. Instead they want to be like middle school girls and worry about how it looks.

[Godebert]

bttt.

[ridesthemiles]

Anyone who is a natural-born U.S. citizen should have no trouble producing a copy of their COLB.””

A COLB is a Hawaiian document, I think. I was born in Wisconsin, and every other person I know who was born wherever in the USA has a BIRTH CERTIFICATE-—not a COLB.

I surmsed that the COLB was unique to Hawaii (not a state until 1959) of natives who don’t usually go to a hospital to give birth. They used mid-wives and gave birth at home. Thus, the system which lets them go to the court house and record the CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH, so their child is able to have some type of documentation.

I think Stanley Ann Dunham (Obama???) gave birth in Kenya, like the Gramma there said, then she flew back to Hawaii and recorded the “birth” of Barack with a COLB, but I am convinced that he was NOT born on USA soil.

I also have doubts that Stanley Ann and Daddy were actually married, because when Daddy came to the US, he already had a Kenyan wife and two Kenyan children he couldn’t bring with him. IF he tried to marry Stanley Ann, that would make his a bigamist. That would also make it difficult to find a “divorce decree” for Stanley Ann and daddy.
Being an illegitimate child isn’t a disqualification according to the Constitution, but not being Natural Born is a disqualification.
The issue of him being “naturalized” has already been proven that he isn’t because Stanley Ann wasn’t 19 at his birth and hadn’t been 5 years uninterrupted inside the USA.

IMO, NObama isn’t legally a President-or President-elect.

He is trying to cover this up, and it is getting some traction- altho lots of money has been spent trying to push him into the highest office in the land.

Wonder what legal redress donors to his campaign would be entitled to?
Unions alone donated over $350 million. What a dirty trick to play on them!!!!! But- considering what kinds of dirth tricks unions have been playing for years: What goes around, comes around.

[TruthWillWin]

It’s too bad more Americans don’t have the manhood to stand and demand that the constitution is obeyed. Instead they want to be like middle school girls and worry about how it looks.

I think a large majority of Americans will want the constitution to be obeyed. That is if they are informed with facts. Will the MSM do this? (dumb question)

[TruthWillWin]

Wonder what legal redress donors to his campaign would be entitled to?

Logic says that would be fraud.

[Brian S. Fitzgerald]

[rjp2005]

Does anyone have a list of states currently filing suit? Is Florida one of them? If not, I’d like to help organize that effort.

[sionnsar]

The rats are such liars and Hippocrates.

Huh? They are a well-known ancient Greek?

[sionnsar]

Hmmmm.... is America too corrupt to care?...

Too corrupted, yes.

[Elvina]

Good for Alan Keyes. I hope that no matter what the future holds for our great nation, that eventually Keyes will earn a place in the history books for standing up for the Constitution at this time of crisis.

When I used to work with leftist teachers who would complain about No Child Left Behind, I would innocently mention to them that they might like Alan Keyes since he has called for the abolishment of the Department of Education. They usually had no coherent response or would say something like "Oh, that sound interesting!" Educated liberals are so uninformed.

[SERKIT]

It makes Republicans look like idiots.

Then why aren't the democrats and media using it?

In the Chicago talk radio market, possibly in fear of the impending "Fairness Doctrine", the radio hosts are actively poo-poo-ing this entire topic.

The other day, one of the WLS-AM hosts said "Can you believe that some people still think Obama is not a US citizen? LET IT GO!".

The fix is "in", I'm afraid. I'd like to see the 17 lawsuits in 12 states, plus the case at the SCOTUS come to some kind of logical and decisive conclusion based on constitutional law versus have this thing becoms a huge cloud (I hesitate to say 'black cloud') over the Presidency.

[avenir]

“Two words: President Biden.”

Yes, but if one of them is a backslidden patriot (who might have a pro-America revival) I’d bet on Biden. I don’t think there’s a patriot bone in Hussein’s body to begin with.

[bronxboy]

Maybe he wants to make Republicans look like idiots. I have no idea. However, I know that if this was the case, the Clinton’s would have found it out.

[Elvina]

"The rats are such liars and Hippocrates." Huh? They are a well-known ancient Greek?

No, the Rats hate Hippocrates because the Hippocratic Oath specifically prohibits abortion (not to mention the "do no harm" part). So let's call them liars, hypocrites, and anti-Hippocratists.