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Iranian grain ship seized as Somali pirates hold world to ransom
The Times ^ | 11/19/2008 | Catherine Philp

Posted on 11/18/2008 9:16:24 PM PST by bruinbirdman

Alarm grows as governments and navies are rendered legally powerless to conduct security operations on the high seas

Somali pirates struck again yesterday, seizing an Iranian cargo ship holding 30,000 tonnes of grain, as the world’s governments and navies pronounced themselves powerless against this new threat to global trade.

Admiral Michael Mullen, the US military chief, pronounced himself stunned by the pirates’ reach after their capture of the supertanker Sirius Star and its $100 million (£70 million) cargo. Commanders from the US Fifth Fleet and from Nato warships in the area said that they would not intervene to retake the vessel.

The Foreign Minister of Saudi Arabia, the owner of the ship, condemned the hijacking as an “outrageous act” that required international action.

“Piracy, like terrorism, is a disease which is against everybody, and everybody must address it together,” Prince Saud al-Faisal said. Arab diplomats would meet in Cairo on Thursday to discuss what could be done in response, Yemeni officials said.

Analysts said, however, that the seizure of the Sirius Star exposed the use of foreign warships as “a sticking plaster” that would not solve the problem. “Maritime security operations in that area are addressing the symptoms not the causes,” said Jason Alderwick, a maritime defence analyst at the International Institute for Strategic Studies.

Roger Middleton, a Horn of Africa specialist at the Chatham House think-tank, said that the capture was a crucial escalation. “Now that they have shown they are able to seize an enormous ship like this, it is beyond a military solution. You won’t fix this without a political solution.”

Pirates pulled the 333m supertanker yesterday to a mooring point off Harardhere, on the Somali coast. Farther north, Italian, Greek, Turkish, British, American and Russian frigates and warships were patrolling the Gulf of Aden under a

(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: islam; pirates; somalia; thomasjefferson
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1 posted on 11/18/2008 9:16:24 PM PST by bruinbirdman
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To: bruinbirdman

2 posted on 11/18/2008 9:17:36 PM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: GOP_Lady
“Now that they have shown they are able to seize an enormous ship like this, it is beyond a military solution. You won’t fix this without a political solution.”

????
3 posted on 11/18/2008 9:19:10 PM PST by Dallas59 (Not My President)
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To: bruinbirdman

Ping me when they take an American ship.


4 posted on 11/18/2008 9:19:44 PM PST by txhurl (somebody just bought 12 Carrier Battle Groups for 600 million dollars)
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To: bruinbirdman
Looks like a great opportunity for entrepreneurial thinking.
5 posted on 11/18/2008 9:19:53 PM PST by Mad_Tom_Rackham ("The land of the Free...Because of the Brave")
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To: bruinbirdman
“Now that they have shown they are able to seize an enormous ship like this, it is beyond a military solution. You won’t fix this without a political solution.”

Bull. Hang enough pirates and they'll either stop or we'll run out of pirates.

6 posted on 11/18/2008 9:20:36 PM PST by hometoroost (Obama our first Halfrican-American president)
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To: GOP_Lady

Imagine the smell. Subhuman.


7 posted on 11/18/2008 9:21:21 PM PST by Rollee
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To: bruinbirdman

Roger Middleton doesn’t sound like he’s a very bright guy. I wonder what he does all day at a “think” tank. Clean the toilets?


8 posted on 11/18/2008 9:22:44 PM PST by FlingWingFlyer (I voted for McCain/Palin so I can look my grandchildren in the eyes when I tell them I'm sorry.)
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To: Dallas59

The ship’s crew is being held hostage.


9 posted on 11/18/2008 9:22:48 PM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: bruinbirdman
Commanders from the US Fifth Fleet and from Nato warships in the area said that they would not intervene to retake the vessel.

Excuse me? They don't have the ability to intervene? Give me a break. Has Obama take the oath of office already?

If I were the CIC the panties of those pirate would be hanging from the yardarms. It would make the point to show their comrades what happens when you start highjacking oil tankers and other cargo ships.

10 posted on 11/18/2008 9:23:16 PM PST by notpoliticallycorewrecked (According to the MSM, I'm a fringe sitting, pajama wearing Freeper)
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To: bruinbirdman

Barch OBAMA must go and talk to these pirates & tell them to be good little boys & behave themselves!


11 posted on 11/18/2008 9:23:20 PM PST by ethics
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To: ethics

LOL.


12 posted on 11/18/2008 9:23:53 PM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: Rollee
Imagine the smell. Subhuman.

No sir! No sir!

13 posted on 11/18/2008 9:24:40 PM PST by dr_lew
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To: Mad_Tom_Rackham

IMO. Our military has determined that the hijacking either did not involve our national interests or was staged.


14 posted on 11/18/2008 9:24:45 PM PST by plymaniac (2010=1994)
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To: Mad_Tom_Rackham
Looks like a great opportunity for entrepreneurial thinking.

Privateers. State sanctioned pirates who area permitted to prey on pirates. Kill they and take thir stuff.

Offer a bounty too.

If nations are legally powerless to stop pirates, are they legally powerless to stop people I might pay to kill pirates?

15 posted on 11/18/2008 9:26:30 PM PST by Doctor Raoul (It's no longer the Press Van, it's a "Tanker" Truck!)
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To: bruinbirdman

” governments and navies are rendered legally powerless to conduct security operations on the high seas”

Oh bulls&%t.
We know who is doing this I’m guessing. Our satellites or whatever, can track where the pirates are coming from.

We need to tell the countries or locations who are sheltering these people to “get with the program”.
You take care of your pirate problem, or the US Navy will.


16 posted on 11/18/2008 9:27:25 PM PST by HereInTheHeartland (I can't wait for January 20, 2013")
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To: bruinbirdman
"governments and navies are rendered legally powerless to conduct security operations on the high seas "

Why, what prevents them? I mean I can see where the U.S. wouldn't want to come to the aid of an Iranian vessel. Since they'd blame the whole thing on us or the Jews. It's better to just let the Muslims sort it out among themselves.

But if it was a friendly state, couldn't we blast the pirates? Give Will Turner some cargo?

17 posted on 11/18/2008 9:28:12 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: bruinbirdman
"governments and navies are rendered legally powerless to conduct security operations on the high seas "

Why, what prevents them? I mean I can see where the U.S. wouldn't want to come to the aid of an Iranian vessel. Since they'd blame the whole thing on us or the Jews. It's better to just let the Muslims sort it out among themselves.

But if it was a friendly state, couldn't we blast the pirates? Give Will Turner some cargo?

18 posted on 11/18/2008 9:28:12 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: bruinbirdman

Arm the crews! There, was that so hard?


19 posted on 11/18/2008 9:29:18 PM PST by Slings and Arrows (We are SO screwed.)
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To: HereInTheHeartland

WHY DON’T THE SHIPOWNERS HAVE AN ARMED SQUAD ON EACH SHIP GOING THROUGH THIS WATERLOGGED ANUS??!?


20 posted on 11/18/2008 9:29:40 PM PST by szweig (Had it up to here)
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To: ethics
Barch OBAMA must go and talk to these pirates & tell them to be good little boys & behave themselves!

Yes, face to face negotiations by The One are the world's best hope.

With no preconditions.

21 posted on 11/18/2008 9:29:52 PM PST by Doctor Raoul (It's no longer the Press Van, it's a "Tanker" Truck!)
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To: bruinbirdman

As much as I hate to say this, if this turns out to be real, and it does not affect the US, I say we should let the rest of the world deal with it.


22 posted on 11/18/2008 9:30:36 PM PST by Las Vegas Ron (((The hell with buckling the seat belts - Load the guns!)))
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To: Doctor Raoul

Hmmm...Q-ships. I like it.


23 posted on 11/18/2008 9:32:04 PM PST by Slings and Arrows (We are SO screwed.)
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To: bruinbirdman

““Now that they have shown they are able to seize an enormous ship like this, it is beyond a military solution. You won’t fix this without a political solution.”

I’m wondering if that is code for: “The Somali government (what little of it exists) is behind this. It’s not just individual groups of pirates acting independently.”

Just a thought.


24 posted on 11/18/2008 9:37:42 PM PST by DemforBush (Millions of conservatives have got your back, Sarah!)
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To: bruinbirdman

I say let the Iranians and Saudis deal with the problem, since it’s their ships. The world will learn soon enough when the US removes itself unilaterally as a world superpower.


25 posted on 11/18/2008 9:38:19 PM PST by Azzurri
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To: bruinbirdman
Blackwater is cocked and ready!
26 posted on 11/18/2008 9:39:41 PM PST by org.whodat (Conservatives don't vote for Bailouts! Republicans do!)
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To: dr_lew

I would not care a bit if every last somali disappeared from the face of the earth. In fact, I would be quite happy if they did. It would be a good start.


27 posted on 11/18/2008 9:40:21 PM PST by Rollee
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To: bruinbirdman
as Somali pirates hold world to ransom

Wow. The very definition of journalistic hyperbole.

28 posted on 11/18/2008 9:41:10 PM PST by buccaneer81 (Bob Taft has soiled the family name for the next century.)
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To: org.whodat

Perhaps a reading of Thomas Jefferson’s deeds in that part of the world would clarify the steps to be taken.


29 posted on 11/18/2008 9:42:31 PM PST by ashtanga
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To: Rollee
I would not care a bit if every last somali disappeared from the face of the earth. In fact, I would be quite happy if they did. It would be a good start.

We could start in Columbus. They have infested our North side. Ignorant, demanding and ungrateful.

30 posted on 11/18/2008 9:43:17 PM PST by buccaneer81 (Bob Taft has soiled the family name for the next century.)
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To: Mad_Tom_Rackham

Somali Piracy is easy to solve, and fun too!

Run some fat targets close to shore, making sure the pirates understand they have lots of cash on board, a drunk skipper, and deep pockets owners.

Then, when the pirates get close, open up with the .50 cal guns and some guided missiles and blow them out of the water.

Repeat until pirates don’t come out for the bait.

No more pirate problem. Good gunnery practice for some Navy boys. Simple and fun!


31 posted on 11/18/2008 9:43:38 PM PST by Uncle Miltie (SARAH *** JOE *** 2012!)
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To: Rollee
This is no joke. Do you know the three largest Somali cities on Earth?

Mogadishu, Minneapolis, Columbus.

32 posted on 11/18/2008 9:45:28 PM PST by buccaneer81 (Bob Taft has soiled the family name for the next century.)
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To: DannyTN

I’m just wondering if anything has changed in the legal landscape. Or if this is a ruse to issue in more international regulation like maybe the Law of the Sea.


33 posted on 11/18/2008 9:49:32 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: Rollee

Ha. That was in Orson Welles’ version of Napoleon. He says to Talleyrand or somebody, “I can’t say I would be any the happier if I woke up one fine morning and found that England had disappeared.” Talleyrand replies, “Ah, but you did say one fine morning.”

This is quite a different matter from “subhuman”, which is simply inaccurate for starters.


34 posted on 11/18/2008 9:50:51 PM PST by dr_lew
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To: ethics

“OBAMA must go and talk to these pirates & tell them to be good little boys & behave themselves!”

He and his little pirate friends are too busy hijacking the U.S.


35 posted on 11/18/2008 9:51:28 PM PST by Beowulf9
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To: bruinbirdman

Let’s clear this up a bit. The 5th Fleet Commanders said they “WOULD NOT INTERVENE...”. They did not say “could not”, they did not say “cannot”, they did not say “prohibited”, they did not say “incapable”, they did not say “we lack legal jurisdiction”.

I’m sure we WOULD INTERVENE on behalf of Iran if they ask us to. As a matter of fact WE COULD retake the ship and escort it all the way into a nice safe Iranian port. All they would have to do is ask.


36 posted on 11/18/2008 9:58:41 PM PST by FreedomNotSafety
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To: bruinbirdman
“Piracy, like terrorism, is a disease which is against everybody, and everybody must address it together,”

Says the country with uber-wealth and without the balls to protect it.

They got a bundle. let them build a navy and earn the "international community's" thanks by taking these guys on. Same for the Iranians.

Fat chance.

37 posted on 11/18/2008 9:58:53 PM PST by ConservativeCompendium.net (We need to amend the US Constitution. We the People --> We the Politicians.)
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To: bruinbirdman
How about sending out some Q-pertankers.

Somali pirates sail up to a supposedly unarmed tanker. Some blinds roll down and they open fire on the pirates. Dump the bodies in the sea.

Repeat as necessary.

(For those who don't know about Q Ships)

38 posted on 11/18/2008 10:04:51 PM PST by MediaMole
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To: bruinbirdman

Maybe the U.N. should send those pirates a strongly worded letter.


39 posted on 11/18/2008 10:06:14 PM PST by Gomez (killer of threads)
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To: Uncle Miltie; Doctor Raoul

Why not Pirate Hunting cruises? Outfit a ship with 50 cal machine guns along the gunnels and sell seats for the cruise. Side betting encouraged.


40 posted on 11/18/2008 10:09:12 PM PST by Mad_Tom_Rackham ("The land of the Free...Because of the Brave")
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To: All
AMATEURS----

Wall Street, Banks, Paulsen, Beranke, Congress---now, these are real pirates.

41 posted on 11/18/2008 10:17:20 PM PST by Wegotsarah.com (My amateur blog--www.wegotsarah.com)
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To: bruinbirdman
governments and navies are rendered legally powerless to conduct security operations on the high seas

Time to repeal large chunks of "International Law."

42 posted on 11/18/2008 10:17:59 PM PST by ApplegateRanch (The mob got President Barabbas; America got shafted)
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To: bruinbirdman
"Farther north, Italian, Greek, Turkish, British, American and Russian frigates and warships were patrolling the Gulf of Aden"

Frigates aren't warships...???

43 posted on 11/18/2008 10:20:17 PM PST by Dan Middleton
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To: GOP_Lady
The ship’s crew is being held hostage.

Correction: ALL ships' crews are now being held hostage thanks to spineless, balless bleeding heart politoces wh gave pirates "legal rights".

IF some crewmen end up dead, it wouldn't be the first time in the fight against piracy.

Dead pirates is the ONLY answer to that scourge.

44 posted on 11/18/2008 10:21:40 PM PST by ApplegateRanch (The mob got President Barabbas; America got shafted)
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To: Rollee

I’m surprised that the Saudi’s haven’t put up a substantial bounty for:

1. The ship.
2. The crew.
3. The heads (or other component parts) of the pirates.

With their money, they could probably get the pirates to turn on each other.

As far as the Iranian ship goes, it might be a very inexpensive “hearts and minds” thing to get their ship back for them. Much like our own situation, not all Iranians are represented by their leaders.

I’m also surprised that the Russians haven’t helped out the Ukrainians, for the same, albeit in their case nefarious, reasons.

Who would believe that this is suddenly a problem in the 21st century?


45 posted on 11/18/2008 10:23:42 PM PST by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
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To: bruinbirdman
“Now that they have shown they are able to seize an enormous ship like this, it is beyond a military solution. You won’t fix this without a political solution.”

Killing them all and burning their pirate villages and cities to the ground is a good political solution.

Kill enough of them and they will stop. Kill enough of their neighbors and their surviving neighbors will kill the pirates.

46 posted on 11/18/2008 10:26:45 PM PST by Centurion2000 (To protect and defend ... against all enemies, foreign and domestic .... by any means necessary.)
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To: org.whodat
"Blackwater is cocked and ready! "

Yup. You get it. Pay the ransom, get the ship and crew released and have Blackwater ready to track down and kill everyone involved.

47 posted on 11/18/2008 10:27:27 PM PST by blam
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To: bruinbirdman
the world’s governments and navies pronounced themselves powerless

don't want to soil their hands with actual work.

48 posted on 11/18/2008 10:27:27 PM PST by arthurus (Old Age beat itself with its own guile and lack of enthusiasm.)
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To: Gomez

“Maybe the U.N. should send those pirates a strongly worded letter.”

Maybe they could send a UN ship there to “observe”; the pirates might use up their ammo using those fear-inducing “blue helmets” for target practice.

I’m almost certain that a big-city street gang or civil war re-enactors with adequate ammo supplies could go up against and annihilate the entire UN force.


49 posted on 11/18/2008 10:28:34 PM PST by The Antiyuppie ("When small men cast long shadows, then it is very late in the day.")
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To: bruinbirdman
"pronounced themselves powerless against this new threat to global trade."

Egad! somebody might SHOOT at them! Can't have that!!

50 posted on 11/18/2008 10:29:36 PM PST by ThanhPhero (di hanh huong den La Vang)
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