Skip to comments.Did Democrats Have Something to Do with the Economic Troubles?
Posted on 11/27/2008 4:36:04 AM PST by Joiseydude
Remember during the campaign how this whole economic mess, according to the Obama camp, was the fault of the Bush administration and the past 8 years? They had all those excellent slogans we cant afford four more years of the same remember? I dont want to say that a lot of people bought that crap, but anytime you tried to talk about actual economic history and how this mess evolved, most people glazed over and muttered past 8 years more of same must change.
Well, just this Sunday while enjoying a piping hot cup of joe and a danish, I was reading through the Sunday papers. Being desirous of news from all sides, I always start with the New York Times. Eventually I finish up with Guns & Ammo. The Times had a story on the front page entitled Citigroup Pays for a Rush to Risk.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
Is the New York Times now suggesting that the Democrats might have had something to do with our current economic troubles? I mention this only because the Dems (to their credit) made piles of hay off the economic crisis leading up to election day
it was those damn Republicans and their addiction to deregulation. What a load of crap.
They get to write the first draft of history. Maybe its time for a re-write.
2004 Video: Democrats Defend Fannie/Freddie from Regulation:
"We've been through nearly a dozen hearings where frankly we were trying to fix something that wasn't broke. Mr. Chairman we do not have a crisis at Freddie Mac and in particular at Fannie Mae under the outstanding leadership of Mr. Frank Raines."-Rep. Maxine Waters, 2004
History of Fannie Mae scandal
Associated Press, December 7, 2006
"Fannie Mae announces its long-awaited restatement, erasing $6.3 billion in profit from 2001 through June 30, 2004."
Guilty Party: ACORN, Obama, and the mortgage mess
Mona Charen, September 30, 2008
An ACORN Falls from the Tree: A congressional outrage
Ken Blackwell, September 29, 2008
Inside Obamas Acorn:
By their fruits ye shall know them
Stanley Kurtz, May 29, 2008
"What if Barack Obamas most important radical connection has been hiding in plain sight all along? Obama has had an intimate and long-term association with the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (Acorn), the largest radical group in America. If I told you Obama had close ties with MoveOn.org or Code Pink, youd know what I was talking about. Acorn is at least as radical as these better-known groups, arguably more so. Yet because Acorn works locally, in carefully selected urban areas, its national profile is lower. Acorn likes it that way. And so, Id wager, does Barack Obama."
How does it go? “The saddest words of tongue or pen are those that say it might have been.” The extremely sad fact of the matter is/was that when the Republicans had their chance to run the country they did a poor job. Think Reagan and his tax increases and 55 mph speed limit. Think Bush and his “No child left behind” or his drug prescription plan or his extremely large fiscal deficits. As you sow, so shall ye reap.
Cloward-Piven Strategy seeks to hasten the fall of capitalism by overloading the government bureaucracy with a flood of impossible demands, thus pushing society into crisis and economic collapse.
The strategy of forcing political change through orchestrated crisis
It will take much to fix what they are about to do to this country. My hope is we are in it for only four years. I can take it in the short term, I fear for my children and my children's children....
One years in the making.
Forcing financial institutions to make bad loans using ACORN,political correctness,the race card,and a feckless President Bush made said institutions cover their loses by bundling bad paper with good and then selling them for a profit to corrupt GSEs like Fannie and Freddie (government sponsored enterprises)where from the beginning the taxpayer was the collaterall.
From Jimmy Carter to Barney Frank,it has been a well played leftist silent coup intended to enslave Americans to socialist tyranny by putting government in control of the once free markets—or the economy,if you wish—control the money and you control those who rely on it—Leninism 101.
When the GOP let the above happen by abandoning their conservative base they abandoned America and the US Constitution as well because they wanted to be “popular” with the MSN and Hollywood.Sick,shallow and seditious became the Republican paradign.
Now only a “popular” uprising supported by the only constitutional right left with bite—the 2nd—may save the America that counts.
Bush's shilling for (and McCain's voting for) a massive bailout did nothing but cement the image of the GOP as being the really big government party.
I believe Soros and his billions had something to do with the stock market melt down. It’s not that hard to do with that much money. Bob Brinker has been talking about slash and burn tactics that hedge funds have been employing.
My sister, who is a "bush lied, people died, lefty was putting this mess 100% on Bush until I asked her do you think the situation would have been different if Kerry were in the White House? She could not honestly answer no.
Economic problems of this magnitude are not possible without a failure of leadership from both parties.
No,Bush and the RHINOs only enabled the Left’s takeover of the American economy.
We now must obey the Left and thank the ‘moderate” Right for the current mess.
One may say Bush is the last Tsar and it is 1917 in the nascent Soviet America.
Which economic troubles, The Great Democratic Crash of 08 or the Great Democratic Depression 08-xx ?
What does she know about anything? I'm surprised she could even read this statement that someone else prepared.
She's so stupid...
when you stand next to her you hear the ocean!
when she heard it was chilly outside she went and got a bowl.
she thinks Fleetwood Mac is a new hamburger at McDonalds!
I always felt that "Evil Daddy Warbucks", aka Soros, had a lot to do with the dollar devaluing problems, and other things, so why not tank the market on purpose.
It is interesting that the problems didn't get out of control until the Dims controlled Congress...hmmm...
“I believe Soros and his billions had something to do with the stock market melt down. Its not that hard to do with that much money. Bob Brinker has been talking about slash and burn tactics that hedge funds have been employing.”
I agree. Shorting stocks started this, escalating with 9/11. I’d include ME types looking to finance further terror, too. Money as a weapon. Stocks and mortgages as ammo. Financial instuments and practices that had previously been illegal, the footsoldiers and drones.
Business for these types, the dem and the minions has been outstanding this autumn.
Remember how the high cost of oil/gas put the kibosh on the economy right after the dems took control of Congress? It was a guarantee that there would be no movement on drilling our own oil and gas for at least 2 years.
Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and CRA we know about.
Chuck Schumer's letter regarding Indymac Bank.
Harry Reid's pronouncement about "the very large insurance company" about to go belly up.
I suspect she and many of the demonRat leadership knew full well that Fannie Mae was failing. They played dumb to deliberately sabotage the U.S. economy. Waters is way out on the commie left.
Maxine Waters and chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, John Conyers, have both given their endorsements to the Revolutionary Communist Party front movement "World Can't Wait--Drive Out the Bush Regime".
Click on the WCW link just below and see: "Endorsers of the Call to Drive Out the Bush Regime Include". Conyers' endorsement appears right after Ward Churchill's. Al Sharpton's, Maxine Waters and Jesse Jackson Jr's are further down the list:
Fact: World Can't Wait--Drive Out the Bush Regime is a Maoist-revolutionary movement organized by the Revolutionary Communist Party. (scroll down the list that appears (after clicking link) to find the World Can't Wait organization --rwor.org is the website of the Revolutionary Communist Party):
From David Horowitz's FrontpageMag.com /DiscoverTheNetworks.org:
Profile: World Can't Wait (WCW)
*Revolutionary communist movement that stages protests against the Bush administration
*Organizes college and high-school students
*Founded in June 2005 by Charles Clark Kissinger, a longtime leader of the Revolutionary Communist Party
From the website of the Revolutionary Communist Party (revcom.us or rwor.org) :
"Create Public Opinion, Seize Power: We are preparing minds and organizing forces for the time when there is a major crack in the system, whenever it comes and wherever it comes from: an opening that makes it possible to bring the future Revolutionary Army of the Proletariat (R.A.P.) into the field and wage a revolutionary armed struggle that actually has a chance of winning. And we have said that building our party itself is the most important part of organizing forces for revolution. This is true now, and it is true looking forward to the creation of that future R.A.P. and the waging of that armed struggle.":
From David Horowitz's FrontpageMag.com /DiscoverTheNetworks.org:
"Throughout its history, one of RCP's [Revolutionary Communist Party] principal objectives has been to foment civil unrest in the United States. The most notable example of such efforts occurred on April 29, 1992, when RCP members looted and trashed the downtown and government districts of Los Angeles, triggering the infamous Rodney King riots. During the days immediately preceding the violence, RCP -- which maintained close ties to the L.A. gangs known as the Crips and the Bloods -- had circulated throughout South Central Los Angeles a leaflet featuring a statement by RCP National Spokesman Carl Dix, titled 'It's Right To Rebel' -- a quote popularized by Mao Zedong.
Encouraged by Dix, RCP activists helped lead the riots that would leave 58 people dead, more than 2,300 people injured, some 5,300 buildings burned, and $1 billion in property damaged or destroyed. On the ten-year anniversary of the rioting, RCP member Joseph Veale fondly recalled the violence as 'the most beautiful, the most heroic civil action in the history of the United States.'"
"The RCP upheld the 1992 sometimes-violent unrest in Los Angeles and nationally as a 'rebellion' in the aftermath of the Rodney King verdicts. Then-LAPD chief Daryl Gates alleged that the RCP was involved in the 'riots'. Los Angeles has long been one of the RCP's larger and more active branches. William 'Mobile' Shaw was a local leader who recently passed and received public commendation from the party."
Maxine Waters on the Los Angeles riots of 1992 (Rodney King riots):
"[Maxine] Waters has been criticized for her comments regarding the Los Angeles riots of 1992. In defense of the people that looted stores and damaged property, Waters said 'If you call it a riot it sounds like it was just a bunch of crazy people who went out and did bad things for no reason. I maintain it was somewhat understandable, if not acceptable. So I call it a rebellion.' She also said it was 'a spontaneous reaction to a lot of injustice' and 'The anger in my district is righteous. I'm just as angry as they are.' She responded to the mass looting of Korean-owned stores by saying: 'There were mothers who took this as an opportunity to take some milk, to take some bread, to take some shoes. They are not crooks. Everybody in the street was not a thug or a hood.'"
Marx the socialist inspiration,Trotsky the intellectual revolutionary,Lenin the charismatic demagogue and Stalin the pragmatic and ruthless enslaver. I only pray a Russian Reagan will cause OUR socialist downfall--and not take 70 years doing it!
“Did Democrats Have Something to Do with the Economic Troubles?”
How about EVERYTHING ?
I don't think the workings of the economy interested him much. Hence, although his administration made some early attempts to control the housing/lending orgy, it also abandoned them easily and without a lot of fuss.
Granted the Arabs,Chavez,Putin and Ahmadinnerjacket hate us but they are suffering now because of the oil bubble burst.
Our liberal Democrats are willing to cripple America in order to win—but foreign America haters who still live and breath American dollars?
A socialist superpower with a super advanced military beholden to the nations holding our IOUs would make an excellent mercenary force available to the highest bidder.
Much to think about.
Reagan lowered taxes and got rid of Carter's 55 MPH AFIK.
People seem to get confused about what the problem really is because it is kind of complex. Deregulation did not cause it and there is nowhere anyone can point to say this law made all these banks go nuts. It didn’t happen. If that did happen, the housing market as a whole would not have responded to rising interest rates, which it most certainly did.
We actually had two problems that fed each other. The first one was the housing bubble that is the result of artificially low interest rates; which by itself would not have caused the financial system to collapse. The second problem was the collapse of the mortage backed securities market, which did lead to the collapse of the financial system. So why did the MBS market collapse?
Subprime lending couldn’t exist within the framework of accepted lending standards. And of course, the main culprits, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were exempt from the banking acts because they could never hope to carry out their charters under them without the government funding it. It wasn’t until Fannie and Freddie were put under these acts, abscent of government funding, that the whole house of cards started coming down and their main partner in crony capitalism, Countrywide, was the first to collapse.
Congress knew that in order to get what it wanted it had to have these government entities out there doing it so it would imply some sort of government guarantee, and they would buy up the mortgages as fast as the banks who were involved, either volunarily or by coersion, could write them, and then spread them around as secuirites to keep the government off the hook. And to make it more of a reality, they had to get high credit ratings for these instruments so they chopped them up and mixed good with bad to imply less risk and/or to obscure what was really behind them. Otherwise, they wouldn’t be able to get investors willing to pony up the cash.
In the end, it had nothing to do with industry wide deregulation, but everything to do with the government trying to get something for nothing and not following its own rules to get there. If the diversified securities had not been there, we would have had some pain with the bursting of the housing bubble, but it would not have lead to the collapse of the financial system.
Yeah,MY BS radar went ballistic too!
Has to be either a typo or a stroke.
The sad fact is, the Conservatives NEVER had a majority in the House or the Senate.
Bush is not a Conservative, but he could have and most likely would have been more so if the small Republican majorities in the House and Senate were not polluted with RINOs.
I can’t believe you said that about Ronald Reagan. He lowered taxes, but couldn’t control the dim congress spending. Tip O’Neill said “The Reagan Budget is Dead on Arrival.” everytime the budget was submitted.
It was Nixon who gave us the 55 mph speed limit.
It is obvious our government schools don’t teach history anymore.
They could have been in collusion, but I'd like to think they were simply on the same side for different reasons.
OPEC pressed their hand too far. They broke the back of an economy that was strong enough to handle the BS mortgage crisis but persistently high and rising oil prices finally tipped it over center. Now they are reeling in an attempt to keep their US economy sugar daddy going with a socialist green head anti-petroleum leader coming on stage.
If OPEC did this on purpose, they didn't get the outcome they desired.
Correction.....Nixon's 55 MPH. At least I knew it wasn't Reagan's
I've had thoughts along those lines ever since I learned first what caused the mortgage instability, then remembered what caused the horrendous increase in crude oil prices: Speculation.
Someone of Soros' ilk would recognize the precarious position of the huge number of overextended mortgages, and would have the resources to engage in crude oil speculation on a massive scale to cause the increase in prices.
This would cause many of those overextended mortgagees to lose control of their budgets and default on their loans. I normally hesitate to use the word "conspiracy," but I think a convincing case might be made here. Whatever the case, I've never believed Soros was a positive influence in America.
So the government,which can arrest and physically punish deadbeats,giving it supreme financial security (like a mafia loanshark),got involved in the financial free markets,the fix was in—cause what can a private bank do without the gun the GSEs have to collect debts?
And when liberal Democrat political correctness forbids the GSEs to use the gun,
Democrats claim deregulation is the cause of the meltdown however they overwhelmingly supported and Clinton signed into law the deregulation bill they claim is responsible. The deregulation bill had absolutely nothing to do with the creation of subprime loans but it did have a CRA requirement at the insistence of the Dems.
Very frustrating that the Republicans took the blame for the meltdown. Worse yet, those Democrats most responsible for the meltdown were in charge of fixing it. Dodd and Frank were the Dems front men working on the Bailout. No wonder the initial bailout bill had ACORN provisions.
The 2008 election was an embarrassment. We allowed the Democrats to hang the subprime collapse right around our necks like boat anchors.
Does a bear use the woods for a toilet?
Does the sun rise in the east?
Is Obama an illegal?
When an ignorant four year old wants to know where babies come from does he believe his biologist father who explains the process of fertilization,conception and pregnancy or his ditzy mother who tells him about the stork?
America is infested with ignorant four year olds and they are being raised by ditzy liberal Democrats.
Dad is just their to pay the bills.
Yup, in an election where the voters who went for Obama wanted to hear economy and jobs, all we wanted to talk about was Wright-Ayers-Hussein. It was a losing strategy.
Another losing strategy was clinging onto not taxing people who make over $250K. When in fact Obama was going to expire the 2003 tax cuts which will raise the federal income tax rates on everyone including low income and middle income. Did McCain ever mention that? Nope! Instead McCain got rope-a-doped with the $250K figure and made himself look like the stereotypical rich evil Republican only out to protect his rich evil friends. The Democrats' duped the McCain campaign good with that one.
Rush has as much of a grasp of economics as mccain. It has been nearly two years since the peak of ARM,s foreclosures.
Created it, managed it, ran it, and caused it.
Promoted it, continued it, used it.
I think Obama saw this. In some of his radio commercials, he said (to paraphrase) "Don't ask yourselves if you're better off than you were four years ago, but if you will be better off." He saw the implications. Too bad McCain and the GOP didn't.
Yep! That’s another full blown issue that McCain completely avoided. I think McCain was more worried about not making enemies from Democrats as he goes back to the Senate. And when you run to not really win, you lose — as McCain showed.
Obama was saying, more particularly, that all the deregulation of the banking industry during the Bush years caused the crisis. President Carter said this too.
But guess what? The last time any legislation was passed deregulating the financial markets was 1999.
Just another example of the media not doing its job.
1913 Fed Reserve/Fed Reserve Act = Woodrow Wilson Dem
1938 Fannie/Freddie Created = FDR Dem
1968 Fannie/Freddie Chartered as GSE = Johnson Dem
1977 CRA = Carter Dem
1990’s CRA build w/ expansionary subprime lending = Clinton & Congress = Dems & some repubs
1990’s Abolished Glass/Steagall Act = Clinton Dem
2007 Abolishment of Uptick Rule = SEC not related
I see a hell of a lot more Dems in there than I do Repubs in regards to the main causes of this crisis - it’s been a long build up and all these institutions and rules were ideas of the Dems!
It’s clear, as every post in this thread reflects, that this was no coincidence.
Isn’t it wonderful to have a truly conservative network like FOX news! The insight alone is an absolute Godsend. And here these masters of “fair and balanced” journalism are finally (perhaps) stumbling upon facts known to Free Republic and its readers for a very long time...that the left is responsible for the financial fiasco in which we find ourselves embroiled. Gee, what ever would we do without such brave television reporting!
I tend to agree and surprisingly enough, if I am not mistaken, his MBA was in business from Harvard. Given the makeup of his cabinet, he may have not had strong conservative influence. Bush 41 was a globalist and it seems 43 had some of those traits as well. Home based capitalist oriented economics would be adversely received. Far different from Reagan....