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St. Petersburgh Times Closes the Case on BHO COLB?
St. Petersburgh Times ^ | JackofHearts

Posted on 12/10/2008 10:55:56 AM PST by jackofhearts

St Petersberg Times spoke with the DoH months ago.The St Petersberg Times fact checkers had running story on this back in June and actually contacted the HI DoH and were satisfied. When the birth certificate arrived from the Obama campaign it confirmed his name as the other documents already showed it. Still, we took an extra step: We e-mailed it to the Hawaii Department of Health, which maintains such records, to ask if it was real.

“It’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate,” spokesman Janice Okubo told us.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/

(Excerpt) Read more at politifact.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; chicagogansta; obama; obamatruthfile
Here's the Okubo quote I've been looking for. What do you all think? Where's Polarik?
1 posted on 12/10/2008 10:55:56 AM PST by jackofhearts
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To: jackofhearts

Yup, I’m to believe a MSM journalist.

Can you say “Dan Rather”?


2 posted on 12/10/2008 10:59:44 AM PST by Da Coyote
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To: jackofhearts
“When the birth certificate arrived from the Obama campaign it confirmed his name as the other documents already showed it. Still, we took an extra step: We e-mailed it to the Hawaii Department of Health, which maintains such records, to ask if it was real.”

So Obama sent them the real birth certificate? Could the state seal be seen on the back side? They are only going by what is on the front side. Again easily photo shopped if only the front side.

3 posted on 12/10/2008 11:02:10 AM PST by Parley Baer
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To: Da Coyote

Yep, and Zer0 has not seen Blag since the election, nor have any of his thugs er guys.


4 posted on 12/10/2008 11:02:13 AM PST by Grampa Dave (Does Zer0 have any friends, who are not foriegn or domestic terrorists or criminals?)
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To: jackofhearts

O can get this monkey off his back by simply producing the birth certificate. I don’t see the problem...(/s)


5 posted on 12/10/2008 11:02:31 AM PST by redhead (ALASKA--Step out of the bus and into the food chain.)
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To: jackofhearts

Well, I’ve just read Okubo’s statement, and she does NOT say that it matches the original vault certificate or that it’s genuine. She says that it looks genuine. Gee whiz.

Or, to be precise, she says it looks like her own birth certificate FROM LAST YEAR (one of the problems with the forgery is that it uses last year’s border with this year’s date), and also that some flunky in the office thought he could see signs of the embossed stamp from the back (but that has been debunked by Polarik, too).


The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama’s birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.

“I guess the big issue that’s being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature,” Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. “Because they scanned the front … you wouldn’t see those things.”

Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received.

And about the copy we e-mailed her for verification? “When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.”

Still, she acknowledges: “I don’t know that it’s possible for us to even say beyond a doubt what the image on the site represents.”


6 posted on 12/10/2008 11:03:52 AM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: jackofhearts

What do you all think? No good, when has this party ever been right?


7 posted on 12/10/2008 11:04:46 AM PST by iopscusa (El Vaquero. (SC Lowcountry Cowboy))
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To: abb; Milhous

What is the financial viability of this rag?


8 posted on 12/10/2008 11:05:23 AM PST by Grampa Dave (Does Zer0 have any friends, who are not foriegn or domestic terrorists or criminals?)
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To: Da Coyote

So the copy the St. Pete Pravda examined is the same as the birth certificate under seal, right??? Then why have one sealed???


9 posted on 12/10/2008 11:07:01 AM PST by seekthetruth
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To: jackofhearts
"'It’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate,' spokesman Janice Okubo told us."

Good, then there is no reason not to show it to us...let's see the birth certificate.

All of these spinmeisters have got to know this isn't going away until solid proof is offered that he is a legal, natural born, citizen. There are so many wordgames being played over this, and so much money being spent to protect it from the light of day, that everyone deserves to see it...if it exists.

Folks, the burden of proof is on Obama...he is the one who is supposed to have "qualified" under the Constitution to become president. Don't let the left and the media goad you with "prove it" statements...it's not ours to prove...it's theirs.
10 posted on 12/10/2008 11:08:23 AM PST by FrankR (“Turtle up”, economically, for the duration of the 0bamanation.)
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To: Grampa Dave

This is the paper that is owned by the Poynter Institute.

http://www.poynter.org/subject.asp?id=41


11 posted on 12/10/2008 11:11:07 AM PST by abb ("What ISN'T in the news is often more important than what IS." Ed Biersmith, 1942 -)
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To: jackofhearts
“It’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate,” spokesman Janice Okubo told us.

Knowing the arcana of Hawaiian state statutes governing such documents as we do now, this statement is meaningless. It doesn't prove or disprove anything. Most statements by Hawaii officials regarding this issue, not uncoincidentally, fail to prove or disprove anything. And, that is logical, given the controversy and the legal maneuvering occurring over the question.

12 posted on 12/10/2008 11:11:55 AM PST by RegulatorCountry
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To: Cicero
When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.

Jeez, did this guy work in Florida in 2000 looking for hanging chads?

Come on people...the embossed seal is RAISED, EMBOSSED, not printed. You won't see "traces" of an embossed seal, you'll see the emboss. And If it was EMBOSSED, it will be embossed on the front AND the back (in reverse, of course).

Another question, where does the Pitts Times get the authority to "close a case"? Exactly what we need, the obama press club being in charge of determining cases disposition.

This is all wishful thinking on the left. Nothing has been proven about obama's qualification for president, as out spelled out in the Consititution.
13 posted on 12/10/2008 11:18:21 AM PST by FrankR (“Turtle up”, economically, for the duration of the 0bamanation.)
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To: jackofhearts

I wouldn’t be surprised if Obama really was born in Hawaii and he’s just playing a game of teasing conservatives.


14 posted on 12/10/2008 11:18:36 AM PST by ari-freedom (Conservatives solve problems. Libertarians ignore problems. Liberals create problems.)
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To: Parley Baer

If he has no qualms about making the document public, why limit who has access to it?

Hand it to the judge in these cases where there are people claiming that the document has not been released.

Or maybe it isn’t THE document, but a notice of record.

If there was nothing to this, why are there even hearings?

Kerry never did release his military records to his critics either, let alone his diary.


15 posted on 12/10/2008 11:23:08 AM PST by weegee (Sec. of State Clinton. What kind of change is it to keep the Bush-Clinton-Bush-Clinton Oligarchy?)
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To: abb

Thanks.


16 posted on 12/10/2008 11:33:54 AM PST by Grampa Dave (Does Zer0 have any friends, who are not foriegn or domestic terrorists or criminals?)
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To: seekthetruth

No, it is the same “Certification of Live Birth” that factcheck.org supposedlyl handled.

And I wonder if they actually handled it or sent the downloaded image to Hawaii.


17 posted on 12/10/2008 11:45:36 AM PST by autumnraine (Churchill: " we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall never surrender")
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To: autumnraine
This is what a Copy of a Certificate of Live Birth (some data redacted) issued by the State of Hawaii, Department of Health in July 1962 for the Birth of a male child in February 1962 on the Island of Oahu looks like. Note the State of Hawaii, Department of Health official embossed seal and official signatures of the then Director of Health, Leo Bernstein, MD and the then Registrar General, Charles G. Bennett. The State of Hawaii officials’ signatures and the date the document was issued are underlined in red. This document is a photographic copied image. It is a black background document with white letters which clearly were created by a 1962 typewriter. A document similar to this is what most of the lawsuits about the record of birth of Obama are asking to be released for public viewing.

The second image is a copy of the Certification of Live Birth document which has been repeatedly “published” on a number of web sites as the Official version of Obama’s birth record from the State of Hawaii. This is no actual place of birth (hospital, plantation, farm, etc.) shown. See boxes #6a through 6d of the document shown in the first image. There is also no Department of Health official embossed seal on this document.

On November 1, 2008, the following email was send:

To The Honorable Linda Lingle Dear Governor Lingle,

I ask that you release all information that the State of Hawaii Department of Health has on Senator Barack Obama's Certificate of Live Birth documentation.

Certainly over 100 million or so Americans, our countrymen, who will be voting on November 4th, 2008 deserve to have this information be publicly made available to them as part of the information they will weigh concerning a candidate as each of them places their vote for President on or before this date.

I can think of no higher purpose for any government entity or branch, than to ensure full, fair, and accurate information is given about a Presidential candidate.

As you well know, the "COLB" or other documents presented as true copies by the Barack Obama campaign website are false and have been digitally modified. As you must realize, this falsification of a presupposed State of Hawaii "official" record, directly and indirectly damages all State of Hawaii real birth records.

These falsehoods from the Obama campaign are a direct attack on the integrity of your governorship and on the integrity of all records kept by the State of Hawaii.

When you took your oath of Office as Governor of the state of Hawaii, did you not also swear to uphold the Constitution of the United States?

By not addresses this issue how and fully, you are also directly denigrating the official State of Hawaii recognition of the birth record of my son who was born in Hawaii just several months after the date of the record(s) in question.

This issue MUST be answered by the truth. By not addresses this issue, you are not fulfilling your oath of office.

Resident of the State of Hawaii

1960 – 1963

As a response the following statement attributed to the current Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, Chiyome Fukino, MD and the current Registrar General per their joint press release on October 31, 2008 was returned by email: in part: “Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures.” Their complete public statement clearly made no references to the key data to be found in #6 boxes and well as the supporting data as in the #7 boxes in the first image.

In fact this response by the office of the Governor of the State of Hawaii was a very disingenuous and a fraudulent response to my original query.

If you had the responsibility to investigate, qualify and vet someone who is to be given a United States Military Top Secret, No Foreign Special Access Security Clearance including the nuclear weapons launch control codes, which document of the two images shown would you find acceptable as a genuine State of Hawaii government issued “Record of a Birth” in the State of Hawaii?

You be the Judge (Roberts, Souter, Ginsburg, Scalia, Stevens, Alito, Kenny, Breyer, Thomas). _______________________________ Certificate-of-Live-Birth-Hawaii-1962 Certification-Of-Live-Birth-Obama-1961

18 posted on 12/10/2008 11:50:21 AM PST by NewEnglander
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To: Parley Baer

Did the article reproduce the text of the e-mail and, if so, what did it actually say and who signed it?


19 posted on 12/10/2008 11:53:03 AM PST by AmericanVictory
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To: FrankR
Folks, the burden of proof is on Obama...he is the one who is supposed to have "qualified" under the Constitution to become president. Don't let the left and the media goad you with "prove it" statements...it's not ours to prove...it's theirs.
20 posted on 12/10/2008 11:56:57 AM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: jackofhearts

They also conveniently ignore the large elephant at the tea party. Forged or not this is a “Certification of Live Birth” not a “Certificate of Live Birth”.


21 posted on 12/10/2008 11:57:01 AM PST by Eagles6 ( Typical White Guy: Christian, Constitutionalist, Heterosexual, Redneck)
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To: jackofhearts

Maybe they should ask Obama why he is e-mailing a digitized image of this document to their newspaper and to a friendly web site BUT REFUSES TO SUBMIT IT TO THE COURTS, which would end all of this madness.

P.S.: They don’t teach logical thinking in journalism school.


22 posted on 12/10/2008 3:15:52 PM PST by OneTimeComment (I)
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To: jackofhearts

That statement is indeed weak, but wasnt the final chapter on what the State of Hawaii said. The KEY issue is whether Obama has records on file with state of Hawaii and do they match the CoLB that’s been publicly presented.

see here:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2145278/posts?page=201#201

4) Now lets review the statement of the Hawaii officials:

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/politics/17866037/detail.html

“There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law (Hawai‘i Revised Statutes §338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record,” DOH Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said. State officials said Saturday they have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate. “Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures,” Fukino said.

So we have state of Hawaii vouching for existence of Obama’s records. This makes the ‘CoLB is a forgery’ claim even more dubious to irrelevent.


23 posted on 12/10/2008 4:06:54 PM PST by WOSG (Obama - a born in the USA socialist)
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To: ari-freedom

“I wouldn’t be surprised if Obama really was born in Hawaii and he’s just playing a game of teasing conservatives.”

I am 99% certain that is indeed the case.
Obama - a born in the USA socialist


24 posted on 12/10/2008 4:08:06 PM PST by WOSG (Obama - a born in the USA socialist)
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To: WOSG

Didn’t this all start with Mr. Berg, a Democrat, many months ago, not conservatives?


25 posted on 12/10/2008 4:10:53 PM PST by OneTimeComment (I)
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To: NewEnglander

Both are genuine. One is the long-form, the other is the short-form CoLB. One was made in 1962 and the other in 2007.

The format is not the issue. The issue is whether the CoLB that Obama shared with factcheck and others represents the data on file with the State of Hawaii. that cuts to the chase of the issue. so this statement addresses that point:

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/politics/17866037/detail.html

“There have been numerous requests for Sen. Barack Hussein Obama’s official birth certificate. State law (Hawai‘i Revised Statutes §338-18) prohibits the release of a certified birth certificate to persons who do not have a tangible interest in the vital record,” DOH Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said. State officials said Saturday they have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate. “Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures,” Fukino said.


26 posted on 12/10/2008 4:21:35 PM PST by WOSG (Obama - a born in the USA socialist)
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To: OneTimeComment
AFAIK, it started with Kos throwing out an image on the net that - whether genuine or not - could have easily been manipulated/created/forged. Some people jumped to the conlcusion that it therefore was forged, since Obama hides so much of his life. I suspect that the Kos crowd doesnt mind at all if right-wingers are distracted on this conspiracy theory.
27 posted on 12/10/2008 4:24:05 PM PST by WOSG (Obama - a born in the USA socialist)
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To: WOSG

Thank you for the information.

What do you think about what seems to be an assault on the natural-born citizen requirement for the presidency?

I remember hearing Orrin Hatch talking about changing the law for Arnold. After reading about this birth certificate controversy, I now realize that Congress passed a resolution for McCain, a naturalized citizen ran on the Socialist Party ticket (incrementalism!) without interference, and others are talking about this provision being antiquated.

Would the Supreme Court be interested in taking one of these cases simply because we seem to be at a turning point on this issue? It seems to me that unless they rule on it soon, the politicians/secretaries of state, etc., might just ignore this requirement.

Why doesn’t every citizen have standing on this issue? After all, each one of us would be harmed if a natural-born citizen became president in violation of the Constitution.


28 posted on 12/10/2008 4:34:26 PM PST by OneTimeComment (I)
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To: OneTimeComment

Correction: That is not a natural-born citizen.


29 posted on 12/10/2008 4:35:36 PM PST by OneTimeComment (I)
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To: FrankR
All of these spinmeisters have got to know this isn't going away until solid proof is offered that he is a legal, natural born, citizen. There are so many wordgames being played over this, and so much money being spent to protect it from the light of day, that everyone deserves to see it...if it exists. Folks, the burden of proof is on Obama...he is the one who is supposed to have "qualified" under the Constitution to become president. Don't let the left and the media goad you with "prove it" statements...it's not ours to prove...it's theirs.

EXACTLY --

30 posted on 12/10/2008 4:45:31 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: WOSG
You seem to have a major problem understanding the English language.

No where in the press release statement by the Hawaii Director of Health does she say what is in the document she controls in regard to a place of birth. Like Farm, plantation, manger, hospital, pineapple field, surfboard etc. In 1961 there was a lot of farming done on Oahu.

The direct response I have received from the Governor of Hawaii's office did not address the place of birth question. If the 2007 document is genuine, why is there no embossed Hawaii Department of Health State seal visible.

Please prove to me that the 2007 document is a genuine original document issued by the State of Hawaii Department of Health.

31 posted on 12/10/2008 4:48:36 PM PST by NewEnglander
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To: WOSG
So we have state of Hawaii vouching for existence of Obama’s records. This makes the ‘CoLB is a forgery’ claim even more dubious to irrelevent.

No your gullibility on this vouch just makes your entire post dubious and irrelevant, along with your pretentious tagline.

32 posted on 12/10/2008 4:50:00 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: jackofhearts
Here's the Okubo quote I've been looking for. What do you all think?

I imagine what she really said was something like, "it looks like a valid Hawaii state birth certificate"

If she said it was one, especially based on being sent a print out of image obtained on the Internet, she was in violation of the law, since that would be confirming the information on it, and that she cannot do, except to those who would be eligible to obtain a certified copy. The St. Petersburgh Times does not fall into that category

33 posted on 12/10/2008 5:45:39 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: FrankR
When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it.”

This is the image they are taling about, same resoution and everything, and from the newspapers own site. Look for yourself and see if you can see any trace of the reverse embossing.

I certainly can not. I downloaded it, and then zoomed in to the point where the JPEG artifacts begin to be visible. No trace of any "seal". Try it yourself.

34 posted on 12/10/2008 5:55:31 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: autumnraine
And I wonder if they actually handled it or sent the downloaded image to Hawaii.

The later as the full article makes somewhat more clear.

35 posted on 12/10/2008 5:56:12 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: WOSG
So we have state of Hawaii vouching for existence of Obama’s records. This makes the ‘CoLB is a forgery’ claim even more dubious to irrelevent.

Existence, yes. there are many ways for someone not a Natural Born Citizen to have a Hawaiian Certificate of Live Birth. And the Certification of Live Birth is much easier to forge, or just alter slightly to change any inconvenient entries to something more acceptable.

36 posted on 12/10/2008 5:59:56 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: WOSG
The issue is whether the CoLB that Obama shared with factcheck and others represents the data on file with the State of Hawaii. that cuts to the chase of the issue. so this statement addresses that point:

It doesn't address it at all. There has been no, zero, nada, confirmation of the contents of the CoLB that Obama "shared". What has been confirmed is the existance of a Certificate of Live Birth, not that what's on it confirms what is on the "shared" CoLB.

37 posted on 12/10/2008 6:03:25 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: El Gato
If she said it was one, especially based on being sent a print out of image obtained on the Internet,

Correction:

...on being sent a jpeg file obtained on the Internet of an image...

Without the actual paper document, there is no way they could confirm it was real, or photoshop. Well, not with a cursory look at the image that is. Traces of photoshopping can be found, although the lower the resolution of the original scanned in image, the harder those are to ferret out conclusively. Working with an image that has been compressed (as jpeg images have been) is also problematic as their are artifacts of the compression process to contend with. But the metadate may show if the file has been touched by Photoshop, or other imagine manipulation software. In this case, it does. But even that doesn't prove the was modified, since photoshop could have been used to obtain the image from a scanner. It could also have been used, and probably was, to block out the certificate number, rather than just putting a piece of black tape over it before scanning. Makes a good excuse anyway for having Photoshop's fingerprints in the file.

38 posted on 12/10/2008 6:14:09 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: ari-freedom

“I wouldn’t be surprised if Obama really was born in Hawaii and he’s just playing a game of teasing conservatives.”

If so, it would be a different kind of proof of his ineligibility to be president.


39 posted on 12/10/2008 6:28:37 PM PST by reasonisfaith (In lying to me, Mr. government official, you have granted me moral authority over you.)
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To: El Gato

I missed that part I guess, but that is even worse! Basically the person was just saying “Yes, this is a format we use”. Not stating it was actually his Birth Certificate!


40 posted on 12/10/2008 6:32:43 PM PST by autumnraine (Churchill: " we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall never surrender")
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