Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Federal Deficit on Pace to Reach Record $1T
AP via Yahoo News ^ | 12/10/08 | Christopher S. Rugaber

Posted on 12/10/2008 6:45:34 PM PST by marshmallow

Gov't reports largest imbalance ever in Nov., annual deficit could reach record $1 trillion

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The federal government ran a record budget deficit in November, putting Uncle Sam on track to post an all-time high annual shortfall of $1 trillion or more.

In just the first two months of the budget year that started Oct. 1, the deficit totaled $401.6 billion, nearly matching the record gap of $455 billion posted for all of last year, according to Treasury Department data released Wednesday. If the deficit does top $1 trillion for the current budget year, it also would be a post-World War II high when measured as a percentage of the economy.

The increased red ink stems from both lower tax revenue and increased spending that is a result of the recessionary economy. The government is receiving less in business and personal income taxes while spending more on programs such as unemployment insurance and food stamps.

Elsewhere, emergency aid for the nation's imperiled auto industry was thrown into jeopardy Wednesday as some Republicans revolted against a hard-fought deal between Democrats and the Bush White House to speed $14 billion to the ailing carmakers.

Then there's the $700 billion bank rescue program. The Treasury report showed that the government spent $76.5 billion from the program in November and $191.5 billion over the past two months.

A congressional oversight panel on Wednesday questioned whether Treasury is following a clear strategy in its use of those funds. The panel, which includes academic and labor representatives, also asked in a report whether the rescue effort has helped any homeowners avoid foreclosure.

(Excerpt) Read more at biz.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: gwbush; rino
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-83 next last

1 posted on 12/10/2008 6:45:34 PM PST by marshmallow
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot; Mase; expat_panama

Here’s another thread where we should ask whether the limitation of our purchases of foreign goods can help.


2 posted on 12/10/2008 6:49:06 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: marshmallow

What if we had laws that said you had to balance the budget?

What if we had kept spending at 2000 levels and increased only at the level of inflation?

What if we had PAYGO in place when Jorge Arbusto decided he wanted to buy off seniors or go fight a war in Iraq?

What if we hadn’t gotten rid of the rules that said debt levels were limited at 12:1 ratios instead of letting the banks and financial houses keep borrowing and lending without a care?

What if......?


3 posted on 12/10/2008 6:52:17 PM PST by misterrob (Smooth talkers win at singles bars and in politics .. often with similar outcomes for the listener)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: misterrob

Deficits dont matter. Its not like they add to the National Debt or anything./s


4 posted on 12/10/2008 6:57:35 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

Trade wars are to no one’s benefit. However, shopping locally when and where possible is a good thing. China is going into tailspin because we are not importing like we used to.


5 posted on 12/10/2008 6:58:04 PM PST by misterrob (Smooth talkers win at singles bars and in politics .. often with similar outcomes for the listener)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: bamahead; AuntB

$1 trillion in one year. I’m at a loss for words.


6 posted on 12/10/2008 6:58:38 PM PST by Clintonfatigued (If Islam conquers the world, the Earth will be at peace because the human race will be killed off.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: marshmallow

Obama, you want to give us real change from Bush? Balance the budget. Yes, we can balance the budget without cutting defense or raising taxes. Yes, we can!


7 posted on 12/10/2008 6:58:53 PM PST by ari-freedom (Conservatives solve problems. Libertarians ignore problems. Liberals create problems.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: misterrob

“China is going into tailspin because we are not importing like we used to.”

yeah because our economy sux


8 posted on 12/10/2008 6:59:51 PM PST by ari-freedom (Conservatives solve problems. Libertarians ignore problems. Liberals create problems.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: marshmallow
T'was this guy's fault.
9 posted on 12/10/2008 7:05:29 PM PST by BufordP (Had Mexicans flown planes into the World Trade Center, Jorge Bush would have surrendered.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

Guess we should be grateful for giving our money away for toxic products./s


10 posted on 12/10/2008 7:07:40 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: misterrob

No argument there. But that has nothing to do with the fact that our government spends more money than it takes in.


11 posted on 12/10/2008 7:08:53 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Perfect non sequitur. Thanks for sharing.
12 posted on 12/10/2008 7:13:57 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

It absolutely follows. Thanks for denying


13 posted on 12/10/2008 7:15:22 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

Oh really? Please explain.


14 posted on 12/10/2008 7:18:05 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: All

The libs sure LOVE their CORPORATE WELFARE all of a sudden ...don’t they?


15 posted on 12/10/2008 7:21:06 PM PST by uncle fenders
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

Where do you think the federal deficit comes from? Define the federal deficit for us. You think its a simple matter of spending more than we take in, tax wise. How is it that we have a “trade deficit” with countries like China, but not Saudia Arabia?


16 posted on 12/10/2008 7:24:36 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: ari-freedom

Hey, there is a danger when the pusher gets his customer hooked on the junk. At some point the junkie gets clean or winds up dead.


17 posted on 12/10/2008 7:27:03 PM PST by misterrob (Smooth talkers win at singles bars and in politics .. often with similar outcomes for the listener)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

You can’t be serious. You think we have a trade surplus with Saudi Arabia?


18 posted on 12/10/2008 7:29:29 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: misterrob

“What if......?”

What if our government weren’t able to monetize debt, and therefore had to go asking for loans? Would anyone give them the time of day?

What if there was no national currency to mess around with?

What if gumdrops rained from the sky?


19 posted on 12/10/2008 7:31:47 PM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Saudi Arabia had been running surpluses until oil cratered. They import pretty much everything but oil. We also only get about 12% of our crude from S.A.
20 posted on 12/10/2008 7:31:59 PM PST by rb22982
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

Saudi Arabia has had a slim trade surplus with the US, but nothing compared to China. Your argument is there is no correlation(nothing follows) between the trade and federal deficits. You would be mistaken.


21 posted on 12/10/2008 7:33:21 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321; 1rudeboy
Where do you think the federal deficit comes from? Define the federal deficit for us. You think its a simple matter of spending more than we take in, tax wise.

Yes.

How is it that we have a “trade deficit” with countries like China, but not Saudia Arabia?

You'd have to go back to 1998 for the last time we had a trade surplus with the Saudis. And before that, 1985.

Source

22 posted on 12/10/2008 7:34:47 PM PST by Toddsterpatriot (The enemy is in your heart, self respect robbed by self pity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: rb22982

They run surpluses with almost every country because oil is pretty much all they have. We get most of our oil from Canada. The point is the federal deficit is directly liked with trade and trade deficits. In a global economy they run hand in hand.


23 posted on 12/10/2008 7:36:00 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Your argument is there is no correlation(nothing follows) between the trade and federal deficits. You would be mistaken.

I pay cash for my oil import from Saudi Arabia. Please explain how that causes the government budget deficit to increase.

24 posted on 12/10/2008 7:36:41 PM PST by Toddsterpatriot (The enemy is in your heart, self respect robbed by self pity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

the deficit is tiny compared to China. My argument is trade and federal deficits are closely linked and 1rudeboy said my argument didnt follow


25 posted on 12/10/2008 7:37:32 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Your argument is there is no correlation (nothing follows) between the trade and federal deficits. You would be mistaken.

And you would have to prove it.

26 posted on 12/10/2008 7:38:16 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

And this gets to the nut of your argument: if we can get the trade deficit to decrease, then the budget deficit will also?


27 posted on 12/10/2008 7:39:58 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

That’s not really true necessarily. A good case in point is Japan.


28 posted on 12/10/2008 7:42:20 PM PST by rb22982
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

Oil is bought by the government as well. Oil is a commodity. When we ship our dollars over for a product that is worth substantially less than that dollar is worth, you have both a trade and federal deficit.


29 posted on 12/10/2008 7:43:37 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: rb22982

we dont buy oil from japan


30 posted on 12/10/2008 7:44:57 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

As trade deficits decrease we are buying more product for the same dollar. If we have more product that is worth what is being paid for, the federal budget becomes stronger with a stronger dollar, which means lower federal deficits.


31 posted on 12/10/2008 7:47:54 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

“Guess we should be grateful for giving our money away for toxic products”

This whopping deficit is all about wasting money on good, old American companies.

By the way, since when is our government stockpiling childrens’ toys?


32 posted on 12/10/2008 7:49:45 PM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
the deficit is tiny compared to China.

So what? You said we didn't have one.

My argument is trade and federal deficits are closely linked and

Only countries with trade deficits run government deficits? Do countries with trade surpluses have federal surpluses or at least no deficits? You have any facts to back up your "theory"?

1rudeboy said my argument didnt follow

Only because it doesn't.

33 posted on 12/10/2008 7:51:55 PM PST by Toddsterpatriot (The enemy is in your heart, self respect robbed by self pity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

I should have said we used to not have one.


34 posted on 12/10/2008 7:54:11 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: Tublecane

According to others here, though trade and federal have nothing to do with each other. How is it we are wasting money on American companies? The US buys more than just oil, by the way


35 posted on 12/10/2008 7:55:46 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

Im simply saying they are linked. They dont have to always be positive or negative in term of correlation. My response is its not a non-seq. argument


36 posted on 12/10/2008 7:57:41 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

A stonger dollar leads to higher trade deficits, and has nothing to do with the federal deficit. If you’ve been paying attention for the past decade.


37 posted on 12/10/2008 7:59:01 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
You are saying that they are linked, except when they are not. Non-sequitur.
38 posted on 12/10/2008 8:00:39 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

No, they are always linked. It may be a strong or weak correlation, but they are always linked. You said my argument didnt follow at all.


39 posted on 12/10/2008 8:02:28 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

Not the point—They have huge government deficits but trade surpluses.


40 posted on 12/10/2008 8:03:55 PM PST by rb22982
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

Uh, we have had a weaker dollar for the last decade and huge trade deficits. If fact the dollar has lost a tremendous amount over the last decade to other currencies and our “trade” deficit has exploded. Are you delusional?


41 posted on 12/10/2008 8:04:11 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Uh, we have had a weaker dollar for the last decade . . . .

Prove it. Not with your feelings, just prove it.

42 posted on 12/10/2008 8:06:16 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: rb22982

Japan has trade surpluses based on their currency valuation. Just like China keep the Yuan pegged to the dollar. Also Japan has been esentially in a recession almost all of the last decade


43 posted on 12/10/2008 8:06:31 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
Oil is bought by the government as well.

How much?

When we ship our dollars over for a product that is worth substantially less than that dollar is worth

Why would we pay $1 for something worth substantially less than $1? Did you ever take an economics class?

44 posted on 12/10/2008 8:07:18 PM PST by Toddsterpatriot (The enemy is in your heart, self respect robbed by self pity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: misterrob

We should not trade with countries that enslave their citizens. That is not “Free” trade. I think you would have to call it “Slave” trade.


45 posted on 12/10/2008 8:08:10 PM PST by ichabod1 (You won't know obammunism is here until it puts a boot in your (fat) bottom.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321
No, they are always linked. It may be a strong or weak correlation, but they are always linked. You said my argument didnt follow at all.

"It may be a strong or a week correlation" is no correlation, and certainly not a "link."

46 posted on 12/10/2008 8:08:18 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

http://www.tfc-charts.w2d.com/chart/US/M


47 posted on 12/10/2008 8:08:59 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

Apart from the other stuff, I’m sensing some serious confusion between “nominal” and “real.”


48 posted on 12/10/2008 8:09:56 PM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

Why would you pay 40 dollars for a plastic toy that is esentially worth 80 cents from China? Happens every day here in America. Why does the government pay 800 dollars for a toilet seat? Check out the SPR for amounts being bought for oil


49 posted on 12/10/2008 8:11:18 PM PST by dreadnought321
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: dreadnought321

Yeah, twice in the last 23 years. LOL!


50 posted on 12/10/2008 8:12:18 PM PST by Toddsterpatriot (The enemy is in your heart, self respect robbed by self pity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-83 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson