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Why chastity pledges by U.S. teenagers don't always ring true
The Daily Mail ^ | 30 December 2008 | Paul Thompson

Posted on 12/30/2008 11:22:07 AM PST by vivalaoink

Why chastity pledges by U.S. teenagers don't always ring true

Teenagers who vow to remain virgins until they marry are just as likely to have pre-marital sex as other young people, a study has found.

But they are less likely to use birth control when they do sleep with a partner.

The idea of abstaining from sex until marriage has gained wider popularity in the U.S. in the last decade. The Jonas Brothers, a three-piece boy band, are among those vowing to wait until they are married.

(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abstinence; antiamericanism; britishpress; culturewar; harvard; ifitfeelsgooddohim; promiscuity; sex; sexeducation; sexpositiveagenda; teens; teensex
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1 posted on 12/30/2008 11:22:08 AM PST by vivalaoink
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To: vivalaoink

Abstinence makes the hard grow fonder............


2 posted on 12/30/2008 11:23:00 AM PST by Red Badger (I was sad because I had no shoes to throw, until I met a reporter who had no feet.....)
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To: Red Badger

But Bubbafucco said the Lewinsky wasn’t sex.....!?!?!


3 posted on 12/30/2008 11:25:07 AM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But have a plan to kill everyone you meet)
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To: Squantos

For her...it wasn’t............


4 posted on 12/30/2008 11:28:27 AM PST by Red Badger (I was sad because I had no shoes to throw, until I met a reporter who had no feet.....)
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To: vivalaoink
Since we already know that's not what the study said, we must ask why the "newsies" said it did ~ or do we. I simply assume the MSM types and their women were and are the furthest thing from abstinence.

They seek validation of their own behavior.

5 posted on 12/30/2008 11:29:49 AM PST by muawiyah
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To: Squantos

Well I don’t think either one would lose their virginity with the things they were doing unless they went further later on. I am not sure how old you are but losing virginity means “going all the way. Not a BJ.”...lol.


6 posted on 12/30/2008 11:30:57 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: Red Badger

I think biology is going to win over words here - How many of us were horny teens 6 days a week?


7 posted on 12/30/2008 11:31:04 AM PST by vivalaoink
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To: vivalaoink
From the article: 'Taking a pledge doesn't seem to make any difference at all in any sexual behaviour,' said researcher Janet Rosenbaum of the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, Maryland. 'But it does seem to make a striking difference in condom use and other forms of birth control.'

Couldn't find much of what is behind this study, but it does seem to be her area of focus (virginity pledges)

http://bantha.org/~jerboa/

I do know that planned parenthood and other like to push this talking point. Not sure why the British Press would be interested in a US report by a private individual.

SEICUS is a sex positive teaching advocate (FOR active sexuality, it is a birthright, abstinence is unhealthy because it is a supression of sexual desires...)...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIECUS

They are affiliated with some of these studies and have a side in this debate. Just saying that it would be nice if someone who comes to this issue WITH a conclusion already in mind were upfront about biases.

8 posted on 12/30/2008 11:31:14 AM PST by weegee ("Let Me Just Cut You Off, Because I Don't Want You To Waste Your Question" - B.Obama Dec 16, 2008)
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To: vivalaoink

How many of us were ENCOURAGED to act on those impulses by parents and educators?


9 posted on 12/30/2008 11:31:46 AM PST by weegee ("Let Me Just Cut You Off, Because I Don't Want You To Waste Your Question" - B.Obama Dec 16, 2008)
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To: vivalaoink

I say teach it anyway and maybe a few will abide by it. Obviously people are going to eventually do what they want but if you can save a few than isn’t that worth it?????


10 posted on 12/30/2008 11:32:05 AM PST by napscoordinator
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To: vivalaoink
Newsflash: Chastity is Difficult.

Its being difficult does not make it ridiculous. Courage is difficult. Is it therefore not a virtue?

Sheesh. For some in the media and even in positions of power, thought is clearly difficult. No wonder they quit doing it!

11 posted on 12/30/2008 11:32:31 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: vivalaoink

I’d say most teenagers words don’t ring true in most matters.

no shock there.


12 posted on 12/30/2008 11:32:56 AM PST by WOBBLY BOB (ACORN:American Corruption for Obama Right Now)
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To: vivalaoink

I dunno. Back in my teenage days, the only “Chastity Pledge” was pledging you were going to lose it before your buddies.


13 posted on 12/30/2008 11:34:34 AM PST by JennysCool (Internet Powerhouse)
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To: vivalaoink
From yesterday:

Virginity Pledge Doesn’t Stop Teen Sex

This study is deeply flawed. What else would you expect from liberals with an agenda?

14 posted on 12/30/2008 11:35:51 AM PST by Responsibility2nd
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To: JennysCool

LOL!

I guess this further illustrates why minors aren’t held to legal binding contracts - it’s just not logical to assume they are going to keep them.


15 posted on 12/30/2008 11:36:15 AM PST by vivalaoink
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To: Red Badger

Abstinence makes the lap grow harder.


16 posted on 12/30/2008 11:36:15 AM PST by DogBarkTree (Sometimes you have to let it go in order to get a Grip.)
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To: vivalaoink

Can’t trust the media or the public education system. They have twisted facts to bash Christians before. I would like to know more aobut the John Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, Maryland. I’m also curious as to why the article didn’t mention how much money is spent on sex education.


17 posted on 12/30/2008 11:36:38 AM PST by pulaskibush (Thou shalt tax/steal from Peter to help Paul/Pablo is not in the Bible!)
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To: vivalaoink

Biology has been winning since before we crawled out of the slime. A hard pedro has no conscience.


18 posted on 12/30/2008 11:38:03 AM PST by DogBarkTree (Sometimes you have to let it go in order to get a Grip.)
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To: vivalaoink
How many of us were horny teens 6 days a week?

6 days a week?........mine had 7..........

19 posted on 12/30/2008 11:40:58 AM PST by Red Badger (I was sad because I had no shoes to throw, until I met a reporter who had no feet.....)
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To: Red Badger

Agreed, 7!


20 posted on 12/30/2008 11:48:17 AM PST by Colonel Jim
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To: vivalaoink
The Jonas Brothers, a three-piece boy band, are among those vowing to wait until they are married.

I think Britney Spears took that pledge too.

21 posted on 12/30/2008 11:48:51 AM PST by Larry Lucido
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To: Larry Lucido

Yes, clearly she has never had sex. LoL


22 posted on 12/30/2008 11:50:38 AM PST by Colonel Jim
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To: vivalaoink; All

My wife and I abstained until marriage, but that doesn’t mean it was easy. We weren’t exactly pure either. Just because you don’t do “it” doesn’t mean you are somehow “in the clear” if you made a commitment to abstain and still did things close to sex.

I could see why people with even less self-control on that issue could frankly go all the way. I know many who did and are pregnant now.

We never did a stupid pledge. We just knew we wanted to wait for religious reasons. I think the pledge thing is almost a joke, and it really isn’t helpful. Virtually nobody signing those dumb things actually keeps it.


23 posted on 12/30/2008 11:51:29 AM PST by rwfromkansas ("Carve your name on hearts, not marble." - C.H. Spurgeon)
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To: RedRover

Perhaps you were a Beatle....8 days a week!!!!


24 posted on 12/30/2008 11:51:39 AM PST by lilycicero (You can't spell Chastity w/out..........oh never mind....my pledge starts now.)
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To: vivalaoink

What, we needed a 300 word column? Because even chaste people get horny as a freaking toad. There. I just saved you a ton of paper and ink.


25 posted on 12/30/2008 11:51:47 AM PST by domenad (In all things, in all ways, at all times, let honor guide me.)
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To: Larry Lucido

Pure as the driven snow. LoL


26 posted on 12/30/2008 11:51:57 AM PST by Colonel Jim
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To: Red Badger

7 days without sex makes one weak.


27 posted on 12/30/2008 11:54:08 AM PST by weegee ("Let Me Just Cut You Off, Because I Don't Want You To Waste Your Question" - B.Obama Dec 16, 2008)
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To: Squantos
But Bubbafucco said the Lewinsky wasn’t sex.....!?!?!

CHORTLE!!

28 posted on 12/30/2008 11:54:55 AM PST by frogjerk (Welcome|Goodbye to|from Free|Fairness Doctrine Republic!)
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To: weegee

LoL!!!


29 posted on 12/30/2008 11:55:17 AM PST by Colonel Jim
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To: rwfromkansas
The argument being made by the MSM is that taking the pledge encourages "unsafe sex".

I'm sure they'd all like to believe that ~ "newsies" do like their "unsafe sex" and all.

And that's the real point ~ look, back in the old days pranksters and whores would put up names with phone numbers in public phonebooths. These days all you gotta' do is call a reporter!

30 posted on 12/30/2008 11:58:58 AM PST by muawiyah
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To: vivalaoink

hormones?


31 posted on 12/30/2008 12:03:29 PM PST by SeminoleSoldier
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To: vivalaoink

Certainly, the concept of a “virginity pledge” comes in somewhere on the scale between absurd and useless. If a teen is raised without the moral background to abstain from sex, a pledge won’t help; and if they are raised with that background the pledge is unnecessary.

Regardless, the way these news stories twist and spin you’d think that high schools were forcing their students to make these things. Nonsense, these are private individuals making decisions apart from the state apparatus - something liberals can’t stand.


32 posted on 12/30/2008 12:03:48 PM PST by eclecticEel (In short, I want Obama given the same respect and deference that Democrats have given George Bush)
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To: vivalaoink
B. S.

Where is the study?
What were the criteria?
Where is the rull report of its methodology and results?

33 posted on 12/30/2008 12:06:10 PM PST by unspun (PRAY & WORK FOR FREEDOM - investigatingobama.blogspot.com)
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To: muawiyah
If you want a couple to become abstinent, marry them together.
34 posted on 12/30/2008 12:09:39 PM PST by weegee ("Let Me Just Cut You Off, Because I Don't Want You To Waste Your Question" - B.Obama Dec 16, 2008)
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To: vivalaoink

media and academia, dutifully preparing the ground for BO to launch a radical Planned Parenthood agenda


35 posted on 12/30/2008 12:18:14 PM PST by Buckeye McFrog
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To: muawiyah

You are speaking to one. What would you like in the paper? :)


36 posted on 12/30/2008 12:18:54 PM PST by rwfromkansas ("Carve your name on hearts, not marble." - C.H. Spurgeon)
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To: vivalaoink

How many of these teens felt coerced into the initial pledge? For far less important things, the law (ass though it often is) realizes that it is difficult for teenagers to understand the ramifications of their word being their bond, so contracts with minors are unenforceable. Coercion also works against contract enforceability, even after the age of 18.

I realize this is a different situation, but if these pledges were made under peer, parental, or church pressure, they aren’t going to always stand up when pressures of a different sort come to the fore.

And, before I’m asked, the thought of a virginity pledge was far from my mind when I was a teen.


37 posted on 12/30/2008 12:21:42 PM PST by Pearls Before Swine (Is /sarc really necessary?)
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To: weegee

The cure for nymphomania————wedding cake and a ring.


38 posted on 12/30/2008 12:29:27 PM PST by Tahoe3002
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To: Pearls Before Swine

Don’t know if I should post this but it seems relevant.

A good friend of the family was very active in beauty pagents. She was very talented and of course, beautiful. Well, she became Miss -———. And she was very close, very close,to becoming Miss America.

Anyway, her “platform” or whatever was chastity until marriage. NO SEX!!!till I got that ring, bud. Did I say we’re from a small town? So, to be true to her pledge she didn’t have intercourse. OH NO!!! She let her boyfriend do her, ah, up the....ah, in the...ah, well you know. Where the sun don’t shine. Yes, really.


39 posted on 12/30/2008 12:33:47 PM PST by saleman (!!!!)
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To: vivalaoink

Something is wrong here.

In 2006, the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health partnered with The Lancet to say that 665,000 Iraqis had been killed since the US occupation began.

“An article in the Wall Street Journal by Steven Moore, who worked as a pollster for the coalition authorities in Iraq, attacked the sampling: “The key to the validity of cluster sampling is to use enough cluster points. In their 2006 report... the Johns Hopkins team says it used 47 cluster points for their sample of 1,849 interviews. This is astonishing: I wouldn’t survey a junior high school, no less an entire country, using only 47 cluster points.”

It is also important to note that: “the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health receives nearly 20 percent of all federal research funds awarded to the 39 U.S. schools of public health.”

Heavily federally funded and using questionable statistical methods?


40 posted on 12/30/2008 12:38:15 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: vivalaoink
I think biology is going to win over words here - How many of us were horny teens 6 days a week?

I wasn't. 7 days.

41 posted on 12/30/2008 12:48:24 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: eclecticEel
Regardless, the way these news stories twist and spin you’d think that high schools were forcing their students to make these things.

Some schools are "encouraging" students to make these pledges. My son refused and was asked for an explanation of his refusal. He told them it was none of their business.

I think many of the kids play along and sign the paper.

42 posted on 12/30/2008 12:59:42 PM PST by Dianna (<i>)
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To: weegee
7 days without sex makes one weak.

LOL

On a slightly related subject (I guess), as a guy, something that makes me...well, not necessarily mad, nor sad, it just bothers me - is when women, especially "professional" women and in some cases, even church women, dress provocatively (top line down to the navel, skirt line up to the waist), and then expect the guys to not look. I'd have to be blind or gay not to notice...

As someone wisely said once, "If you're not for sale, don't advertise."

43 posted on 12/30/2008 1:00:14 PM PST by Christian4Bush (Role of the press: Republican scandal - prosecutors; Democrat scandal - Defense attorneys.)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Seeing that connection made me have to check, I see that Go Ask Alice (another advocate of the sex positive “anything goes, no moral judgements” agenda) is run by Columbia University.

But I did have to check.


44 posted on 12/30/2008 1:03:58 PM PST by weegee ("Let Me Just Cut You Off, Because I Don't Want You To Waste Your Question" - B.Obama Dec 16, 2008)
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To: vivalaoink

Anyone else sick and tired of these expert reports that tell us how we really live that are based on “surveys” of 1,000 human beings?
Excuse me but there are over 300 million people in the Uited States. I have serious problems with some agenda researcher picking 1000 people asking a few questions then reporting what all those 300 million people are doing or not doing........
Anyone thnk the result of a survey on kids and sex could vary based on location?


45 posted on 12/30/2008 1:20:59 PM PST by SECURE AMERICA (Coming to You From the Front Lines of Occupied America)
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To: JennysCool

Wick Wet - BUMP


46 posted on 12/30/2008 1:39:17 PM PST by DoingTheFrenchMistake
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To: weegee

They took the raw data (which does show that people who take pledges have sex less than those who don’t), and massaged it.

Specifically, they decided that comparing “pledgies” with “non-pledgies” wasn’t rational, since pledgies were more likely to be people who wouldn’t have sex. So they looked for OTHER factors like upbringing, religion, etc, to “weight” the information.

Once they had “comparable groups”, they found that within a “comparable group”, those who took the pledge had sex just as much as those who didn’t, but those who took the pledge were less likely to have a condom or birth control.

Now, the 2nd part is simply common sense. If you have pledged not to have sex, you probably are not on the pill, and probably don’t have condoms around.

On the other hand, the idea that you can find comparable groups in which you can then differentiate between pledgers and non-pledgers is problematic.

For example, suppose you have two girls of similar looks and circumstances, both from conservative christian homes. Both are taught not to have sex before marriage.

Which of the two is more likely to “take the pledge”? The one that feels more drawn to having sex. The pledge is a tool to help you resist temptation. A girl who has no interest in sex may not feel necessary to take the pledge, the girl who is getting pressure to have sex might take the pledge to help fend off the pressure.

Which means that, absent the pledge, it is likely the “pledgers” would have more sex than the non-pledgers.

The point is that “taking the pledge” is not some independent variable. A person’s circumstances is what DRIVES them to take the pledge, or not.


47 posted on 12/30/2008 2:54:44 PM PST by CharlesWayneCT
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To: vivalaoink

I was as horny as the next kid, and I’ve only had sex with my wife, and only had sex after we were married.

I had the opportunity, but knew it was wrong.

Just as I had the opportunity to steal, to kill, and to do other things that were wrong, but knew they were wrong.

We expect people to obey other laws. We would expect a horny ugly boy to refrain from sex if no girl will sleep with him. SO why can’t we expect other boys to refrain?


48 posted on 12/30/2008 2:56:26 PM PST by CharlesWayneCT
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To: CharlesWayneCT
We expect people to obey other laws.

I'm not sure the comparison is apt. It's not illegal for teenagers to have sex (unless they violate statutory rape laws)

49 posted on 12/30/2008 2:59:31 PM PST by Citizen Blade ("A Conservative Government is an organized hypocrisy" -Benjamin Disraeli)
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To: Dianna

I did the same thing your kid did when I was in school (refuse to sign such nonsense).

Good for him.


50 posted on 12/30/2008 4:59:39 PM PST by vivalaoink
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