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U.S. to abandon Israel
ISRAPUNDIT ^ | Dec 31/08 | Ted Belman

Posted on 12/31/2008 7:06:25 PM PST by tedbel

U.S. Intelligence Official about Israel: "This is just the beginning".

U.S. Intelligence official "breaks silence" on Israel situation"

Homeland Security

31 December 2008: Northeast Intelligence Network director Doug Hagmann interviewed a highly-placed U.S. intelligence official late yesterday who not only confirmed rumors about escalated and more intensive Israeli military operations against the Muslim terrorists in Gaza, [but] warned of the increasing probability of abandonment of Israel by the U.S. and other Western countries based on what he termed "malicious intelligence."

"Remember that term," advised this well-placed intelligence official, "you'll be hearing it again."

"This is just the beginning," stated this intelligence official, who wished to remain anonymous. This official stated that the possibility for a much more protracted ground war is more likely today than at any other time in the past, adding that Israel is exercising her right to protect herself from her enemies in Gaza. But there is a catch, noted this official, and a big one at that: Israel could be about to lose the support of the United States.

    "I have every reason to believe, based on what I've seen at my level of [security] clearance especially over the last several years, that Israel will soon be completely on their own… or worse."

When asked what could be worse than losing the support of the United States, he stated:

    "when our administration provides more support to Arab countries [with] financial and military aid, undercutting Israel's defense efforts all while pushing Israel to succumb to the pressure of unreasonable demands designed to end with their political annihilation as a nation."

(Excerpt) Read more at israpundit.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Israel; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: ally; arabs; dhs; gaza; hamas; islam; israel; jihad; obamaspals; proarab
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To: rmlew; SJackson; Yehuda

ping


101 posted on 12/31/2008 8:09:48 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: killjoy
U.S. to abandon Israel

Good

Care to elaborate?

102 posted on 12/31/2008 8:12:34 PM PST by Las Vegas Ron (The tree of liberty is getting mighty dry)
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To: Shadowstrike
I would generally classify myself as a Dispensationalist / Premillenialist.

But I don't feel that I need to know the details of the last days. Whether Rapture is truly coming or not, does not seem an essential point to me (my job is to get right with God -- He's in charge of the rest of the details). However, I do think the last days are coming, Christ will return, that Israel is in trouble, and that the US will abandon her.

103 posted on 12/31/2008 8:13:30 PM PST by ClearCase_guy
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To: PetroniusMaximus

He’s right; the actual WORD “Rapture” isn’t in Scripture, but it’s definitely implied in verses like the one you quote.

The Greek Term is “Harpudzo” or something like that.
What it means is to “catch” or to haul in as a fisherman hauls in his catch. Ever wonder where we get the word for “harpoon”?

The term “Rapture” comes from another term that I can’t remember right now which at the time meant to snatch or to suddenly seize and carry away - as a RAPTOR (Eagle, hawk, owl etc.) does to it’s prey. The general meaning is quite similar to “Harpudzo” though.
One popular speculation is that just as the risen Christ levitated away from the Earth into the clouds in their amazed sight, so will his followers in due season.

Others think we’ll explode or suddenly vanish in a flash of light and clap of thunder as the air rushes in to fill the vacuum left by our rapidly vanishing body. Perhaps we’ll just sort of fade away and leave our empty clothes in a pile on the ground.
I’ve had dreams of climbing on to the back of a huge white eagle with golden beak and eyes, to be lifted off of this terrestrial globe.

I may or may not be here to see it, but it surely will be interesting!

The study of eschatology is at best, IMHO, an excersize in passionate, chaotic and often contentious speculation. Usually Theologians both amature and professional who really KNOW what the prophets meant and exactly what the future holds in store for us... probably don’t.


104 posted on 12/31/2008 8:14:34 PM PST by George Varnum (Liberty, like our Forefather's Flintlock Musket, must be kept clean, oiled, and READY!)
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To: familyop

Uh, I said that God formed an New Covenant. Do you understand the illogic of posting quotes from the Old Covenant to dispute that?

That’s like my saying the Articles of Confederation are the governing laws of the US, and when you point out there is a Constitution now, my quoting from the AOC to dispute you.


105 posted on 12/31/2008 8:15:51 PM PST by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: advance_copy

AC, I always thought that Rev. 12:14 meant the US, as our symbol is the eagle, and this is the strongest or greatest “eagle” ever known. Almost sounds like we would use our airlift capacity at that time to move the “woman”, Israel, to a place of safety.

I never associated Dan. 7:4 with the Great Britain/USA connection—I always thought that this referred to empires that would rise and fall from Daniel’s time.

But what if the images in Daniel 7 are not meant to span time( such as the image of the statue Daniel saw in another dream in Chapter 2), but to reflect contemporary global entities in a short time span of a period to come? We would not know who was being described until the time for them to be revealed—then Daniel’s words would provide important clues to their identity, and allow understanding of the chapter.

For instance, the wings plucked from the lion could mean Babylon, as the lion was a symbol of Babylon, if Chapter 7 was a mirror to Chapter 2, as is commonly assumed.

But the lion is also a symbol of Great Britain. And the wings being plucked from the lion, indicates a seperation out from the lion, and the USA is represented by a symbol with wings, and we came out of Great Britain.

Perhaps these other descriptions in Chapter 7 mean similar contemporary enitites or powers. The bear-could this be Russia( in it’s newest reincarnation and insertion in MiddleEast politics? The leopard—China? The last vision is of the AntiChrist’s powerbase, a ten nation confederacy that is yet to be.

Food for thought...................


106 posted on 12/31/2008 8:17:41 PM PST by exit82 (It's all Obama's fault. And Biden is still a moron. They are both above their paygrade.)
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To: 444Flyer

Since the November elections, I firmly believe that this country will pay a price for electing a muslim as the leader of the free world. It is his first religion and the one he holds dear. What that price will be or what form it will take, I have no idea, but I do know that all belivers will recognize it once it takes shape.


107 posted on 12/31/2008 8:17:56 PM PST by skimask (Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience)
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To: tedbel
This from the same intellegence community that told the world that Iran was not intending to build Nukes. Like I would trust a word they say.

Wait until PEBO betrays Israel. What will the Jews that supported him think. I mean, you know, he like stopped supporting the terrorists for a day while he talked to liberal Jewish leaders. So they could support him. What was the term for Jews that helped the Nazis in WWII?

108 posted on 12/31/2008 8:17:57 PM PST by Nuc1 (NUC1 Sub pusher SSN 668 (Liberals Aren't Patriots))
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To: Cacique; All; SJackson
There is a wonderful piece by Alan M. Dershowitz on the Idiocy of Moral Equivalence. Click Here
109 posted on 12/31/2008 8:23:11 PM PST by Larousse2 (Like June Carter Cash, "I'm just tryin' to matter.")
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To: Mom MD
"No. Ezekiel 38 clearly states when Israel fights the war with Russia and Iran they will stand alone."

Descendants of the tribes mentioned there cover most of the nations of the earth. You might also find Isaiah 18 interesting.


110 posted on 12/31/2008 8:23:49 PM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), NG, '89-'96, Duncan Hunter or no-vote, http://falconparty.com/)
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To: ClearCase_guy

Oh, I do agree with you about the last days coming, and I pray that we are all right with God. :)


111 posted on 12/31/2008 8:24:15 PM PST by Shadowstrike (Be polite, Be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Pinkbell
"But but but...the majority of Jews voted for Obama."

Ironic, isn't it.

112 posted on 12/31/2008 8:28:27 PM PST by YHAOS
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To: Chris DeWeese

Sitting in pews won’t save anyone. Only believing in Jesus can do that. As another person posted , the time lines can be debated but one thing is for sure and that is that we are on our Lord’s time.


113 posted on 12/31/2008 8:30:28 PM PST by CindyDawg (I)
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To: exit82

Food for derision and mirth.

No passage of scripture is subject to private interpretation. ONLY the Bible interprets the Bible. Every symbol in Revelation is explained somewhere else in the Bible.

If you would actually like to know what the meaning of what has been foretold ... here is a good beginning.

http://www.biblestudying.net/index.html


114 posted on 12/31/2008 8:30:39 PM PST by gost2
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To: Mom MD

Ezekiel 38 is about Gog and Magog. Let me know when they attack Israel.


115 posted on 12/31/2008 8:30:54 PM PST by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: George Varnum

Ditto to you sir.

Pre, mid or post - doesn’t matter. Prepare for post and hope for pre.


116 posted on 12/31/2008 8:30:58 PM PST by Uhaul (Time to water the tree of liberty...)
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To: tedbel
Israel could be about to lose the support of the United States.

Bullshit.

117 posted on 12/31/2008 8:32:55 PM PST by ScreamingFist (Annihilation - The result of underestimating your enemies. NRA)
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To: girlangler; killjoy
"Why on earth would you possibly think this is good?"

See the location of that citizen of the world on his or her FR page: Thailand. ...common philosophy among free traitors and the like.


118 posted on 12/31/2008 8:33:37 PM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), NG, '89-'96, Duncan Hunter or no-vote, http://falconparty.com/)
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To: tedbel

This looks really bogus. The US is not going to stop supporting Israel no matter who is president. Obama will try to encourage peace in the mideast just as all previous US presidents have done, and he will continue to support Israel as previous US presidents have done. You can count on that no matter what dubious internet posts are circulated.


119 posted on 12/31/2008 8:35:58 PM PST by Blanton
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To: tedbel

Dramaqueen Alert


120 posted on 12/31/2008 8:41:39 PM PST by VaBthang4 ("He Who Watches Over Israel Will Neither Slumber Nor Sleep")
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To: YHAOS; Pinkbell
"Pinkbell wrote:
"But but but...the majority of Jews voted for Obama."

YHAOS replied:
"Ironic, isn't it."

Not really.

Bush on Israel: Heartburn for All
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1844641/posts

President Abbas asks Congress help to release PNA funds withheld by Israel
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1844647/posts

Bush releases money to Abbas
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1844646/posts

Rice: Better to have Hamas in power than in streets
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1733397/posts

Rice: Palestinians deserve to live free of ‘occupation’[at an event of pro-Palestinian group]
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1717847/posts

US Supplies Fatah With Arms, Rice Decries “Occupation”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1718348/posts

Rice: Israel Must Withdraw from More than Gaza and Samaria
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1333354/posts

Disciples of Christ to Israel: Drop dead
http://209.157.64.201/focus/f-religion/1458942/posts

U.S. Presbyterians target five firms with Israel links
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1458765/posts

The Church Stares Into the Abyss (The dhimmitude of the Church of England)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1435084/posts

(Anti-Semitic) Anglican group urges Israel sanctions
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1430566/posts

Anglicans Call for Sanction on Investment in Israel to Uphold Justice
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1430772/posts

THE VATICAN AND THE STANDOFF AT THE CHURCH OF THE NATIVITY
http://www.jcpa.org/jl/vp515.htm

Two United Methodist gatherings urge selective divestment from Israel (official anti-Israel United Methodist Website)
http://www.umc.org/site/c.gjJTJbMUIuE/b.886089/k.A105/Two_United_Methodist_gatherings_urge_selective_divestment_from_Israel.htm

world council of churches (WCC)
church & ecumenical relations
http://www.wcc-coe.org/wcc/what/ecumenical/index-e.html
"Among those churches which are not members of the WCC, the most notable is the Roman Catholic Church (RCC). Since 1965 a Joint Working Group (JWG), co-sponsored by the WCC and the RCC, has met regularly to discuss issues of common interest and promote cooperation. The group meets annually. One of the church and ecumenical relations staff members serves as co-secretary for the JWG and helps to coordinate contact between the Council and the dicasteries of the Vatican through the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity. [And] . . . Though the Roman Catholic Church is not a member of the WCC, it is a full member of the Faith & Order Commission. The RCC also serves the team on Mission & Evangelism in a consultative capacity."

President Bush Calls for New Palestinian Leadership
The Rose Garden
June 24, 2002
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/06/20020624-3.html
"The United States, the international donor community and the World Bank stand ready to work with Palestinians on a major project of economic reform and development. The United States, the EU, the World Bank, the International Monetary Fund are willing to oversee reforms in Palestinian finances, encouraging transparency and independent auditing."

Quartet Joint Statement
Summary
July 16, 2002: Text of a joint statement issued by the "Quartet" (United Nations, Russian Federation, the United States and the European Union) following their meeting in New York
[Document behind the link.]
http://europa-eu-un.org/articles/sk/article_1489_sk.htm
"The new international Task Force on Reform, which is comprised of representatives of the U.S., EU, UN Secretary General, Russia, Japan, Norway, the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund, and which works under the auspices of the Quartet, will strive to develop and implement a comprehensive action plan for reform."

...little more background material:

Rice: Israel Must Withdraw from More than Gaza and Samaria
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1333354/posts
February 1, 2005

Bush and Sharon disagree over Israel's future
Wednesday June 27, 2001
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,513410,00.html

Sharon presses Putin to drop UN resolution on road map
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1013908/posts
4 November 2003

Commencement Address at Boston College (Secretary Condoleezza Rice, Boston, Massachusetts, May 22, 2006. US Department of State)

Excerpts:

As a student of a Catholic high school, the Sisters of Loretta taught me, I am pleased to be at an institution of higher education with such strong and celebrated Catholic and Jesuit traditions . . . You see, I got my Master's Degree at Notre Dame. (Boos.) I acquired a passion for the fighting Irish . . . and my family has been college educated and Presbyterian ever since. (Laughter and applause.) . . . I wandered into a course on international politics taught by a Czech refugee who specialized in Soviet studies, a man who had a daughter by the name of Madeleine Albright. With that one class, I was hooked. I discovered that my passion was Russia and all things Russian.


121 posted on 12/31/2008 8:43:27 PM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), NG, '89-'96, Duncan Hunter or no-vote, http://falconparty.com/)
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To: Blanton
People are just worried because Obama has clearly stated in one of his autobiographies that if things got ugly he would stand with the Muslims. And then Joe Biden said that early in Obama's administration things would get get bad (we'd be "tested") and Obama's reaction would be surprising and seem wrong.

Obama has no military experience, no executive experience. He has a history of voting "present" when faced with a tough decision.

I'm no soothsayer, so I don't know what Obama would do -- but there are certainly grounds to think that Obama might abandon Israel if there is a major war in that area. To him, it might seem like a politically safe course of action (I say that because I think Obama is a coward and also not very bright).

122 posted on 12/31/2008 8:45:36 PM PST by ClearCase_guy
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To: tedbel

As Benjamin Netanyahu has said, Britain in WWII is an analogy. And one thing that can be learned from that analogy is, every intelligence leak is intentional and purposeful.


123 posted on 12/31/2008 8:49:18 PM PST by the invisib1e hand (revolution is in the air.)
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To: pollywog

“It’s not called the Rapture but it’s there.”
______________________________

Or perhaps it’s not, and we’ve now entered the Tribulation Period to all appearances. We’ll know for certain soon.


124 posted on 12/31/2008 8:50:24 PM PST by cowdog77 ("Are there any brave men left in Washington, or are they all cowards?")
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To: familyop

there’s just not enough tinfoil in the world...


125 posted on 12/31/2008 8:51:47 PM PST by the invisib1e hand (revolution is in the air.)
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To: verity; tedbel; ClearCase_guy; fish hawk; Doug TX; conservativegramma; PistolPaknMama; TalBlack; ...

Interesting how some here swear the United States will never “abandon” Israel.

That was _then_, pre-Obama.

This is now:

“The Devil’s Bargain”
by Arthur Herman:
http://www.nypost.com/seven/12302008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/devils_bargain_146440.htm

Excerpt:


” Imagine if, in the summer of 1941, Adolf Hitler had approached Winston Churchill and Franklin Roosevelt with this deal: I will cease hostilities and leave the British Empire alone, if you leave me alone to finish my extermination of the Jews. Expect Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to offer a similar deal to Barack Obama come January.

“Officially, the offer will be Iranian cooperation with the West in Iran’s nuclear program, possibly including United Nations inspections - if the United States reverses course on its support for Israel, including its actions against Hamas in Gaza.

“Iran expert Ze’ev Maghen of Bar-Ilan University thinks this may be what top Iranian officials are preparing to offer the West in a kind of crude devil’s bargain. In short, Iran’s price for getting along with America, “the Great Satan,” will be our acquiescence in the destruction of “the Little Satan,” Israel.”


This could never happen, right?
Not a chance, right?
Not even with a pro-Muslim president of Islamic origins and upbringing, right?
Right?

- John


126 posted on 12/31/2008 8:53:09 PM PST by Fishrrman
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To: killjoy

Abandon Israel? What could you possibly mean by that?


127 posted on 12/31/2008 8:54:43 PM PST by ArmyTeach (You have a Republic, Madam, if you can keep it...)
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To: tedbel

If the USSA betrays Israel like the rest of Western civilization has, it will be a hot time in Iran. Boombaboombaboom!


128 posted on 12/31/2008 8:55:14 PM PST by pallis
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To: the invisib1e hand

Heh...tinfoil’s for anti-Israel, pagan movie stars, IMO. ...all in good fun and humor, of course. ;-)


129 posted on 12/31/2008 8:56:25 PM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt), NG, '89-'96, Duncan Hunter or no-vote, http://falconparty.com/)
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To: tedbel

**U.S. to abandon Israel**

Won’t happen.


130 posted on 12/31/2008 8:56:49 PM PST by Salvation ( †With God all things are possible.†)
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To: ClearCase_guy

BS


131 posted on 12/31/2008 8:57:57 PM PST by Buddy B (MSgt Retired-USAF - Year: 1972)
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To: Buddy B

ping


132 posted on 12/31/2008 9:03:20 PM PST by VNam68
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To: Chris DeWeese

Parousia. Is that better?


133 posted on 12/31/2008 9:04:20 PM PST by gitmo (I am the latte-sipping, NYT-reading, Volvo-driving, no-gun-owning, effete, PC, arrogant liberal. -BO)
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To: familyop
"Not really."

Your point? (In 100 words or less). { 8^)

134 posted on 12/31/2008 9:06:25 PM PST by YHAOS
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To: gost2

Sorry, no one can know with absolute certainty what Daniel is referring to. Even Daniel did not understand all that he had seen, and he said so. There were things Daniel saw that he was commanded to not reveal.

Even the source you linked was weak in its arguments about Chapter 7.

And the linkage we were discussing was Rev. 12 and Daniel 2, not Daniel 2 and 8 and Rev 13, then with 7, a sequence which your source discusses at length.

I’m well familiar with various end times theories and views.

But it is abundantly clear that God gives us enough information, so that when we are in the events being described, we will recognize them. Not one jot or tittle will be overlooked or dispensed with.

But as for knowing all of the eschatological details, there is room for interpretation.

In the end, it will unfold as God has foretold, whether we understand all of the symbolism or not.


135 posted on 12/31/2008 9:20:09 PM PST by exit82 (It's all Obama's fault. And Biden is still a moron. They are both above their paygrade.)
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To: fish hawk

I wouldn’t put much stock in anything coming out of Hagmann or NEIN.


136 posted on 12/31/2008 9:30:50 PM PST by thecabal (We care a lot)
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To: CindyDawg

Interpretation of Revelations is pretty deep and hardly anything for novices to talk or worry about. Plenty else in the Bible to focus on.


137 posted on 12/31/2008 9:36:24 PM PST by plain talk
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To: killjoy

Are you an Islamist?


138 posted on 12/31/2008 9:55:15 PM PST by streetpreacher (Arminian by birth, Calvinist by the grace of God)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

I wasn’t proud when we bombed the Serbs.


139 posted on 12/31/2008 9:57:15 PM PST by katykelly
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To: Nuc1
What was the term for Jews that helped the Nazis in WWII?

Atheists.

140 posted on 12/31/2008 9:59:26 PM PST by Polarik (quote)
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To: tedbel

yeah, so all you Israeli sympathizers that voted for Barack, start demanding your vote right back there

HOWS THAT CHANGE WORKING FOR YOU!


141 posted on 12/31/2008 10:01:37 PM PST by television is just wrong
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To: Ron Jeremy
Everything I Ever Needed To Know
142 posted on 12/31/2008 10:04:36 PM PST by Larousse2 (Like June Carter Cash, "I'm just tryin' to matter.")
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To: streetpreacher
Are you an Islamist?

No, but I have shot a few.

143 posted on 12/31/2008 10:09:17 PM PST by killjoy (Life sucks, wear a helmet.)
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To: tedbel

144 posted on 12/31/2008 10:11:38 PM PST by wedwo
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To: ClearCase_guy

obama may never take office.


145 posted on 12/31/2008 10:13:10 PM PST by television is just wrong
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To: CindyDawg
"It’s not called the Rapture but it’s there."

Try Second Coming of Christ.

vaudine

146 posted on 12/31/2008 10:17:47 PM PST by vaudine
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To: CindyDawg

Look at the tag attached to my name to see what will happen to the US if such comes to pass.


147 posted on 12/31/2008 10:22:20 PM PST by Ban Draoi Marbh Draoi ( Gen. 12:3: a warning to all anti-semites.)
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To: ClearCase_guy

http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_write_that_he_would_stand.html

Misleading e-mail: From Audacity of Hope: “I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.”

Actual quote from “The Audacity of Hope” [pg. 261]: Of course, not all my conversations in immigrant communities follow this easy pattern. In the wake of 9/11, my meetings with Arab and Pakistani Americans, for example, have a more urgent quality, for the stories of detentions and FBI questioning and hard stares from neighbors have shaken their sense of security and belonging. They have been reminded that the history of immigration in this country has a dark underbelly; they need specific assurances that their citizenship really means something, that America has learned the right lessons from the Japanese internments during World War II, and that I will stand with them should the political winds shift in an ugly direction.


148 posted on 12/31/2008 10:22:44 PM PST by streetpreacher (Arminian by birth, Calvinist by the grace of God)
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To: killjoy

So your animosity towards Israel stems from what?


149 posted on 12/31/2008 10:23:52 PM PST by streetpreacher (Arminian by birth, Calvinist by the grace of God)
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To: olezip

I remember when a leftist Jew commentator wrote that he was now at a point where he could imagine a world without Israel. The lefties out here where I live were furious with me for observing that the farther left politically a Jew was, the less supportive of Israel they were.

It was true then and it is true now. I have always wondered why American administratios invariably urged Israel to exercise restraint after they had been goaded in to attacking the Palastinians who have been killing them with regularity for years.

Something stinks! It is clear that Jimmy Carter is anti-Semetic. He is a leftie though not Jewish. He’s just a plain old fashioned redneck Jew hater. What has been puzzling is that Republican administrations have also asked Israel to soft pedal their military responses to being routinely murdered.

I don’t know what credence to give to this “intelligence” officer, since part of what they do is routinely pass along B.S. for their own purposes. If in fact Israel is abandoned, I believe that we will quickly find out what it is like to have nucleur weapons going off all over the planet.


150 posted on 12/31/2008 10:31:48 PM PST by SkipW
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