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China ups ante with new flattops
Asahi Shimbun ^ | February 14, 2009 | Kenji Minemura

Posted on 02/13/2009 8:13:23 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet

In a move likely to stoke concerns in Tokyo, Washington and throughout Asia, China plans to greatly expand the reach and firepower of its navy by building at least two nuclear-powered aircraft carriers.

Analysts believe China is expanding its naval power as part of a push toward strategic dominance over the western Pacific, including the waters that surround Japan.

Military sources said the first nuclear-powered flattops would be constructed in 2020 or later. China will begin construction of two conventional aircraft carriers this year.

According to sources, a meeting was held in Beijing on Dec. 30 among military officials.

A high-ranking military officer said the navy would begin construction of the two conventional aircraft carriers this year. Production of parts for the electricity control system has already begun in China and plans call for completing the two conventional carriers by around 2015.

A system for operating those carriers will be established by 2020, according to sources. Those two carriers would allow Beijing to extend its defensive reach beyond a so-called 1st extended defensive line linking Okinawa, Taiwan and the Philippines.

The two nuclear-power carriers being considered would be about 60,000 tons in displacement. Chinese officials have already obtained blueprints from Russia for the Ulyanovsk nuclear-powered aircraft carrier, which Russia no longer intends to build.

Chinese officials will likely use the blueprint as a reference point for their own development of a nuclear-powered carrier.

Analysts said China eventually wants to secure maritime control over the western Pacific that would lie within a so-called 2nd extended defensive line stretching from Japan to Guam and Indonesia.

The ultimate goal for China would be serving as a counter force to the U.S. Navy for the entire Pacific and Indian oceans.

A Chinese military source said: "The two conventional aircraft carriers we will begin constructing from this year will only be the opening gambit. While constructing and operating nuclear-powered aircraft carriers will require huge amounts of money, it will not be a large barrier considering our present pace of economic development, so there is the possibility of building even more in the future."

The white paper on national defense released by China on Jan. 20 for the first time clearly stated a policy of "improving strategic capabilities in distant waters." However, no mention was made of constructing aircraft carriers.

The Chinese navy has set up a special task force for construction of aircraft carriers titled, "the 048 office."

Construction has already begun on a wharf along Yalong Bay in the Sanya district of Hainan island. The wharf would provide base functions for aircraft carriers as well as include underground storage for ammunition.

Currently, only the United States and France have nuclear-powered aircraft carriers.


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: china; geopolitics; navair; navy; seapower
Just building the ships is the easy part.
1 posted on 02/13/2009 8:13:23 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

You’re so right. Packing the ship with advanced technology takes the assistance of the Clintons. Now showing as a Secretary of State in a country near you.


2 posted on 02/13/2009 8:14:46 PM PST by coloradan (The US has become a banana republic, except without the bananas - or the republic.)
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To: coloradan

She’s going to Asia to finish the job of our hubby.


3 posted on 02/13/2009 8:17:17 PM PST by max americana
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

If they build them they are fighting the wars of the last 60 years. Unmanned aircraft launched from all classes of ships and loiterable drones are the wave of the next 20-30 years.


4 posted on 02/13/2009 8:20:31 PM PST by wxgesr (I want to be the first person to surf on another planet!)
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To: max americana

It’ll cost ‘em though.


5 posted on 02/13/2009 8:22:18 PM PST by Seven plus One
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; Jeff Head

bump


6 posted on 02/13/2009 8:25:17 PM PST by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but they're true.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
Carrier quals for the airwings will be so much fun to watch.

Popcorn, beer, lotion and glasses at 5 miles would be great accommodations.

5.56mm

7 posted on 02/13/2009 8:28:21 PM PST by M Kehoe
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To: wxgesr

We still build them. They are still powerful symbols as well a foating theater command centers. Smaller navies use them as floating aid centers, rescue and evac, and amphibious deployment.

Much of it is symbolism. China wants to play on the world stage and in space.


8 posted on 02/13/2009 8:33:53 PM PST by ffusco (Maecilius Fuscus,Governor of Longovicium , Manchester, Englan d. 238-244 AD)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

This is a pretty ambitious project for a country that hasn't seriously ventured outside its shoreline. Building them is one thing. But then what?

www.fas.org

9 posted on 02/13/2009 8:34:38 PM PST by Seven plus One
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To: wxgesr

If they build them they are fighting the wars of the last 60 years. Unmanned aircraft launched from all classes of ships and loiterable drones are the wave of the next 20-30 years.

also low cost ships with the ability to fire 100 cruise missiles rapidly.


10 posted on 02/13/2009 8:38:02 PM PST by bravo whiskey (NO I WON'T)
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To: wxgesr
You're right on with that analysis. There are also multiple new weapons coming out soon that can loiter for extended periods of time, waiting for enemy targets to enter their envelope. These plus UCAVs are going to be a nasty combination that few nations can afford to research, build, and operate effectively.
11 posted on 02/13/2009 8:38:26 PM PST by aegiscg47
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To: Seven plus One

Looks like they are going to build them with a curved up deck at the end so they can get a little bit of lift on take off, or am I interrupting the drawing wrong.


12 posted on 02/13/2009 8:54:18 PM PST by ReformedBeckite
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To: max americana; Fred Nerks; Beckwith; LucyT; F15Eagle; forkinsocket

Hitlery will help out with this carrier business by meeting with General Qian Lihua, who is very excited about China’s new carrier plan. Hitlery will grease the rails for tech on nuclear powered steam turbine generators to stream from the USA to Shanghai. Someone is going to sell out America for big bucks.

The Taiwanese do not think much of General Quian Lihua. Her is an animated cartoon the Taiwanese put up ridiculing him:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pm0jl_WSIGY&eurl=http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/12/china-to-start-construction-of-1st-aircraft-carriers-next-year/&feature=player_embedded


13 posted on 02/13/2009 9:20:11 PM PST by Candor7 (Fascism? All it takes is for good men to say nothing, ( member NRA)
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To: Seven plus One
We have many times made the mistake of underestimating the Chinese. Do not be surprised if military offivers from the USN are assigned by Obama to train their pilots and ship board infrastructure personell on carrier operations.

Goodbye Taiwan.

Elections indeed do have consequences.

14 posted on 02/13/2009 9:23:47 PM PST by Candor7 (Fascism? All it takes is for good men to say nothing, ( member NRA)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; Jeff Head

Chinese economy may soon implode..


15 posted on 02/13/2009 9:27:07 PM PST by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole....)
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To: ffusco
We still build them

Obama's gonna change that. Change the Red Chinese can believe in. Hope for the Jihadies.

16 posted on 02/13/2009 9:36:22 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: ReformedBeckite
There are a couple ways to get an airplane off a carrier. There is the STOVL method like the harrier, with or without a ramp. There is the catapult method, which is a lot more fun. Last is using a conventional airplane with a s@#%load of thrust and a "ski-jump" type bow.

The ski-jump basically give the airplane a little free lift until it can accelerate up to true flying speed.

Advantages of the ski ramp are that it doesn't take any maintenance and you don't have to design nose gear to attach to a catapult.

Disadvantages are not being able to carry as much weight, whether that be in weapons or fuel, than a catapult launched aircraft.

Rate of launch will be an open question. Catapults take a little bit of time to hook up, but catapult boats have four catapults to launch from. This boat has one ramp capable of lining up two aircraft for launch in sequence.

The other difference between this boat and American carriers is gross tonnage, deck space, and the ability to run cyclic flight operations. The super carrier give you the option to run constant flight operations as long as the crew can keep going. The bigger deck size allows for faster, bigger launches. That is the ability to launch protective fighters and a strike simultaneously. Smaller boats will have difficulty doing that.

17 posted on 02/13/2009 9:38:29 PM PST by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: USNBandit
Looking again at the diagram it looks like it also has a couple waist cats, but they are so close together that you have to shoot the inner cat before the outer cat.

On U.S. boats you can't shoot the waist cats or the bow cats simultaneously, but when in launch position the aircraft are spaced apart so you have the option of which to shoot first. We often shoot one waist and one bow simultaneously. That's nice if the other jet is your wingman, as you almost always get cleared by the "Boss" to join immediately.

18 posted on 02/13/2009 9:43:08 PM PST by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: magslinger

ping


19 posted on 02/13/2009 11:16:31 PM PST by Vroomfondel
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
I hope they place them strategically. Creating new artificial "reefs" can be a delicate process.
20 posted on 02/14/2009 2:46:19 AM PST by Caipirabob (Communists... Socialists... Democrats...Traitors... Who can tell the difference?)
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To: ffusco

We stil build them for political reasons, I am sure. I believe that we will see an end to the CVN or CVX wihtin the next 10-20 years. They are obsolete in the future years. We do need large deck amphib hybrids that will be able to deliver troops but with smaller unmanned weapons delivery systems and ISR platforms, manned flight from carriers already is fewer and smaller.


21 posted on 02/14/2009 5:18:38 AM PST by wxgesr (I want to be the first person to surf on another planet!)
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To: USNBandit
That drawing is of the Ex SovUn Project 1143.7 Ul'yanovsk laid down in 1988, scrapped 45% complete in 1992 after the Evil Empire went pear shaped.

It's a "reference point", but 30 years on, expect changes.

22 posted on 02/14/2009 8:43:49 AM PST by Oztrich Boy ( As for a future life, every man must judge for himself between conflicting vague probabilities. - D)
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To: ReformedBeckite
Looks like they are going to build them with a curved up deck at the end so they can get a little bit of lift on take off, or am I interrupting the drawing wrong.

That’s the way the Russians build them.

http://images.google.com/images?q=admiral%20kuznetzov&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B3GGGL_enUS298US298&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi

23 posted on 02/14/2009 9:28:51 AM PST by Cheburashka (Liberalism: a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.)
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To: Vroomfondel; SC Swamp Fox; Fred Hayek; NY Attitude; P3_Acoustic; Bean Counter; investigateworld; ...
SONOBUOY PING!

Click on pic for past Navair pings.

Post or FReepmail me if you wish to be enlisted in or discharged from the Navair Pinglist.
The only requirement for inclusion in the Navair Pinglist is an interest in Naval Aviation.
This is a medium to low volume pinglist.

24 posted on 02/14/2009 12:49:48 PM PST by magslinger (I talk to myself but sometimes I like a third opinion.)
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