In times of crisis, never forget the value of gold (William Rees-Mogg)

The Times(UK) ^ | 02/16/09 | William Rees-Mogg

[TigerLikesRooster]

In times of crisis, never forget the value of gold

The dollar is simply a piece of paper. Gold is a much better store of value and is the best insurance against future shocks

William Rees-Mogg

Last week was a bad one for bank shares; after the HBOS £8.5 billion loss, Lloyds shares fell by a third and other bank shares fell as well. Yet it was a very good week for the gold price, which closed on Friday at $935 an ounce, after reaching what was nearly a seven-month high of $953.30 on Wednesday.

Barclays Capital commented that gold prices were resuming their long-run bull trend after eight consecutive years of gains. For longer than the past eight years I have been arguing that investment in gold is an essential insurance against financial shocks. Last week was a classic example. Respectable British bank shares have now fallen by up to 90 per cent, while the gold price has risen by more than 200 per cent since Gordon Brown began selling the Bank of England's gold reserve.

I have been following the gold price since I published The Reigning Error, a short book on inflation, in 1974. I have not consistently advised people to buy gold - like all other assets, gold can become significantly overvalued, as it did in 1980. However, I have found that the movements of the gold price are one of the most useful pieces of evidence about the health of the world economy. Mr Brown's sale of gold was an avoidable error. My friend the MP Peter Tapsell repeatedly warned him in Parliament not to do it.

[Attention Surplus Disorder]

“!!!Beware of counterfeit Chinese silver dollars!!!
Grrr... those Chinese are into every fakery available.”

The abacus was invented in China thousands of years ago, but I suspect fraud was introduced into transactions about 35 minutes later, LOL.

[Attention Surplus Disorder]

http://coinauctionshelp.com/Counterfeit_Silver_Dollars_Fake_Trade_Dollars_Fake_Morgan_Dollar.html

Google “Counterfeit Chinese silver dollars” or “Counterfeit trade dollars” or “Fake Chinese silver/trade dollars”....you’ll find plenty of info.

There have pix on the net of factories in China with huge bins of fake coins. It’s alarming, to say the least.

[Axenolith]

An airstrike should be launched on those factories...

[Force of Truth]

Gold is overpriced as it is now.

[Force of Truth]

Rev 6:1-6

Now I watched when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder, "Come!" And I looked, and behold, a white horse! And its rider had a bow, and a crown was given to him, and he came out conquering, and to conquer. When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, "Come!"

And out came another horse, bright red. Its rider was permitted to take peace from the earth, so that men should slay one another, and he was given a great sword. When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, "Come!" And I looked, and behold, a black horse! And its rider had a pair of scales in his hand. And I heard what seemed to be a voice in the midst of the four living creatures, saying, "A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius, and do not harm the oil and wine!"

[M-cubed]

Good price...Where did u get them?

[dennisw]

“The Great Reckoning” changed my thinking about a lot of things. A great book. I read it in 1992 a few times since then

[jsh3180]

Apmex was selling, as of late last week, rolls of 20 “war nickels” for just a tad under spot price of silver. Each roll of 20 Jefferson war nickels has 1.125 oz pure silver. The coins are 35% silver, the remainder nickel. Cheapest US Mint silver I’ve seen anywhere. If (when) TSHTF, these would make great silver denominated coins for small purchases/barters. 0.0563 Oz silver per coin.

[RegulatorCountry]

Declare the private ownership of gold to be illegal, then take it away from the people who have "horded" it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've been under the impression that "seized" gold was compensated at price that was above market at the time, something like $35.00/oz.?

[Travis McGee]

Simple enough. Declare the private ownership of gold to be illegal, then take it away from the people who have "horded" it. It's been done before.

By the time they try that, millions of people will be hungry and afraid. They will have to take the guns at the same time in order to take the gold. IOW, they will risk igniting a dirty civil war if they try.

[Travis McGee]

Gold was “reimbursed” at 20 dollars and ounce, then FDR turned around and revalued it at 35 an ounce, instantly ripping off everyone who turned in their gold.

[ExSES]

Declare the private ownership of gold to be illegal, then take it away from the people who have "horded" it.

I would imagine that there would be a great deal of employee turnover in the "Taker" positions!

[ArtDodger]

A bit before my time but I believe you were allowed to own one ounce of gold at a time. Thank you, FDR. If you were in possession of more than one ounce, it was confiscated WITHOUT COMPENSATION!
By collecting all the gold and putting it into the Reserve, FDR could print more money. A mere formality not bothered with today. By calling in all the gold, changing the monetary notes from gold-backed to new, silver backed ones,instituting federal income tax collection, and ID-ing us all with Social Security Numbers, FDR could track every dime and its owner in the USA.
There is no refuge from the Socialism that is coming. Not gold, not foreign banks, not property, not hiding it under the bed. Other than taking the fight to the streets when they come for your rights, all is lost... And with 60% of the country already willing to wear uniforms with pretty red stars on the hats, well, we can go down trying,I guess.
I see reeducation camps in the future for many of us on Free Republic.

[GOPJ]

In a depression, gold should be going down with other commodities - it's not because of the underlying financial chaos.

Going to cash now includes putting actual cash in a safe deposit box. What is going on?

[TigerLikesRooster]

Many fear that, down the road, all those bailout money eventually come back to create hyperinflation(via catastrophic devaluation/sovereign default.)

[blam]

"Good price...Where did u get them?"

Here

[GOPJ]

Many fear that, down the road, all thosebailout money eventually come back to create hyperinflation (via catastrophic devaluation/sovereign default.)

Yep. And I'm one of those people...

[Chewbacca]

ARTICLE 1 SECTION 8, US COMSTITUTION:

No State shall make anything but gold and silver COIN a payment of debt.

[Chewbacca]

“Declare the private ownership of gold to be illegal, then take it away from the people who have “horded” it. “

You would cause the instant rebellion of millions of women and married couples that would refuse to turn over their jewelry and wedding rings to the government.

[Attention Surplus Disorder]

You’re right, the Ag content of war nickels is the highest multiple over face of any US coin: about 15x face vs 10x face for dimes, Q’s, H’s. But; I’d suggest they won’t be highly desirable as silver “fractions” because the fraction of silver is so low and the sheer logistics of any quantity of these things. (I’m not using the word “never”!) Which is reflected now and will be reflected “then” in the market price. Just my opinion. After all...imagine if I had a 17.3 lb block of steel which had 1 oz of pure Ag within it, totally assayed. How many of those would you want to drag around/store? Semi-ridiculous example, I admit. Point being: There is a good reason why the premiums are low on less desirable forms. Just a thinking point.

This is also illustrated by the dynamics of the sterling silver I’ve gathered over the years. Sterling, nominally 92.5% Ag, is really taken as 91% by refiners, you have to ship it to them, a cost that rises and rises over time and you had better insure it...last shipment I made was $9 freight and $16 insurance...they will give you (typ) 88% of the recovered metal vs 90% on junk silver even though the tare weight Ag content is higher on .925; they will extract 1-2% for “the pot”; they will decide which of the seven days they held your goods for processing will be the day your price is established, and golly gee, that will be the lowest 30-minute price established in the spot market that week.

http://www.midwestrefineries.com/

Note also; that as the price of Ag rises, since the various processing fees are “percentages of spot”...the higher the proc costs are. It’s a weird game. I don’t underestimate for one minute the hassles of maintaining and fueling a 2000+ degree furnace and an assay lab and dealing with fumes and fire regs and I’ll certainly not have same in my garage or back yard. But sterling silver only yields 80% of its actual weight.