Mutual funds are hazardous to your wealth

MarketWatch ^ | Feb. 15, 2009 | Doug Fabian

[nufsed]

The purpoes of what I am proposing is building wealth and retiring. In other words, benefits during life. The death benefit is secondary. In fact, the death benefit in an IUL is usually, the LEAST amount of insurance by IRS regulation. The emphasis is on growing the fund and takling the money out.

IULs are completely liquid. You can use it as your own bank to avoid non-preferred debt.

[nufsed]

Start with destructing the part where I responded to you calling me a fraud and then work your way down.

I don't shy away from questions or dissent, so why ask for permission to post. That didn't stop you before when you were making false accusations and acknowledging you didn't know much about the program I was recommending.

Bring it!

[nufsed]

Don’t be bashful about pinging your friends and neighbors.

[Uncle Miltie]

"Start with destructing the part where I responded to you calling me a fraud"

Okay.

I suspect your deep concern about ME calling YOU a FRAUD comes from my post #40: "Insurance purveyors who suppose they are offering an investment, in my experience, are usually A) Frauds."

Please read the whole sentence: "Insurance purveyors who suppose they are offering an investment, in my experience, are usually A) Frauds, B) Extremely Misleading, or C) Have such convoluted and long-term tax-based advantages that a really smart guy wouldn't dare enter that market without a PhD dissertation to back him up." This sentence leaves open two alternatives to Fraud.

Please note the subject of the sentence: "Insurance purveyors...in my experience." I have not met you, or had you pitch me insurance. My experience stands, the subject of the sentence stands, and this is factually true from my experience. Note that the subject of the sentence is NOT YOU.

Your apparent misunderstanding of that sentence follows rapidly in post #41: "Well you just accused me and my wife and three major insurance companies of being a frauds." That is factually incorrect. Please note again that neither you nor any particular insurance company (much less your three) is accused by me of being a Fraud. However, I do know personally (my brother-in-law as an example, sadly) of Insurance Agents who represent their offerings fraudulently.

Next, just to be doubly clarifying on the foregoing points, in my post #41, I particularly disabuse you of the notion that I have called YOU a FRAUD: "If the shoe fits....just kidding. More on this below." Emphasis added. Note further that below in the same post, to elaborate as promised, I point out that:

"most normal people, I believe, are duped into Insurance. That's not to say that a really great Financial Advisor couldn't understand it and guide people into proper vehicles. I'm just saying that virtually all the people so invested have no idea what they've been put into. Might be smart, might be stupid, but they have no idea. While that may not constitute fraud, it is really not a very nice thing to do to people." Emphasis added. Note that I particularly and repeatedly call out examples where insurance practices, including yours, may NOT BE FRAUD.

After repeatedly telling YOU that I was not accusing YOU of FRAUD, you remain perfectly oblivious, in post #44: "And the day they taught ethics about accusing people you don't know." Thumping you repeatedly between the eyes seems completely ineffective at this point.

Your post #83: "Don’t be bashful about pinging your friends and neighbors." Done.

[Uncle Miltie]

OBTW - Have your friends, neighbors, client list and prospect list come and read my Post #84. Please. Let them all render a judgment here.

[Uncle Miltie]

A question to the assembled multitudes:

Based on the thread as a whole, and with Post #84 having been considered:

Q: Did UNCLE MILTIE directly and distinctly charge NUFSED with FRAUD?

Standing by for a verdict of YES or NO. Reasoning for said judgement would be appreciated.

[Uncle Miltie]

Self correction in advance. In my haste, I lumped the often rotten apples (investments masquerading as insurance) in with the good ones (plain old risk insurance). Allow me a correction that is not on point to #84:

"most normal people, I believe, are duped into Insurance 'investment vehicles'."

[nufsed]

The answer is yes. You called me a fraud or misleading yada yada yada. Misleading is the same as dishonest. I don't open my opinons to a vote. And I don't stand for my character to be smeared by some wise cracker on the internet who showed he didn't even know what he was talking about.

If you want to apoliogize do so, but quit squirming and asking others to do denials you can't support.

[nufsed]

"duped" another libel.

I have nothing more to say to you. You can apologize or stop wasting time.

[Uncle Miltie]

I see you haven no refutation of Post #84.

As they say in NoDak: “Well there you go there then now, eh?”

[M. Espinola]

For Japan this is a replay of very recent history in that of the 'Economic Asian Flu'. During the Asian Flu crude oil prices dropped to under $11 a barrel, and gas at the pump sunk to below $1 a gallon, due to Asian nations curtailing advance purchases, thus creating a world-wide surplus. OPEC & the Russians were very ticked off.

We are heading down the same road, but this time it is not only Asia who has the economic flu.

[!1776!]

The purpoes of what I am proposing is building wealth and retiring. In other words, benefits during life. The death benefit is secondary. In fact, the death benefit in an IUL is usually, the LEAST amount of insurance by IRS regulation. The emphasis is on growing the fund and takling the money out. IULs are completely liquid. You can use it as your own bank to avoid non-preferred debt.

Can you use take all of the money out of the account (prior to the death benefit) without any tax implications?

[!1776!]

Not in my opinion.

I still can't get a straight answer from nfused on a couple issues...

[nufsed]

It's an insurance policy. You can take out all of the surrender value at any time. Increases as you earn over time. If you take everything out, you lose the death benefit and they close the policy. It would be like cashing out a regular life policy.

You could become your own bank. Let's say you put in 100,000 and you increase over time to 200,000. Now you want to buy a car or have an emergency and you want to take out 30,000. Take it out. The death benefit will diminish by 30,000 and no requirement to pay back. Pay it back with no interest if you want. You can be your own bank and avoid non-preferred debt the rest of your life.

No tax on cash out or taking retirmeent income or other withdrawals.

I see you complained to another poster about me being non-responsive to your questions. I was unaware I had open questions from you. Please direct me or repost.

[nufsed]

That's no tax on the contribution. No tax on the distribution. No tax on withdrawals. No tax on the growth. No tax on the death benefit.

I did this one yesterday. If you pay into a 401k or other tax deferred programs, you will pay 5-10 times the tax during retirement as you deferred during your work years.