Posted on 02/19/2009 11:16:59 AM PST by HighlyOpinionated
Animal owners, consumers and taxpayers: NAIS ALERT! Protect your right to farm and to eat local food. Speak out against the National Animal Identification System!
The USDA [http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usdahome] has proposed a rule to require all farms and ranches where animals are raised to be registered in a federal database under the National Animal Identification System (NAIS) for existing disease control programs. The draft rule covers programs for cattle, sheep, goats and swine. It also sets the stage for the entire NAIS program to be mandated for everyone, including anyone who owns even one livestock animal (for example, a single chicken or a horse). Learn more about the legislation in The Truth About the Animal ID Plan. [http://www.motherearthnews.com/Sustainable-Farming/2007-06-01/National-Animal-ID-System.aspx]
(Excerpt) Read more at motherearthnews.com ...
Remainder of Article with information of how to submit comments is at the link. [http://www.motherearthnews.com/Happy-Homesteader/Speak-Out-Against-NAIS.aspx?blogid=1510&utm_medium=email&utm_source=iPost]
If the government has the infrastructure to track every animal, it is a no-brainer to apply it to every person.
Will we be required to have collective farms now too?
Call for REFORM in 2010-2012!!!!!!!
I think some Civil Disobedience is called for en masse.
This is interesting since the government has opposed testing cows for mad cow but now they want to track all the cows - that would seem to undercut their strategy because once one cow goes downer it will be easier to see where the disease came from.
That said, I’m not sure I oppose this on its face.
We’re supposed to be so busy calling the USDA to oppose NAIS, the IRS about cabinet tax cheats, the FCC to complain about Fairness Doctrine, the Dept of Interior about concealed carry and forest fires caused by environmental regulation, the EPA about CAFE requirements....
Who The Frak has time to “grow and consume local food” if we’re supposed to spend so damn much time petitioning the bureacracy?
The Bureaucrats have unlimited time and money.
I say “stay home and do what makes sense and deal with them when they actually show up.”
Conspiracy theory alert! Is this plan, along with the hybridization of plants, a way to starve the us out?
Let's see, you want to force every person to chip every dog, cat, and chicken and report to the Federal government every time you take that animal off your property. You want a report to go to the Feds every time that animal sees a vet. You want it to be reported to the Feds if you decide to eat one too. You want a Federal database and a reportign system capable of tracking the whereabouts and status of hundreds of millions of "animals."
Do you fully understand the implications of what you want?
That is what is wrong with government bureaucratic risk management empowered by democratic whim. You don't have enough information to know what it's really about, until it's too late.
“Animal owners, consumers and taxpayers: NAIS ALERT! Protect your right to farm and to eat local food.”
Or you could, I don’t know....HUNT.
The USDA [http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usdahome] has proposed a rule to require all farms and ranches where animals are raised to be registered in a federal database under the National Animal Identification System (NAIS) for existing disease control programs.
Somehow I fail to see the urgent problem here.
Register your chimp for sure!
If you truly believe the gov has time to actually keep track of every time somebody’s dog goes to the vet, there’s not much that can help. The gov can’t find its a** with a crew of gov’t agents.
The NAIS program is designed to keep what happened in the UK with foot and mouth from happening here. If you are into watching billowing smoke from burning livestock carcasses month after month with no end in sight because farmers were playing games shifting livestock from one end of the country to the other, by all means, call in and oppose this.
Let’s see, you want
You want a report
You want it to be reported
You want a Federal database
Do you fully understand the implications of what you want?
Here is what he said,
That said, I’m not sure I oppose this on its face.
The elements I listed are all parts of the NAIS.
>>That said, I’m not sure I oppose this on its face.
Let’s see, you want to force every person to chip every dog, cat, and chicken and report to the Federal government every time you take that animal off your property. You want a report to go to the Feds every time that animal sees a vet. You want it to be reported to the Feds if you decide to eat one too. You want a Federal database and a reportign system capable of tracking the whereabouts and status of hundreds of millions of “animals.”
Do you fully understand the implications of what you want?
<<
I’m just going by the article but it said “register” not chip and it only says “The draft rule covers programs for cattle, sheep, goats and swine” - i.e. large food animals.
Plus i already have to register my dog plus isn’t Mother Earth news a bit left wing?
That said, if it turns into something worse or you are right that worse is already planned then yes i would oppose it. My comment goes to having to register large food animals so that diseases can be traced.
Geez. They aren’t talking about cats and dogs, although I am very happy my doggie has a chip. This is to track animals that enter the food supply, cows, and at some point I would expect pigs (for cholera and other diseases). The idea is to be able to trace any outbreak of mad cow disease so we don’t have to destroy every last cow in our country. They would chip calves when they are born, or brought across the border from Canada, and be able to tell where they had been. Mad cow has been spread by bad practices such as including cow material from sick cows in cow feed. That practice has been banned here, but, as the peanut butter episode is proving, not everyone follows all the rules all the time.
We had one incidence of the disease being detected in beef in 2003, and the Japanese blocked our beef exports for several years. Producers lost hundreds of millions of dollars. Ask the people in the UK what an outbreak of mad cow can do to the domestic food supply. It isn’t pretty. Given the dismal performance of the FDA and the Department of Agriculture, this is a pretty good idea. I buy what little meat I consume from a speciality butcher who gets his beef from a local producer he knows and trusts.
I know, I know...that'll never happen.....
The original NAIS proposal was exactly what I said it implied. The goal, as cooked up by lobbyists for corporate ag, is to preclude people from raising animals for food with the cost of compliance to bureaucratic regulations.
Since then, the Feds have backed off a bit on the regs, but do you really believe they won't come back by stages?
I chipped my dog. I chose freely to do so. I have no problem with the technology. What I oppose is the Feds mandating the States to do it. It may sound like is serves the purpose of food safety, but it is really not.
When they started it they were. Then they backed off at the noise. What makes you think they won't come back?
I chipped my doggie too. This has nothing to do with technology and everything to do with who controls the information.
The idea is to be able to trace any outbreak of mad cow disease so we don’t have to destroy every last cow in our country.
No, the idea is for corporate ag to put small producers out of business with the cost of tracking.
Given the dismal performance of the FDA and the Department of Agriculture, this is a pretty good idea. I buy what little meat I consume from a speciality butcher who gets his beef from a local producer he knows and trusts.
This plan will put your local producers out of business because the cost of capital is the same regardless of the size of the enterprise. Thus large producers have an incentive to lobby for an expensive tracking system as opposed to taking real measures on the ground to assure a safe product because tracking bad product is a one-time capital expense rather than a unit cost. If you think this is going to do a thing for food safety, you are seriously mistaken.
They can’t track 12 million illegals in order to deport them, but they want track about a zillion cows????????? These people are utterly insane.
Liberalism is an insidiously evil mental disease with no known cure.
Exactly! You have to eliminate the competition within the markets.
“That said, I’m not sure I oppose this on its face”
Ok lets say you are a small scale producer. Like me. Let’s say you raise anywhere between 3-4 head a year. One for your own consumption, selling the rest to pay for the one you eat. Under this proposal I’ll have to pay to register each and every animal.
Now as a contrast. Let’s say you are a large operation with hundreds or thousands of cattle. You register the enitre herd as one single entity. In other words my 4 head are potentially going to cost far more than a couple hundred head just to register.
Now lemme ask you this. Which beef would you rather eat. The one that spent it’s life standing on huge pile of manure fed god only knows what. Or the beef I raise which eats nothing but grass and grain? Which herd is more likely to inject diesease into the food stream?
This is not about tracking disease. This is about control.
Send your chimps to Washington and forget chipping. I think they could do better than what we have in control now.
>>Ok lets say you are a small scale producer. Like me. Let’s say you raise anywhere between 3-4 head a year. One for your own consumption, selling the rest to pay for the one you eat. Under this proposal I’ll have to pay to register each and every animal.<<
If the price for registration is too high that;s a different argument.
I’m from Gerogia and we are a large peanut producing state. I’m glad they were able to trace to Salmonella outbreak to one company because it kept a broader run on peanut butter from occurring.
Even knowing that no major brands are effected, peanut butter sales are still down by a third.
Do I want excessive fees or to make small farmers unable to compete - of course not -that’s not conservative. Do I want this to spread to non-food animals? - no I don’t see where that’s the government’s business.
But, on the surface I don’t see a problem with keeping up with the movement of large food animals... particularly in this day when they may come in from Mexico under God knows what conditions.
‘Conspiracy theory alert! Is this plan, along with the hybridization of plants, a way to starve the us out?”
There is much talk about dependence on foregn oil...ever looked at how much food we import?
It will never happen.
But if it ever did...and I am as die hard liberal as you are going to find...I will get a gun and stand along side you in the resistance :)
I think that this legislation is a smoke screen. Once the database has been collected, taxing of “greenhouse gasses” from animals will be next, using this list. The EPA was ordered by the USSC to declare whether CO 2 is a pollutant. They are going to declare that it is. Once that is done, taxing will come immediately after that.
On the money post.
BTTT
Ok lets go on and discuss what this means to horse owners.
Currently if you want to hop on your horse and go for a ride you just go.
With this nonsense you essentially will have to file the equivalent of a flight plan. Detailing out where you plan on going, how long you plan on being gone blah blah blah. Every time you move a horse off of your property you have to do this. For what purpose? To protect the community from a food borne illness?
It’s not about controlling disease. It’s not about being able to track problem back to a single producer, heck they already do pretty good job of that.
Which each proletarian commune receive a mule once they register?
>>Ok lets go on and discuss what this means to horse owners.
Currently if you want to hop on your horse and go for a ride you just go.
With this nonsense you essentially will have to file the equivalent of a flight plan. Detailing out where you plan on going, how long you plan on being gone blah blah blah. Every time you move a horse off of your property you have to do this. For what purpose? To protect the community from a food borne illness?<<
that doesn’t sound like a reasonable policy - without the mandate to keep food safe I don’t see how they would justify registering horses nationally.
But I also don’t see anything that suggests day trips would be tracked with something like a flight plan.
Should it come to that, I would certainly oppose it.
It's not only about Tyson, ConAgra, and Cargill controlling food, it's about Applied Digital Solutions getting the production ramped up sufficient for a "global problem."
Now they want birth certificates for animals? Does this mean the secretaries of state must now fund this effort?
my dog was born in hawaii.
no you cannot see the birth certificate.
“But I also don’t see anything that suggests day trips would be tracked with something like a flight plan.”
I stand corrected. It appears that component has been dropped, unless the horse comes into contact with an animal from another property. So if you go for a ride with a buddy from down the road you’ll have to document that fact.
These urban control freaks really take the cake. If they weren't endangering everybody it might be funny.
“These urban control freaks really take the cake. If they weren’t endangering everybody it might be funny.”
I’m just wondering when they’re going to figure out that several of the diseases they’re so worried about are carried by deer, elk, moose, etc.
Classic regulatory capture. The largest corporations do not want free markets - they want fascism.
There is existing technology for this purpose.
For instance, this brand stands for F______ Socialism.
If you remain a liberal, you’ll embrace it...whatever form it takes. After all, you’ll need to be able to buy and sell.
And welcome to FR this week.
“I think that this legislation is a smoke screen.”
That is one opinion. Could be correct too but I am only commenting on the article at hand.
Ok lets say you are a small scale producer. Like me. Let’s say you raise anywhere between 3-4 head a year. One for your own consumption, selling the rest to pay for the one you eat. Under this proposal I’ll have to pay to register each and every animal.
Now as a contrast. Let’s say you are a large operation with hundreds or thousands of cattle. You register the enitre herd as one single entity. In other words my 4 head are potentially going to cost far more than a couple hundred head just to register.”””
FIRST: You cannot register an entire herd as one entity...Each cow/steer/bull is separate. There is SOME discussion of being allowed to register a flock of chickens as a unit, but that is also difficult to control and keep up your reports. Especially if a fox or feral dogs get any of your flock.
The entire paperwork required is far more insidious than what is being presented here.
I have a much longer version somewhere in my desk. I can send/fax it to anyone who wants it.
The reasons are being told in 2 different versions to owners of livestock.
Big producers are being told it is to track animals which are being raised in large numbers and sold for food purposes. Mad Cow is the trigger name used.
People like me who breed and raise horses in small amounts are being told that “IF our horse is stolen- they can find it”—THAT IS TRACKING WITH A CHIP!!!!!! It is also a total lie about how they can find my horse!! If they can “track my horse-—they are also tracking ME when I am out riding”!!!!!!
The authorities cannot keep track of all the sex offenders!!! They cannot keep track of all the illegal aliens coming over our southern borders in droves...I’m not a felon!!! Leave me alone!! My horses are NOT criminals!!! Leave them alone!!
Cars/Trucks have had VIN numbers for over 40 years. How fast does your police department find a stolen car?????
There are millions of cattle raised in this country each and every year. There have been only 2 or 3 confirmed cases of Mad Cow found in the USA, and the ear tags cattle already carry traced the cow back to Canada. It was not a USA cow to begin with.
This plan is devised to apply to everything-animals- plants- everything-—there is even a category for trees!!! Just how migratory are the trees in your area??
There is absolutely no provision for tagging or chipping wild animals- bears- wolves- birds—etc, which are predators against ranchers and farmers.
Meanwhile- NAIS wants to chip even your pet turtle and gup-py; the list is endless.
“Register” is a cover word: They intend to CHIP—Period. Some horse onwers have ‘volunteered” to have their horses chipped. Large abcesses have developed on their necks, and many of them have been very sick. I am not sure if any or how many died or had to be put down because of the infection and their inability to eat or drink. Various states have tried to make it mandatory—with the Feds bribing the states with extra agriculture money. It is a joke!! They want to know where YOU are!!
The ‘registration’ of your property means that ‘inspectors’ can come onto your property at any time- without an appointment- and they can search for where and how I/you store my/your feed and how much I/you keep on hand. They can inspect water tanks, and decide how “well” I take care of my animals. That is a job for me- my vet- and the County Animal Control to intervene if I am not doing a good job. The inspectors can also determine if you are ‘properly using’ your animals.
What are the parameters of the knowledge/training of these inspectors? They become little brown shirts about your animals. Don’t clean your cat box every 6 hours?? Shame—Shame— Dog is overweight? More problems...
Here’s more: IF I chip my horses:
I MUST purchase and carry with me when I am hauling/trailering an ID gun -—which costs $600-800, so that I can prove when stopped that the horses I am hauling are mine. I already have brand inspection laminated cards that I carry in my truck. The Chip ID and ID gun is on top of that expense I already must do. I also must purchase software to report all this crap on.
How about those of us who do NOT have a computer?
I MUST get on the computer—with a Federal computer program— and report to the Feds when I am riding off my property. I MUST get on same computer and report my arrival back to my property. I MUST file these reports within 24 hours of movement—or face a $5000 fine for each occurrance. Since I can ride right off my property here in the high desert- that is onerous reporting.
I know a woman in N Kalifornia who trains and conditions horses- her own and others. I have seen her make 3 trips a day in the summer- each trip with 2 horses minimum. Rides one 1/2 way while ponying the other, then switches. Come home, gets 2 more, repeats, then makes a 3rd trip in the longer summer days.
EACH and EVERY animal must be chipped, and separate reports for each animal that leaves the perimeter of the property must be reported—out and back.
If I am a rancher—I must chip each cow or horse. Let’s say that Bike riders or ATV riders cut my fence in Wyoming because they are too lazy to go to the gates or to also ASK PERMISSION to be on my ranch land. Now I have 35 heifers out of the fences. I might not know this for a couple of days. When my neighbor calls and tells me, and we round them all up and fix the fence, I have to file 35 reports of their escape-—which must be accurate, and I don’t even know exactly when they got out-—and another 35 reports to report them back onto my property. I am subject to 35 fines for this group which escaped, for not filing the reports timely. What rancher has the time to do all this reporting??? How about when your rural electricity is out for days due to a snowstorm? How about those who live OFF the grid and don’t even have anything but a generator??
If I go to a horse show- a group ride- a benefit ride- whatever- I must file a report stating exactly when I am leavine- why- where I am going- what ROUTE I am taking- where I will be if overnight- when I am coming back- what ROUTE I am taking- and what horse (s) I am taking with me. Then I have to report that we all are back on the property. two comnplete sets of reports!!!
What if I have an emergency and I haul a horse to the Vet Clinic and I stay there for a couple of days with the horse ( I have done that)... I will NOT be able to file all my ‘reports’ timely. One trip to the clinic occurred when a horse I was riding at a state park suffered a cut pastern. Bandaged her at the park, then scrambled to the clinic. She needed surgery. IF I had ‘filed’ a report stating where I was going- the route- etc- and my expected return time—I would have been out of compliance with my report filed before I left the house!!!
This is a direct attack on myself and the 4th Amendment of the Constitution. It is unreasonable search of where I am with my horses. It can result in seizure of my horses if I don’t comply.
It is also a direct attack on those who raise chickens-calves-steers and sell them for meat to the neighbors. Funny they didn’t try to stamp eggs!!!!
Maybe some of you think this is OK, but I am strongly telling you—Think again.
Oh, no. Allow me to drop the other shoe. The cattle industry has been lobbying Congress since 2003 or so to get the GOVERNMENT TO PAY FOR IT ALL. I say user pays. Of course it would be built into the cost of the meat. The DOA had been resisting, but who knows under the new regime. Other than that, and the fact that I personally sat through a bunch of the meetings and hearings, I am sure you are right, and I am just a poor, misguided, ignorant woman.
I say let the customer decide if they want the service.
Other than that, and the fact that I personally sat through a bunch of the meetings and hearings, I am sure you are right, and I am just a poor, misguided, ignorant woman.
Quite apparently. You have no clue how markets using risk-based pricing and third party verification can do it without police power.
Yup. You have no clue.
I’d like to see the references where each and every animal must be chipped when you mention “each cow or horse”.
Our sheep flock is enrolled in the USDA Scrapie Flock Certification Program and you can use either ear tags or ear tattoos. The Program is voluntary. I’ve not seen anything about chips being required for sheep...
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