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'No One Can Fathom a Motive': Pastor Shot During Service
ABC News ^ | 3/9/2009 | KATIE ESCHERICH

Posted on 03/08/2009 1:30:43 PM PDT by StarCMC

A shooting during a morning church service outside St. Louis has left at least one person dead -- the church's pastor -- and several others wounded, officials said.

The Rev. Fred Winters was at the pulpit at the First Baptist Church in Maryville, Ill. at 8:15 a.m. local time when a man "walked down the aisle of the church," approached the pulpit and shot Winters in the chest with a .45 caliber handgun, said Trooper Ralph Timmins of the Illinois State Police, which is handling the investigation.

The gun jammed, and the shooter then injured himself with a knife and subsequently was restrained by parishioners, Timmins said in a "preliminary release" left on his office voicemail recording. Approximately 150 people were in the church at the time.

Two parishioners who "tackled" the shooter received "non-life-threatening" injuries from the knife, Timmins said.

Winters was "pronounced [dead] at the hospital for a single gunshot wound to the chest," Timmins said.

(Excerpt) Read more at abcnews.go.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: Illinois
KEYWORDS: armedcitizen; banglist; ccw; churchshooting; fredwinters; murder; pastorshot; rkba; sedlacek
Excerpted as necessary - more details at the source.
1 posted on 03/08/2009 1:30:43 PM PDT by StarCMC
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To: Forest Keeper; Missouri; Just another Joe; Jen; Bahbah

Not Missouri - but nearby.


2 posted on 03/08/2009 1:31:59 PM PDT by StarCMC (Sometimes you need a Jimmy Carter to get a Ronald Reagan.)
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To: StarCMC

And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.


3 posted on 03/08/2009 1:37:09 PM PDT by chuck_the_tv_out
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To: StarCMC

For an informative addition to the community background look at this link.

http://www.madisonrecord.com/news/127236-gotv-and-the-pulpit

Rev. Winters photo is to the right of the article.

Not photo below. Apparent competing interests.


4 posted on 03/08/2009 1:38:19 PM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: StarCMC

The question arises... Allah Ackbar?


5 posted on 03/08/2009 1:44:39 PM PDT by BigFinn (IMAHAINGTTIA = I'm Mad As Heck And I'm Not Going To Take It Anymore.)
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To: StarCMC

If the shooter were a fat, bloated drunk Democrat Senator from MA, he maybe could get away with this.


6 posted on 03/08/2009 1:49:50 PM PDT by exist
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To: StarCMC
'No One Can Fathom a Motive': Pastor Shot During Service

75% chance that there's a woman involved!

7 posted on 03/08/2009 1:53:22 PM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: BigFinn

It was a Baptist church. It could have been a gay man who was mad at Baptists...could have been a muzzie... ciould have just been mentally unbalanced/demon possessed.

Lord, receive your servant into You arms.


8 posted on 03/08/2009 1:54:28 PM PDT by hoagy62 (Obama: slowly sucking the positive attitude out of the US since 11-4-08)
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To: StarCMC
There IS a motive.

And if the MSM won't reveal it, it is because it is a political incorrect motive.

Time will tell.

Prayers for the pastor and his family. They seem like such nice people.

9 posted on 03/08/2009 1:57:55 PM PDT by Candor7 (I love Lucy : http://www.fiftiesweb.com/lucy.htm ( Those were better days))
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

My first thought.


10 posted on 03/08/2009 1:59:54 PM PDT by stormer
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To: All

The heart of unregenerate man is deceitfully wicked...who can know it.


11 posted on 03/08/2009 2:01:12 PM PDT by anniegetyourgun
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To: Candor7
There IS a motive.

Yes, there is but it's possible that no one knows yet what it is.

12 posted on 03/08/2009 2:04:54 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Selah)
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To: StarCMC

East St. Louis?


13 posted on 03/08/2009 2:06:44 PM PDT by expatpat
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To: StarCMC

Prayers for the family. May his soul and all the souls of the faithful, departed rest in peace.


14 posted on 03/08/2009 2:10:53 PM PDT by Salvation ( †With God all things are possible.†)
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To: StarCMC

xref
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2201931/posts


15 posted on 03/08/2009 2:13:45 PM PDT by kanawa (Trust in God and hunker down, we're in for a ride on the Crazy Train)
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To: Graybeard58
Yes it is to soon to know what the motive was, but then, I have seeen politically incorrect motive spun out to be unrecognizeable in many murders over the last 5 years, especially if it involves a muslim, or an illegal alien.

So like you, I will probably view what the MSM has to say on it with a grain of salt until we can hear it from a reliable source.

BTW, the bombing of a Doctors car in Arkansas, which happened on Feb. 2nd has no assigned motive yet either.Generally that means it was a personal motive involving marital infidelity, as most of those cases go, but we may never know.

The MSM has actually abandoned true investigative reporting for the realm of political self censorship.If a dem is involved, the news is quickly back paged or not followed up.

16 posted on 03/08/2009 2:17:50 PM PDT by Candor7 (I love Lucy : http://www.fiftiesweb.com/lucy.htm ( Those were better days))
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To: StarCMC

It was not a hate crime and it was not against Christianity. I repeat, it was not a hate crime and it was not against Christianity.


17 posted on 03/08/2009 2:23:50 PM PDT by AD from SpringBay (We deserve the government we allow.)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

I agree. Maybe the pastor was doing some extracurricular ministering.


18 posted on 03/08/2009 2:28:39 PM PDT by Ted Grant
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To: Candor7

Regarding the Docs car being bombed.

Got Link? or Name/info.

If it was narrowed down to the doc was pro choice or pro life I can bet the MSM would not futher report if he was pro life.

Just watched World Over News (Catholic News) and if FOCA goes through with mandates that all doc refer for or perform anti pro life health care we may lose about 2,000 physicians not to mention the Hospitals that will be forced to shut down because of funding cuts due to non compliance.


19 posted on 03/08/2009 2:36:03 PM PDT by Global2010 (Worship the Creator Not the Creature.)
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To: StarCMC
Thanks for the ping. This is just awful. I saw the local news conference a little while ago. Apparently the shooter is 27 y.o., with no record. Police are not releasing the name yet. Witnesses seem to agree that he was not a regular attender, i.e., no one knew him. Prayers up for the pastor's family and all the members of that church.
20 posted on 03/08/2009 2:41:44 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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To: StarCMC
All the shooter has to do is claim that the Preacher made him wear high heels while play acting and a jury will let the shooter get away with an accidental shooting. At least that what happens in Democrat Controlled McNairy County, Tennessee..
21 posted on 03/08/2009 2:42:27 PM PDT by vetvetdoug
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To: Global2010

No its not a pro life issue. The doc didn’t do them.He was a GP. No surgery.

The story is largely buried though now.No entertainment value.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/02/06/arkansas.doctor.explosion/


22 posted on 03/08/2009 2:42:47 PM PDT by Candor7 (I love Lucy : http://www.fiftiesweb.com/lucy.htm ( Those were better days))
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To: Candor7

bump for later


23 posted on 03/08/2009 2:55:56 PM PDT by Centurion2000 (01-20-2009 : The end of the PAX AMERICANA.)
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To: Candor7

bump for later


24 posted on 03/08/2009 2:55:57 PM PDT by Centurion2000 (01-20-2009 : The end of the PAX AMERICANA.)
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To: BigFinn

Good question.

Thus far no description of the perp. . . none that I came across yet. . .


25 posted on 03/08/2009 3:20:39 PM PDT by Hulka
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To: StarCMC

Definitely not a hate crime. /s


26 posted on 03/08/2009 3:28:06 PM PDT by taxesareforever (Quick justice for the senseless killing of Marine Lance Cpl. Robert Crutchfield.)
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To: StarCMC

Somebody out there knows who this was and why.

It must either be infidelity or not politically correct to say why.


27 posted on 03/08/2009 3:48:21 PM PDT by Sequoyah101 (Get the bats and light the hay)
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To: exist

...maybe???...


28 posted on 03/08/2009 3:50:59 PM PDT by onedoug
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To: expatpat
East St. Louis?

It's on the east side -- but not in East St. Louis. More towards Collinsville if you know the area.

29 posted on 03/08/2009 9:01:25 PM PDT by StarCMC (Sometimes you need a Jimmy Carter to get a Ronald Reagan.)
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To: All

http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=169309&catid=3


30 posted on 03/08/2009 10:30:23 PM PDT by StarCMC (Sometimes you need a Jimmy Carter to get a Ronald Reagan.)
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