Posted on 03/09/2009 3:50:09 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
Critics of the Bible have often said that the writings of Genesis reflect an “unscientific view” of the universe—one that reflected the cosmology of the ancient world. One of these criticisms centers on the Hebrew word raqia used in the creation account of Genesis 1. Several Bible versions, such as the New King James, translate this word as firmament:
Genesis 1:6–8, NJKV
Then God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” Thus God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament; and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. So the evening and the morning were the second day. [Emphasis added.]
The argument from these Bible critics is that the ancient Hebrews believed in a solid dome with the stars embedded in the dome. They say that the word firmament reflects the idea of firmness, and this reflects erroneous cosmology. Therefore, the Bible is not the inspired Word of God, and we don’t need to listen to its teaching.
However, other versions of the Bible, such as the New American Standard, translate raqia as expanse:
Genesis 1:6–8, NASB
Then God said, “Let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.” God made the expanse, and separated the waters which were below the expanse from the waters which were above the expanse; and it was so. God called the expanse heaven. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day. [Emphasis added.]
But which is the correct term to use?...
(Excerpt) Read more at answersingenesis.org ...
These ancient illiterate shepherds got their divinely-inspired cosmology, physics, geology, and biology right right, they just missed a few decimal places here and there.
The division you referenced is between the waters (fluids, gasses, plasma) above (outside the earth's gravity field) and the waters (fluids, plasma, gasses, and (eventually) dust) below the divide. That which was above became the (remained) as the sun, other planets, moons, asteroids, etc.
That which was below became (is) the earth.
But then the waters below are said to be “gathered into one basin” (one ocean) just as the plate tectonics tells us now - and despite what the ancient Israelis actually saw as separate seas and oceans. The visible sky is, of course, above the seas. You're mixing up a physicist's “fluids” with an old shepherd's “waters” - but both describe accurately the same thing.
Notice that plants created next. But still in the proper sequence.
Because you can't see the stars and moon UNLESS there is a free oxygen and nitrogen atmosphere - which did NOT happen until AFTER the plants created oxygen from the impenetrable and poisonous CO2 clouds at the beginning. (The moon was formed by collision before plant life has been found - though not much before.
Thought you might be interested in the following:
How can distant starlight reach us in just 6,000 years?
http://creation.com/how-can-distant-starlight-reach-us-in-just-6000-years
All the best—GGG
Do you think that's why the Hebrew says, 'evening morning x day'?
Of course, we know that the Hebrew 24-hour day begins at sundown, consistent with the word order that we see in Genesis indicating the same 24-hour day.
Or maybe, Exodus 20:9-11 - "Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your animals, nor the alien within your gates. For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy."
This is where Scripture specifically relates the 24-hour days of the work week and the 24-hour Sabbath with 24-hour days of creation.
You have to be really, really, super-duper smart to get around it when it's worded like that.
Its funny I remember discussing this with my father when I was a teenager, its always amazes me how science based on things as they are now think they can determine the way things were in the past, I told my father I believe there use to be a firmament that is why in the days before Noah people lived for hundreds and hundreds of years, then the firmament(even if this firmament was gaseous liquid clouds) gave way we had the flood and now increased radiation shortens our lives. theories are a dime a dozen, like carbon dating based on what, current carbon levels
Don't you realize the absurdity of that statement. You disagree with what they wrote, and then call them illiterate. While illiterate can merely mean ignorant, it is most commonly understood to mean the inability to read or write.
The ancient Israelites may certainly have thought in that fashion. However, I think the fault is in their understanding and (most assuredly) not God’s Word. Basically, air has mass and volume. While it is not as solid as a rock, it is definitely not a vacumn.
I agree, in that something made them live longer, and it was, in my limited understanding, some sort of water canopy above the Earth, which would filter harmful radiation. At the time of the flood, it collapsed, and along with the fountains of the deep, flooded the entire Earth.
And evolution is sound scientific theory? Keep dreaming.
Their history was oral. Doesn't make it any the worse as a history - nor any less divinely inspired for many years of being passed down word-of-mouth before it was first written.
Heck - They had not yet invented the “zero” - so how do you expect them to keep track of decimal places and powers of ten?
But their entire SEQUENCE of events describes what we only now know. And THAT is the miracle of Genesis.
i’m really impressed
Yes, I can see that...
>You have to be really, really, super-duper smart to get around it when it’s worded like that.
Um... God _IS_ that smart. Again, even if you don’t think that the creation-days are 24 hours, it is quite obvious that it was a principle that God set up (the Sabbath, like you pointed out).
I honestly don’t know if the days of Creation were 24-hr days or not, in the end it doesn’t matter... it’s the Creator, not the creation that’s what this is all about.
“Capacity: 1000 angels. By order of the fire marshall.”
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Thank heavens we finally worked that one out.
What’s that? Sultan Mehmet and his army have battered down the gates? Guess the church is going to get a redecorating.
Firmament means expanse...What’s intriguing is not the firmament but the massive body of water above it...Above the Solar System...
>No...and the sky still ain’t solid...
Really? Would you like to smash head-on into the Earth’s atmosphere at... oh, say, .4c? Water “isn’t solid” either, and yet you can smash into it breaking your legs on the surface tension from a helicopter’s height with just the Earth’s gravitational acceleration.
If it wasn't important, God wouldn't have written it...
>which did NOT happen until AFTER the plants created oxygen from the impenetrable and poisonous CO2 clouds at the beginning. (The moon was formed by collision before plant life has been found - though not much before.
I protest! CO2 is NOT poisonous. You can survive in a CO2/O2 concentration.
CO (Carbon-monoxide) _IS_ poisonous, in the sense that it bonds to your red blood-cell, like oxygen would, but then cannot [naturally] be unbound/utilized, thusly “killing” that blood-cell’s utility.
You determined it??? How about letting God determine it...
That's your 'logical' understanding of it...Obviously it's not God's...
Light and darkness were created before the Sun was created...A day obviously was determined by God before the Sun was created...
God created the Sun to line up with His definition of DAY, not yours...
I once read a theory that prior to the flood the earth was surrounded by a water canopy. This canopy was responsible for filtering solar damage that shortened our life spans after the flood. It was an interesting read, but as I remember, the volume calculations just didn’t fit.
The Bible was written by many authors, who were inspired by God.
However, the original Editor and Publisher of the Original Bible, the Roman Catholic Church, never claimed that God wrote the Bible, or any of its separate, diverse Books, directly.
It seems odd to me, as a Catholic, that non-Catholics can question Papal authority (Which, by the way, only attaches when it is expressly applied) -— However, the same non-Catholics want to grant “infallibility” to the very HUMAN authors of the many separate Books of the Bible.
The Bible tells us how to live our lives, as the Book was intended to do.
The Bible does NOT tell us how life began, in any scientific sense, but that was never the intent, to begin with.
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