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Obama Youth Brigade: Church Attendance Forbidden
The Voice Magazine ^ | 03/25/09 | Jonas Clark

Posted on 03/25/2009 12:34:07 PM PDT by Fiddlstix

Obama Youth Brigade: Church Attendance Forbidden
By Jonas Clark

Is this the change you really voted for? President Obama has only been in office for two months. Now we have HR 1388. The Bill was sponsored by Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) with 37 others. The Bill was introduced to the floor of the House of Representatives where both Republicans and Democrats voted 321-105 in favor. Next it goes to the Senate for a vote and then on to President Obama.

This bill’s title is called “Generations Invigorating Volunteerism and Education” (GIVE). It forms what some are calling “Obama’s Youth Brigade.” Obama’s plan is require anyone receiving school loans and others to serve at least three months as part of the brigade. His goal is one million youth! This has serious Nazi Germany overtones to it.

The Bill would forbid any student in the brigade to participate in “engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.” That means no church attendance or witnessing.

Again, is this what America voted for? Here is part of the HR1388 Bill’s wording:

SEC. 1304. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

Section 125 (42 U.S.C. 12575) is amended to read as follows:

SEC. 125. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.

(a) Prohibited Activities- A participant in an approved national service position under this subtitle may not engage in the following activities:

(1) Attempting to influence legislation.

(2) Organizing or engaging in protests, petitions, boycotts, or strikes.

(7) Engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 111th; agenda; bho44; brownshirts; frontpage; giveact; hr1388; irreligiousleft; islamobama; moralabsolutes; obama; obamayouth; oshirts; religion; sharia
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1 posted on 03/25/2009 12:34:07 PM PDT by Fiddlstix
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To: narses; NYer; SJackson; MeekOneGOP

Ping


2 posted on 03/25/2009 12:35:11 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Fiddlstix

Sig heil, suckers.


3 posted on 03/25/2009 12:36:32 PM PDT by Zeppelin
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To: Fiddlstix

So, what are they going to do to someone who simply ignores the prohibitions on free speech?


4 posted on 03/25/2009 12:37:13 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Fiddlstix

This stuff is happening way to fast.


5 posted on 03/25/2009 12:37:28 PM PDT by cornelis
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To: Fiddlstix
I would hope that they are just saying that ‘serving at your church doesn't count’, but I am not ‘legal minded’. I don't even see abortion in the first amendment...
6 posted on 03/25/2009 12:37:33 PM PDT by LearnsFromMistakes
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To: Fiddlstix

Violation of the constitution ping.


7 posted on 03/25/2009 12:37:43 PM PDT by malkee (Actually I'm an ex-smoker--two and a half years-- But I think about it every day.)
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To: All
LINK Here
8 posted on 03/25/2009 12:39:22 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Zeppelin

Jebus H. Hillary is looking soooo much better.


9 posted on 03/25/2009 12:41:25 PM PDT by radiohead (Buy ammo, get your kids out of government schools, pray for the Republic.)
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To: Fiddlstix
Don't get me wrong, I think this whole GIVE/Obama Youth thing is creepy, but this prohibition is only for when the little dears are on the govt clock.

I heard a Pubbie added the language about no lobbying, strikes, union organizing, etc. RATS are trying to strike that.

Let's hope the whole bill is sent down the crapper where it belongs.

10 posted on 03/25/2009 12:42:05 PM PDT by Martin Tell (ask for the ancient paths, ask where the good way is, and walk in it)
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To: cornelis

Better they boil the water so quickly the frog jumps out than so slowly the frog doesn’t notice.


11 posted on 03/25/2009 12:42:15 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: muawiyah

I have to believe that the restrictions apply only when you are “on the clock”. Otherwise it would never pass constitutional muster.

But while we are at it, I want to see an amendment added making it illegal to deputize them and or to require them to carry a firearm or to issue them a firearm in the course of their job.


12 posted on 03/25/2009 12:43:27 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: Fiddlstix

There’s absolutely no way this is trying to forbid people in the youth corps or whatever it is from ever going to church or witnessing. That would be blatantly illegal and even the dimmest bulb on Capitol Hill knows it wouldn’t hold up. I wouldn’t be surprised however if they’re saying that going to church doesn’t count as volunteer work.


13 posted on 03/25/2009 12:44:07 PM PDT by gracesdad
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To: Fiddlstix
“Attempting to influence Legislation.” You mean like attempting to influence elections? How about busing protesters to harass AIG bonus recipients?

It all sounds so innocent. But then, isn't that how they all start?

14 posted on 03/25/2009 12:44:13 PM PDT by PSYCHO-FREEP (WHAT? Where did my tag line go? (ACORN))
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To: LearnsFromMistakes
I would hope that they are just saying that ‘serving at your church doesn't count’, but I am not ‘legal minded’. I don't even see abortion in the first amendment...

At least abortion clinics, ACORN (those indicted for voter fraud), and union activities are excluded from receiving any services from volunteers.

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h1388/text

Sec 1301 (b)

We'll see how selectively these rules get enforced for religious organizations (that don't recognize gay marriage, of course) and ignored for unions and abortion clinics...

15 posted on 03/25/2009 12:44:31 PM PDT by Zeppelin
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To: Fiddlstix
This is WRONG. Obama must be dumb as a box of rocks if he thinks the majority of Americans will accept this. I keep trying to tell my self that this can't be happening but I am having a hard time believing ME.
16 posted on 03/25/2009 12:46:33 PM PDT by WellyP (obama must go!)
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To: Martin Tell
Don't get me wrong, I think this whole GIVE/Obama Youth thing is creepy, but this prohibition is only for when the little dears are on the govt clock.

That's how I read it. If so, this is a good thing. Now I guess I'll have to read the actual bill to confirm that.

17 posted on 03/25/2009 12:46:38 PM PDT by giotto
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To: Blood of Tyrants
The restrictions are bizarre. Government employees are not subject to them and it makes no sense for a kid doing slave labor to be subjected to them at all. It's not like they are gong to be "on the clock".

One of the big problems we will all have with the Obamaistas is that so few of them have any connection to the real world. It's like they start the day by kicking back with a little cocaine or something.

18 posted on 03/25/2009 12:47:26 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Fiddlstix

The Bill would forbid any student in the brigade to participate in “engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.” That means no church attendance or witnessing.

//////////////////
Unless its negroes going to a mosque, or reading a koran or selling the newspaper of the nationofislam.


19 posted on 03/25/2009 12:48:24 PM PDT by TomasUSMC ( FIGHT LIKE WW2, FINISH LIKE WW2. FIGHT LIKE NAM, FINISH LIKE NAM)
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To: Martin Tell

I don’t know - if this wording is accurate, it looks like the government is attempting to suppress religious freedom - definitely unconstitutional. That would be like saying senators and reps may not attend church services while in office, right?


20 posted on 03/25/2009 12:48:56 PM PDT by ElayneJ
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To: Fiddlstix
(`SEC. 125. PROHIBITED ACTIVITIES AND INELIGIBLE ORGANIZATIONS.)

Reads very much like joining the military....which it really is.

(Hitler youth corps)

21 posted on 03/25/2009 12:50:19 PM PDT by yoe
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To: cornelis

“This stuff is happening way to fast.”

I was trying to come up with the write one line reply. You nailed it.


22 posted on 03/25/2009 12:50:27 PM PDT by NavyCanDo (Party Like Its 1773)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Yeah, I suppose that’s saying “when you’ve got your Obama armband on, you can’t go to a church, except maybe to burn it.”

OK, I added that last part.

}:-)4


23 posted on 03/25/2009 12:51:08 PM PDT by Moose4 (Hey RNC. Don't move toward the middle. MOVE THE MIDDLE TOWARD YOU.)
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To: Fiddlstix

I think it just means that church-related work doesn’t count as your “mandatory volunteerism.”


24 posted on 03/25/2009 12:55:08 PM PDT by Sloth (The tree of liberty desperately needs watering.)
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To: Fiddlstix

Obama’s Communism Here We Come Youth Brigade is a better description.


25 posted on 03/25/2009 12:55:51 PM PDT by lilylangtree (Veni, Vidi, Vici)
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To: Martin Tell
A participant in an approved national service position under this subtitle may not engage in the following activities:

but this prohibition is only for when the little dears are on the govt clock.

I see nowhere there that it draws a distinction between being on, or off, the clock. I see where it says "a participant" may not engage..now, if you join (or are forced to), are you now a full participant whether or not you're on the clock?? This would be a question that definitely WOULD require clarification IMHO..but from what we've seen, the government isn't adverse to changing their minds and rules AFTER the fact when it comes to legislation (witness the AIG bonuses which were allowed, then retroactively taxed at x%)

26 posted on 03/25/2009 12:55:54 PM PDT by GeorgiaDawg32 (A democrat will break your leg, then hand you a crutch and take credit for your being able to walk.)
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To: Fiddlstix
The Bill would forbid any student in the brigade to participate in “engaging in religious instruction, conducting worship services, providing instruction as part of a program that includes mandatory religious instruction or worship, constructing or operating facilities devoted to religious instruction or worship, maintaining facilities primarily or inherently devoted to religious instruction or worship, or engaging in any form of religious proselytization.” That means no church attendance or witnessing.

I don't like the idea of mandatory service at all but I don't think this paragraph means what the author implies it means. I'm sure that what it's saying...and complete context would be helpful...is that the activities above can't be counted as 'vonteer service'. it doesn't say that folks doing service can't attend church.

27 posted on 03/25/2009 12:56:26 PM PDT by pgkdan ( I miss Ronald Reagan!)
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To: malkee

No kidding. What on earth does teaching a Sunday School class on the weekends have to do with fulfilling a commitment to three months of volunteer work? I find the mandatory volunteer thing to be repugnant, but then to add on a ridiculous clause about prohibiting just about any participation in church beyond the pale. It doesn’t prohibit actual ATTENDANCE from what I can see, but that could change or be construed to mean active participation in a Bible study class. After all, if you participate in a discussion are you not also part of the “religious instruction” process?

What will they think of next?


28 posted on 03/25/2009 1:00:29 PM PDT by ChocChipCookie ("Let his days be few, and let another take his office." Psalm 109:8)
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To: ElayneJ
It's more like telling someone working a Social Security desk that they can't hand out religious tracts with every Social Security Card.

These types of prohibitions (specifically those forbidding union and boycott organizing) had their start in the 1980s. Legal Service Corp (free legal services to the poor) lawyers were using their "clients" to harass landlords, form unions, lobby, and otherwise advance their leftist causes. The stuff done by ACORN today.

Reagan's folks put a stop to it, but it was not easy. The Commies screamed like stuck pigs.

29 posted on 03/25/2009 1:01:29 PM PDT by Martin Tell (ask for the ancient paths, ask where the good way is, and walk in it)
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To: ElayneJ
"...it looks like the government is attempting to suppress religious freedom..."

Now you are beginning to understand the Obama agenda, Billy Ayres wasn't his friend for nothing nor was sitting in Rev. Jeremiah Wright's Black Liberation Theology church for 20 years of "hate whitey", that hasn't gone unnoticed. If America had ignored the MSM and done their homework on Barack Obama, they would have seen that a child raised in radical Marxist homes with animosity towards America and whites was not going to help America, he, Obama, was going to destroy America as he had been taught America destroyed his ancestors....actually it was Muslims who did the slaving. Obama is not what the MSM told you...........

30 posted on 03/25/2009 1:03:04 PM PDT by yoe
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To: Fiddlstix; Blood of Tyrants; Moose4; NavyCanDo; cornelis; yoe; ElayneJ; Martin Tell; muawiyah; ...

If you are GIVEn a government student loan you must
GIVE three months of your time to G.I.V.E. During
that service your are forbidden to associate in any
way with religion of any kind. ForGIVE me for
asking, but what might Muslims say about this?


31 posted on 03/25/2009 1:03:54 PM PDT by Jo Nuvark (Those who bless Israel will be blessed, those who curse Israel will be cursed. Gen 12:3)
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To: Sloth
I think it just means that church-related work doesn’t count as your “mandatory volunteerism.”

__________________________________________

I don't know. If a person taught Sunday School at their local Christian Church, that could be “engaging in Religious Instruction” as far as the feds are concerned.

I've learned to read between the lines, particularly when there is no disclaimer such as “. . .while on duty”

32 posted on 03/25/2009 1:06:58 PM PDT by KittenClaws ("The state rubs the lotion on its skin, then it places the lotion in the basket". ~ Dead)
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To: KrisKrinkle

This should be posted under “News Activism” and everybody should contact their congressional representatives to oppose this. Does anybody see the gall Obama has? He wants to forbid your kids from going to church.


33 posted on 03/25/2009 1:09:19 PM PDT by malkee (Actually I'm an ex-smoker--two and a half years-- But I think about it every day.)
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To: Jo Nuvark

Muslims will get a wink and a nod. They will be allowed to set up “front” organizations that soft-pedal Islam until the unsuspecting recruits get inside, and the Obamajugend will help them. I truly believe this. Not because Obama himself is a Muslim, but simply because liberals hate Christians and twist themselves into pretzels trying to ignore the bloodthirstiness of militant Islam.

}:-)4


34 posted on 03/25/2009 1:09:53 PM PDT by Moose4 (Hey RNC. Don't move toward the middle. MOVE THE MIDDLE TOWARD YOU.)
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To: KittenClaws

I’ve learned to read between the lines, particularly when there is no disclaimer such as “. . .while on duty”

exactly..see my post 26


35 posted on 03/25/2009 1:10:30 PM PDT by GeorgiaDawg32 (A democrat will break your leg, then hand you a crutch and take credit for your being able to walk.)
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To: KittenClaws

IOW you can’t do public service with a church group.

IOOW those children who do community service as a graduation requirement for high school are no longer allowed to do it for their church.


36 posted on 03/25/2009 1:11:46 PM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: pgkdan; Fiddlstix
The bill forbids prosletizing and engaging in any activity that promotes any religion. It does not prohibit church attendance.

It also prohibits any activity related to abortion, political campaigning, lobbying, etc.

It's a bad bill but let's be accurate and honest.

btw, iirc more republicans voted aye than democrats.

37 posted on 03/25/2009 1:13:22 PM PDT by wtc911 ("How you gonna get back down that hill?")
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To: Fiddlstix

Million Jugend


38 posted on 03/25/2009 1:15:27 PM PDT by mikeandike
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To: Moose4

[... liberals hate Christians and twist themselves into pretzels trying to ignore the bloodthirstiness of militant Islam...]

Yup! That’s exactly what I wast thinking.


39 posted on 03/25/2009 1:17:08 PM PDT by Jo Nuvark (Those who bless Israel will be blessed, those who curse Israel will be cursed. Gen 12:3)
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To: wtc911

It does not prohibit church attendance.

I would be much happier to see that, in black and white, in the bill..


40 posted on 03/25/2009 1:18:34 PM PDT by GeorgiaDawg32 (A democrat will break your leg, then hand you a crutch and take credit for your being able to walk.)
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To: Fiddlstix

That list looks similar to what one might see in the armed forces meaning that as military members troops cannot lobby, organize protests and such.

Obviously you interpret this to mean that participants cannot go to church....but could it mean that participants cannot try to make a church within the organization, or cannot represent the organization and lobby, protest, etc?


41 posted on 03/25/2009 1:18:48 PM PDT by Eagle Eye (Obama - Taking jobs from Americans.)
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To: GeorgiaDawg32
Bills by nature detail that which is prohibited. If it is not clearly prohibited then it is allowed.

It is still a bad bill, beginning to end.

42 posted on 03/25/2009 1:25:28 PM PDT by wtc911 ("How you gonna get back down that hill?")
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To: muawiyah

“So, what are they going to do to someone who simply ignores the prohibitions on free speech?”

You know those prisons down south that don’t exist?


43 posted on 03/25/2009 1:27:00 PM PDT by EQAndyBuzz (Bow down to me. I am TOTUS.)
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To: Fiddlstix

The bolsheviks writing zerObama’s decrees just couldn’t help themselves, could they?

Lots of Christian, Jewish, Buddhist and Muslim kids who practice their religion and engage in volunteer work with their churches/temples won’t be eligible for “federal govt guaranteed” student loans, will they? I suppose Boy Scouts will be outlawed by then.

Next, seniors who don’t sign up for tutoring, babysitting and sidewalk sweeping may face cuts in their benefits?


44 posted on 03/25/2009 1:29:48 PM PDT by silverleaf (Freedom's just another word for "nothing left to lose")
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To: Fiddlstix

While I loathe this Hitler Youth Group idea, I don’t see in the prohibitions cited anything that prevents a participant from attending church.


45 posted on 03/25/2009 1:34:33 PM PDT by Laur
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To: wtc911
The bill forbids prosletizing and engaging in any activity that promotes any religion. It does not prohibit church attendance.

Sorry but that's impossible. I may believe that the bill prohibits caounting church work as volunteer work but not that it prohibits attendance or proselytizing oor preaching.

46 posted on 03/25/2009 1:39:48 PM PDT by pgkdan ( I miss Ronald Reagan!)
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To: pgkdan

Read the bill yourself, I did. It prohibits proseltyzing, preaching, building a church....it does not prohibit church attendance (I never said it did).


47 posted on 03/25/2009 1:45:02 PM PDT by wtc911 ("How you gonna get back down that hill?")
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To: cornelis

“This stuff is happening way to fast.”

There isn’t any speed that makes this tolerable.


48 posted on 03/25/2009 1:45:34 PM PDT by Toespi
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To: cornelis

It’s designed that way. It is like being in a boxing match. One guy (Hussein)is punching the other (the American citizens) from the right and the left and the right again, that the one getting pummelled (US) has no idea where the next punch is coming from because so we have no way to react or defend ourselves.


49 posted on 03/25/2009 1:45:42 PM PDT by FarRightFanatic (It wasn't an election. It was a socialist coup.)
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To: GeorgiaDawg32

I din’t see your #26 before I posted, you beat me to it!

Great minds think alike, eh?


50 posted on 03/25/2009 1:52:08 PM PDT by KittenClaws ("The state rubs the lotion on its skin, then it places the lotion in the basket". ~ Dead)
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