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Darwinists Trick Themselves in Texas
Discovery Institute ^ | March 29, 2009 | Bruce Chapman

Posted on 03/30/2009 12:58:22 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts

click here to read article


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To: GodGunsGuts; atlaw
the creationist mob GGG summoned with his double-posted arm-waving fit are the ones with their hair on fire

Au contraire mon ami, you are no special person. GGG has a ping list which alerts us to the topic. Your specious attack caught my attention as it probably did to the others. In the case of Harun(or whatever) what criminal offense has he performed by believing what he believes?

101 posted on 03/31/2009 5:53:11 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC; atlaw

For Mr. Lawyer, it’s not about the Yahya the man, it’s about Yahya teaching the Muslims about creation, which he pretty much lifted from Christian creationists. My main point is, not only is Yahya’s group bringing a calming influence to the Muslims in the Middle East (and Europe for that matter), he may be unwittingly bringing them the gospel by creating a cultural commonality between the *Christian* West and Islam. It’s only a matter of time before many of his creationist converts begin reading Christian Creation and ID books. And this will remind them of why the Qur’an affords special status to Christians and Jews as “people of the Book.”


102 posted on 03/31/2009 6:03:54 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: AndrewC
Perhaps you haven't noticed, but the “association” at issue is between GGG and GGG’s own statements. Do you agree with his assertions about the “materialist core” of radical Islam? That assertion, and his others delineated in post 73 (I believe, since I'm on a blackberry) are the ones at issue. They also happen to be consonant with the assertions of Harun Yahya, but GGG insists that they belong to him alone. So be it.
103 posted on 03/31/2009 6:24:31 PM PDT by atlaw
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To: atlaw
OK, I'll bite:

— “the majority of radical Islamist terrorists despise creation, and are materialist to the core”;

I haven't seen any polls of self-identified radical Islamist terrorists, so I'm agnostic on this point. GGG may know something I don't.

— radical Islamic terrorists are actually “hardcore Commie-Materialists who worship at the alter of evolutionary materialism”;

See above. Given the historical fact of Soviet sponsorship of anti-western Islamists I wouldn't be surprised that there is a Marxist influence in their beliefs, but at the same time the Koran is a creationist book in itself. They just have a really wicked idea of God and what He wants people to do to other people.

— “the more Muslims who become creationists (even if it’s of the Muslim variety) the more that helps the US and its allies in the War on Terror”; and

I think this would only help marginally. It would all depend on what sort of creationist they become (as per the above). I do lean in favor of this statement because while creationists can believe either a good God or a wicked one, atheism historically and logically drives people in the direction of practicing evil (either through hedonism or fascist/communist drives for control and domination).

— that 9/11 was actually perpetrated by Darwinist, materialist, atheists who were just disguised as radical Muslims.

Insofar as it was perpetrated by followers of the Wahhabi sect, I'm dubious. The Wahhabi doctrine is presumably uninfluenced by modern Darwinism, though elements of it may creep into their thought.

104 posted on 03/31/2009 6:34:40 PM PDT by Liberty1970 (Democrats are not in control. God is. And Thank God for that!)
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To: Liberty1970; atlaw; AndrewC

If anyone is interested in a fairly indepth *discussion*/intelligent debate on the subject, I would be glad to oblige.


105 posted on 03/31/2009 6:40:57 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
If anyone is interested in a fairly indepth *discussion*/intelligent debate on the subject

You can count atlaw and his evo cohorts out on that one. Even if capable that would not be their intent 

106 posted on 03/31/2009 6:44:39 PM PDT by valkyry1
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To: Liberty1970

Thanks. An actual rational response. I’ll read it more closely and respond tomorrow when I’m not on the blackberry with its mini-keyboard.


107 posted on 03/31/2009 6:44:43 PM PDT by atlaw
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To: editor-surveyor; atlaw; GodGunsGuts; Liberty1970; metmom; demshateGod; Fichori; AndrewC

“Comic relief has arrived!”

I ALWAYS MISS THE GOOD STUFF!!!

Am I way too late?


108 posted on 03/31/2009 6:52:36 PM PDT by Gordon Greene (www.fracturedrepublic.com - Jesus said, "I am THE way, THE truth and THE life." Any questions?)
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To: Liberty1970; atlaw; AndrewC; betty boop; valkyry1; editor-surveyor; Tailgunner Joe; Thunder90

re: If anyone is interested in a fairly indepth *discussion*/intelligent debate on the subject, I would be glad to oblige.

We could start right here:

http://www.globalpolitician.com/23436-terror-russia

Let me know, and I’ll start a new thread to discuss the subject.

All the best—GGG


109 posted on 03/31/2009 6:53:27 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: Gordon Greene

Not at all. If you look at my last reply, it may be only just beginning. Are you in???


110 posted on 03/31/2009 6:54:21 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

Looks like a pretty deep one and I don’t know who the heck Harun Yahya or whoever he’s talking about...

But sure... I’ll bite. I’ll be off and on though.

Got to take some time to indoctrinate my kids in my simplistic faith before they say their prayers to an unknown god.


111 posted on 03/31/2009 6:59:40 PM PDT by Gordon Greene (www.fracturedrepublic.com - Jesus said, "I am THE way, THE truth and THE life." Any questions?)
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To: Gordon Greene

LOL. You are always welcome, GG. Don’t bother knocking, just come right in :o)


112 posted on 03/31/2009 7:01:10 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts
Perhaps you haven't noticed, but the “association” at issue is between GGG and GGG’s own statements.

Perhaps you haven't noticed what you asserted. Here....



... You know, like your Islamic mentor GGG.


24 posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 5:52:51 PM by atlaw

That assertion, and his others delineated in post 73 (I believe, since I'm on a blackberry) are the ones at issue.

No, what is at issue is your guilt by association tack. Whether or not Muslims are materialists is not relevant since you injected the subject of Islam by accusation.


113 posted on 03/31/2009 7:05:26 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC; atlaw

I am left wondering if atlaw will ever admit what he did and apologize.


114 posted on 03/31/2009 7:33:18 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts; Alamo-Girl
... he wrangles up the pitchfork wielding villagers....

We're not going to get very far, atlaw, if all you've got are ad hominum attacks.

It's nice to know you hold me in such high regard though. /sarc

Meanwhile, I'm still waiting for you to clarify your objections to what GGG wrote.

115 posted on 03/31/2009 7:35:54 PM PDT by betty boop (All truthful knowledge begins and ends in experience. — Albert Einstein)
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To: GodGunsGuts

“I am left wondering if atlaw will ever admit what he did and apologize.”

Evolutionists of this ilk do not apologize. They simply pontificate.

It would take humility and an admission you are not god to apologize... I would love to think this is hyperbole, but it’s probably an understatement.


116 posted on 03/31/2009 7:40:37 PM PDT by Gordon Greene (www.fracturedrepublic.com - Jesus said, "I am THE way, THE truth and THE life." Any questions?)
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To: AndrewC
Carve it any way you want, Andrew. GGG’s statements still reek of Islamic apologetics to me, lifted almost verbatim from the words of an Islamic apologist. If you adopt another’s opinion as your own and reiterate it, “association” is a fair inference.

And the issue is, in fact, whether Islamic terrorism is the product of the supernatural irrationality that prevails in those contemporary societies that practice it or, as GGG asserts, the product of the western scientific rationalism that prevails in those contemporary societies that actually reject it.

And you still haven't addressed whether you agree with GGG's assertions.

117 posted on 03/31/2009 7:43:19 PM PDT by atlaw
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To: Gordon Greene

You never cease to crack me up...but then I realize you’re serious (and that I’m in serious agreement with you)!

All the best—GGG

PS Hopefully, atlaw will prove us wrong!


118 posted on 03/31/2009 7:46:09 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: atlaw; AndrewC; GodGunsGuts

“If you adopt another’s opinion as your own and reiterate it, “association” is a fair inference.”

“And you still haven’t addressed whether you agree with GGG’s assertions.”

DON’T DO IT, ANDY!!! IT’S A SETUP!!!

By your logic, outlaw... I’d be afraid to agree with you if you said the sky were blue for fear someone might think I was a radical, faith-based evolutionist.


119 posted on 03/31/2009 7:52:16 PM PDT by Gordon Greene (www.fracturedrepublic.com - Jesus said, "I am THE way, THE truth and THE life." Any questions?)
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To: atlaw; AndrewC; CottShop; Thunder90; Tailgunner Joe; editor-surveyor; betty boop; metmom; ...

==And the issue is, in fact, whether Islamic terrorism is the product of the supernatural irrationality that prevails in those contemporary societies that practice it or, as GGG asserts, the product of the western scientific rationalism that prevails in those contemporary societies that actually reject it.

See reply #109 for a pretty fair assessment of where I stand re: the roots of Islamic Terrorism. I don’t agree with every word, but it is a good launching pad for a serious discussion of the same.

All the best—GGG


120 posted on 03/31/2009 7:56:51 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: atlaw; betty boop; GodGunsGuts

GGG has the decency to ping people in plain view, as opposed to the stealth tactics of discussing *TOS* on the hidden threads over at DC and notifying everyone that way.

Your attempts to associate creationists with radical islam will only be seen as not whacked out by your fellow DCers. The rest of humanity, which has more decency and integrity in their little fingers than the DC crowd has put together, will see your tactics for what they are. You’re not fooling anyone but your other blinded evos comrades.


121 posted on 03/31/2009 7:57:34 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: atlaw; AndrewC

==And you still haven’t addressed whether you agree with GGG’s assertions.

You mean your deliberate twisting of my “assertions” in your attempt to make me look like I am a paid agent of muzzy extremists. Not only that, you created a hit piece using those same distortions, and began posting them in the threads. That’s character assassination, my FRiend, no two ways about it.


122 posted on 03/31/2009 8:00:45 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts
GGG’s statements still reek of Islamic apologetics to me, lifted almost verbatim from the words of an Islamic apologist.

So? Convince others that GGG lifted the words instead of being "convergent evolution". Darwinists should be adept at tap dancing around logic. In any case, it would still be red herring.

And the issue is, in fact, whether Islamic terrorism is the product of the supernatural irrationality that prevails in those contemporary societies that practice it or, as GGG asserts, the product of the western scientific rationalism that prevails in those contemporary societies that actually reject it.

No it isn't. You injected Islam into a thread about Texas education standards.

And you still haven't addressed whether you agree with GGG's assertions.

And I won't since your red herring has nothing to do with the subject of this thread. If you wish to start one on the principles of Islam, you are free to do so.

123 posted on 03/31/2009 8:01:30 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: Gordon Greene
DON’T DO IT, ANDY!!! IT’S A SETUP!!!

Thanks for the warning, but I am very familiar with "their" tactics.

124 posted on 03/31/2009 8:04:29 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC

“Thanks for the warning, but I am very familiar with “their” tactics.”

Sorry... that was meant as sarc for outlaw. I totally assume you know what you’re doing here.

outlaw?

notsomuch.


125 posted on 03/31/2009 8:10:56 PM PDT by Gordon Greene (www.fracturedrepublic.com - Jesus said, "I am THE way, THE truth and THE life." Any questions?)
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To: GodGunsGuts

[[Thanks, AC. I knew about Yahya long before Mr. Lawyer brought him up, but I don’t base what I think about Islamist terrorism on his writings. He’s a bit wacky here and there re: masonic conspiracies, etc.]]

NO need to explain GGG- And NO need to apologize for garnering info from Huryan when that info is spot on correct either- His views on other issues bears absolutely NO weight on those evidences he does present which happen to be correct- The evidences REFUTING Macroevolution stand on their own weight, and have stood the test of time- not to mention the silly malignings and ad hominem attacks agaisnt hte messenger, and there’s absolutely no reason to explain anything-

the whoel point of the matter is that this ‘guilt by association’ is NOTHING but a diversionary tactic perpetrated by evos when the FACTS and evidences are too much for them to handle- citing evidences no matter whom those evidences coem from does NOT align oneself with the author- Atlaw knows this- but the evidences lsited by Huryan apparently are too difficult for atlaw to tackle, so his only recourse is to attack both you and Huryan in hopes that peopel will forget that the evos stumbled over the evidences and couldn’t refute what was said with any credible coutner evidneces. Huryan has many great points about ID and IC that evos treat as though were kryptonite, and apparently their only recourse is to rabbit trail the topic- derail it at all costs- I’ve seen htis time and tiem again- infact most threads on FR abotu creation or ID or IC get derailed in like manner- with hte evidences NEVER being discussed by the evo crowd-

Apparently Macroevolution is in such terrible shape these days that derailing threads is the only way to ‘defend it’ anymore


126 posted on 03/31/2009 8:15:00 PM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: AndrewC

[[And I won’t since your red herring has nothing to do with the subject of this thread.]]

That’s al lthey’ve got left is red herrings- it’s almost comical - almost


127 posted on 03/31/2009 8:17:32 PM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: CottShop

You are quite correct. Mr. Lawyer is behaving like...well...a lawyer. If my make-believe Evo glove doesn’t fit, you must acquit!


128 posted on 03/31/2009 8:18:31 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

No- he’s goign way beyond that- he is itnentionally trying to ruin your reputaiton here on FR with blatant outright lies- dissagreements are one thing- but intentionally lying about someone time and tiem again is quite another, and he’s proven he’s apparently going to try to ruin you one way or another- He’s evidently not even itnerested in the thread topics anymore, but just in tarnishing you any way he can and derailing your threads- Those actions are NOT parcipitating in threads- they are intentional disruptions based on flat out lies, and annoying to everyone


129 posted on 03/31/2009 8:28:54 PM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: AndrewC
Nice out, Andrew (although “miraculous convergence” seems more apropos than “convergent evolution”). And I look forward to seeing you exercise your newly discovered outrage at the actual guilt by association arguments that are regularly trotted out by creationists.
130 posted on 03/31/2009 10:00:33 PM PDT by atlaw
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts
And I look forward to seeing you exercise your newly discovered outrage at the actual guilt by association arguments that are regularly trotted out by creationists.

I'm not outraged. I'm amused by your lack of argument. Back up what you assert. Mere similarity(the hallmark of Darwinism) is not an argument. Just because it looks so does not make it so. Where in the Quran does it mention the creation story? And again, what I do or fail to do has nothing to do with your argument against GGG. If I used the guilt by association argument, all Darwinists would be Dawkinists. They are not. Neither does it make them right.

131 posted on 03/31/2009 10:26:44 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts; Liberty1970; editor-surveyor; demshateGod; Fichori; AndrewC; CottShop; ...

The Book of Genesis contained in the Jewish Torah is believed to have been written about 1400 BC.

Jesus referred to it regularly while he was here on earth about 1400 years later, at about 33 AD.

Islam, which borrowed heavily from both the OT and NT, didn’t come into existence until after 600 AD.

Now to conflate Christianity and creationists with islam and use it to accuse creationists of being islamic terrorists because the muslims took the same creation account as the Jews, is intellectual dishonesty of the highest degree.

You aren’t really a lawyer, are you? Can you represent my opponent if I ever have to go to court for something?


132 posted on 04/01/2009 5:12:46 AM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: GodGunsGuts
If anyone is interested in a fairly indepth *discussion*/intelligent debate on the subject, I would be glad to oblige.

From the evo, no-intelligence allowed camp?

133 posted on 04/01/2009 5:15:36 AM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: AndrewC
Where in the Quran does it mention the creation story?

Heck if I know. Ask Harun Yahya. Or GGG, who claims to be sufficiently well versed in the subject to conclude that Muslim creationists are collectively peace-loving.

134 posted on 04/01/2009 5:23:27 AM PDT by atlaw
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To: metmom
Now to conflate Christianity and creationists with islam and use it to accuse creationists of being islamic terrorists because the muslims took the same creation account as the Jews, is intellectual dishonesty of the highest degree.

You really need to talk with GGG and Harun Yahya about this.

Can you represent my opponent if I ever have to go to court for something?

Sure. Who is he, and what's he suing you for?

135 posted on 04/01/2009 6:39:03 AM PDT by atlaw
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To: atlaw
Not just that Muslim creationists are peace loving; but into the “truther” territory that 9-11 was a conspiracy of secularists trying to pin it on Islamic fundamentalists or pass themselves off as Islamic fundamentalists.

And that Islamic terrorists are not Islamic if they are terrorists, and not terrorists if they are Islamic.

136 posted on 04/01/2009 6:42:05 AM PDT by allmendream ("Wealth is EARNED not distributed, so how could it be redistributed?")
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To: editor-surveyor

LOL!

That’s right.


137 posted on 04/01/2009 7:08:00 AM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: allmendream

Precisely. Rather frightening reasoning, isn’t it? But it doesn’t seem to disturb the creationists around here one whit.


138 posted on 04/01/2009 7:30:53 AM PDT by atlaw
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To: atlaw; GodGunsGuts
Heck if I know. Ask Harun Yahya. Or GGG, who claims to be sufficiently well versed in the subject to conclude that Muslim creationists are collectively peace-loving.

Well you should know. You are the one that introduced Islam into this thread and you made this statement in post 31....

...radical Islam is creationist to the core.

139 posted on 04/01/2009 8:08:38 AM PDT by AndrewC
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To: atlaw; allmendream; metmom; AndrewC; CottShop; Tailgunner Joe; Thunder90; editor-surveyor; ...

Allmendream and atlaw seem to be perfectly content in taking potshots rather than making and defending their apparent position. I have offered to start an in-depth debate thread on this subject of the Soviet roots of Islamic terrorism. I even offered a starting place. Namely, right here:

Roots of Islamic Terrorism: How Communists Helped Fundamentalists

http://www.globalpolitician.com/23436-terror-russia

Also, I cantacted the author of the above article, and he said he would be glad to join us. So what are you waiting for????


140 posted on 04/01/2009 8:14:05 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: AndrewC; atlaw

==...radical Islam is creationist to the core.

That seems to be atlaw’s agenda. As far as I can tell his thesis is as follows.

Harun Yahya = Creationist = Islamic Terrorism = Biblical Creation


141 posted on 04/01/2009 8:18:16 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: metmom

Trust me, I’m not holding my breath!


142 posted on 04/01/2009 8:19:26 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: metmom; atlaw

==Now to conflate Christianity and creationists with islam and use it to accuse creationists of being islamic terrorists because the muslims took the same creation account as the Jews, is intellectual dishonesty of the highest degree.

Notice, Mr. Lawyer refuses to defend his twisted “logic.” He’s only here for one reason, and one reason only...to slime creationists.


143 posted on 04/01/2009 8:21:15 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
I'm waiting for the tinfoil hat needed to tune in the secret transmission that says that Osama Bin Lauden is really motivated by Darwin not Mohammad; that he quotes from “the Origin of Species” not the “Quran”; that the organization known as “Islamic Jihad” is neither Islamic nor jihadist.

Now a Quiz for anybody interested in breaking the link between Islam and terrorism.....

In 1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by: (a) A salesman from Utah (b) An construction worker (c) A college student on Spring Break (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1972, 11 Israeli athletes were killed at the Munich Olympics by: (a) Your grandmother (b) A Midwest auto-parts dealer (c) A mom and her 6-year-old son visiting from Indiana (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by: (a) A bluegrass band (b) Dallas Cowboy fans (c) A tour group of 80-year-old women (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

During the 1980’s numerous Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by: (a) A family on their way to Disney World (b) Jesse Ventura (c) A Boy Scout Troop (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1983, the U.S. Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by: (a) A pizza delivery boy (b) The UPS guy (c) Geraldo Rivera making up for a slow news day (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked, and a 70-year-old disabled American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard by: (a) A girls’ choir (b) A hardware store owner (c) A secretary (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a U.S. Navy diver was murdered by: (a) A Marine officer with two weeks leave (b) A plumber going to visit his mom (c) A Catholic nun (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by: (a) A college-bound freshman (b) A cardiac surgeon on his way to Houston (c) A waitress (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1993, the World Trade Center was bombed by: (a) A starving actress (b) A mom with a newborn (c) Twin six-year-old boys (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1995, a plot to blow up U.S.-bound international flights over the Pacific was attempted by (a) Hawaiian school kids (b) An decorated Vietnam Veteran (c) Twin sisters on their way to Paducah (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 1998, the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by: (a) A local TV weatherman (b) A dad and his two sons on a ski trip (c) A widower going to visit his grandchildren (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2000, 17 sailors died in an attack on the USS Cole (DDG 67) in Yemen by: (a) A child in a stroller (b) A high school class on their way to visit Washington, DC (c) Newlyweds on their way to Miami (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked — two flown into the World Trade Centers, one into the Pentagon and one into the ground in rural Pennsylvania. They were hijacked by: (a) A retired police officer on a mission trip to Haiti (b) A
firefighter going to Maryland for training (c) An paramedic on his way to vacation in Hawaii (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2002 the United States liberated Afghanistan from: (a) USAID relief workers (b) Jewish Pilgrims (c) Christian missionaries (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl and other Westerners were kidnapped and beheaded by: (a) The Peace Corp (b) Scottish clansmen (c) Cuban refugees (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2002, more than 330 hostages n Beslan and 130 hostages in Moscow were murdered in sieges by: (a) Russian exchange students (b) The Red Guard (c) Church planters (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2003 the United States liberated Iraq from “The Butcher of Baghdad,” but most American military personnel were killed by: (a) Iraqi school-girls (b) Street vegetable venders (c) Women without burkas (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2004, more than 200 Spanish civilians were murdered on trains by bombs in Madrid, detonated by: (a) Morning commuters (b) A three-year-old Chinese girl (c) Flamenco dancers (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2005 more than 50 UK citizens were killed by bombs on trains in London, detonated by: (a) Rail workers (b) Those unable to hail taxis (c) Wheelchair-bound grandmothers (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2005, there were hundreds of casualties, men, women and children, killed by bombs in Jerusalem, Riyadh and Amman. These innocent civilians were murdered by: (a) Construction workers (b) Farmers (c) Christian missionaries (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2005, the city of Paris, and other European cities experienced an extended period of riots and destruction. The unrest was led by: (a) “Youth” (b) Soccer fans (c) Catholic nuns (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

Since the beginning of Operation Iraqi Freedom, more than 2,500 Americans have been murdered by terrorists. 35,000 Iraqi men, women and children have also been murdered by terrorists. Most of the combat and civilians casualties were the result of bombs
detonated in civilian population centers by: (a) Fruit vendors in Baghdad (b) Disgruntled transit union workers (c) Iraqi schoolteachers (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2006, hundreds of Israeli civilians have been killed by rockets launched by: (a) the Salvation Army (b) remnants of the ‘Jackson Five’ (c) the cast of ‘Friends’ (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

In 2006, a plot to blow up 10 U.S.-bound planes from the U.K. was attempted by (a) members of the royal family (b) Japanese tourists (c) groupies of the band ‘Cream’ (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

Since 2001, the FBI reports that there are major terrorist cells still in U.S. urban centers. Several of these cells have been uncovered and cell members arrested. In every case, the terrorists cell members were: (a) Southern Baptists Conventioneers (b) Lutheran Youth Groups (c) Presbyterian Elders (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

144 posted on 04/01/2009 8:30:19 AM PDT by allmendream ("Wealth is EARNED not distributed, so how could it be redistributed?")
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To: allmendream

Who said anything about breaking the link between Islam and Terrorism? My main point is that the Communists infiltrated Islam to spread world revolution, in much the same way as they attempted to infiltrate that Christian church via Liberation Theology to spread the same. My contention is that radical, political Islam is a hybrid of revolutionary materialism and Islam. That’s why you see Hezbollah flags lining the streets in Lebanon, not with their founders picture, but instead adorned with pictures of Che Guevara. That’s why studies have found that the majority Hezbollah suicide bombers come from secular socialist and communist parties. That is why Bin Laden’s number two man is a known KGB agent...because the commies (read: revolutionary materialists) have infiltrated Islam.

Like I said, put up or shut up. Are you up to starting a separate debate thread on this subject or not?


145 posted on 04/01/2009 8:42:56 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

I am not going to shut up. If you want to present your argument, such as it is, post the thread, invite me and anybody else you want to it, and I will engage your argument.

And you are the one trying to break the link between Islam and Terrorism. You are trying to claim that terrorists are not motivated by Islam to blow themselves and others sky high; but are “Temple of Darwin Fanatics” to use your phrasing.

This is revisionist history, and abject blindness to the motivations, rhetoric, and propaganda of our enemies.


146 posted on 04/01/2009 8:46:10 AM PDT by allmendream ("Wealth is EARNED not distributed, so how could it be redistributed?")
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To: GodGunsGuts

Care to answer the quiz questions GGG?

Who was responsible for all those terrorist acts?


147 posted on 04/01/2009 8:47:03 AM PDT by allmendream ("Wealth is EARNED not distributed, so how could it be redistributed?")
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To: allmendream

==Care to answer the quiz questions GGG? Who was responsible for all those terrorist acts?

Quiz question #1: In 1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by: (a) A salesman from Utah (b) An construction worker (c) A college student on Spring Break (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

“Sirhan was born in Jerusalem to a Palestinian Christian family and immigrated as a child to the United States with his family. In his adult life, however, he made several religious conversions, joining Baptist and Seventh-day Adventist churches, and dabbled in the occult.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirhan_Sirhan

He (Sirhan) told Weidner, “There is no God. Look at what God has done for the Arabs! And for the Palestinians! How can we believe in God?”

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=3114ABEF-4F87-4987-A263-E71D81ABD9AD

The only Arab leader he really admired was Nasser (secular socialist) and he thought Nasser’s policies were right. The Arabs had to build themselves up and fight Israel, that was the only way. The only outside friend the Arabs had was Russia, but, according to Sirhan, Russia had not proved a good enough friend during last June’s fighting (Six Day War).”

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=3114ABEF-4F87-4987-A263-E71D81ABD9AD


148 posted on 04/01/2009 9:03:41 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: allmendream

==In 1972, 11 Israeli athletes were killed at the Munich Olympics by: (a) Your grandmother (b) A Midwest auto-parts dealer (c) A mom and her 6-year-old son visiting from Indiana (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

“Probably the second largest organization and certainly the key to the story of the Black September hijackings was the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP). Unlike Fatah, it was highly ideological, calling not only for the liberation of Palestine but also for the creation of a Marxist-Leninist Arab society. Formed in January 1968 by 41-year-old Dr. George Habash and his second in command, 43-year-old Dr. Wadia Haddad, the PFLP was fiercely independent although it did receive extensive funding from Iraq and had close ties with Red China. The group was militant and radical. “If [it] is the only way to destroy Israel, Zionism, and Arab reaction,” Habash asserted in a 1970 interview, “then we want World War III to come.” In another he warned, “America is our enemy,” and the PFLP was about to “teach the United States a lesson.”

http://www.meforum.org/1768/terror-in-black-september-an-eyewitness-account


149 posted on 04/01/2009 9:08:42 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: allmendream

==In 1979, the U.S. embassy in Iran was taken over by: (a) A bluegrass band (b) Dallas Cowboy fans (c) A tour group of 80-year-old women (d) Middle Eastern Islamist males between the ages of 17 and 40.

“Among the closest associates of Khomeini, there were many Communists who had conveniently grown beards. Mustafa Ali Chamran had studied in California and Egypt before he founded a Red Shi’ite secret society. His pupils included later foreign minister Ibrahim Yazdi, oil minister Mohammed Gharazi, and a Lebanese fellow student in Berkeley University, Hussein Shaikh al-Islam, who led the occupation of the US Embassy in Tehran. This occupation, shortly before the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, focused Iranian radicalism into anti-Americanism. (Taheri, p. 78 and 139-140) Mohammed Beheshti, whose death at a bombing on June 28th, 1981, remained a mystery, had resided in East Germany. Khomeini’s early companion and foreign minister, Sadegh Ghotbzadeh, was a link to Syria. Most left-wing radicals were repressed only after summer 1981, by which time many former Communists had successfully accommodated with the new regime. Both Ghotbzadeh and Chamran had received Palestinian terrorist training. As a student in the USA, Ghotbzadeh had been recruited by the GRU. (Livingston & Halevy, p. 153-154; Kuzichkin, p. 302)”

http://users.jyu.fi/~aphamala/pe/issue5/roots.htm


150 posted on 04/01/2009 9:19:43 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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