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FOX News Reports On The Myth Of "90 percent" (of the firearms in Mexico come from the USA)
NRA - ILA ^ | April 03, 2009 | NA

Posted on 04/07/2009 12:02:19 AM PDT by neverdem


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FOX News Reports On The Myth Of "90 percent"
 
Friday, April 03, 2009
 

In a story that looks at the reality of firearms seized from Mexican drug cartels, Fox News has found that the truth does not match the rhetoric of anti-gun politicians and journalists. 

In a story entitled "The Myth of 90 Percent: Only a Small Fraction of Guns in Mexico Come From U.S." Fox reporters William La Jeunesse and Maxim Lott found that the 90% number far overstates the number of U.S. origin guns that are in the hands of the cartels.  In fact, the story reports that the number is actually closer to 17%. 

NRA-ILA Executive Director Chris Cox, quoted in the story said "Reporter after politician after news anchor just disregards the truth on this.  The numbers are intentionally used to weaken the Second Amendment." 

The story also details the other sources for weapons used by the cartels, including firearms from Russia, South America, Asia and even the Mexican Army. 

Unsurprisingly, when contacted for comment, radical anti-gun activist Tom Diaz of the Violence Policy Center called the issue a "red herring."  Ignoring the reality exposed by the Fox News story, Diaz remained adamant that U.S. gun laws are to blame, claiming, "We know that one hell of a lot of firearms come from the United States because our gun market is wide open." 

Go here to read the entire story and get the truth about the guns seized from Mexican drug cartels.



TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Front Page News; Mexico; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: banglist; democrats; foxnews; hillary; immigrantlist; medialies; mythof90percent; obama
< EMBED id=mediumFlashEmbedded name=undefined pluginspage=http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer src=http://foxnews1.a.mms.mavenapps.net/mms/rt/1/site/foxnews1-foxnews-pub01-live/current/videolandingpage/fncLargePlayer/client/embedded/embedded.swf width=305 height=275 type=application/x-shockwave-flash flashvars="playerId=videolandingpage&playerTemplateId=fncLargePlayer&categoryTitle=Search&referralObject=4137802&referralPlaylistId=search" wmode="false" scriptAccess="always" salign="LT" menu="false" scale="noscale" play="false" quality="high" allowFullScreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" bgcolor="#000000">< /TD>< /TR>< /TBODY>< /TABLE>

That's the code for the video apparently, but I don't know how to make it work. I added spaces or it would otherwise vanish.

Go to the source for the video.

1 posted on 04/07/2009 12:02:19 AM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem

Good try....{:-)


2 posted on 04/07/2009 12:16:47 AM PDT by SuperLuminal (Where is another agitator for republicanism like Sam Adams when we need him?)
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To: neverdem

Diaz is whining about “open gun market” (which it isn’t). If they belive this, why don’t these jerks plug the borders?


3 posted on 04/07/2009 1:04:45 AM PDT by Cobra64 (www.BulletBras.net)
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To: neverdem
The U.S. government is doing most of the "gun running."

The Cockroach and the Lightswitch: A Spotlight on the Gunshow-Loophole-Mexican-Narco-Nexus Lie

Here is another article with similar information.

The Myth of 90 Percent: Only a Small Fraction of Guns in Mexico Come From U.S

4 posted on 04/07/2009 1:09:26 AM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye; neverdem
The U.S. government is doing most of the "gun running."

Absolutely, the govt has been pumping weapons into Mexico for years under the failed "War On Drugs" banner, now they want to increase the "help" to Mexico in battling the cartels again... By sending more weapons.

Anyone with half a brain can tell that Mexico is hiding the true source of the weapons traffic by not releasing the serial numbers from the confiscated weapons... Because the bulk of American made weapons come from the Mexican Military deserters and the Zetas, which were supplied by... Good 'ole Uncle Sam.

Drop the WOD and the Cartels influence and funds would be cut to the bone.

5 posted on 04/07/2009 3:23:44 AM PDT by AvOrdVet ("Put the wagons in a circle for all the good it'll do")
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To: neverdem

The truth will never stop Feinstein, McCarthy, Pelosi, Schumer, Biden, and their puppets in the MSM from spouting the “90% comes from U.S. gun dealers”!

This is the Democrat talking point and will NEVER be challenged by any Democrat politician or any MSM source. The U.S. State Dept. will never be given blame - only the EEEEEEEVIL gun dealers!


6 posted on 04/07/2009 3:47:01 AM PDT by TexasRedeye (uickly)
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To: TexasRedeye

Demo-Socialists can’t handle the truth. Whenever the Socialists are confronted with the truth, they change the subject.


7 posted on 04/07/2009 5:08:48 AM PDT by pleikumud
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To: neverdem

W-W-What?? You mean our government, and our media, LIES to us?


8 posted on 04/07/2009 5:59:48 AM PDT by 2harddrive (...House a TOTAL Loss.....)
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To: pleikumud

The Left is all about mythology, they are like the kids in the movie, “Song of the South.”


9 posted on 04/07/2009 6:01:33 AM PDT by junta (Not even respectable mainstream conservatives can save liberalism.)
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To: TigersEye
The Cockroach and the Lightswitch: A Spotlight on the Gunshow-Loophole-Mexican-Narco-Nexus Lie

There is a simple reason I don't buy this "American military weapons" story. It's too easy and too cheap to get them from somewhere else.

10 posted on 04/07/2009 8:35:44 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: Carry_Okie
The frauds just keep on a-coming.....thanks to the conniving Mexican government.

Juan Hernandez (stooge McC's hispanic outreach man) told Cong Tancredo: "Mexico's plan to populate the United States with millions of Hispanics tied economically, politically and linguistically to Mexico, makes us able to exert enormous influence and pressure on US policy and its dealings with Mexico."

Juan Hernandez is a dual citizen who headed the "Ministry of Mexicans Living in the United States."

THE LATEST RIPOFF The bogus Mexican "drug war" is creating a new class of illegal connivers........"refugees" seeking "political asylum" in the US.

This classification was once reserved for those claiming religious or political persecution.

Now Mexican are pouring into the US, whining about "persecution"......another way to collect US govt freebies.

THE RIPOFF UP CLOSE Social Security provides outrageous government financial aid to "refugees" claiming "persecution."

Keep in mind these people never paid a dime into the SS system; yet, they can collect seven years straight and can get extended payments if they are politically well-connected. The SS checks to these "persecuted refugees" can amount to $1000 a month and more.

NOTE WELL Some of these suckups are wealthy people whining about "persecution", squatting on US soil, intent on draining the US treasury.

ACTION NOW Call your reps and demand these payments and the "persecuted refugee" classification be stopped.

Call Congress 202-224-312----WH 202-456-1414

11 posted on 04/07/2009 10:48:27 AM PDT by Liz (I was like Snow White, then I drifted. Mae West (on liberalism.)
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To: Carry_Okie
How hard and how expensive is it to walk away from your army unit with the hardware they issue to you. And maybe a little extra?

Between Jan 2000-Dec 2006: More than 163,000 military members were criminally processed during former president Vicente Fox’s 6 years term of office. The majority of the crimes were: [the list includes abuse of power, homicide, embezzlement, kidnapping, bank robbery, illegal possession of firearms and health crimes [essentially organized crime].

Another slide in that same DEA PowerPoint presentation states that the Mexican military reported an average of 1,200 desertions per month in 2006.

I would also say that neither article I linked, nor the one heading this thread, attribute the whole problem to legally transferred arms from the U.S. Nor did I intend to infer that.

12 posted on 04/07/2009 11:55:07 AM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: AvOrdVet
Drop the WOD and the Cartels influence and funds would be cut to the bone.

Unfortunately I think the current administration (and possibly the last two as well) have a stake in wanting to foment civil strife in Mexico in order to break the border with a flood of refugees.

13 posted on 04/07/2009 12:01:41 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye
How hard and how expensive is it to walk away from your army unit with the hardware they issue to you. And maybe a little extra?

Are you saying that the Mexican Army uses US military small arms? Aren't all of those serialized? If in fact the weapons the gangs use do not (for the most part) have serial numbers, then the scenario you describe, while I am sure it happens, does not follow in most cases, unless of course they were removed. I just don't see why anyone in Mexico would bother removing them. It's easier just to buy a dispensation from the Federales.

14 posted on 04/07/2009 12:08:49 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: TigersEye
Unfortunately I think the current administration (and possibly the last two as well) have a stake in wanting to foment civil strife in Mexico in order to break the border with a flood of refugees.

I agree, People have been wondering for years why the Feds would leave the door open, especially after a devastating attack on our own soil...

...Its kind of weird, over the years I watched and listened to the "fringe" talking about the SPP, the Amero, the Trans Highway, a Global Financial System, a One World Government... For some reason they don't seem as "fringe" anymore.

15 posted on 04/07/2009 12:26:13 PM PDT by AvOrdVet ("Put the wagons in a circle for all the good it'll do")
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To: neverdem

Fox News, doing the job of the entirety of the media.


16 posted on 04/07/2009 12:37:22 PM PDT by wastedyears (April 21st, 2009 - International Iron Maiden Day)
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To: Carry_Okie
Are you saying that the Mexican Army uses US military small arms? Aren't all of those serialized?

Yes the Mexican Military uses U.S. weaponry and yes they are serialized. But for some weird reason the Mexican Government will not share the serial numbers with the U.S. Government or maybe they have... But none of it has been released publicly, Why?

I'm willing to bet a chunk of those U.S. made weapons came from the Mexican Military and/or the Zetas, both were armed with American weapons and "other" technology in the "War On Drugs". Unfortunately the Zetas, a former Mexican Military Para-Military Unit, decided the Cartels paid better.

The truth on this "American Gun running" lie is starting to get out and there will be some politicians with egg all over their faces. As it has been reported for about a week now, only about 17% come from the U.S. the rest are from the normal suspects... China, Russia, South and Central America, etc., a veritable smorgasbord of manufacturers.

17 posted on 04/07/2009 12:43:33 PM PDT by AvOrdVet ("Put the wagons in a circle for all the good it'll do")
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To: Carry_Okie
Are you saying that the Mexican Army uses US military small arms?

The main arm of the Mexican army has long been the M-16.

Aren't all of those serialized?

Another example of coordination problems occurred this month. Mexican authorities in Reynosa across the border from McAllen, seized the country’s single largest stash of cartel weapons — nearly 300 assault rifles, shoulder-fired grenade launchers and a half million rounds of ammunition.

But weeks later, Mexican authorities still have not allowed the ATF access to serial numbers that would help them track down the buyers and traffickers on the U.S. side.

----------------------------------

But in those same two years, according to the Mexican government, 29,000 guns were recovered at crime scenes. In other words, 68 percent of the guns that were recovered were never submitted for tracing.

It's easier just to buy a dispensation from the Federales.

The drug cartels are buying dispensations for full-auto rifles, grenade launchers and explosives?

18 posted on 04/07/2009 12:44:27 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: AvOrdVet
For some reason they don't seem as "fringe" anymore.

I know what you mean. I have long taken those theories with a grain of salt and a "wait and see" attitude. The more I see the more those theories are bolstered not less.

19 posted on 04/07/2009 12:46:38 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye
The main arm of the Mexican army has long been the M-16.

IIRC, the M-16 is far from being the most common weapon obtained from drug gangs in Mexico.

The drug cartels are buying dispensations for full-auto rifles, grenade launchers and explosives?

They get Federales in 50-cal equipped Hummers to escort coyotes over the border, so why not?

20 posted on 04/07/2009 1:00:42 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: Carry_Okie
IIRC, the M-16 is far from being the most common weapon obtained from drug gangs in Mexico.

Like I said; neither I nor the two articles used as sources here are making the claim that the majority of drug cartel weapons come from the U.S. Legally or illegally. But it is clear that a lot of hardware from legally sanctioned U.S. sources is available in Mexico and other Latin American countries.

More Than $1 billion In Private-Sector Weapons Exports Approved For Mexico Since 2004

That means the total value of defense-related hardware and service exports by private U.S. companies to Mexico tallied nearly $5 billion over the four-year window. And that figure doesn’t even count the $700 million in assistance already authorized under the Merida Initiative [Plan Mexico] or any new DCS exports approved for fiscal years 2008 and 2009 [which ends Sept. 30].

Following is a sample of the types of arms shipments approved for export to Mexico through the DCS program during fiscal years 2006 and 2007 alone:

They get Federales in 50-cal equipped Hummers to escort coyotes over the border, so why not?

Yet you are making the case that the drug cartels are not armed with American equipment taken from the Mexican army!?! But they are getting American made Humvees and .50 cals complete with troops to man them??? That is a mighty fine line those gangsters walk. Hired Federales with Humvees and Ma Deuces but no M-16s.

21 posted on 04/07/2009 1:28:30 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: Carry_Okie
IIRC, the M-16 is far from being the most common weapon obtained from drug gangs in Mexico.

Could you give us the source of your information and tell us what is the most common weapon taken from Mexican drug gangs? That would be helpful to us all since everything I have read says the Mexican gov, the ATF and our own State Dept. have been unwilling or unable to provide that information.

But that assumes the Mexican government, and our own government, really want to trace those weapons. A November 2008 report in the San Antonio Express News, which includes details of the major weapons seizure in Reynosa, Mexico, that same month involving the Zetas, reveals the following:

Another example of coordination problems occurred this month. Mexican authorities in Reynosa across the border from McAllen, seized the country’s single largest stash of cartel weapons — nearly 300 assault rifles, shoulder-fired grenade launchers and a half million rounds of ammunition.

But weeks later, Mexican authorities still have not allowed the ATF access to serial numbers that would help them track down the buyers and traffickers on the U.S. side.


22 posted on 04/07/2009 1:34:50 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye
Could you give us the source of your information and tell us what is the most common weapon taken from Mexican drug gangs?

Look at the pricing. The average world price for an AK-47 is around $150. That would have to mean that the supply is virtually unlimited. The AK is one of the most reliable weapons ever made. NOBODY could make a profit transporting weapons from the US and selling them there for that price.

So, why buy an M-16 when you can get an AK that cheap?

23 posted on 04/07/2009 1:46:45 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: Carry_Okie
For the third time; I have not argued (nor have the sources I cited) that most arms in drug gang's hands are from the U.S. I have pointed out repeatedly that the majority of arms confiscated have not even been submitted to tracing efforts.

You made the claim that the M-16 was not the most common weapon found. (it is also not the only U.S. made military rifle either) Many FReepers have been working hard to find out what is being found and where it came from. If you have information about that please share it with the forum.

24 posted on 04/07/2009 1:56:30 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye
You made the claim that the M-16 was not the most common weapon found. (it is also not the only U.S. made military rifle either).

I stated it as a recollection, not a "claim."

Many FReepers have been working hard to find out what is being found and where it came from.

Anybody who has such sources would be VERY unlikely to divulge them, because the people in a position to know would take a very dim view of such a revelation.

25 posted on 04/07/2009 2:06:19 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: Carry_Okie
So, why buy an M-16 when you can get an AK that cheap?

I will also repeat what I said about that in the first place. Free is still cheaper than $150.

26 posted on 04/07/2009 2:06:35 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: Carry_Okie
Anybody who has such sources would be VERY unlikely to divulge them, because the people in a position to know would take a very dim view of such a revelation.

IOWs there is no reliable information, from any source, as to what the drug gangs have or where they are getting it. We have your recollection, from an apparently unremembered source, that something other than M-16s are the most found drug gang weapon. A "recollection" I did not tacitly disagree with.

You have danced around every question I have put to you and all the supporting information I have produced so I don't really know what point it is you're trying to make. The bottom line is the drug gangs aren't getting much from gun shops, gun shows or any other civilian source in the U.S.

27 posted on 04/07/2009 2:14:54 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye

Thanks for the links.


28 posted on 04/07/2009 2:18:30 PM PDT by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: neverdem

You’re welcome. Apparently one is the same FOX News article your link leads to. I didn’t realize that when I posted it. Oh well. It can’t have too much exposure.


29 posted on 04/07/2009 2:26:21 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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To: TigersEye; Squantos
For the third time; I have not argued (nor have the sources I cited) that most arms in drug gang's hands are from the U.S.

Please show where I said that you did.

I have pointed out repeatedly that the majority of arms confiscated have not even been submitted to tracing efforts.

That is now common knowledge. So what?

You made the claim that the M-16 was not the most common weapon found. (it is also not the only U.S. made military rifle either)

Correct. According to the Fox News article, The Myth of 90 Percent, the several sources listed Asia, Russia, Israel, South Korea, Spain, and "former Soviet block manufacturers."

Hence my comment, that if I recall correctly, the majority of weapons are not M-16s which, frankly, should be obvious. You are making a mountain out of a mole-hill, reading more into what I said than what I meant.

If I had any other source of information, I would surely not divulge it to you on a public forum. For such information to be citable and definitive would require significant information on illegal gun trafficking I do not possess. For you to ask a long standing FReeper to do that, is thus effectively setting them up for a knock on the door. Why would you do that?

30 posted on 04/07/2009 4:01:57 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (From Messiah to Massah in one swell foop.)
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To: Carry_Okie
Please show where I said that you did.

You have repetitiously made the point that Mexican gangland arms are not mostly from the U.S. I just figured you had a point in that somewhere.

That is now common knowledge. So what?

So what is your point arguing whatever obscure point it is that you're making? Or are you simply babbling with no point to make?

Hence my comment, that if I recall correctly, the majority of weapons are not M-16s which, frankly, should be obvious.

I never said they were so, again, what is your point if any?

If I had any other source of information, I would surely not divulge it to you on a public forum. For such information to be citable and definitive would require significant information on illegal gun trafficking I do not possess. For you to ask a long standing FReeper to do that, is thus effectively setting them up for a knock on the door. Why would you do that?

That is the nuttiest screed I have read in a while. You made a statement (recollection/whatever) regarding what the most common arm is taken from the drug gangs. I asked you for something more than your recollection to back it up. It is a common request here at FR and always has been. Paranoid much? lol

31 posted on 04/07/2009 5:46:33 PM PDT by TigersEye (Cloward-Piven Strategy)
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