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McVeigh reference prompts responseDavid Schippers contends OKC bomber part of Islamic,
World Net Daily ^ | 04/23/2009 | WorldNetDaily

Posted on 04/23/2009 4:19:29 PM PDT by RaceBannon

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To: muawiyah
"What do you imagine happened to it?"

Three columns were taken out a few seconds before the truck blew. Several other columns were also wired to go, but the det cord must have fallen, preventing them from igniting. The OKC fire dept disclosed their existance about 30 minutes after the explosion.

101 posted on 04/23/2009 6:44:55 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (The beginning of the O'Bummer administration looks a lot like the end of the Nixon administration)
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To: yazoo

Your comments might lead one to think that you are FBI or ATF. Your signup date is fairly recent. Just saying........


102 posted on 04/23/2009 6:45:54 PM PDT by WVNan (Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected.: Sun Tzu)
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To: editor-surveyor
Not really.

The large column closest to the explosion disappeared. That's all it took. Gravity did the rest.

103 posted on 04/23/2009 6:52:32 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: XeniaSt
The final report ( City Of Oklahoma City Document Management. Final Report. pp. 10–12.) describes 30-foot (9.1 m) wide, 8-foot (2.4 m) deep crater on NW 5th Street next to the building.

The general concensus of opinion is that the truck bomb created the crater because no one recalled it ever having been there before.

104 posted on 04/23/2009 6:57:43 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Cicero

Folks by the millions come into the United States all the time WITHOUT the assistance of the CIA. Why would this guy need the CIA? Was he not as educated and smart as your typical Mexican illegal?


105 posted on 04/23/2009 6:59:24 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: exit82

You people spouting off on this truck bomb doing little damage are good for several laughs. Ya’ll need to study up on your physics as it relates to blast compression and decay rates of low speed detonations.

Tim McVeigh set of the bomb. The truck bomb brought down the Murrah building.

What the government covered up was the fact that Iraquis were involved. Jayna Davis deserves the Presidential Medal of Freedom for her work in uncovering the Iraqi link/involvement to the bombings.

By the way, Bush didn’t want to get involved because his daddy is the one who started the repatriation of former Iraqi military into the US.


106 posted on 04/23/2009 7:01:43 PM PDT by Bryan24 (When in doubt, move to the right..........)
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To: muawiyah

Why would a good, middle class guy, a lieutenant in military intelligence in Germany, from a well-known Christian Democrat family, in no need of money, and absolutely no record of extremism, want to sneak over the border?

Obviously there’s no way of knowing, but Ockham’s Razor suggests that he was invited as a shared intelligence gesture. Especially when virtually everyone at Elohim City seems to have been a double agent working for some branch of US government. It’s even been suggested that the Pastor in charge of Elohim City was not really a simple Nazi Aryan cultist but yet another double agent. Else why was he friendly with such strange folks?


107 posted on 04/23/2009 7:12:37 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: yazoo
"And it has been shown beyond any doubt that there was no rocket."

No, exactly the opposite. They cannot ascertain what caused "the spark". They suppose and guess and theorize, BUT NEVER FOUND A SPARK CAUSE.

"It was debris from the plane that appeared to be a rocket. No one saw the rocket before it hit the plane, they all said they looked up when they heard the explosion and saw the rocket trail."

Total lie. There were dozens of witness who saw rocket/fireworks/something going up. Included in those was Colonel Fritz Meyer, a NG helicopter pilot who flew helicopters in Vietnam. He's SEEN highorder detonations and knows what they look like. He saw the explosions.

TWA80 was a succesful coverup. The truth will never be made public nor accepted.

"Not one trace of explosives was found anywhere on the plane.

False. Residue was found. The FBI trotted out the bomb training exercise as the excuse. Never mind that the 747 downed over Long Island was NOT the same 747 that the bomb exercise occured on.

108 posted on 04/23/2009 7:13:26 PM PDT by Bryan24 (When in doubt, move to the right..........)
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To: RaceBannon

I was in the same batallion at Fort Riley (2-16 Inf) that Mcveigh had served in a couple years prior 94-95 before being shipped to Korea (I never knew him but knew a couple of guys that did). I remember going to formation after the Murrah building was bombed and as young soldiers do we were of the same mind that we’d soon be back in the Middle East kicking the crap out of whatever organization and/or country was responsible. I’ll never forget a certain staff sergeant who was a “homesteader” (he’d been at Fort Riley KS for 8 years or so already with no change of duty station) say “I wouldn’t be so quick to assume it was someone from over there”. He stated this the day before McVeigh was caught. The way he said it has always stayed with me. The FBI showed up on post once Mcveigh was caught, and we were told the FBI was opening files on all of us and that we may be brought to the old WW2 barracks (replete with triple-strand concertina wire and MP guards) for questioning. Looking back, it rates up as one of the more bizarre moments in my life. And later, once I read of Nichols visits and his wife from the Phillipines, I didn’t find it much of a stretch to think that Islamists were involved. I’d bet there were others that assisted or knew of the plot as well.


109 posted on 04/23/2009 7:13:45 PM PDT by model B (attitude is a little thing that makes a big difference -- Sir Winston Churchill)
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To: Bryan24
By the way, Bush didn’t want to get involved because his daddy is the one who started the repatriation of former Iraqi military into the US.

That's true. There were a number of Saddam's Republican Guards in the area at that time--and still are, evidently.

110 posted on 04/23/2009 7:14:28 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Cicero

Maybe he had no idea you needed to “check in” through customs or something. Like it’s not uncommon to just walk into this country and go about your business like you belonged here.


111 posted on 04/23/2009 7:14:42 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

Well, as a matter of fact, since the statute of limitations has now passed, I can confess that we sneaked into England that way back in fall 1974. My wife and I, with five kids and a babysitter, and an enormous pile of luggage, got off the QE 2 in Southhampton. I think we did show someone our passports on board.

Then the kids started to get antsy, so we proceeded down the gangplank, where we located our VW bus that had come over with us and had been lifted out of the hold by crane, and our enormous pile of luggage. I rented a small lorry for the drive to Cambridge.

Then we looked around for Customs. They had been absent all this while. It seemed they were having a tea break. So I loaded the trunks into the lorry, my wife got the kids into the car, and we just drove off. No luggage inspection. No questions asked. They must have been having a very nice tea break.


112 posted on 04/23/2009 7:21:23 PM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Cicero

Just to see if it could be done I used to walk from adjacent postal facilities into the heart of the customs facility (in various port cities) and not once was I challenged.


113 posted on 04/23/2009 7:23:46 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: 2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten
All I can say in this day of 20 year long drawn out appeals before death row inmates are executed they sure got McVeigh out of the way in a hurry.

I was wondering about that, too. It seems that Timothy McVeigh waived his appeals. So, since he had a conviction with a death sentence, he was going to be executed (which he wanted).

114 posted on 04/23/2009 7:25:29 PM PDT by my_pointy_head_is_sharp (We're living in the Dark Ages.)
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To: April Lexington

You are 1000% Correct! Regarding Oklahoma City, Richard Clarke, Clintoon’s Terror Czar, ridiculed the theory that McVeigh and Nichols did it on their own, in his words, “they couldn’t make a firecracker explode with a match” and that the Bomb was more powerful than the very sophisticated one that the Iranians used on the Khobar Towers! We need to know the Facts!


115 posted on 04/23/2009 7:26:31 PM PDT by True Republican Patriot (GOD BLESS AMERICA and Our Last Great President George W. Bush)
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To: muawiyah

You’re accepting the propagandidts hand waving. None of what you have posted is even marginally factual. You need to challenge more.


116 posted on 04/23/2009 7:39:12 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (The beginning of the O'Bummer administration looks a lot like the end of the Nixon administration)
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To: editor-surveyor
You did know about the post office across the street, right?

It's not like I was isolated from some very relevant but little publicized information.

Plus, we've had tall buildings around here that collapsed top to bottom because they do that when a floor gets cut loose. I posted URLs so even you could read about that particular process.

As even Isaac Newton could have told you "Gravity Works".

117 posted on 04/23/2009 7:52:44 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: SonOfPyrodex

Hey, welcome aboard!
You’re one of the few nubies that doesn’t seem bent on destroying this place.


118 posted on 04/23/2009 7:59:04 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (The beginning of the O'Bummer administration looks a lot like the end of the Nixon administration)
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To: True Republican Patriot
An 85-foot crater marked the spot where the truck bomb went off. Ballistics experts would later determine that the blast was the equivalent of 20,000 to 30,000 pounds of TNT, far greater than the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995 that destroyed the Murrah Federal Building.


OKC:


119 posted on 04/23/2009 8:09:23 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: yazoo

How old were you when the Oklahoma bombing happened?


120 posted on 04/23/2009 8:33:22 PM PDT by A. Patriot (CZ 52's ROCK)
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To: 70th Division
and the Government put Tim down in a month.

BIIIIINNNNGOOOOOO! You will the cupie doll! This is EXACTLY my point! I would have kept him alive and did the Gitmo on him until he sung loud and clear! They wanted him quiet. Add him to the Arkancide list...

121 posted on 04/23/2009 9:07:15 PM PDT by April Lexington (Study the constitution so you know what they are taking away!)
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To: editor-surveyor

Gee, wonder if he read Jayna Davis’s book? Too bad Napolitano didn’t.


122 posted on 04/23/2009 9:09:52 PM PDT by Arizona Carolyn
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To: A. Patriot

50s


123 posted on 04/24/2009 3:50:51 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: editor-surveyor

“The OKC fire officials said early on on TV that the columns had been cut, and that there had been multiple charges in the basement. They even allowed the TV news crew to shoot some footage of unexploded charges that had been found.”

And this tv crew, who had the story of the century just let it drop. Where did you get all this bogus information about columns being cut and charges placed? You gotta know it is someone’s fantasy.


124 posted on 04/24/2009 3:53:19 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: editor-surveyor

“If you haven’t observed that conspiracies are the only way that anything gets done here you’re truly blind.”

Well, that pretty much said it all. Of course, this is a conspiracy run by Bill Clinton who was so good at managing conspiracies he couldn’t keep himself from being impeached for screwing around with a bimbo.


125 posted on 04/24/2009 3:56:43 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: Cicero

“No, he didn’t need to come into the country openly because someone, presumably the CIA, let him in covertly. And his line of work included intelligence liaison.”

It is obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. Germans did not need visas to travel to the US. Americans do not need visas to travel to EU.


126 posted on 04/24/2009 4:03:04 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: RaceBannon

McVeigh was just a precurser training vessel used by Islamic terrorists against America.

Now they have a McVeigh 2.


127 posted on 04/24/2009 4:12:35 AM PDT by Eye of Unk ("If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." T. Paine)
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To: D-fendr

128 posted on 04/24/2009 4:23:46 AM PDT by BushCountry (They say the world has become too complex for simple answers. They are wrong.)
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To: Kansas58; editor-surveyor; yazoo
More Incidents of Denying Islamist Terrorism

Note that one of the incidents on this list involves OK authorities denying an Islamic connection to a crime where there obviously is one.

OK, yazoo, I posted without checking my facts and you called me on it. Good for you.

But now I have read up on Nichols and he does claim there were others involved. I guess you could say that a lot of unsubstantiated claims are made in prison but I can't help thinking that the Clinton and Bush administrations didn't have much interest in finding out if that particular claim is true.

Do you have any theories?

129 posted on 04/24/2009 4:29:38 AM PDT by samtheman
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To: yazoo

“It is obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. Germans did not need visas to travel to the US. Americans do not need visas to travel to EU.”

That is strange since visas are required to travel to Canada, Mexico and the Carribean now.


130 posted on 04/24/2009 6:14:16 AM PDT by antisocial (Texas SCV - Deo Vindice)
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To: yazoo

You seem to have some sort of comprehension problem. Did I mention “visa”?


131 posted on 04/24/2009 8:02:10 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: ItisaReligionofPeace
The idiotic bantering on this thread is NOT any different from the idiots who claim 9/11 was a conspiracy by Bush to start a war and to profit. Unbelievable idiots.

So, in essence, you are saying that we can expunge the word conspiracy from our dictionaries?

It's been a while, but I did a lot of research into the various conspiracy theories surrounding both the OK city bombing and 9/11. The 9/11 folks are nuts and there are gaping holes in all of the scenerios I read about.

Oklahoma City is another matter. There is (in my humble opinion) a ton of evidence that the bombing did not happen as we have been told. When you add up all of the unexplained discrepancies, you are left with a cover-up. I don't know what the truth is with any certainly, but I am damned well sure that it wasn't just McVeigh and Nichols.

132 posted on 04/24/2009 8:53:28 AM PDT by BlueMondaySkipper (Involuntarily subsidizing the parasite class since 1981)
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To: antisocial

“That is strange since visas are required to travel to Canada, Mexico and the Carribean now.”

Look it up, you don’t need a visa to travel to Germany and Germans don’t need Visas to visit the US for up to 6 months.


133 posted on 04/24/2009 2:21:19 PM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: samtheman
Nichols and he does claim there were others involved.

I believe the claim involved members of the Aryan Republican Army/Midwest Bank Robbers. They were also spent time at Elohim City.

The letter is shown here. From the link:

In his letter, Nichols alleged that gun dealer Roger Moore -- who provided key testimony for the prosecution in Nichols' 1997 conspiracy trial -- was an FBI "provocateur" who sold explosives to Timothy McVeigh, who was executed in 2001 as primary perpetrator of the April 19, 1995 bombing that killed 168.

In a crucial new allegation, however, Nichols wrote to Trentadue that Moore also sold bomb-making material to a group of white supremacist bank robbers long suspected of playing a role in the bombing -- the Midwest Bank Robbers, also known as the Aryan Republican Army.

I think these connections, if true, can explain a lot of how the bomb was made and other parts of a conspiracy. I don't think you need an Islamist connection for this aspect.

If an Islamist connection could be made to these folks, then.. maybe.

134 posted on 04/24/2009 3:08:25 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: Cicero

“You seem to have some sort of comprehension problem. Did I mention “visa”?”

Nice try. You said he was here illegally and had been snuck in by the CIA. All he needs is a passport so there would be no reason to sneak him in and he would be here legally.


135 posted on 04/25/2009 7:37:11 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: samtheman

“Do you have any theories?”

I don’t need theories since the facts speak for themselves. Hundreds of people were involved in the investigation and all information they collected was put together and available to any one of the investigators. To have a conspiracy to hide evidence of foreign involvement would have required the cooperation by all of these people to cover up and keep silent about what they knew. Now, you can believe that all of these people were immoral scum who were willing to hide the truth, but I don’t. And I certainly would not accept anything Nichols said as anything more than the rantings of a lunatic out to keep himself out of the gallows.

Within a year after Korea Flight 007 was shot down over Soviet airspace many books were written which posed many questions and concluded that there was some conspiracy in the highest levels of the USG to cover up what 007 was doing over Soviet airspace. The books posed hundreds of questions that seemed to point to a plot hatched by the USG to use commercial aircraft to spy on the Soviets. Well, when the soviet union fell we found out the truth. The Russians knew it was just a plane that had strayed over their territory and because of poor command and control they shot it down. They dreamed up the spy plane story to cover their ass and they got lots of westerners to swallow the story. The original and simple truth was the reality.

I think it is the same with the OKC bombing. A few nuts decided they could change the direction of the government by killing a lot of people. They made a simple but very large bomb (we have records of their fertilizer purchases), they created a simple detonation device, and because of poor security at the Federal building were able to park it in front and detonate it. No matter how much they investigated they could find absolutely no foreign involvement and they ended up putting two people in jail and executing the third.


136 posted on 04/25/2009 7:56:50 AM PDT by yazoo (was)
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To: yazoo

What you wrote makes a lot of sense.


137 posted on 04/25/2009 10:15:22 AM PDT by samtheman
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To: Kansas58

You can bet the liberal/democrats would have had no
problem waterboarding McVey, probably the fastest federal
execution ever.


138 posted on 04/25/2009 10:44:12 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I too distinctly remember mention of the men of middle eastern decent being seen and sought on the news that day, and somehow, mysteriously, never mentioned again.
139 posted on 05/06/2009 5:54:34 PM PDT by unitedwestand (What's up with that?)
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