FReeper Book Club: Atlas Shrugged, The Face Without Pain or Fear or Guilt

A Publius Essay | 23 May 2009 | Publius

[MarkL]

So Heath Leger really “nailed the part” in the “Dark Knight”.

The same way he “nailed the part” in “Brokeback Mountain?”

Never saw "Brokeback Mountain." Have you seen "The Dark Knight?" Leger deserved the Academy Award for that character portrayal.

Mark

[Vigilantcitizen]

....and Phil Carson (think Daniel and Kit if your historical memory is sluggish)

Good job.

V.C. Carson

[whodathunkit]

Nevertheless, Hank has delivered the blow, and realizes too late...

- "that he would give his life for he power not to have committed the action he had committed."

Rand obviously didn't get the memo.

Rearden had taken to carrying a gun and according to the current gun control crowd, it would have been impossible for him not to have used it.

[Billthedrill]

LOL - yeah, or it would have just gone off all by itself. I have to get one of those - it would sure save range time.

[Chode]

BRAVO ZULU!!!

[mick]

Great analysis, drill.

And you hit the nail on the head for what became for me the first crack in my admiration ( need I say heroine worship !) of Rand nearly forty yrs ago when I first read this chapter.

. It just rang so false. Men don't act like that in real life. Here's a couple of tough guys caught in the same room with a woman both of them have been sleeping with and one of them slaps....not punches, or kicks in the balls....but SLAPS!........the other one and the slapee just friggin walks away. In front of the woman, no less !And for this act of timidity or cowardice or whatever, we are supposed to feel admiration for the guy as a paragon of self control. Give me a break. Nobody I know would do that.

I can't say it better than you:

It is here that Rand’s sexual theories reach the far shore of adolescent fantasy.

And I agree about the God like references. But when I first read AS I thought she was writing like a modern day Homer, with all those multiple gods interacting with mere humans. I knew she was talking about real men but it had that Greek Pagan quality for me. Maybe because at the same time I was reading Homer for school. Who the hell knows what she was thinking. Except to say she never really could grasp what actual sexual desire is all about...at least from the man's side......and it ain't your mind, cowgirl ! In her fiction or her real life. Witness her Nat Brandon interlude.

[Still Thinking]

I like Rearden too but if he’d done that to me the New York Fire Department would be prying my fingers off his throat with the Jaws of Life.

Hear, hear. And not an honest punch in the chops, but a slap! Could he get any more demeaning?

[Travis McGee]

Just stay away from the .45mm caliber that authors sometimes mention.

[Travis McGee]

It’s a good start.

[ml/nj]

Trains are great, but not quite cutting edge.

It's not about trains.

ML/NJ

[Travis McGee]

No kidding. But is a 50 year old libertarian/conservative novel the best we can come up with?

It just gripes me no end to see conservatives sifting the ashes of that half-century old novel, while ignoring equally good fiction that is up to date in all areas.

And you can't get more up to date than my third novel, published 2 weeks ago.

http://www.amazon.com/Foreign-Enemies-Traitors-Matthew-Bracken/dp/0972831037/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1242785988&sr=1-2

[ml/nj]

I guess you think Shakespeare is outdated too. The thing about great literature is that it is timeless. Good luck with your stuff, but the way to promote it isn't to put down a book like Atlas Shrugged as being just a "half-century old novel." In fact, I would suggest that by demeaning Rand's work, you have rather demeaned your own, in my eyes at least.

ML/NJ

[whodathunkit]

The thing about great literature is that it is timeless.

I agree with your post, ML/NJ.

Trains, cigarettes, chrome, etc., all are props and have modern equivalents.
I find it easy to explicate the 50 year old references as I read.
Who is John Galt?
(Francisco tells her the road to understanding leads to Atlantis - Publius post1)
Where is Atlantis?
These are questions pertaining to a destination or ending, however, the true value of Atlas Shrugged is in the journey. Rand is blazing a trail for us to follow.

[Travis McGee]

Please read replies 11 and 24. I think it's great that Rand is still appreciated. It's just frustrating to see literary archaeologists fixated on the ancient while ignoring the current.

[Still Thinking]

That’s right, and I saw someone on here the other day singing the praises of the 0.050 caliber. I think that one and the one you mentioned are actually flechettes.

[Travis McGee]

It was .45mm, and it was a joke, based on common news reporter errors.

[Still Thinking]

I know, although I did see a post the other day where an actual Freeper referred to 0.050 caliber. My flechette comment was a joke as well (this is hugh and series). I’m a little too dry for most people.

[Travis McGee]

It has only reached Amazon, so the 2 reviews are by folks who bought the books elsewhere and reviewed it on Amazon anyway.

I only post this review snippet because it relates to the thread.

Which Constitution?, May 23, 2009 By Nelson Hultberg (Dallas, TX United States) - See all my reviews (REAL NAME) Will America survive as a "sovereign nation," or will the Orwellian dream of one-world government be the fate of our children? This is the ominous issue facing America in the 21st century; it transcends all other concerns. In Foreign Enemies and Traitors, Matt Bracken has created a brilliant Atlas Shrugged like narrative of how this issue might play out amidst the economic meltdown now consuming us. Conservatives and libertarians throughout America will take to this tale like the colonists took to Tom Paine in 1776.

[Travis McGee]

Gotcha. My favorite is when authors put thumb safeties on Glocks and the like.

[sig226]

Rand’s dialogue and plot construction can be annoying, but they have to be taken in their own context. Your profile says you enjoy detective fiction, so you’re familiar with the hilarious lowbrow dialogue that is just as comical as the highbrow dialogue found in older fiction. I picked up a copy of I, The Jury at a used book sale a few years ago and found myself laughing out loud at parts that Spillane never intended to be lol’d.

Throughout the novels I read in school, my most common thought was, “WHO TALKS LIKE THIS?” Answer: authors. Realistic dialogue was not wanted. Dialogue reflected the writer’s style and intelligence, not the characters’. One teacher described the disposition to such verbiage plainly.

“Why write a book full of dialogue that you could hear in any tavern?” That’s what they were thinking. Nowadays, we seem to have the opposite problem. Dialogue is so realistic, so street smart, and so clever, that its use is often preposterous.