Skip to comments.Ukraine commemorates defeat of Sweden at Poltava
Posted on 06/29/2009 3:01:57 PM PDT by Bushwacker777
"Ukrainian and Russian officials commemorated the 300th anniversary of the defeat of Sweden at the battle of Poltava with the unveiling of a new memorial on Saturday.
The commemoration ceremonies showed that the victory, which marked the beginning of Russian imperial dominance of eastern Europe, continues to cause controversy over how history should be remembered.
High-profile delegations, including Kremlin administration chief Sergei Naryshkin and top Ukrainian presidency officials, inaugurated a memorial to soldiers killed in the battle and placed garlands in front of local monuments.
"After the battle of Poltava... no-one on the European continent could ignore Russia's political will," Naryshkin said at the ceremony, Interfax news agency reported."
(Excerpt) Read more at thelocal.se ...
When the Ukrainians sought protection from the Tsar they expected a European style feudal arrangement, but when they showed up to exchange oaths they found the Tsar had sent a priest to hear their oaths instead of coming himself. When they asked about the Tsar’s oath to them the priest told them a Tsar does not swear oaths to his subjects.
To discover the significance of this a Swedish timeline is in order: http://www.risberg.ws/Hypertextbooks/Economics/History/Swedish/Timeline.htm
Charles XII. The pre- Napoleon Napoleon.
yeah well I am commemorating Stalin’s death and Marx’ death and USSR’s fall and Hussein’s death and Lenin’s death and Hitler’s death and Judas’ death and Henry the 8th’s death...
He sworn his loyalty to Peter I as a subject and a military commander. Since he broke the oath he was a traitor. Using Yuschenko's logic Judas wasn't a traitor since he didn't betray the Ukrainian people.
One can preserve only something existant. At that time there was no independent Ukraine. The territory we call the Ukraine now was a province of Rzech Pospolita.
Peach with Russia is reached at Täysinä. Esthonia and Narva are ceded to Sweden.
Peach treaty is signed with Denmark.
The author really loves this fruit ;)
See that “....ws”? That’s SAMOA. So whadda’ they know about the Fenno-Scandian Peninsula anyway eh?!
Please don't get offended. But thanks for a good laugh.
- I don't hate Russians, but seriously, what part of Western/Central Europe has Russia ever managed to dominate?
Russia has never been a culture fit enough to found a genuine empire.
To begin with; In 1795, Russia was punished hard for Poltava.
“The second battle of Svensksund is the biggest naval battle ever fought in the Baltic sea: 500 ships (including supply ships and other ships not involved in combat), close to 30,000 men and several thousand cannons. In Svensksund, the Swedes boasted to have destroyed 40 percent of the Russian coastal fleet. It is even considered one of the largest naval battles in history in terms of the number of vessels involved. Only the Battle of Leyte Gulf has involved a larger number of vessels (if sources from the Classical Era regarding the Battle of Salamis and Battle of Ecnomus are disregarded).”
Russia's Baltic naval forces were (more or less) annihilated, ridiculed and humiliated by us Swedes under Gustavus III.
Yes, it's also true that Russia took Finland in 1809 (aided by certain Finnish opportunists among the Finnish upper class of those days), but all the same Russia got its *ss thoroughly beaten in Finnish Winter War(s) a lot of people would say.
Mazepa was a traitor to Russia but not to Ukraine. Just like George Washington was a traitor to Britain, but not to America.
Washington revolted against Britain, while Mazepa joined a foreign army. That's like if Washington had joined the French during the contemporary colonial wars.
Mazepa sided with the Swedes to advance Ukraine's national interests, just like the Founders sided with the French to advance America's interests. The father of the Constitution himself, James Madison declared war on Britain in 1812 during the Napoleonic wars, siding with France again.
As long as you look on Ukraine as an enslaved Russian vassal, then you will always see them as traitors whenever they act in their own national interests, instead of acting in Moscow's interests at their own expense, as you expect your "little brothers" to do.
Mazepa, indeed, was a Tsar general like Washington was a general of a British King. He also was a kind of governor, but this adds nothing in his case.
Balance of powers matters to my mind. Mazepa lacked power much to the grade which is enough to revolt. Instead he joined a foreign army and could hope on Charles XII's grace only. Whatever his purpose was.
The father of the Constitution himself, James Madison
We don't know exactly the Mazepa's motivation. He neither wrote anything like the American declaration of independence nor joined someone who had written a like document. Also no evidence he supported such movement.
Therefore Mazepa's motivation could be that he wanted to join the strongest at the right time or to find a better overlord.
Maybe Mazepa was just following in the footsteps of those medieval Kievans who invited Scandinavian Rus princes from Sweden to rule over them.
Mazepa was a Russia-dependant hetman of Cossacks, a group which hardly have an analogy. They very often changed sides, choosing from Poland, Russia, even Turkey.
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