Skip to comments.Unveiled! Hawaii's 1961 long-form birth certificates
Posted on 07/28/2009 7:34:23 PM PDT by pissant
Images of two 1961 Hawaii birth certificates similar to the one President Obama purportedly has on file have now been unveiled.
The Honolulu Advertiser published photostats of the original long-form birth certificates of twin daughters born to Eleanor Nordyke at Kapi'olani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital Aug. 5, 1961, one day after Obama was supposedly born at the same facility.
The Nordykes' certificates include information missing from the short-form document for Obama published online, including the name of the hospital, the name of the attending physician, name and address of the parents, the race of the parents and the race of the baby.
As WND reported yesterday, Hawaii's director of health responded to the growing controversy over the White House's refusal to release Obama's original long-form birth certificate by issuing a statement about the document in apparent contravention of Hawaiian law.
(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...
I believe it is more likely than not Obama was born in Hawaii,
I believe is more likely he was not. Why would Ann, after just giving birth to her first born, take off a couple of weeks later to Seattle and enroll in school there? Alone. Sr. didn’t want to see his new baby? It makes no sense.
What is your request? I live in the Bay Area but Sacto is no barrier.
I don't recall anything hitting the fan during the campaign other than Crash McCain.
That said, forging newspapers is an inexact science, even 48 years after the fact. How many copies of those two newspaper columns are still in existence?
I wonder if anyone has asked the Nordykes?
You think the BC issue didn’t come up until after the election? WRONG!
The Nordyke twins are the key to this, IMHO. Where is their birth announcement in either Hawaiian paper?
If a copy of the paper turns up with the Nordyke announcement where the Obama announcement is, this will blow wide open.
What is going to be really fun is if they try to fake it NOW and end up caught by a sting. People thought of that and have the announcements for 3 months prior and after. *wink*
It made zero difference in the election. The only people who noticed were FR and some of the HRC supporters. Even if it had managed to get some traction, McCain would have done his best to bury it.
It made a big enough difference that he felt compelled to have Kos and factcheck post that fake crap on the internet.
....I believe is more likely he was not. Why would Ann, after just giving birth to her first born, take off a couple of weeks later to Seattle and enroll in school there? Alone. Sr. didnt want to see his new baby? It makes no sense......
Ann’s life from 17 on doesn’t make a whole lot of sense either...to me anyway.
I think she went back to Seattle to escape the jerk she married until he was gone...as she had friends close by and was probably accepted their previously thus easier to get in, in state tuition etc Autumn semester starts late september in UW...did she keep Jr with her or was mom taking care of him ?
That should be really simple. The sequence of names in both columns is the same, although the surrounding advertising is different. So, if some extant copies have the Nordykes where Bambi is, then we'd have solid evidence of skulduggery! Suddenly, solid proof would turn into solid doubt.
The facts suggest something happened between the two of them around the time Bambi was born. Perhaps, before the blowup (or whatever happened), they had arranged to rent the cottage behind 6085 Kalanianaole Highway, and that's why it's listed in the birth announcment, but they never actually lived there, which explains why no one remembers them there. Unfortunately the owners of the house, Orland and Thelma Lefforge, are no longer with us. It's certainly strange that she would head back to Washington while her parents were in Hawaii, while he, thousands of miles from home, would finish his education in Hawaii.
So is anyone looking at Aug. ‘61 records in British Columbia? I’m itching to, but too far away to go dig.
“Methinks someone faked BHOs document, and forgot to check for sequential integrity.”
We need to know the procedure the hospitals and registrar used back then. It might be that they only forwarded paperwork every few days from the hospital to generate the birth certificates. There’s a date of Aug 11, 1961 stamped at the bottom of both Nordyke’s as “Date Assigned by...”
Remember, 1961 was a lot slower than things are today, no computers or data systems to speak of, and paperwork was done by hand and moved at messenger speed at best.
The part I'd like to know is where the certificate numbers were/are added. It appears to be a Bates-stamped number affixed by the registrar. Most vital records offices I've seen have two or more deputy clerks sharing a single stamp while working on separate stacks of documents, so it is possible that the date / sequential number disagreement is simply the result of one worker being a bit faster than the other.
I've seen enough public records offices that used to divide up the work in that manner (particularly pre-computer) that I view the out-of-sequence numbers as literally "close enough for government work". It's not a smoking gun, by any means.
That is an interesting idea.
Find many people who were born the day before, the day of, and the day after 0bama at the same hospital.
The hospital or Government could have assigned numbers for each day alphabetical. In fact, most things in 61 were sorted aplha before identifying for computer punch cards.
Bump for later reading
Yes, alpha by day.
The lame stream media keeps calling it a conspiracy theory. They even get that wrong. The “birthers” they malign aren’t claiming conspiracy. It’s about deception and authentication. Obama refusing to release his BC involves only one person — Zero himself. Those running flak for him are not conspiring, simply living up to the sycophant status.
God I hate the lying, liberal, anti-American press.
No that isn’t the one. this guy talked about how the date is situated on different places on the birth certificate... I think it depended on how you got (ordered) the birth certificate but I don’t remember the various placement of the stamps. that post is important and I don’t know why I didn’t save it. Stupid.
Oh yeah, that’s it. I will save it this time.
The padding of 61 to 1961 could easily have occurred due to Y2K issues. The document O released was printed off the computer record. Not so clear is why the twins' cert. is numbered 37 vs. 41 for O (when O was born a day earlier), but these things are probably printed in stacks, and I'd doubt that there was much concern about numbering people sequentially, just giving each a unique number.
Frankly, all my birth certificate questions are now answered except one:
Why has the government and the Obama campaign spent millions of dollars defending against lawsuits asking for the release of the long-form certificate?
You guys rock.
That's not a big deal. Let's say you have a stack of blank documents at the hospital, numbered 1-50. You hand 1-20 to Dr. A, 21-40 to Dr. B, and 41-50 to Dr. C. Dr. C happens to attend the first birth of the day, so that child gets Document 41. Dr. A attends the second birth of the day, so that child gets Document 1.
The numbers being slightly out of order really isn't a big deal at all.
His serial number is later, BECAUSE HIS NOTIFICATION OF BIRTH WAS INTRODUCED LATER.
Do we have proof from this hospital that his birth took place there?
God, this is maddening. NO OTHER PRESIDENT EVER has sealed his biographical data.
I THINK I SPEAK FOR ALL AMERICANS WHEN I SAY, I COULDN’T CARE LESS, WHO IS FATHER IS, ETC. IF HE WAS BORN HERE AND A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN BY LAW THAT’S WHAT IS IMPORTANT.
I would think more of the man if he just comes clean on his past. Whether adopted or not, or whether he lived in Indonesia, travled to Pakistan. Who cares. If true these are the facts of the man, and we’ll accept them.
JUST SHOW US YOUR GD BC AND YOUR SCHOOL RECORDS ETC AND LET’S PUT ALL THIS STUFF BEHIND US!!!!!
WHAT ARE YOU HIDING??????????????
I was concerned about the year in the registration number in particular. That is, the registration number format was 999-YY-99999; e.g., 151-61-10537.
So when someone says that Obama's registration number is 151-1961-10641 I suggested that it made me suspicious. They obviously did not know much about the DP world of 80-column punch cards and 80-byte card-image files from which came Obama's b.c. We did not have the space for the "19".
However DP is far beyond memory worries today and the standard today is CCYY.
Y2k projects often enforced that standard. The legacy files were not likely changed but programmers inserted logic to expand the date internally to match the new registration number format of 99-CCYY-99999 (if Hawaii did in fact change the format).
So perhaps I have no reason to be suspicious. Thus I remain suffering from truth delay. When will we ever know?
I was talking about the long form.
Whatcha gonna do if he reveals the long form - and it proves full NBC citizenship?
If you ever feel that frustrating gut feeling that you are being manipulated, you probably are...
Let’s LIGHT UP THE CAPITOL COM CENTER!!!
Just sent this message — or a variant of it — to Boortz, O’Reilly and my congresscritters:
New evidence, honesty and the CONSTITUTION to which you SWORE AN OATH TO GOD TO PROTECT AND DEFEND and which you profess to respect requires that you revisit the matter of Obama’s eligibility to the office.
The longer this goes on, the deeper will be the crisis we’ll face.
The truth, crushed to earth, will rise!
The info is here:
You said that NO OTHER PRESIDENT EVER has sealed his biographical data.
I don’t know about those in the far past, but just in our lifetimes we’ve had Presidents who were born under other names and in difficult circumstances. Gerald Ford was Leslie King at birth, the son of a violent man who did not raise him. Slick Willy was William Jefferson Blythe, later adopted by an abusive stepfather.
Both Ford and Clinton treated their early years matter-of-factly, didn’t glorify their hard times nor try to hide them. Americans will accept most anything if it’s lawful, but WE DON’T LIKE BEING PLAYED.
I don’t feel that way. I don’t get manipulated by commies.
Exactly. I would think more of someone who pervails in the face of long odds.
Obama clearly was manhandled into going and living here and there during his young life.
He was a loner like many AMerican youth.
He prevailed. His presidency could be a beacon to others.
Instead, his presidency is cloaked in deception about his past.
This article posted recently here cuts through the chase.
It explains what is it that Obama is hiding and also explains how he could not have been born in a Hawaii hospital but still have a birth certificate on record.
If Obama’s certificate is supposed to be an accurate reflection of what is on his long-form birth certificate, why would it be necessary to make a change to his certificate number.
The original document, if there is indeed one, would have been numbered using the established system in place in 1961; meaning it should read 61 if it’s an correct and un-doctored duplicate of his vault certificate.
I worked for years for my local government and we often had to go back to case files that were made well before Y2k.
We did NOT change the numbers to reflect the new dating system for our older files as doing so would have changed the original of the document, making it impossible for us to state that copies of the files were correct and unchanged when they were printed out.
My question to Hawaii is simple. Did you change the certificate number for Obama’s COLB and if so, how can you claim it is an accurate and exact representation of his vault birth certificate?
If you did not change the number, why does the certificate presented by Mr. Obama have a dating system that was not in place in 1961 and why are you validating the document as a correct and unchanged copy of his vault certificate?
Nixon and Truman. I love reading their stories.
Where are the bios on Obama? If they do not critically and accurately address the birth place they start out of the gate as false.
The man is very liberal. Over 75% of the American public say that he is.
As Cort Wrotnowski indicated in his Supplemental Brief to the SCOTUS back in December,
President Chester Arthur was not a “natural born citizen”, and hid those facts until his death.
From that Supplemental Brief: http://www.scribd.com/doc/8830185/Wrotnowski-v-Bysiewicz-Supplemental-Brief
The definitive biography of Chester Arthur's life is Gentleman Boss by Thomas Reeves.
Since Chester Arthur burned his papers around the time of his death, this biography fills
many gaps with interviews of family members and authentic documents such as the Arthur family Bible.
From Gentleman Boss, page 202 and 203:
Hinman was hired, apparently by democrats, to explore
rumors that Arthur had been born in a foreign country, was not a
natural-born citizen of the United States, and was thus, by the
Constitution, ineligible for the vice-presidency. By mid-August,
Hinman was claiming that Arthur was born in Ireland and had
been brought to the United States by his father when he was fourteen.
Arthur denied the charge and said that his mother was
a New Englander who had never left her native country a
statement every member of the Arthur family knew was untrue.
Amazing how history repeats. Remember that emergency trip that Obama made in the last week of October last year,
immediately before his last living grandparent passed away in Hawaii? I'm sure before Obama’s grandmother (”Toots”)
died the day before the election, Obama had PERSONALLY rummaged through every drawer, closet and
shoebox to ensure he had EVERY scrap of paper that could tip off anyone in the future about his ancestry.
Americans have come a long way since the sins of the father were placed on the child.
If Obama was a bastard. If his father is not listed or his parents were not married; Americans would not hold that against him. It’s not like the baby/child Obama had control or any say in his conception. American’s by our values and way of life place honesty and integrity as traits to be respected.
Obama has proven himself to be a liar. He has done what no other candidate or President before has, completely censored his entire life and refused, via laws and the courts, any attempts to property vet his character, abilities and achievements. This is unacceptable to the majority of Americans who have an ounce of ethical standards left.
Of course people are questioning Obama, he’s proven himself unethical and lacking in integrity.
I’ve followed this story from the start. I along with a few others, (e.g. Pissant), here about a year ago noted the discrepancies regarding the listing of two hospitals as his place of birth. I’m not saying this for acknowledgement, I say this because it seemed obvious to me, that something was not right.
Wikepedia interestingly made changes soon after these questions were raised. Then his COLB was released online and later found questionable.
There’s no question that the Hawaii trip had a purpose. I agree with you.
You also had the governor of the state come out and say that the long form of the BC would not be released.
Now there is clearly a push to discredit those of us, now in large numbers who want answers.
I’m a doctor. I’m not some wingnut. I just want to know who my president is.
I’m of the opinion now, that the only way this will come out, is if Obama’s negative ratings continue to sour.
Once they reach the -15, you’ll see MSM not afraid to take their shots at him and ask him the tough follow up questions.
Thomas Sowell’s article today in NRO says it all. Everyone should read it. Has it been posted yet?
LASTLY, I COULDN’T PUT THIS TOGETHER, BUT I’D LIKE TO SEE A U-TUBE 30 SECOND POST, CALLED “I’M A BIRTHER”. AND HAVE IT FEATURE A DOZEN OR SO AMERICANS FROM ALL WALKS OF LIFE SAYING THIS...KIND OF LIKE THE AD LAST YEAR THAT SAID “I’M A PC.”
I THINK IT WILL BE POPULAR AND BE A “FRINGE” THING.
I RECALL THAT THE SWIFTBOAT ISSUE STARTED THE SAME WAY.
I think you are right. The padding of “61” to “1961” is suspicious; and it may not be a real certification number.
I mean’t to say that it will NOT be a “Right Wing Fringe” thing.
Which brings me to something that went trough my mind this morning. Maybe the COLB produced has something to do with barry's adoption.
That Swiftboat ad in which the camera panned across a field of Kerry’s former military colleagues who would not support him was one of the most powerful I have every seen. Especially when it featured Bud Day with the Medal of Honor around his neck.
It was, in my opinion, enough to cost him the election.
Yours is an excellent idea, but it needs to feature people with a broad geographic and ethnic spread, and it needs to identify them by walk in life, i.e. “doctor,” “homemaker,” “teacher,” “roofer,” “lawyer,” “student,” etc.
It will take money. Anybody here with the talent and skills to do it?
That might hold up if the address (where O's folks didn't live) is where the twins' folks lived. Another project.
I don't have the skills to put an ad together. I think the money is there. But I've seen some pretty clever and simple things on U-Tube.
I agree, it should be people from all walks of life and color.
Once you see his scores consistently hitting double digits, (e.g. it's at 10 today and was 11 over the weekend), this thing will take hold, because people will realize that they elected someone who should never have been put in office, and they're going to want a reason for being duped.
Well we were duped the same way alt of people have been over the course of time with Obama.
I was in Dixon, IL a few years back to work for a week or so.
Reagan is everywhere.
I stayed at a hotel that had a swimming pool and a huge mural showing Reagan as life guard, and in another room large pictures of him.
There's the house he lived in etc etc.
I don't really wish to know the dirt about the president unless it truly reflects the man's character.
I guess Watergate defined the way presidents up till that time acted. No one questioned LBJ having the FBI taking home movies of MLK etc and other sibilance's. But Nixon got busted and was too stupid in his handling of it.
Clinton's presidency will always be characterized by his affair that underscored the man's sexual addiction.
Obama is a narcissist in the worst way. This health care bill is all about him, and nothing about what is good for the country.
The man is now talking about passing ANY health care bill. And if it can be termed bipartisan then all the better.
IF ANY REPUBLICANS PULL A BEHIND THE SCENES MANEAUVER ON THIS, TO PUT A BILL TOGETHER WITH THE DEMOCRATS I'LL SCREAM!