Posted on 08/02/2009 1:35:53 AM PDT by rxsid
Edited on 08/06/2009 12:10:02 AM PDT by John Robinson. [history]
“Because the Canal Zone was a “no man’s land,” (14) in 1937 Congress passed a statute granting citizenship to “any person born in the Canal Zone on or after February 26, 1904” who had at least one U.S. citizen parent. (15) This Act made Senator McCain a United States citizen before his first birthday. “
You are not listening.
McCain was not born in the Canal Zone. He was born in Colon, Republic of Panama.
The rest of us who were born in the Canal Zone of American parents knew from the beginning none of us could become president of the U.S. because of where we were born. That was a given.
This would have also included slippery McCain had he been born in the Canal Zone which he wasn’t. Again, for the millionth time, he was born in Colon, Republic of Panama.
Do you want me to draw you a picture?
And don’t argue with someone who has lived here most of her life. You know nothing about life here concerning Americans born in the Canal Zone and those who weren’t...like McCain.
OK well how do you get by the October 1963 letter agreement--according to some source which has now been erased or edited, the form of those letters was that Zanzibar ceded control and released any claim of sovereignty over the Coast Province to "the Republic of Kenya" which Republic of Kenya did not then exist? The republic of Kenya did not FORMALLY exist in 1963, except possibly for the 10-mile strip itself, when it became a "sovereign state" before (the rest of) Kenya became independent on Dec 12, 1963.
My "how do you get by the October 1963" comment was addressed to your proposition that Obama might have been born in Zanzibar.
I am sufficiently asleep that I don't realize until I am writing this response that is exactly the point. I have been focused on Zanzibar in connection with the birth certificate in 1964--but the birth in 1961 would be exactly the same--born in part of Zanzibar under British Administration.
I believe, although have not been able to verify that the coastal strip was administered as the "Coastal Province"--hence the "Coastal Provincial General Hospital on the birth records; the provincial reference deleted as a result of the October 1963 letter agreement.
I remain of the view that Orly's original 1964 Birth Certificate is probably a true and correct document. It can't be just a color copy of something because it has the raised seal. Seems to me that all the discrepancies have been adequately addressed.
Lolo Soetoro adopted little barry in Hawaii when Lolo married Stanley Ann. Living in Indonesia, Barry Soetoro attended school as an Indonesian citizen. Then, when he was ten and still the adopted son of Lolo, Stanley Ann shipped him back to Hawaii to live with Toots and Stanley senior. He likely traveled on an Indonesian passport at age ten.
Barry graduated from High School in late Spring of 1979. He entered Occidental College in California in August or September of 1979, likely under the name Barry Soetoro since he was still the legally adopted son of Lolo Soetoro, according to Stanley Ann's pleading the next year in her divorce suit.
In 1980, Stanley Ann sued for divorce from Lolo Soetoro, in Hawaii, though she was still a resident of Indonesia ... she was married to Lolo in Hawaii before moving to Indonesia, and the adoption took place in Hawaii. In Stanley Ann's pleading to the court, she cited TWO children Lolo was legally responsible for supporting, one over eighteen who needed educational assistance. That means that Barry Soetoro was still legally known as an Indonesian citizen in 1980.
So far, not one scrap of paper has been found showing that Barry Soetoro ever legally changed his name to Barack Hussein Obama, so at the very worst he is still Barry Soetoro and only using Barack Obama as the name he held prior to legal adoption in Hawaii by Lolo Soetoro.
This makes a good case for even more documentation to be released from Hawaiian Vital Records, because if this lying fraud didn't legally change his name to Barack Hussein Obama at some time after 1980, he has purjered himself to Chief Justice John 'the pirate' Roberts when sworn in one of those two events! And if he was sworn in as Barack Obama and again as Barry Soetoro, by all that's holy I want to know the truth about this lying affirmative action criminal!
David, perhaps you would care to weigh in on the legal aspects of Barry Soetoro and Barack Obama names and presentments as Indonesain citizen and American citizen?
Seems to me we’re hitting a few nails on the head. Who (with a faster than dialup computer) has the link to the British archive...Spent hours on it the other night. Remember seeing SAHN=ZE+ BAH listed there.....
Get this to the lawyers handling the cases ASAP and make certain your insurance premiums are paid.
Field Trip!
GROUP HUG ;~)
Let’s not worry about Mc CANE right now....stay focused on the other issue who is trying to take our country.
I don't think the name change by itself means much. Legally, you might have trouble with your perjury argument or with the proposition that the name alone means much as long as it wasn't being used by A to deceive people into thinking he was B. Reason people spend money and go through these elaborate proceedings from a legal point of view to change names is to be sure that their name representation to the credit card company and the bank and the IRS and their employer with their SS card is acceptable and to get a Court Order which can be used by itself to line up all the identification documents on the same name.
Fact he is still an Indonesian citizen is substantive. And his Indonesian citizenship and subjection to Indonesian sovereignty ought to preclude him from being a Natural Born Citizen, even if he were born in Hawaii (he wasn't).
However, I would not be surprised (although this is out and out speculation) to find that what he did at some point was do a State Department proceeding to reclaim his citizenship under the statute that permits children to disaffirm acts of their parents surrendering citizenship.
That would have been the easiest proceeding to hide; and would have produced documents he could have used to get a passport. And might very well, as you suggest, have resulted in a filing with Hawaii that would have generated him some form of fake birth certificate.
Since in 1980 thru 1982, it is not even remotely likely that Barry Soetoro foresaw being a Seantor from Illinois or a presidential candidate, it is likely that he used his Indonesian citizenship as an adult to game the college netry and perhaps college tuition/scholarship programs, and to travel on an Indonesian passport. THAT constitutes a default to Indonesian citizenship as an adult. Any subsequent act to regain sloely American citizenship would constitute citizenship via statute and make him precisely ineligible for the primaries, much less the swearing in.
hoosiermama, I agree with you, and I thank you.
While I don’t know you, I have always regarded you as a special person because my Dad was from Indiana. He was born in Brazil, Indiana. So in some respect, we are fellow Hoosiers.
Anyway, I must cool down.
Could he be a UK/Kenyan/Indonesian triple citizen?
Frankly, the more one considers the logical conclusions, the more it appears Fukino was lying through her teeth for her affirmative action liar-in-chief! Of course, we should not expect Linda Lingle to seek to get to the truth since she has already acquiesed to the pressures from the DNC machine. I wonder what juicy crap is in her FBI file held in the White HOuse? There doesn't appear to be a true patriot int he entire political arena. And frankly, Dick Cheney's obsequious disattention at the moment he knew he had to act to save the Constitutional contract is disgusting and the real historical perspective on the man. In the end, he too was nothing but a two-bit politician playing the political games, Constitution and We The People be damned for the little nuisances the poli-class sees U.S.
Could be, actually could be. But the fact that so few American citizens see the pissing on their Constitutional contract as unimportant to their future tells me they no longer deserve to be the sovereigns, so to hell with them for their coulteresque ridicule of the issue so vital to a healthy Republic. ... Yes, Ann, if you’re reading this, you stink to high heaven. You’ve exposed yourself for the money and fame above all else pol you are. Disgusting!
Seems that many people who could have done or said something (or still can or do something) care more about their fortunes and their lives than their sacred honor; and therefore they have little honor left.
However, I think the contention seems to be about McCain's UNIQUE circumstances in terms of YEAR and EXACT LOCATION of his birth.
McCain’s mother could have, as many Americans did, delivered in Colon Hospital in Colon, a facility built, owned, and located in a town owned by the Panama Railroad, a U.S. company, but under Panamanian sovereignty. He would have been a citizen at birth under R.S. § 1993, because born out of both the territory and jurisdiction of the United States.I have NO doubt that had McCain WON, the Left would be challenging him as many Conservatives are challenging Obama, based upon the arguments in this academic paper and in other investigations on this subject.
Under a principle called the "plenary power doctrine," judicial challenges to immigration and citizenship policies are strictly limited. The reverse of strict scrutiny, plenary power review is deferential in theory, virtually non-existent in fact. To this day, no person denied immigration or citizenship based on race, political belief, sex and out-of-wedlock birth or sexual orientation has persuaded the Supreme Court that such discrimination is unconstitutional. Because exclusion of undesirables might well be "essential . . . . to the preservation of our civilization," the Court holds that " 'over no conceivable subject is the legislative power of Congress more complete than it is over' the admission of aliens" and that it is unobjectionable that "in the exercise of its broad power over immigration and naturalization, "Congress regularly makes rules that would be unacceptable if applied to citizens.
Other foreign-born children of U.S. citizens were made U.S. citizens, as Senator McCain would have been had his mother elected to deliver a hundred yards over the border in the Republic of Panama. Birth in the Canal Zone is justifiably treated differently from birth in other parts of the world, but those differences warrant more favorable treatment, not less, as Congress determined in the 1937 Act. Arguably, a well-functioning Congress would not have left those born in the Canal Zone in limbo for years after the problem became clear in 1932.
Pardon me for jumping in here with a thought.
Barry went back to live in Hawaii as a child at what, age 10? Even if he did nothing and remained a citizen of Indonesia, which I suspect he did just that, he had to apply and received an Indonesian passport at some point (at 16 or after?) to travel on it. No way he could travel as an Indonesian passport at 21 which was issued at the age of 10. Btw, most passport for children last only 5 years anyway.
Again, my gut hunch is that the hot paper trail should be in Indonesia.
The DNC sent a future democrat representsative to Indonesia prior to the primaries, to sanitize the vital records in Indonesia. And That country is still deeply in the pockets of Democrats so you will not likely find anything to expose the lying bastards over there. Although, we have a freeper who lives in the Far East who seems to have had access, for the right price, but didn;t have the bribe money at the time.
Before hoosiermama jumps all over me, keep in mind I can’t be presisdent of the U.S. because I was born in the Canal Zone.
End of story.
I remember that! GAThoosier.
Now to get to the British Archives.....Past tea time, tall one at the pub is in order.
If we find this dern thing...I think we should all meet and party!
OK
for a laugh!
smart dog doesn’t care for obama
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