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Kenyan Birth Certificate - 1964 Divorce Timeline
Free Republic ^ | 8-2-09 | BP2

Posted on 08/02/2009 12:58:22 PM PDT by BP2


My first take is that the dates DO match up for 1964 events surrounding the Obama's 1964 divorce.

Here we go:

Ann filed for Divorce Jan. 20, 1964 (Inauguration Day – what are the odds?), and the date was set by the presiding judge for the trial to commence 30 days after Obama SR would have responded to his notification, sent to Cambridge, Mass (Cambridge – what are the odds? ).
Photobucket Photobucket


Judge Samuel P. King who granted the divorce – last I heard was retired and alive (for now) in his 90s in Hawaii -- MAY or MAY NOT have asked to see the Marriage Certificate. BUT, I bet Judge King asked to see Obama JR's Birth Certificate to confirm Ann's claims that Obama SR was in fact the father. That is “standard” policy to have a Birth Certificate in case the mother asks for child support from the father (or Welfare) later after the divorce. Judge King probably told Ann to produce a birth certificate before or at trial, which would have been sometime in mid- to late-February 1964 HAD Obama SR answered his notice that was sent to Cambridge.

When Judge King wrote the order on Jan. 23, he had his clerk notify Obama SR via what's referred to as a "knock and nail". That is, the postman leaves the notification on the door for (generally) 10 days and retrieves it after that time passes -- signed or unsigned. That order was sent on Jan. 23 via airmail from Hawaii and was probably posted on Obama SR's door Jan. 27-28.
Photobucket Photobucket

Obama SR's notification was unsigned by him and apparently IGNORED -- either he didn't want to accept it OR he was NOT at that location.

However, Judge King granted the divorce to Ann Obama (which changed back to Ann Dunham) exactly 60 days from when the original order was request by Ann by default.

Photobucket


NOW, my guess is that Judge King asked to see Obama JR’s Birth Certificate before he'd be willing to grant the divorce, either at trial or by default on March 20, 1964. Ann probably didn’t have the birth certificate when she filed on Jan 20. That's when this birth certificate would have been generated -- before trial for the 1964 divorce.

Important side note: the Certificate issue date of Feb 17, 1964, is JUST A FEW SHORT MONTHS AFTER KENYA BECAME INDEPENDENT on Dec. 12, 1963. TO THIS DATE, this may be the only certificate on Kenyan file today if British documents were sent to the UK for archiving leading up Kenya becoming an independent nation.

Obama's unconfirmed Kenyan birth certificate


If you note the date on the Certified Copy, it was created by the Registrar in Kenya on Feb. 17, 1964. The Kenyan Birth Certificate would have been issued in the midst of the divorce -- AFTER the divorce was filed by Ann in Hawaii on Jan. 20, but BEFORE the divorce was granted by Judge King on March 20.

Furthermore, it's quite plausible that once Ann actually had this Kenyan birth certificate in her hands, and the divorce was granted on March 20, her attorney, George Kerr, counseled her on Hawaiian birth certificate "loopholes" and told her how to file for a Hawaiian "Certificate of Delayed Birth" to get Welfare or OTHER support for young Obama as a child of a non-supporting foreign national.

As Hawaiian law allows, that CODB could have been "converted" later to a “Certificate of Live Birth” (long birth certificate) in the 60s or 70s, which would then be a "root document" of the famed “Certification of Live Birth” (short birth certificate on "Fight the Smears") we see today presented as "proof" of birth of Barack Hussein Obama II, reportedly in Hawaii (note: the abstract “Certification of Live Birth” certificate did not exist in Hawaii until November 2001).


I can’t personally vouch for the veracity of the Kenyan birth certificate itself, not knowing how or from whom Orly obtained the birth certificate (the chain of evidence). It may have been obtained quite surreptitiously from the only filed Kenyan birth certificate record copy requested -- likely generated from the 1964 divorce.

It's QUITE possible that all other copies of this Kenyan birth certificate may have been scrubbed from Kenyan archives, but this one may have survived in a lone Vital Statistics office somewhere in Kenya not known about until now.

HOWEVER -- the dates DO "line up" for the Kenyan Birth Certificate to be REAL.



TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: anndunham; anndunhamobama; article2section1; barackobama; berepository; bho44; bhosrdivorce; birth; birthcertificate; birthers; certificate; certifigate; colb; dunham; dunhamdivorce; kenya; kenyaindependence; naturalborn; obama; obamafamily; obamanoncitizenissue; obamatruthfile; stanleyanndunham
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To: machogirl

Some are saying that Kenya did not become a Republic until 1964, while others are saying they were using “The Republic of Kenya” (in 1963) even before there was an official recognition from Britain (which happened in 1964.


201 posted on 08/02/2009 7:23:25 PM PDT by autumnraine (You can't fix stupid, but you can vote it out!)
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To: seekthetruth

No harm, no foul, I enjoyed the show he did have. :)


202 posted on 08/02/2009 7:25:52 PM PDT by papasmurf (RnVjayB5b3UsIDBiYW1hLCB5b3UgcGllY2Ugb2Ygc2hpdCBjb3dhcmQh)
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To: papasmurf; seekthetruth

Cunningham DID just discuss this new BC a bit and directed listeners to WND’s website


203 posted on 08/02/2009 7:31:06 PM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68 (CALL CONGRESSCRITTERS TOLL-FREE @ 1-800-965-4701)
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To: Vn_survivor_67-68
Yes he did. But my friend saw this thread on FR and took it that Orly was going to be ON the show. She told me and I spread the news that Orly was going to be on....which was WRONG! I am sorry I did not check it out!

http://209.157.64.201/focus/f-chat/2306641/posts

204 posted on 08/02/2009 7:34:23 PM PDT by seekthetruth ("See You In DC From 9/11 - 9/13 At Our National Freeper Tea Party Convention!")
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To: BP2

obumpa


205 posted on 08/02/2009 8:01:00 PM PDT by Dajjal (Obama is an Ericksonian NLP hypnotist.)
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To: autumnraine

I have only found that in one internet item. But there is a lot out there. Certainly many more Kenyan docs for other things that happened in 63-64


206 posted on 08/02/2009 8:22:37 PM PDT by machogirl (If Obama's handing out Pie, I like Lemon Meringue.)
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To: BP2

Interesting. Thanks for the ping.


207 posted on 08/02/2009 8:41:11 PM PDT by brytlea (Jesus loves me, this I know.)
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To: politicalmerc
See Post 58 for a rebuttal to the idea that the Republic of Kenya came around in 1964, it was 1963.

As I understand it, neither the Republic nor the Constitution became official until approval by the voting public in the May, 1964 election.

However, during the intervening months -- between Dominion status and official Republic status -- officialdom may well have employed forms imprinted with "Republic of Kenya".

Whether they actually did or not is subject to authentication -- which needs to be undertaken before we assume the validity of this document.

208 posted on 08/02/2009 8:49:26 PM PDT by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance on Parade)
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To: Cheburashka

There's more than meets the eye here ... it seems the "Republic of Kenya" might have existed before Dec. 12, 1964.

Please read the following about the "ten mile strip" of what is now "Coastal Province":

The Constitution of Kenya Review Commission - [Cached Version]
Published on: 9/1/2002

Views were divided as to whether the coastal strip should be treated as a single entity with Kenya Colony, or whether it should be handed back to the Sultan of Zanzibar or it be treated as an independent entity and declared Independent.

In a report submitted to the British Government and the Sultan of Zanzibar entitled ‘The Kenya Coastal Strip Ð Report by the Commissioner’ Mr. Robertson recommended that the coastal strip be incorporated into Kenya before self government and independence subject to certain safeguards being given to the coastal people which should be entrenched in the constitution.
...
Robertson further recommended that the British Government abrogate the 1895 Agreement with the Sultan of Zanzibar and that another Agreement be made between the Government of Kenya and the Sultan of Zanzibar whereby the Sultan of Zanzibar will surrender his Sovereignty claims over the Coastal strip in consideration of the Kenya Government undertaking to respect and safeguarding inter alia the maintenance of the Sharia Law for Muslims and the retention of the Kadhi’s Courts.
...

On the 5th October 1963, the said Agreement was actually executed in the form of an exchange of letters between the Prime Ministers of Kenya and Zanzibar Messrs Jomo Kenyatta and M. Shamte respectively.


...
That Kadhis’ work should be restricted to judicial work and Muslims to elect their own Islamic/spiritual leader (mufti) who will be their official spokesman and an advisor to the government on issues affecting Muslims in Kenya.
...
Muslim personal law on marriage, divorce, inheritance and succession is not codified into legislation in Kenya. It is left to the Kadhi’s in their different courts to interpret the law as they understand it.There are no reports of the Kadhi’s Court's decisions - hence this has hampered the growth of Islamic Law jurisprudence in Kenya.
...
Muslims are mainly of two sects in Kenya - the Sunni and Shia.Majority of the Muslims in Kenya are Sunni Muslims but there is a significant population of Shia Muslims too and consideration ought to be given to the appointment of Kadhis of the Shia Sect to cater the interest of the Shia Muslims.
...
Under Section 66 of the constitution as read with the provisions of the legislations passed pursuant to that Section, Islamic Law is clearly recognised as a source of the Laws of Kenya in as far as matters pertaining to marriage, divorce and inheritance for the Muslims is concerned.The Kadhi’s Court's and the High Court must apply the Muslim Personal Law in dealing with Muslim personal matters. However, Section 3 of the Judicature Act, Chapter 8, Laws of Kenya which lists the sources of the Laws of Kenya and provides for the Jurisdiction of the various Courts in Kenya, does not include Muslim personal law as one of the sources of the Laws of Kenya subject to limitation as to the scope of application.The result has been that Institutions of higher learning in Kenya that teach law to students do not include Islamic Law in their curriculum or courses.Consequently, when lawyers get admitted to the bar in Kenya as advocates with the right of audience before all Courts, they find it difficult to effectively represent clients in the Kadhi’s Court's especially if they are not Muslims and have not studied Islamic Law. It is therefore necessary to recognize Islamic Law as one of the sources of the law in Kenya and for the same to be taught at universities and in the Kenya School of Law.

I'll reiterate the key quotations from this official Kenyan report:
... "Views were divided as to whether the coastal strip should be treated as a single entity with Kenya Colony" ...
... "Islamic law" ...
... "Muslim personal law on marriage, divorce, inheritance and succession is not codified into legislation in Kenya." ...

and MY personal favorites:
... "recommended that the coastal strip be incorporated into Kenya before self government and independence subject to certain safeguards being given to the coastal people which should be entrenched in the constitution" ...
... "Agreement was actually executed in the form of an exchange of letters" ...

It appears the "Ten-Mile Strip" (where Obama's possible place of birth is located) was separate and seemingly sovereign from the county that WOULD eventually BECOME the "Republic of Kenya" -- at least for a short while in 1963 and 1964.

* I wonder what they might have called themselves in the interim, to ensure they wouldn't be annexed by Zanzibar, you know, BEFORE the whole of Kenya became a Republic on Dec. 12, 1964? *

My money is on the "Republic of Kenya". And this Kenyan birth certificate from the "Republic of Kenya" in February 1964 is looking MORE and MORE plausible...


209 posted on 08/02/2009 8:59:31 PM PDT by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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To: Yaelle
I am thinking that at least at Barack Jr.'s birth, his father had some kind of interest in him, as he was the only child actually named AFTER him...

Agree...and I don't think it's any stretch of the imagination to think that Obama SR would have wanted Stanley to give birth to his first child with her in his homeland of Kenya/Africa. Which would explain WHY Stanley went over there to begin with - other than meeting her new relatives!
210 posted on 08/02/2009 9:01:43 PM PDT by Wolf-Lake
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To: okie01
During that one year period, what forms would Kenya bureaucrats most likely have been using in February 1964? The old forms of a political entity that had ceased to exist (Dominion), or the new forms of an emerging political entity (Republic)?

There is a third option: temporary forms of an intervening temporary entity--whatever it was (neither Dominion nor Republic). This makes the least sense practically, because it's arguably needlessly expensive to make and stock forms that will only be used for one year. And what would the intervening entity be called, anyway?

Logically and practically, it makes most sense for Kenya bureaucrats to have been using the new Republic of Kenya forms in February 1964 inasmuch as the Dominion was dead and gone and the Republic was a "done deal" just waiting to be fully implemented.

211 posted on 08/02/2009 9:03:45 PM PDT by behzinlea
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To: behzinlea
Logically and practically, it makes most sense for Kenya bureaucrats to have been using the new Republic of Kenya forms in February 1964 inasmuch as the Dominion was dead and gone and the Republic was a "done deal" just waiting to be fully implemented.

Sure, I agree. But that is a matter which can be readily authenticated.

All we can do is speculate...until such authentication is actually conducted.

212 posted on 08/02/2009 9:08:41 PM PDT by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA: Ignorance on Parade)
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To: PowerPro
The one who’d benefit from a provable forgery would be Obama. And if he’d be the one to benefit...does it not follow that one of his agents put it out there to distract and detract from what Orly and Keyes are trying to do?

More likely to distract us from what Obama, Reid and Pelosi are trying to do.

213 posted on 08/02/2009 9:15:25 PM PDT by giotto (title:)
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To: BP2

This information needs to be spread far and wide. EVERYONE needs to know about this!


214 posted on 08/02/2009 9:15:36 PM PDT by GoRepGo
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To: Cheburashka; BP2; All
Cheburashka wrote:

On February 17, 1964 the formal title of the country was the “Dominion of Kenya”. It became the “Republic of Kenya” on December 12, 1964, about 10 months later.

Wrong.

MADARAKA DAY and Barack Obama's COLB

Like BP2 said, I'm not speaking of the authencity of the picture of the COLB; I don't know if it is real or not. But, I do know your dates are wrong.

Madaraka Day - June 1, 1963:

Jamuhuri (Republic) Day - December 12, 1963:

December 12th 1963 (Jamuhuri or Republic Day), Kenya attained independent dominion status within the British Commonwealth under a constitution that was negotiated and agreed at three multi-party Constitutional Conferences held in London and Nairobi between 1961 and 1963.

Exactly a year later, on December 12, 1964, Kenya became a republic and the last British governor in Kenya departed, leaving Kenyatta to steer the country as its first president. Indeed Kenya was now a free country having severed a colonial ties and becoming a republic answerable to no one else but its people.

215 posted on 08/02/2009 9:57:45 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Tawiskaro

You are overlooking Madaraka Day - June 1, 1963 and Jamuhuri (Republic) Day - December 12, 1963


216 posted on 08/02/2009 10:11:45 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: BP2

You are absolutely the best.

Your deductive reasoning skills are impeccable.

Great work.


217 posted on 08/02/2009 10:12:07 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (Just say NO to national socialism!)
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To: fireman15

Madaraka Day - June 1, 1963:

- Kenya was given sovereignty over their political affairs and their resources
- Kenya was given a Bill of Rights to be enforced by an independent judiciary
- Kenya created a democratic Nation by rule of law

Jamuhuri (Republic) Day - December 12, 1963:

December 12th 1963 (Jamuhuri or Republic Day), Kenya attained independent dominion status within the British Commonwealth under a constitution that was negotiated and agreed at three multi-party Constitutional Conferences held in London and Nairobi between 1961 and 1963.

December 12, 1964, Kenya became a republic and the last British governor in Kenya departed, leaving Kenyatta to steer the country as its first president.


218 posted on 08/02/2009 10:16:40 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: okie01

Kenya’s independence day is Madaraka Day, June 1, 1963.


219 posted on 08/02/2009 10:21:46 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Mount Athos

>>> it was not a republic until december 1964, a full year later.

Then what is their National Holiday, Jamuhuri Day - December 12, 1963?


220 posted on 08/02/2009 10:26:46 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Porterville; kabar

>>>>find documents establishing the use of Republic prior to December of 1964.

Jamuhuri Day - December 12, 1963 - National Holiday.

Jamuhuri means Republic.


221 posted on 08/02/2009 10:39:31 PM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Calpernia
Then what is their National Holiday, Jamuhuri Day - December 12, 1963?

Jamhuri is the Swahili word for "republic", a holiday to mark Kenya's establishment as a republic on 12 December, 1964.

Kenya also gained independence exactly one year before this, on Dec 12th 1963. So they can celebrate both independence and becoming a republic on the same day, despite these events being one year apart.

Independence Dec 12th 1963
Republic Dec 12th 1964
222 posted on 08/02/2009 11:00:09 PM PDT by Mount Athos (A Giant luxury mega-mansion for Gore, a Government Green EcoShack made of poo for you)
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To: BP2; penelopesire; seekthetruth; television is just wrong; jcsjcm; Pablo Mac; April Lexington; ...

Thanks so much for posting this information ..


223 posted on 08/03/2009 12:20:53 AM PDT by STARWISE (The Art & Science Institute of Chicago Politics NE Div: now open at the White House)
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To: Calpernia

Good job.

Yep, it’s all coming together now!


224 posted on 08/03/2009 12:23:02 AM PDT by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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To: Cicero; All

Google executives are on WH boards, friends of BHO .. rumors out there they may do the healthcare database online deal.


225 posted on 08/03/2009 12:26:51 AM PDT by STARWISE (The Art & Science Institute of Chicago Politics NE Div: now open at the White House)
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To: xkaydet65

That’s reaching ... no equivalency at all or relevance.


226 posted on 08/03/2009 12:28:02 AM PDT by STARWISE (The Art & Science Institute of Chicago Politics NE Div: now open at the White House)
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To: Fred Nerks

Good deduction !


227 posted on 08/03/2009 12:34:15 AM PDT by STARWISE (The Art & Science Institute of Chicago Politics NE Div: now open at the White House)
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To: STARWISE

There are eight pages on this link, the pages are numbered by hand from ONE to TWELVE.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/9694026/Obama-64-Divorce-Decree-Plains-Radio

Looks like four pages relate to identification to me.


228 posted on 08/03/2009 12:46:07 AM PDT by Fred Nerks (fair dinkum!)
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To: rawcatslyentist

Note that repeating “f” characters in the printed document are not represented as ligatures (”ff”) in the words “official” and “Office”.

Wouldn’t it be standard practice for a printer to use ligatures in those words?


229 posted on 08/03/2009 12:54:08 AM PDT by Royal Wulff
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To: DJ MacWoW; NYIslander; All

Google’s Schmidt and Microsoft’s Mundie Appointed As Obama Tech Advisors

http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/04/27/googles-schmidt-and-microsofts-mundie-appointed-as-obama-tech-advisors/


230 posted on 08/03/2009 12:54:32 AM PDT by STARWISE (The Art & Science Institute of Chicago Politics NE Div: now open at the White House)
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To: Plutarch
If you haven't seen it, ping to Post 494.

I've poured over numerous documents and research essays that DEEPLY explore the Islamic secessionist movement in the 10 mile coastal strip of the British Protectorate leading up to and including 1964.

That area of land, which was part of what is now Coastal Province in Kenya where Mombasa lies, became independent on October 5, 1963 from an agreement in the exchange of letters between the Prime Ministers of Kenya and Zanzibar Messrs Jomo Kenyatta and M. Shamte.

It seems the Coastal Registrar's office started calling itself the "Republic of Kenya" BEFORE Dec. 12, 1964 to protect its rights and not be annexed by neighboring Zanzibar.

The facts still line up for the Kenyan birth certificate to be legitimate.

231 posted on 08/03/2009 1:23:05 AM PDT by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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To: BP2

Placemarker ... need sleep! Must have sleep ..............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................


232 posted on 08/03/2009 1:36:32 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Believing they cannot be deceived, they cannot be convinced when they are deceived.)
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To: Mount Athos

No.

Independence Day is June 1, 1963 (Madaraka Day)

Republic Day is December 12, 1963 (Jamuhuri Day)


233 posted on 08/03/2009 5:11:44 AM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Calpernia; STARWISE; BP2; LucyT; penelopesire; FARS

Good find Calpernia:
Independence Day is June 1, 1963 (Madaraka Day)

Republic Day is December 12, 1963 (Jamuhuri Day)

From another post, another thread:
(This one looks particularly interesting.)

Genealogy Forum - Kenya: http://genforum.genealogy.com/kenya/


234 posted on 08/03/2009 6:11:52 AM PDT by hoosiermama (ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)
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To: STARWISE; maggief; Calpernia; BP2; Fred Nerks

From previous link:

“I got a lot of help from the Kenya Government archives without actually going there!”
...

WEBSITE - http://www.kenyarchives.go.ke


235 posted on 08/03/2009 6:27:49 AM PDT by hoosiermama (ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)
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To: okie01
Whether they actually did or not is subject to authentication -- which needs to be undertaken before we assume the validity of this document.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I totally agree. I just don't like the assumption some have made that it somehow shows the document is a hoax. PM

236 posted on 08/03/2009 6:55:16 AM PDT by politicalmerc
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To: politicalmerc; okie01; Calpernia
From Calpernia (one of FR super sleuths)

Independence Day is June 1, 1963 (Madaraka Day)

Republic Day is December 12, 1963 (Jamuhuri Day)

237 posted on 08/03/2009 7:09:12 AM PDT by hoosiermama (ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)
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To: hoosiermama; Fred Nerks
And, I believe, it was Fred Nerks that initially found that information unknowingly on the old, super long, blogger info thread we have had going for about a year now.

Fred Nerks posted this MONTHS ago. But didn't realize that this date was actually called:
June 1, 1963, reads: “Nairobi, Kenya – Waving his ‘wisk’ the newly-elected Premier of Kenya, Jomo Kenyatta (R, foreground), greeted throngs of cheering citizens as he rode through the streets of Nairobi.

What Fred didn't realize was this was Madaraka Day. Because it was only captioned with the date.

Madaraka Day - June 1, 1963:

- Kenya was given sovereignty over their political affairs and their resources
- Kenya was given a Bill of Rights to be enforced by an independent judiciary
- Kenya created a democratic Nation by rule of law

That is how I learned about Jamuhuri:

Jamuhuri (Republic) Day - December 12, 1963:

December 12th 1963 (Jamuhuri or Republic Day), Kenya attained independent dominion status within the British Commonwealth under a constitution that was negotiated and agreed at three multi-party Constitutional Conferences held in London and Nairobi between 1961 and 1963.

238 posted on 08/03/2009 7:56:38 AM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: Calpernia

ANother good find...FR-mail


239 posted on 08/03/2009 8:02:17 AM PDT by hoosiermama (ONLY DEAD FISH GO WITH THE FLOW.......I am swimming with Sarahcudah! Sarah has read the tealeaves.)
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Bump


240 posted on 08/03/2009 9:06:24 AM PDT by ChowChowFace
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To: Calpernia
Wrong.

My date Dominion status proclaimed: December 12, 1963. (In a different post, but still February 14, 1964 is after that date and before December 12, 1964)

Your date Dominion status proclaimed: December 12, 1963.

My date Republic proclaimed: December 12, 1964.

Your date Republic proclaimed: December 12, 1964.

Nope, your dates agree with mine. So if I'm wrong, you are too.

241 posted on 08/03/2009 9:07:36 AM PDT by Cheburashka (Stephen Decatur: you want barrels of gunpowder as tribute, you must expect cannonballs with it.)
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To: Cheburashka

The document you posted was from December 10th 1963.
Check the date.
Two days before the 1963 Constitution was instated.
Kenya declared independance December 12th.

Looks like this document may be more accurate.
http://www.constitutionnet.org/files/Kenyan%20constitution%20amended%202008.pdf


242 posted on 08/03/2009 9:10:07 AM PDT by arKangel01
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To: STARWISE; penelopesire; seekthetruth; television is just wrong; jcsjcm; BP2; Danae; SE Mom; ...

You guys—Soebody is on to something, BIG. The Birther issue is suddenly TOP STORY on Yahoo.

Please remain skeptical, like me, about every story, good or bad, concerning ‘birther’ news—it may be an intentional distraction from someone else who is getting closer and closer.

Also, hang on to the my FINAL UIPA request, and please send it too, if you will. I feel like I need back up. This is a link to a pdf with all my support, etc.

It grew to be 17 pages long!

http://fs10n2.sendspace.com/dl/31e61f2e6573ca4fb81a2353bdc9abcd/4a770f9a6ac1c609/lwt4sg/FullUIPAReqX-2.pdf

ALSO, let me know if any of you decide to send it, too. I have been having strange internet issues all week. I’m just nervous about the circumstances.

I sent the request to: governor.lingle@hawaii.gov, janice.okubo@doh.hawaii.gov, chiyome.fukino@doh.hawaii.gov, oip@hawaii.gov, ltgov@hawaii.gov


243 posted on 08/03/2009 9:32:35 AM PDT by MissTickly
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To: arKangel01

No, that’s the 2008 constitution. Yeah, it says it’s the 1963 constitution, but it also says as amended through 2008. So it isn’t really the 1963 constitution.

Most constitutions around the world are not treated like the U.S. Constitution. We list the seven original articles and after that the 27 amendments. We can do it that way because our Constitution is relatively short, and the Amendments are relatively few.

Most constitutions of other countries go on for a hundred or more articles. And there may be pages and pages of amendments. So to make it readable and understandable they interpolate the amendments into the basic body of the text, and remove the deleted parts. As I said, far different from how we do it.


244 posted on 08/03/2009 9:35:32 AM PDT by Cheburashka (Stephen Decatur: you want barrels of gunpowder as tribute, you must expect cannonballs with it.)
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To: Cheburashka
Jamuhuri (Republic) Day - December 12, 1963: commemorates the use of Republic.
245 posted on 08/03/2009 9:37:34 AM PDT by Calpernia (DefendOurFreedoms.Org)
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To: arKangel01

I forgot to comment about the date discrepancies in your post. I assume your notes about discrepancies is correct, I’m not going to bother checking them. Any dates noted in the constitution were done by Kenyans, I assume no responsibility.


246 posted on 08/03/2009 9:41:11 AM PDT by Cheburashka (Stephen Decatur: you want barrels of gunpowder as tribute, you must expect cannonballs with it.)
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To: autumnraine
You guys gotta remember this is the third world we are talking about,stuff that we would never ever allow document wise is hardly even acknowledged in the third world,its a different world.
247 posted on 08/03/2009 9:44:23 AM PDT by rodguy911 (HOME OF THE FREE BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE--GO SARAHCUDA !!)
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To: BP2

“Judge King probably told Ann to produce a birth certificate before or at trial”

________________

This is not true. There would be no reason for the judge to ask for a birth certificate unless the father was refuting paternity.

This is a more logical time line:

1). Hopeful conspiracy theorists latch on to a “birth certificate/eligibility” scenario contrived by a Hillary supporter named Berg from Pennsylvania.

2). Months pass with several false starts and sputters due to a headline hungry immigrant from California who holds a law degree from an on-line school.

3). Several weeks ago commotion is caused when a ‘birth certificate from Kenya, reported to be Obama’s, goes on sale on e-Bay, but is pulled as it cannot be verified.

4). Headline hungry e-lawyer rekindles commotion with a Birth Certificate (convenient weeks after the e-Bay fraud).

5). FR gets excited but then cooler heads begin threads suggesting that the document is obviously bogus, desparately trying to regain credibility for mainstream conservatives.

6). Conspiracy nuts continue fantasizing about pseudo-evidence, could be documents and divorce proceedings.


248 posted on 08/03/2009 9:55:55 AM PDT by awake-n-angry
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To: awake-n-angry; LucyT
There would be no reason for the judge to ask for a birth certificate unless the father was refuting paternity.

Judge King would have requested Obama Jr's mother (Ann Dunham) provide a copy of the birth because:

1) The judge must know who the parents are before he awards child support

2) The judge must know who the parents are before he awards custody

Go away troll. Don't waste your time on "Conspiracy nuts" ...

249 posted on 08/03/2009 10:25:10 AM PDT by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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To: BP2

You, with all due respect, are delusional.

The judge settles disputes. If the plaintiff asks for custody and the respondent does not contest, then the plaintiff will get custody. If the plaintiff asks for child support and there is no argument against posed by the respondent, the the plaintiff is awarded child support (as calculated by the court per financial filing on both sides). No disputes, no need for the court to invent one.

It is common for a man to pay support for children that are not his, only because he supported the children during the marriage (this subject has been discussed extensively on this forum).

Birth certificates are not evidence of paternity. Often a man is named as a father without his knowledge or consent. The court would not use a birth certificate for this purpose.


250 posted on 08/03/2009 1:38:24 PM PDT by awake-n-angry
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