Skip to comments.Obama Birth Story Unraveling - Mother In Univ Class In Seattle 15 Days After Obama Supposedly Born!
Posted on 08/08/2009 9:20:49 PM PDT by MindBender26Edited on 08/08/2009 9:33:42 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
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“...and you don’t sound anywhere near crazy enough for that.”
Thank you very much.
The reason that I am not a politician or a lawyer is that then, I would have to be around politicians and lawyers.
No doubt, knowing that momma was a ho messed with his mind. That, and being exposed to all-out, Moscow-line communism during the Cold War had to cause this guy to have serious issues.
I remember finding out at age 12 that my very Catholic mom was previously married and divorced. Just that sent me into a tailspin for days. But a mother like Annie??
It’s not hard to imagine how a childhood like Hussein’s could produce a flaming psychopath.
If they did in 1961, the term wouldn't begin until the very end of September.
Most mothers wouldn't want to be separated from a two month or seven week-old baby, but I'd double check on this 15 day story.
If Obama's mother was definitely in classes in Seattle two weeks after her son was born, could we finally lay this stupid Kenya fable to rest?
Oh my gosh. DUH. There is no news here. No one has ever said that Obama’s mom and Dad settled down for a happy marriage. They did not live in the well-to-do home listed on the newspaper birth announcement, ever, nor did the Dunhams. One wealthy family lived there for decades. (Who knows how that address went on the records?)
Obviously Obama’s mama left the baby with her parents and went off to Washington to school. Today women are out and about within days of birth. She was probably in denial and probably even her family didn’t want the shame of their pride and joy only child to not just be “burdened” with a baby, but to miss out on her college education.
Well really I was into my second bottle wine by the time I posted. might not be a good idea to drink and post. LOL!
For reference, here is the transcript.
Almost certainly she was in night school in the Fall quarter and was not taking her courses by correspondence.
You can see in the bottom right corner of the transcript her credits for extension courses. If you read the fine print you can see that the university distinguished extension courses from correspondence courses by an "x" in front of the course number.
Her neighbor Mary T. in her interview said she was babysitting for Ann while Ann was taking night classes at the university, and as I recall that recollection related to the period around Feb-Mar 1962.
Looking at the credits and courseload, it appears she was taking the same type and load of courses in both the Fall and Winter quarters.
You may well be right about the date being Sept 19 and not Aug 19. The date on the transcript could read either way, and we have your recollection to rely on.
To my mind, the curious thing is not that whether she started school in August or September, but that there she was at that time in Seattle, a teenaged mother taking her newborn baby and moving far away from her husband and parents.
Her courses were "Modern Government" and "Intro to the Study of Man" -- it is simply not credible to think that she went there because she couldn't find analogous courses at the University of Hawaii.
Perhaps Barack Sr. didn't believe the baby was actually his, and dumped her.
There has been speculation that Ann learned about his other wife in Kenya and left him for that reason. But that is completely contrary to the interview with Mary T., in which she said Ann told her that the baby's father might have to take a Kenyan wife because of tribal obligations and that Ann was okay with that. In other words, Ann did not know that Barack Sr. already had taken a Kenyan wife.
It appears Ann did not resume residence in Hawaii until after Barack Sr. left for Harvard.
However, that does not mean that I have to accept YOUR definition of “Natural Born Citizen” -—
It was the intent of the founders to prevent RETROATIVE citizenship, through legislation, to qualify someone for POTUS.
It was also the intent of our founders that Naturalized citizens would NOT be qualified, for POTUS.
However, if you ARE a citizen, at the very moment of birth, then you are a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN!
It is possible that Communist Frank Marshal Davis is Obama’s Father. In which case, Obama Jr. MIGHT be qualified for Potus, if Ann was not truly married to Obama Sr. -— even if Obama was born abroad.
I fully agree that Obama is the villain here.
He should hold the office in such high regard that he would be more than willing to defend his qualifications and avoid a crisis, just as McCain did, when requested.
However, your definition of “Natural Born Citizen” is no more than the rehashed and untested opinions of a few others, throughout history.
Very, very few people with any authority agree with your definition.
My definition would probably hold up in Court.
Yours will not.
However, you have every right to YOUR opinion.
My point is only that it is YOUR opinion, and not established law.
In his latest research, to be splashed on WND early next week, Dr. Corsi will reveal that he has documentary evidence that the mother of Barack Obama Jr., Ms Stanley A. Durham-Soetoro, began evening classes at the University of Washington in Seattle on August 19, 1961. This is just 15 days after she supposedly gave birth to President Obama in Hawaii.
It says 1961
Who says she took the baby to Washington? She did so well in her classes, maybe she left the baby with Grandma? This woman never bonded with her child, and this early separation may prove why. She abandoned him several more times in his short childhood.
Seriously, we should NEVER, and I mean NEVER, elect as our President someone who had a childhood so lacking in unconditional love. We should almost never elect a President who desperately wants the job, anyway...
Fred is correct as usual. My own view is that she did in fact go all the way back to Hawaii on August 8--I think that her actions from the birth date in Mombasa in August 4 (3 West Coast US Time) were driven by some direction, perhaps her mother, to attempt to establish citizenship in the US by birth under the then citizenship statutes.
Sure, the COLB might have been a complete fake (including the August 8 date for filing); in which case whatever she did file might have been filed at any point in that period. My own expectation is that we will ultimately see a filing in Hawaii made around the August 8 period. I accept the announcement in the newspaper also--that could be someone who effectively recut the microfiche in five libraries but that seems excessive and I don't think so.
So someone did something to give Hawaii Birth Records notice of the birth around the 8th of August. I think something got filed in the August 8 time period. I further speculate that she intended to be able to put his footprint on something before she filed it which is why they hurried to get him back.
There isn't any evidence that they did that. But if I were going to try to pursue their objective, I would have brought the kid to Hawaii; found a doctor friend who delivered babies at one of the local Hospitals; had him brief the Certification paper and footprint it; and slip it into his pile of deliveries for that period.
Something went wrong with that scheme or they couldn't fully execute and they did something that was part way and had some defects on its face.
But Fred's correct and there isn't any evidence she was in Hawaii again in that time period.
And it isn't fatal to the Kenya birth thesis that she wasn't. She registered for extension classes at the U--so what; she could have done that from anywhere by mail.
Don’t you love people who do that?
Maybe I’ll start looking for topics here that don’t interest me and then post comments about what a boring subject to waste time with.
Grandma had a full time job in a bank.
If Ann was sans baby Barry, one would think she would have taken a regular course-load in the Fall quarter 1961, instead of two night courses, which was the same courseload she took in the Winter quarter when we know she had baby Barry based on the baby-sitting recollections of her neighbor.
So the evidence points to Ann being with baby in Seattle in the Fall quarter.
It didn’t when it was first posted.
This is exactly the evidence-less supposition we criticize the MSM for. There is no "obviously" "probably" or other delayed mind-reading about it. Nor is there any evidence that this was any other excuse we want to give for this.
It all boils down to one point. There is a reason that Obama will not release his birth certificate. The COLB is worthless. The reason must be very significant for him to take so much flak about not releasing it. There is an huge amount of both direct and circumstantial evidence to indicate that he is telling lies about his birth, and as a result, his legal qualifications to be president.
It all boils down to one point; if there isn't a major problem, then release the birth certificate, school records and other pertinent information!
What is he hiding?
So Obama knows Senior isn’t his father, which is why he identifies so closely with him and hates America.
You need to work on your logic a bit.
For reference, here is the transcript. Almost certainly she was in night school in the Fall quarter and was not taking her courses by correspondence. You can see in the bottom right corner of the transcript her credits for extension courses. If you read the fine print you can see that the university distinguished extension courses from correspondence courses by an "x" in front of the course number. Her neighbor Mary T. in her interview said she was babysitting for Ann while Ann was taking night classes at the university, and as I recall that recollection related to the period around Feb-Mar 1962. Looking at the credits and courseload, it appears she was taking the same type and load of courses in both the Fall and Winter quarters. You may well be right about the date being Sept 19 and not Aug 19. The date on the transcript could read either way, and we have your recollection to rely on.
Correspondence courses were extension courses. I know. My little sister did exactly that which is exactly how they appear on her transcript also.
Unfortunately, the thing I haven't yet said is that it may be that the night school courses were also extension courses. And I have a vague recollection that may have been in fact the case from something another friend did in exactly that time period.
Of course the only evidence we have that the winter quarter classes were night school is the statement from the lady who was babysitting--and she was expressly uncertain and that may not have been the case.
It makes more sense that the first date (bottom right hand corner) is the date she registered rather than the date classes started which for extension classes was done by mail. You know that Winter Quarter Classes didn't start until the first week in January so you know the December 27, 1961 date for the Winter Quarter registration doesn't reflect her presence in class which didn't start until the following week.
On that basis, the 9/19 or 8/19 date probably would have reflected registration but not class start, whether night school or correspondence.
And the 8/19 date would be too long for Fall Quarter also. The 12/11 and 12/12 dates indicate the date she took the final (which might have happened for a correspondence course or a night school course); the quarter was ten weeks long--the partial thanksgiving week offset days lost for holidays; plus finals. So if the date was 8/19, it didn't represent a class start date.
Your suggestion that the start date really is 9/19 makes some sense; that's about when she might have registered for an extension class, correspondence or night school, for fall quarter.
I continue to doubt that she was physically present in Seattle in the fall of 1961--but it is certainly possible that she was. And for that matter, even if she made it back there by the 19th of August, that too doesn't exclude either the prospect that he was born in Kenya on August 4 (3 Seattle time and date) or the prospect that she got him all the way back to Hawaii on the 8th to register and then back to Seattle 10 days later.
But I continue to be pretty confident that whatever happened with the U of W, she wasn't physically in class in August and the fact that she was registering for extension classes fall quarter doesn't put her there then either.
Observe also that the statements to Mary T and to Susan Blake about her happy relationship with her husband refute a later date for the initial Seattle appearance, however you structure it.
8/19 or 9/19, no later than September, she was establishing a Seattle base at a time he was living in Hawaii. That isn't picking up and moving back in with him and their kid.
That is in part why I think she went back to Hawaii first--to see if she was going to put the deal back together there. It turned out she wasn't; she went back to Seattle and started over.
It’s been an exhausting year since we first started digging around on this mystery man. While we’ve learned a good deal- we still do not know what he’s hiding. We simply know that he IS hiding something.
At the rate he’s trying to push through cap n trade and health care - it’s looking like a race to the finish- will the facts about his past come out before he turns this country into a fascist state?
I am curious as to how you can tell the difference, the heading in the section clearly says:
EXTENSION & CORRESPONDENCE COURSES
read the line below that - “X prefix = Extension, C Suffix = Correspondence”
and then look down to the courses she took, which have the “X” prefix.
Yes, and then we have the reports of her flying to Cambridge to see Barack Sr., and coming back disappointed.
I suspect she was completely deluded about her relationship with Obama Sr. Obama Sr. perhaps had doubts that the baby was his, or perhaps considered Ann a liability regarding his political future in Kenya.
Notwithstanding her liberated views, it seems she fell in love with him and deluded herself about his feelings for her. Those "bourgeois" feelings die hard. As to him, not so much.
He’s from Birmingham, Oblamolam, way down in Alabam, Oblamalam.
And my memory for Monday the 21st is bulletproof. No classes then either.
On the other hand, Tuesday, September 19 was the week before classes started on Monday September 25; finals week was December 11.
Thing is I think I have seen the August 19 date on a U of W letter--I wonder if the person who wrote it may have looked at the file transcript and made the same mistake I did initially and read the 9/19 date as 8/19. Maybe that is where Corsi got his information--someone should tell him.
Ought to suggest to him to find out if night classes had some designation other than X (Extension).
Do you read? It’s already been posted numerous times that when this thread was first posted last night it was posted as 1962. A few minutes after posting it the moderator came by and corrected it. Capiche, Mr Latecomer?
No - it doesn't: Article edit history
Aha! I see it now. Question: If I had a baby, and requested that the extension course materials be made available to me to complete at home...might that be possible?
I ask that question because I am convinced she used that address as an address only - but never lived there. Mary Toutinghi, who maintains she baby-sat may well have been a ‘post-man’ not a baby-sitter:
Database of Restricted Neighborhoods in Seattle:
Scroll for Capitol Hill Neighborhoods...all of them were restricted:
Corsi has the written documentation. It was an evening class. It was not a correspondence class. I, and many others have registered for school on Saturdays and gone to Saturday classes.
Why do you have the huge need to try to debunk that which you admit you have no knowledge of?
I ask that question because I am convinced she used that address as an address only - but never lived there. Mary Toutinghi, who maintains she baby-sat may well have been a post-man not a baby-sitter:
Huh? Read the Toutonghi interview yourself.
One version of the Kenya birth story is that the birth certificate refers to Obama senior by name, but Stanley Dunham by “Anna Toots.” The reason this is interesting is that the Dunham family used “Toots” as an informal proper noun for Obama juniors grandmother. Like mother like daughter?
Ah, well, I played volleyball with a woman who played until she went into hard labor- the next night. She returned in two weeks to play. A friend of mine also went shopping at Target, two days after a C-Section. Yeah, times are different now, but if a woman has her mind set to do something, not even post partum is going to stop her.
Geez dude, got attitude?
Oh that’s alright. What kind of wine?
Cellar No. 8 and a Duckhorn.
By the way, is there some reason we cannot find a single person in Hawaii or who was born in Hawaii that used a “Certification of Live Birth” to obtain a passport.
I just don’t see how a “Certification of Live Birth” would provide sufficient information to the State Department.
A “Certificate of Live Birth” maybe but the State Department is quite clear that they require a Birth Certificate.
The above was taken from this link.
WASHINGTON STATE UNIVERSITY ACADEMIC CALENDAR Semesters vs. Quarters
As you can see from the below link the quarter begins in September and ends in December. So that obscure number in the above transcript has to be a 9 (Sept) instead of an 8 (Aug)
“...Toutonghi said her daughter asked if she had voted for President Obama because she had once baby-sat him.
I said no...”
If the course number starts with "X" it's an extension course, if it ends with "C" it's a Correspondence course. The transcript form says that right below the heading you referance.
The transcript form says Correspondence courses have a "C" suffix after the course number. Hers do not have the "C" suffix.
If she gave birth in HI she would have had her mother there to teach her to care for the baby. Grandmothers love that sort of thing.
If I had a baby, and requested that the extension course materials be made available to me to complete at home...might that be possible?
She wasn’t saying she didn’t vote for Obama.
She was saying the reason she voted for Obama is NOT because she had once baby-sat for him. In the original interview, at the end of the interview her comments make clear she is a supporter of Obama.
If your point is that you don’t believe anything she says about the baby-sitting because she is an Obama supporter, you can hold that opinion if you like. I don’t go that far, myself.
My understanding is that the baby need not be presented for registration in cases of birth not in a hospital. It was all done by paperwork.
And it isn't fatal to the Kenya birth thesis that she wasn't. She registered for extension classes at the U--so what; she could have done that from anywhere by mail.
There's no evidence that she was ever in Hawaii, other than Neil Abercrombie's fairy tales and what we are led to believe from 'Dreams'
I'm convinced the extension course materials were posted to her. Mary Toutinghi is as believable as Susan Blake, Neil Abercrombie, and 'the teacher from Kenmore' Barbara Nelson...who IIRC arrived from Bufallo the same year as Abercrombie did. As believable as Eleanor Nordyke, connected to the East West Centre, that lists her written works...who had twins in the 'same hospital' whose announcement we cannot find.
these are people with a common purpose.
"Documentation for these timeline conclusions come from records recently provided WND by the University of Washington at Seattle.
On July 29, the University of Washington e-mailed WND Dunham's complete grade transcript covering her attendance at the university. The university confirmed Dunham's classes starting in the fall of 1961 were night classes.
The transcript clearly documents that Dunham was enrolled at the University of Washington for two classes that began on Aug. 19, 1961: Anthropology 100, "Introduction to the Study of Man" and Political Science 201, "Modern Government."
WND has the physical copy of the transcript which is clearer to see, and got confirmation from the university about the courses. They were night classes through the extension program.
“Incidentally the serial number of the younger of the Nordyke twins, 10638, is still 3 numbers less that BHO Jr.’s, even though he was supposedly born almost a full day earlier, in the same hospital (this week anyway) and the online COLB also indicates his BC was filed 3 days before those of the Nordyke twins, Aug. 8 verse Aug 11. . Something to make you go “hmmm”.”
What evidence is there that Hawaii BC’s are numbered according to time of birth?
Here’s my informed guess as to the reason for the numbers difference:
In 1961, the Hawaiian birth rate was a bit under 50 births per day. One clerk could easily process a day’s worth of birth reports before lunch break.
I’m guessing that the birth reports from hospitals would arrive by mail, and the clerk would sort them in alphabetical order by name for easy filing, then process them. Hmmm.... Could it be that the three BC numbers between “Nordyke” and “Obama” have names alphabetically between “Nordyke” and “Obama”? Call me crazy, but that’s what I’m guessing.
At the University of Washington in August of 1961? Really? Which ones?
During a regular term, you might have a Saturday class. But in August, 1961, the school was pretty much shut down as soon as summer quarter finals were over which by my recollection was August 10.
The issue is August. Corsi says she was there August 19. Starting class on Saturday? When the school is shut down? The August 19 date doesn't demonstrate she was there. Among other things, the real date is probably September 19 and the August 19 simply represents a misreading of the note on the transcript. And that doesn't demonstrate she was there then either.
The "C" is a problem for my analysis--I have just looked at a fall quarter 1964 transcript for someone else for a class that was done out of state--by mail; no C; only an X. So I wonder about their classification system.
But the real issue is the timeline for her movements. There is floating around a letter from the University which sort of supports Corsi's original story but the August 19 presence date is wrong.