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Journo Asks Why Can't 'Progressives' Win?
Publius Forum ^ | 08/10/09 | Warner Todd Huston

Posted on 08/10/2009 10:57:28 AM PDT by Mobile Vulgus

The L.A.Times' Dan Neil is confused. He thinks that the so-called progressive movement is right on all the issues, but he just cannot understand why they can't win the public debate. Neil laments that they have all the "English majors" on their side but cannot win "any war of words." Just what is going on here, he wants to know? He's so frustrated that he took to his keyboard to ask these questions in a Pittsburgh Gazette article from August 9.

In his piece, Neil wonders, for instance, why the "progressives" are so inept at debate and cannot convince the lowly voters of the merits of their argument even though they are obviously right? He goes on to bemoan that the "progressives" are trying, but are just too darn nice, too “anti-inflammatory” in their rhetoric. He concludes that it's time for the "progressives" to take off the gloves and fight dirty like the "insurance companies" have been doing.

Now, Mr. Neil seems like a smart fella. All his words and spelled correctly, and all. But for all his moaning and gnashing of teeth about why the "progressives" just can't seem to win he misses the elephant in the room. "Progressives" can't win because they are liars. And, as his blather in the Gazette shows, Neil is a liar, too.

Read the rest at Publiusforum.com...


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Yeah, they can't win because they are LIARS. Liberals and "progressives" can't tell the truth.
1 posted on 08/10/2009 10:57:29 AM PDT by Mobile Vulgus
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To: Mobile Vulgus

but mostly importantly, they’re on the wrong side of the issues.


2 posted on 08/10/2009 10:58:24 AM PDT by A_Former_Democrat
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To: Mobile Vulgus
Neil laments that they have all the "English majors" on their side but cannot win "any war of words."

Well, most music majors can't play worth a crap, either.

3 posted on 08/10/2009 10:59:23 AM PDT by HIDEK6
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Cant’t tell the truth. You are close. The reality is that they can not tell right from wrong. Liberals and progressives are insane.


4 posted on 08/10/2009 11:00:09 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (!!)
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To: Mobile Vulgus; All
"Journo Asks Why Can't 'Progressives' Win?"


5 posted on 08/10/2009 11:00:15 AM PDT by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Well, no matter how articulate you are — it’s going to be hard to convince someone that 2 + 2 = 100000.

Even if you have TOTUS at your beck and call.


6 posted on 08/10/2009 11:00:15 AM PDT by rom (Israel got Saul before they got David. Where's our David?)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
The L.A.Times' Dan Neil is confused. He thinks that the so-called progressive movement is right on all the issues, but he just cannot understand why they can't win the public debate.

Because Socialism is built on lies. It cannot stand the public scrutiny and measure against the historical record.

Socialist revisionist history means never having to accept the lessons of the past.

7 posted on 08/10/2009 11:00:55 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (There is no truth in the Pravda Media.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Huh? They’ve won battle after socio-political battle in this country, and they’re well on their way to winning the war!

Take your little begging-the-question trick and play on the simple-minded.


8 posted on 08/10/2009 11:01:30 AM PDT by LearsFool ("Thou shouldst not have been old, till thou hadst been wise.")
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To: Mobile Vulgus

They can’t win because they are simply on the wrong side of the issues. The left resorts to name-calling, ad hominem and physical attacks because they have no basis in facts.


9 posted on 08/10/2009 11:03:21 AM PDT by astounded (The democrat party is a clear and present danger to America.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

dan.neil@latimes.com


10 posted on 08/10/2009 11:04:17 AM PDT by Vasilli22
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To: Timesink; martin_fierro; reformed_democrat; Loyalist; =Intervention=; PianoMan; GOPJ; ...

Media Schadenfreude and Media Shenanigans PING


11 posted on 08/10/2009 11:04:42 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (There is no truth in the Pravda Media.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

remember Obama successully came out as a TAX CUTTER because he said he would not tax health benefits.

Obama had to run as a conservative in order to sucker the mushy brained middle


12 posted on 08/10/2009 11:04:44 AM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

It’s because a boatload of English degrees can’t overcome the innate power of stupid.


13 posted on 08/10/2009 11:05:04 AM PDT by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (We bury Democrats face down so that when they scratch, they get closer to home.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

They did. In 1917.


14 posted on 08/10/2009 11:05:10 AM PDT by Larry Lucido (This tagline excerpted. To read more, click on MyOverratedBlog.com)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

here’s why they cannot win

these elitist liberals and they are that are stuck up, snotty nosed sheep.

They surround themselves with like minded people and it is when they hear another side they are shocked, stunned that someone can have another view.

If they actually got out of their mc mansion houses and neighborhoods and actually met people who live outside the north east , west coast and DC they would know that they are a small minority


15 posted on 08/10/2009 11:06:15 AM PDT by manc (Marriage is between a man and a woman -- end racism end affirmative action)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

It’s because they’re effing idiots too. Most of them are nothing more than a home for gerbils.


16 posted on 08/10/2009 11:06:57 AM PDT by Waco (Libs exhale too much)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

HA....sat with a “Progressive” at my HS reunion this past weekend....whoa....she did not even know about the FARM Bill....told her she ought to check it out (I figure progressives will be upset by it, too)....THEY are SO ignorant....didn’t have the heart to go into anything else...let her buy me a drink....and then left the table!


17 posted on 08/10/2009 11:07:13 AM PDT by goodnesswins (Tell everyone, DEMS are the RACISTS...they created the KKK and Jim Crow Laws...to start)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Actually, they have been winning because they ARE liars!

In many districts, they campaign as “moderate alternatives” to the GOP’s candidates - when in fact, they were anything but moderate.

They have also been winning because of groups like ACORN, SEIU and AFSCME - not to mention a significantly large chunk of the media.


18 posted on 08/10/2009 11:08:08 AM PDT by MplsSteve
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To: Mobile Vulgus
They DID win.

Look at California and Massachusetts. Any questions?

19 posted on 08/10/2009 11:09:45 AM PDT by listenhillary (90% of our problems could be resolved with a government 10% of the size it is now.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Well each issue is cultivated by little walled off isolated cults, with only the public purse as a common.


20 posted on 08/10/2009 11:10:36 AM PDT by junta (Conservatives, the word "racism" is now ours.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Liberalism is a little bit like a cult. Heavily based on feel good emotionalism sheeple liberals are so beholden to their limited and often naive perceptions washed in the juice of sugary highs. They can’t debate because there is little logic involved so they crumble when their ideology is tested. Leftist leaders apply their devious principles of marxism/alinsky, etc.....heads of the snakes!


21 posted on 08/10/2009 11:12:05 AM PDT by tflabo (Truth or Tyranny)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
"The L.A.Times' Dan Neil is confused. He thinks that the so-called progressive movement is right on all the issues, "

Well, if you start with a false premise, then the conclusion is always wrong.

22 posted on 08/10/2009 11:12:17 AM PDT by avacado
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To: a fool in paradise

But the paid hacks of the GOP conservatives play by the liberal rules and never mention all the past sillyness of liberalism.


23 posted on 08/10/2009 11:12:25 AM PDT by junta (Conservatives, the word "racism" is now ours.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

If leftists told the truth about their policies, their beliefs, or their goals,

they’d get 10% of the vote.

They are simply “know better” elitists that are arrogant enough to think they can make your decisions for you better than you can.

This is why they “can’t win” in a fair discussion. Either it’s obvious that they’re lying, or their agenda is unpalatable.


24 posted on 08/10/2009 11:12:51 AM PDT by MrB (Go Galt now, save Bowman for later)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Who is this idiot? He says the “progressives’ have been too nice? His so-called “tolerant” progressives are the most intolerant folks around. And, to answer his question as to why they are not winning the debate? That’s an easy question to answer: They wrap themselves in emotion rather than logic and reason, so their argument is doomed from the start.


25 posted on 08/10/2009 11:13:29 AM PDT by ought-six ( Multiculturalism is national suicide, and political correctness is the cyanide capsule.)
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To: HIDEK6

His English majors show up unarmed for a war of words.


26 posted on 08/10/2009 11:13:39 AM PDT by tgusa (Gun control: deep breath, sight alignment, squeeze the trigger ....)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

“Liberals and “progressives” can’t tell the truth.”

It’s not that they can’t tell the truth. It’s that they don’t dare for fear of being found out. What they want is to take power from the many and give it to a few by confiscating the wealth of some and using it to buy the votes of others. Since they know that the many don’t want to be powerless and that the rich don’t want to be poor, they have no choice but to disguise their intentions.


27 posted on 08/10/2009 11:15:06 AM PDT by Clioman
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To: Mobile Vulgus

show how much of a thick elitist idiot he is.

the left play nice, etc

ARF

they act like the NAZIS party , rat mail
sending out paid thugs
talking about hitting back twice as hard
dropping charges v the black racists in Philly

the Dem party is nothing but a party of elitist and if you left wing trolls do not think so then look at where your base of support comes from

rich men like soros
the north east and parts of the west coast

you lefty trolls are nothing but snotty nosed elitist sheep,you think driving a hybrid and diversity is cool but you live in a mostly white area in a big house thus more pollution
you like designer shopping malls like saks but think nothing of the trees you cut down for your malls
you pay silly prices at starbucks but then say give to the poor
the north east does not give as much as the south in charity but you preach about Africa
you think it is cool for a chinese kid to be bought but you foget about the inner city kids in this country

to you snobby elitist lefty sheep everything you do is about status and yet you fail to see the hypocrisy

westchester county NY is a prime example of a Dem area

you don’t stand for the working man or women you put people into groups so they can compete against each other
you say to blacks they are too dumb to get a job based on brains so you say give them a job based on color thought a racist programmes named affirmative action

you make me sick

you get in peoples faces who cannot fight back but complain if someone does fight back you want to press charges


28 posted on 08/10/2009 11:15:36 AM PDT by manc (Marriage is between a man and a woman -- end racism end affirmative action)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

link provided does not work.


29 posted on 08/10/2009 11:18:35 AM PDT by Fishtalk (If you're a Freeper and have a Blog Freepmail me with the link. I'll do you if you do me.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
In terms of socio-economic policy and political organization, "Progressives" are currently dominant, all denials to the contrary. When one of their number complains, irrespective of their victories, about a lack of "progress" he or she is really admitting to the ideological rigidity of Utopianism.

An essential belief of the Progressive religion is in the perfectibility of Man and in the agency of the State to bring about that end. Because neither people nor governments are perfect or capable of perfection, Progressives will always be unhappy, blaming not their own unreasoning ideology but other people for failing to meet an unachievable standard. The inevitable result is physical force or its implied threat, multiplied until people will stand it no longer.

It is clearly not necessary to be an English major to fall prey to such a miserable ideology, but it equally appears to be of some assistance. I postulate this is so because certain academics confuse the malleability of words with that of their fellow human beings.

30 posted on 08/10/2009 11:18:45 AM PDT by andy58-in-nh (America does not need to be organized: it needs to be liberated.)
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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

here’s what they do not understand and the left say this always

they say well I have a college degree yet the right never boasts about it as the right knows it does not make one better than someone else

the left say well they are educated but any donkey can go to college for 4 years and party

the left say they know more because they went to school but forget that they have no common sense

when they find people do not agree they are stunned and ask why tehn say er er er

why do they do this
easy
because a bumper sticker has not give them the talking points for it

the left are truly dumb and this election showed it.
how many times did we ask them by what they mean by change and they say er er er

ask about bozo to them and all they say is he wants change


31 posted on 08/10/2009 11:20:21 AM PDT by manc (Marriage is between a man and a woman -- end racism end affirmative action)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
Neil laments that they have all the "English majors" on their side but cannot win "any war of words."

It's worse than that, Neil.

Not only are you more articulate (to accept your argument), but you also control the media of the message, stifle arguments on the other side, dismiss them en masse as the lunatic fringe, and still can't seem to convince anyone of the merits of your side.

You're a self-proclaimed smart guy, Neil. What does that indicate to you, brain-trust?

32 posted on 08/10/2009 11:23:47 AM PDT by Egon (The difference between Theory and Practice: In Theory, there is no difference.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
it's time for the "progressives" to take off the gloves and fight dirty

Oh. What a novel approach.

33 posted on 08/10/2009 11:23:47 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Play the Race Card -- lose the game.)
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To: ClearCase_guy

Just let me make one last run to the gun store before they take off the gloves...ok?


34 posted on 08/10/2009 11:25:23 AM PDT by Armedanddangerous (I think youre so full of inconsolable rage you don't care who you hurt)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

It’s very simple...
1. because their ideas have been proven over and over again that they don’t work
2. they haven’t managed, yet, to control the flow of information so that people are kept ignorant of that fact... but they’re trying. Next will be an assault on free speech.


35 posted on 08/10/2009 11:27:36 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: Mobile Vulgus

We conservatives are realists. We look at a situation and we know instinctively what will work and what won’t. We are much more in tune with human nature.

Liberals just want change, and that wonderful, fashionable (/s!) concept known as “progress”. However just any change for the sake of change won’t work. Libs always shoot for some pie in the sky and in the process completely ignore human nature.


36 posted on 08/10/2009 11:30:29 AM PDT by bergmeid
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To: Mobile Vulgus
Neil laments that they have all the "English majors" on their side but cannot win "any war of words."

I was expecting more English major jokes by now.

In the few English courses I took in college (I was an engineering major), I realized that the grades were all subjective. An old book written by a "dead white male" could be interpreted a lot of ways, especially when the author isn't there to give his say. Want to get a good grade? Just repeat what your professor says about the book.

English major aren't used to backing up their arguments with facts, like mathematical theories or laws of physics.

37 posted on 08/10/2009 11:33:58 AM PDT by JeffChrz (Atlas will shrug.)
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Comment #38 Removed by Moderator

To: Mobile Vulgus

They always were and always will be on the wrong side of history. It makes our job all the more difficult.


39 posted on 08/10/2009 11:37:42 AM PDT by Rickcbw
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To: aquila48

People that THINK they are smart are the problem. This whole Obama group sounds like a dormitory BS session where all of the world problems are readily settled by a group that has never accomplished anything.

This is a raid on the American treasury plain and simple.


40 posted on 08/10/2009 11:41:05 AM PDT by nj patriot (Gore is beyond help.... Snakes in the head.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

With few exceptions, the progressives controlled the White House from the middle of the 18th century right up until FDR was elected.

Of course the progressives back then were Republicans.


41 posted on 08/10/2009 11:43:54 AM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: nj patriot

“This is a raid on the American treasury plain and simple.”

Bad as that is, what’s worse is that they’re raiding our freedoms!!


42 posted on 08/10/2009 11:46:14 AM PDT by aquila48
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To: Mobile Vulgus

i was an “english” major. education is meaningless without common sense. keeping your head shoved so far up a dark stinky place does not give one greater insight as to the workings of the world.


43 posted on 08/10/2009 11:49:36 AM PDT by wiggen (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WayzmX0WQvg)
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To: bergmeid

We understand the reality of human nature - the depravity of the human condition.

Leftists’ base assumption, the source of all their ideological error, is in the assumption that man is basically good. This leads to the belief that, given the proper environment (to be created by elites), man will behave in a manner conducive to the common good at all times.


44 posted on 08/10/2009 11:51:24 AM PDT by MrB (Go Galt now, save Bowman for later)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Here’s an interesting little thing that Mr. Neil should focus his miniscule brain on - a columnist for the LATimes travelled with zero for the last 9 months of the campaign last year. When it was over, he stated that he still didn’t know who Barack Hussain Obama was!!

Mr. Neil should comtemplate that over his next bowl of Cap’n Crunch!


45 posted on 08/10/2009 11:52:13 AM PDT by DustyMoment (FloriDUH - proud inventors of pregnant/hanging chads and judicide!!)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Really? Is he serious?

Are liberals really sitting around wondering why they can’t win a debate with words when their basic factual logic itself is so obscenely flawed?

I mean everybody knows that a college degree these days from *most* universities isn’t a measure of one’s intellect. It’s all about answering the questions in a way that liberal professors are assured they’ve thoroughly indoctrinated you.


46 posted on 08/10/2009 11:52:21 AM PDT by BuckeyeTexan (Integrity, Character, Leadership, and Loyalty matter - Be an example, no matter the cost.)
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To: Mobile Vulgus
Neil laments that they have all the "English majors" on their side but cannot win "any war of words."

Liberal Debate Skills in action

47 posted on 08/10/2009 11:53:24 AM PDT by martin_fierro (< |:)~)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

This makes me think about what it must be like to be an Islamic Fundamentalist. Allah is always on the side of righteousness and goodness, and yet the West is continually kicking Islam’s ass. The cognitive dissonance must be mind numbing...


48 posted on 08/10/2009 12:11:43 PM PDT by Paradox (Obama - Harvard = Sharpton {thanks to sfvgto})
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To: Mobile Vulgus

“Progressive” is just another term for someone whose head is stuck so far up his rear he can bite his own kidneys.


49 posted on 08/10/2009 12:19:40 PM PDT by Julia H. (Remember when dissent was patriotic?)
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To: Mobile Vulgus

Dan Neil should know the answer to that one. It’s those evil Republicans and conservatives. If it weren’t for them, the World would be just perfect.

The Left has been demonizing us for the last forty years.


50 posted on 08/10/2009 12:31:05 PM PDT by popdonnelly (Yes, we disagree - no, we won't shut up - no, we won't quit.)
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