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Richard Dawkins : Creationists, now they’re coming for your children
Times Online ^ | 8/24/2009 | Richard Dawkins

Posted on 08/24/2009 1:41:52 PM PDT by SeekAndFind

Imagine that you are a teacher of Roman history and the Latin language, anxious to impart your enthusiasm for the ancient world — for the elegiacs of Ovid and the odes of Horace, the sinewy economy of Latin grammar as exhibited in the oratory of Cicero, the strategic niceties of the Punic Wars, the generalship of Julius Caesar and the voluptuous excesses of the later emperors. That’s a big undertaking and it takes time, concentration, dedication. Yet you find your precious time continually preyed upon, and your class’s attention distracted, by a baying pack of ignoramuses (as a Latin scholar you would know better than to say ignorami) who, with strong political and especially financial support, scurry about tirelessly attempting to persuade your unfortunate pupils that the Romans never existed. There never was a Roman Empire. The entire world came into existence only just beyond living memory. Spanish, Italian, French, Portuguese, Catalan, Occitan, Romansh: all these languages and their constituent dialects sprang spontaneously and separately into being, and owe nothing to any predecessor such as Latin.

Instead of devoting your full attention to the noble vocation of classical scholar and teacher, you are forced to divert your time and energy to a rearguard defence of the proposition that the Romans existed at all: a defence against an exhibition of ignorant prejudice that would make you weep if you weren’t too busy fighting it.

If my fantasy of the Latin teacher seems too wayward, here’s a more realistic example. Imagine you are a teacher of more recent history, and your lessons on 20th-century Europe are boycotted, heckled or otherwise disrupted by well-organised, well-financed and politically muscular groups of Holocaust-deniers.

(Excerpt) Read more at entertainment.timesonline.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: anevocretin; antichristian; antitheist; atheistsupremacist; christfags; creation; creationism; darwiniac; evocultists; evolution; evoreligion; fanaticalevos; hatespeech; hyperbole; intelligentdesign; junkscience; liberalbigot; religiousintolerance; republicanbutthurt; richarddawkins; templeofdarwin
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Yep, creationists are akin to holocaust deniers now according to Richard Dawkins.
1 posted on 08/24/2009 1:41:52 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind

Richard’s arguments grow more hysterical as he gets closer to death.


2 posted on 08/24/2009 1:43:55 PM PDT by Mojave (Don't blame me. I voted for McClintock.)
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To: SeekAndFind

I loved Richard Dawkins in Hogan’s Heroes. On Family Feud, he mostly just creeped me out.


3 posted on 08/24/2009 1:45:05 PM PDT by VisualizeSmallerGovernment (This Little Piggie Gets Wee Wee'd Up All The Way Home)
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To: SeekAndFind

Dicky’s grasping at straws.


4 posted on 08/24/2009 1:46:03 PM PDT by Rodebrecht (Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.)
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To: SeekAndFind
Yep, those Bible-toters are out of control shooting up our schools.....oh wait those are the other guys...never mind.
5 posted on 08/24/2009 1:46:31 PM PDT by Huskrrrr
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To: SeekAndFind

It’s a shame that an otherwise respectable newspaper will print this fanatic’s drivel.

Even if you are an atheist Dawkins regularly goes beyond any discussion of religion and wants to turn it all into a culture war.


6 posted on 08/24/2009 1:47:47 PM PDT by relictele
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To: VisualizeSmallerGovernment

Richard Dawson

7 posted on 08/24/2009 1:51:43 PM PDT by Puppage (You may disagree with what I have to say, but I shall defend to your death my right to say it)
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To: relictele

Andrew Sibley at the website : Uncommon Descent, after reading Dawkin’s article, comments :

“I am sure Richard Dawkins is aware that Holocaust denial is illegal in some countries; perhaps it is his aim to make evolution denial illegal in those countries where there is a resistance to Darwinism. ‘If evolution cannot win in the market place of scientific ideas, then we’ll sure win in the courts once it is a mandated belief’ would appear to be the direction of his rhetoric. What is Dawkins afraid of? Can’t evolution hold its own in the science arena?

Next Dawkins thinks he ought to tell the Vicars and Bishops how to preach. He notes of course that all the leading clerics accept evolution, as if the authority of theologians will establish a truth in science.

But what of Dawkins’ scientific smoke and mirrors?

Nowhere in this article does he seek to qualify what he means by evolution. Evolution is a fact he asserts, a statement that even Henry Morris would have agreed with in part, but what type of evolution is ‘fact’? Natural selection of pre existing genetic information does not explain causally where that genetic information came from. Dawkins peddles the simplification that the process that gave a dalmatian spots is the same process that turns a bacterium into an ostrich, or a fish into a hippo. But Dawkins knows that neo-Darwinism is more complicated than that. The problem for Dawkins is that belief in evolution is dependant upon such over simplifications, because if people really understood the complexity of organic life and what is being claimed then they would not accept unguided molecule to man evolution. In other words evolution is rejected because people understand it too well, not too poorly, and Dawkins has to keep to the simple text to keep the illusion going.

So we may ask – why cannot Dawkins and others conduct the discussion of origins in a more rational manner without the type of smoke and mirrors and fear-mongering rhetoric that is being engaged in with his article? What is at stake really? Is it science or is it his atheism?”


8 posted on 08/24/2009 1:52:22 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind

what a joke
9 posted on 08/24/2009 1:52:43 PM PDT by ari-freedom (Obama acted stupidly...and that's after knowing all the facts.)
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To: SeekAndFind

He sounds disgusted with ALL religions (is there any faith that exists with a belief in a God that believes that God had nothing to do with “creation”)? So why does he single out all of his venom over Christianity?

Why does he set up straw man arguments?

Why does his own supremacist theology in the no-god god (he doesn’t just hold this worldview for himself, he wants everyone onboard HIS faith) trump a universal right to religious belief?


10 posted on 08/24/2009 1:53:14 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Barry Falsewitness is proud of his "healthy skepticism" of organized religion. He's a deceiver.)
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bkmk


11 posted on 08/24/2009 1:54:08 PM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
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To: SeekAndFind

The ones the Darwinists and evolutionists have not aborted presumably.
Frankly, an atheist Darwinist complaining about people "coming after children"
is ridiculous and absurd in an extreme degree considering their track record here.

12 posted on 08/24/2009 1:54:29 PM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
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To: SeekAndFind

“Imagine that...”

Imagine that Dawkins were an ass. Then he would be an ass, QED.

What an ass.


13 posted on 08/24/2009 1:54:41 PM PDT by rightwingcrazy
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To: SeekAndFind

Unlike homosexuals, who just want to be left alone, right? /sarc

Was it an Alinsky ys’’v rule to accuse your political opponents of the sins you commit?


14 posted on 08/24/2009 1:54:50 PM PDT by Jeb21 (www.jewsagainstobama.com)
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To: Puppage

Richard Dawson with his former wife, Diana Dors. Yow!

15 posted on 08/24/2009 1:55:38 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (There is no truth in the Pravda Media.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Dawkins is the ignoramus. Jesus had many Roman followers, and St. Paul was a Roman himself.
This atheist is not very bright.


16 posted on 08/24/2009 1:55:50 PM PDT by kittymyrib
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To: SeekAndFind

Are Muslims creationists? Somehow I doubt this will apply to them.


17 posted on 08/24/2009 1:56:41 PM PDT by GeronL (Toward the TOTUS State-Nightmare in Obamaland .. http://tyrannysentinel.blogspot.com)
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To: Puppage

"Who loves you and who do you love?"

18 posted on 08/24/2009 1:57:23 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: SeekAndFind

For a supposedly intelligent man he really is a wanker!

Mel


19 posted on 08/24/2009 1:57:35 PM PDT by melsec (A Proud Aussie)
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To: SeekAndFind

Who kept all of that great Latin history around for 2000 years? Oh that’s right, the monastic schools and later the christian Universities.

For every Galileo, there is an Isaac Newton, a Georges Lamaitre, and a Michael Faraday. Christianity has produced giants in the hard sciences. Too bad, just imagine what they could have accomplished if they hadn’t been Christians, right Dawkins?


20 posted on 08/24/2009 1:57:53 PM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: SeekAndFind

Only one response to this article; you better believe we are after your children. Somebody has to tell them the truth, and it won’t be Richard Dawkins.


21 posted on 08/24/2009 2:05:23 PM PDT by LiteKeeper (When do the impeachment proceedings begin?)
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To: SeekAndFind

bookmark


22 posted on 08/24/2009 2:05:51 PM PDT by GOP Poet
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To: SeekAndFind

I didn’t understand a single word of that.


23 posted on 08/24/2009 2:08:36 PM PDT by ronnietherocket2
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To: SeekAndFind
In a universe of blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won’t find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but blind pitiless indifference.
– Richard Dawkins River Out of Eden: A Darwinian View of Life
I have argued that the discontinuous gap between humans and 'apes' that we erect in our minds is regrettable. I have also argued that, in any case, the present position of the hallowed gap is arbitrary, the result of evolutionary accident. If the contingencies of survival and extinction had been different, the gap would be in a different place. Ethical principles that are based upon accidental caprice should not be respected as if cast in stone.
- Dawkins
Dawkins signed a petition in the UK to “ make it illegal to indoctrinate or define children by religion before the age of 16”. .
24 posted on 08/24/2009 2:24:46 PM PDT by Heartlander
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

Galileo too was working for the church. His “persecution” has been greatly exaggerated and had more to do with his mocking the pope than science/religion.

http://www.catholic.com/library/Galileo_Controversy.asp


25 posted on 08/24/2009 2:25:30 PM PDT by LastNorwegian
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To: Heartlander

“The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but blind pitiless indifference.”

If you turn your back on God and spurn His blessings, then yes, the universe does look a lot like that.


26 posted on 08/24/2009 2:32:07 PM PDT by dsc (The "t" in the word "often" is silent.)
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To: dfwgator

LMAO. Greatest “Awnold” movie ever.


27 posted on 08/24/2009 2:38:19 PM PDT by randomhero97 ("First you want to kill me, now you want to kiss me. Blow!" - Ash)
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To: dsc
Richard Dawkins - The Blasphemy Challenge. Dawkins is actually the one who is going after the children…
28 posted on 08/24/2009 2:42:13 PM PDT by Heartlander
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
For every Galileo, there is an Isaac Newton, a Georges Lamaitre, and a Michael Faraday. Christianity has produced giants in the hard sciences.

For every Galileo...?

Galileo Galilei was put on trial by the Church for supporting Copernican astronomy. This was not all that long ago. It's scary when you give that much power to theocrats.

29 posted on 08/24/2009 2:46:43 PM PDT by LoneRangerMassachusetts
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To: Mojave
He be a believer for sure when he dies.
30 posted on 08/24/2009 2:47:40 PM PDT by jokar (The Church age is the only age man will be able to glorify Christ, http://www.gbible.org)
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To: LoneRangerMassachusetts

I’m pretty sure you have been exposed to more accurate history than that, right here on FR.


31 posted on 08/24/2009 3:47:57 PM PDT by dsc (The "t" in the word "often" is silent.)
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To: SeekAndFind; jtmkns; metmom; DaveLoneRanger; editor-surveyor; betty boop; Alamo-Girl; MrB; ...

Writing from under Richard Darwkins bed...Ping!


32 posted on 08/24/2009 3:52:02 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
Dawkins has company under the bed, that eminent scholar and scientist, Ellen Goodman opines that you might be a “HOLCAUST DENIER” if you don't accept the global warming scare. Says she:

“I would like to say we're at a point where global warming is impossible to deny. Let's just say that global warming deniers are now on a par with Holocaust deniers, though one denies the past and the other denies the present and future.” (ELLEN GOODMAN
No change in political climate
By Ellen Goodman | February 9, 2007 The Boston Globe)

The Holocaust Deniers, HD’ers to the uninitiated, are everywhere, disguised as creationists and global coolingists and people who wear brown shoes with blue suits.

Poor Richard. It's scary out there in the colonies.

33 posted on 08/24/2009 5:01:03 PM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: a fool in paradise

You’ll find that, almost exclusively, biblical Christianity is the only religion that is attacked...

It’s the truth, and that’s why the father of lies focuses his attention on it.


34 posted on 08/24/2009 5:03:27 PM PDT by MrB (Go Galt now, save Bowman for later)
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To: count-your-change

Don’t forget about the HIV denialists...LOL! I know you take the other side of the debate over what causes AIDS, but wouldn’t it be funny if all three groups labeled as “denialists” by the evo-atheists turned out to be correct?!?!?


35 posted on 08/24/2009 5:08:25 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: SeekAndFind
"Evolution is an inescapable fact"

How appropriate, Mr. Dawkins is writing in the entertainment section. I guess that's where they let the clowns write whatever they want.

"The more energetically and thoroughly you try to disprove a theory, if it survives the assault, the more closely it approaches what common sense happily calls a fact"

Who is trying to disprove Evolution energetically? A few creationist scientists are trying. Almost every university researcher bends over backwards to make sure they never even come close to disproving it. Who would want the religious Dawrinists running after them with axes trying to remove them from their jobs and take their research money. This article is laughable, simply laughable.
36 posted on 08/24/2009 5:49:27 PM PDT by Jaime2099 (Human Evolution and the God of the Bible are not compatible)
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To: SeekAndFind; GodGunsGuts

The only sense to make of his article is that he is shilling a new book.


37 posted on 08/24/2009 8:08:16 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: SeekAndFind

“And the survey SAYS....!”

“Goofball.”


38 posted on 08/24/2009 8:10:24 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: SeekAndFind
the strategic niceties of the Punic Wars

There was nothing nice about the Punic Wars. Ugly, nasty affairs.

that being said, if Dawkins thinks this is a serious or legitimate argument against creationism, then he's even more of a mouth-breathing, brain-dead cretin than I'd thought.

39 posted on 08/24/2009 8:27:35 PM PDT by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (We bury Democrats face down so that when they scratch, they get closer to home.)
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To: LoneRangerMassachusetts
Galileo Galilei was put on trial by the Church for supporting Copernican astronomy. This was not all that long ago. It's scary when you give that much power to theocrats.

While it's true that Galileo was tried for his support of Copernicanism, "theocrats" had nothing to do with it. In fact, Galileo's prosecution was engineered by his fellow scientists who supported the Ptolemaic cosmology (i.e. geocentrism). The pope initially sided with Galileo, but was eventually convinced, through several underhanded means, that Galileo's advocacy represented a POLITICAL (not theological) threat to the Church.

40 posted on 08/24/2009 8:32:21 PM PDT by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (We bury Democrats face down so that when they scratch, they get closer to home.)
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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus
While it's true that Galileo was tried for his support of Copernicanism, "theocrats" had nothing to do with it.

for the past 20 years I have been hearing various reasons Galileo was tried ranging from philosophical/theological beliefs about interpreting Aristotelian logic to political intrigue intertwined with the Church, but supposedly not on theological grounds. Maybe, but the Church still used their power to try him. For all the charity they professed in the name of Christ, they had little for Galileo.

41 posted on 08/24/2009 9:13:46 PM PDT by LoneRangerMassachusetts
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To: GodGunsGuts

Thanks for the ping!


42 posted on 08/24/2009 9:17:22 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: GodGunsGuts; count-your-change; SeekAndFind; Jaime2099

Thus, Evolutionist rhetoric, juxtaposed against the facts of science and history demonstrates that they are totally incompetent, in addition to being angry and dangerous. In a truly sane society, e.g., the one to be run by God, evolutionists, at a minimum, would not be allowed to vote.”

Clearly then, “evolutionists should not be allowed to roam free in the land.” All that remains for us to discuss is “What should be done with evolutionists?” For the purposes of this essay, I will ignore the minor issue of Western-style jurisprudenceand merely mention possible solutions to the

“evolutionism problem,” leaving the legal details to others:

· Labor camps. Their fellow believers were high on these. But, my position would be that most of them have lived their lives at, or near the public trough. So, after their own beliefs, their life should continue only as long as they can support themselves in the camps.

· Require them to wear placards around their neck, or perhaps large medallions which prominently announce “Warning: Evolutionist! Mentally Incompetent – Potentially Dangerous.” I consider this option too dangerous.

· Since evolutionists are liars and most do not really believe evolution we could employ truth serum or water-boarding to obtain confessions of evolution rejection. But, this should, at most, result in parole, because, like Muslims, evolutionist religion permits them to lie if there is any benefit to them.

· An Evolutionist Colony in Antarctica could be a promising option. Of course inspections would be required to prevent too much progress. They might invent gunpowder.

· A colony on Mars would prevent gunpowder from harming anyone but their own kind, in the unlikely event they turned out to be intelligent enough to invent it.

· All options should include 24-hour sound system playing Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, and Sam Harris reading Darwin’s Origin of Species, or the preservation of Favored Races by Means of Natural Selection. Of course some will consider this cruel & unusual, especially since they will undoubtedly have that treatment for eternity. ~ Tom Willis, Creation Science for Mid America.

http://homoeconomicusnet.wordpress.com/2008/08/24/tom-willis-should-evolutionists-be-allowed-to-roam-free-in-the-land/

Matthew 7:3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?


43 posted on 08/24/2009 9:22:06 PM PDT by Ira_Louvin (Go tell them people lost in sin, They need not fear the works of men.)
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To: Ira_Louvin
If you would like to direct your admonition to the offender, here (from their web site) is where they meet:

CSA meets monthly at the Westbrooke Church, 9898 West 95th, Overland Park, KS.

44 posted on 08/24/2009 10:06:19 PM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change

As a Christian why have you not called out these outrageous comments made on behalf of all creationist?

By your silence I can only assume that you agree with his position.


45 posted on 08/24/2009 10:21:09 PM PDT by Ira_Louvin (Go tell them people lost in sin, They need not fear the works of men.)
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To: Ira_Louvin
If you mean this Willis guy, there is so much garbage on the internet, why would I know or care what every person says on their website? You provided a link that lead to their home page but that is the first and last I heard of him.

If you wish to slap wrists, at least go to the right wrists. So have you written or called or faxed them to protest their outrageous statements? If not, doesn't that mean you agree?
And my neighbor does hard drugs, but I haven't protested to him so will you also assume I agree with his practices? And then there's a butcher I know who says he's communist......

You see my point, I trust.

46 posted on 08/24/2009 10:36:45 PM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Richard Dawkins is man speaking well out his level of his expertise. He is not a trained physicist nor is he trained in any serious form of hard biology.


47 posted on 08/24/2009 10:42:40 PM PDT by Minus_The_Bear
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To: Minus_The_Bear

You are mistaken my friend…………

Richard Dawkins is an evolutionary biologist, author and outspoken atheist. He has established himself as a biological guru with the publication of books detailing and expanding upon Darwinian theory……… University of California, Berkeley, assistant professor of zoology, 1967-69; Oxford University, Oxford, England, lecturer in zoology and fellow of New College, 1970-90, reader in zoology, 1990-95; Evolutionary biologist and the Charles Simonyi Professor For The Understanding Of Science at Oxford University; Elected as a Fellow of the Royal Society in May, 2001

http://www.richarddawkins.com/


48 posted on 08/24/2009 11:03:22 PM PDT by Ira_Louvin (Go tell them people lost in sin, They need not fear the works of men.)
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To: count-your-change

So you do not agree with Mr. Willis comments?

You are now aware or Mr. Willis and his outrageous comments is it not your duty as a Christian to rebuke your brother in Christ, or do you just have a problem with hate speech when it is directed at you?


49 posted on 08/24/2009 11:05:06 PM PDT by Ira_Louvin (Go tell them people lost in sin, They need not fear the works of men.)
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To: Ira_Louvin

I am aware of Dawkins. I am not a big fan of people taking a few classes in soft sciences calling themselves a “scientist.”


50 posted on 08/24/2009 11:17:15 PM PDT by Minus_The_Bear
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