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Suspected flag burner pilloried
timesunion.com ^ | Sept. 26, 2009 | BOB GARDINIER AND HUMBERTO MARTÍNEZ

Posted on 09/26/2009 10:12:55 AM PDT by Free ThinkerNY

VALLEY FALLS -- The young man was given three choices: get turned over to the police, go one-on-one in a fight with a seasoned war veteran, or be duct-taped to a flagpole for six hours with a sign around his neck identifying his alleged crime: flag burning.

It was the third option that would still have the small town buzzing a week after a 21-year-old was hunted down and forced to endure a public humiliation with its roots dating to the Middle Ages. Members of the Veterans of Foreign Wars Post 1938 were incensed enough to tie up the man last Sunday after they accused him of setting the flag in front of their building on fire.

Post Commander Nick Normile, a Vietnam War veteran, said the man came into the post's bar Sept. 18 on Poplar Avenue and was eventually turned away for not having a proper ID.

Apparently angered, the young man, who Normile did not want to name, cut the rope of the American flag flying overhead and used a cigarette lighter to set it on fire, Normile and others said.

The man sat pilloried as the village had its fall youth soccer picnic with a long parade of children passing in front of him.

"He'll never disrespect the flag again, I can tell you that," Normile said.

(Excerpt) Read more at timesunion.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: fightingwords; flagburning; happyending; traitor; vietnamvets
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1 posted on 09/26/2009 10:12:55 AM PDT by Free ThinkerNY
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Excellent!


2 posted on 09/26/2009 10:15:37 AM PDT by roaddog727 (It's the Constitution, Stupid!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Right Wing Extremists Assault Young Man.

Violated his Civil Rights. Holder is on it.

3 posted on 09/26/2009 10:16:13 AM PDT by Candor7 (The effective weapons against Fascism are ridicule, derision, and truth (Member NRA)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

humiliation doesn’t change anyone anymore — because it requires humility to be effective, and that’s in short supply these days. It’ll probably turn him into a shoe bomber.


4 posted on 09/26/2009 10:16:18 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (dear world: we are so sorry for Barack Hussein Obama. Can you ever forgive us? ** hang the Czars.)
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To: roaddog727

Pointless and stupid.


5 posted on 09/26/2009 10:17:49 AM PDT by dr_who
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To: Free ThinkerNY
I like it! But instead of a choice, he should have had all 3 done to him!

On a similar note: I am afraid that vigilantism will become the law of the land soon, because the laws now give no justice. Had this perp been turned over to the constables, the ACLU would have been there in a heartbeat to "preserve his right to free expression" and the leftists would have carried him out of the jail on their shoulders.

Calm down Dubh! You're getting your BP up again....

6 posted on 09/26/2009 10:18:28 AM PDT by Dubh_Ghlase (Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for thee.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

No doubt some will laud this, but I find it despicable.


7 posted on 09/26/2009 10:19:14 AM PDT by Melas
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To: Free ThinkerNY

My Dad got one up in Columbus, Ohio in the sixties while I was away. Broad daylight, smacks the crap out of a guy desecrating a flag in an anti-war protest and leaves. We need more folks that remember what that flag represents!


8 posted on 09/26/2009 10:21:52 AM PDT by Big_Harry ( Thank God I am an "Infidel"!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Let the punishment fit the crime ...

I think it’s a good approach to let the perp choose his punishment.


9 posted on 09/26/2009 10:23:18 AM PDT by OldNavyVet
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To: Dubh_Ghlase

“I am afraid that vigilantism will become the law of the land soon”

I agree. How many people have confidence in our justice system? Not many, I think. It’s seeming more like the wild west all the time.


10 posted on 09/26/2009 10:23:18 AM PDT by ElayneJ
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To: Dubh_Ghlase
"I like it! But instead of a choice, he should have had all 3 done to him!"

A fourth choice of being wrapped in the flag and set on fire would have been my suggestion.....

11 posted on 09/26/2009 10:24:16 AM PDT by sniper63 (Silent and stealthy - one shot - one kill)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Stocks and Pillories...huzzah!


12 posted on 09/26/2009 10:24:20 AM PDT by Don Corleone ("Oil the gun..eat the cannolis. Take it to the Mattress.")
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To: Melas

Hey, it was his choice.


13 posted on 09/26/2009 10:25:12 AM PDT by Ladysmith ("A community organizer can't bitch when communities organize." Rush Limbaugh)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Apparently angered, the young man, who Normile did not want to name, cut the rope of the American flag flying overhead and used a cigarette lighter to set it on fire

Should have been prosecuted for burning (arson), theft (taking hold of someone else's property), nusiance (sp?) by creating greenhouse gases, etc., etc.

Myself, I wish we'd have a law that burning a U.S. flag is not only
a matter of "political speech", but also "fighting words".

And that a swift a$$-kicking is a legal response to those fighting words.
14 posted on 09/26/2009 10:25:23 AM PDT by VOA
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To: ElayneJ

“It’s seeming more like the wild west all the time.”

Which had a much lower crime rate than today.


15 posted on 09/26/2009 10:25:51 AM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: dr_who

IMOH it is neither pointless nor stupid. I majored criminology in college and there is a long history in the use and success of public shaming in behavior modification.


16 posted on 09/26/2009 10:27:01 AM PDT by joesjane (The strength of the pack is the wolf - Rudyard Kipling)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Righteous!


17 posted on 09/26/2009 10:28:39 AM PDT by radiohead (Buy ammo, get your kids out of government schools, pray for the Republic.)
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To: Ladysmith

Technically, the choice itself was criminal extortion by threat of violence. So, no, not buying. The problem with vigilantism is that it begets retribution. At this point since the police are obviously in on it, who could blame a family member of this kid for going vigilante on the vigilantes which of course would beget retaliation in kind...


18 posted on 09/26/2009 10:28:47 AM PDT by Melas
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Is there a reason that we don’t just make the flag out of fire resistant materials?


19 posted on 09/26/2009 10:29:38 AM PDT by Grunthor (Gun toting, Bible thumping Flag waver. According to the left, I am a racist.)
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To: VOA
And that a swift a$$-kicking is a legal response to those fighting words.

Exactly!

20 posted on 09/26/2009 10:29:53 AM PDT by NonValueAdded ("The President has borrowed more money to spend to less effect than anybody on the planet. " Steyn)
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To: Melas

yes, despicable vigilantism


21 posted on 09/26/2009 10:30:00 AM PDT by beefree
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To: Grunthor

That is entirely up to the manufacturer.


22 posted on 09/26/2009 10:31:13 AM PDT by Melas
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To: ElayneJ
Agreed. It takes no psychic to see when someone with "friends in high places" gets a walk, where a normal joe (like myself) would have the book thrown at them. Look at how the dems in MA change the rules on the fly, depending on the party in power in the governors office (MA Senate appointment or election).

Pissed off? U-Betcha!

23 posted on 09/26/2009 10:31:46 AM PDT by Dubh_Ghlase (Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for thee.)
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To: ElayneJ
It’s seeming more like the wild west all the time.

You're thinking about the wild west as portrayed in the movies.

In the real west, a man's word was his bond, women were respected and if you could work you worked or died. Your country was sacrosanct and neighbors were neighbors. Everyone carried a gun and there was less crime per capita than in Boston or New York City.

The west was not settled by a bunch of brie eating Chablis drinking Long Island liberals.

24 posted on 09/26/2009 10:32:11 AM PDT by Don Corleone ("Oil the gun..eat the cannolis. Take it to the Mattress.")
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To: ElayneJ

Yes, “Law & Order” is just the name of a TV show. Decent people will need to be prepared to defend themselves and their homes and property all on their own. And probably sooner rather than later. It is indescribably sad that we have come to this, but it is fact. It is a long struggle back, if we can make it at all.


25 posted on 09/26/2009 10:32:34 AM PDT by Emmett McCarthy
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To: Rebelbase

Which is why shooting a perp during the commission of a crime should be grounds for a reward, not persecution...


26 posted on 09/26/2009 10:34:01 AM PDT by Dubh_Ghlase (Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for thee.)
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To: dr_who

Neither.


27 posted on 09/26/2009 10:36:14 AM PDT by roaddog727 (It's the Constitution, Stupid!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Did passer’s by call him a p**** for not choosing option 2? I would have been unable to resist that.


28 posted on 09/26/2009 10:36:23 AM PDT by sportutegrl (If liberals could do math, they would be conservatives.)
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To: ElayneJ
I agree. How many people have confidence in our justice system?

True. All you have to do is watch "Cold Case Files" or "Forensic Files". I respect the sometimes superhuman efforts of the lab techs and officers but when the latter say that "justice" was served when a killer, nailed by strong DNA and forensic evidence, plea bargains a death sentence down to a "Life" (sometimes WITH parole) I have to wonder.

29 posted on 09/26/2009 10:36:35 AM PDT by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Rather than prosecuting the young man and giving him a permanent criminal record, they offered a reasonable solution which served everyone’s purpose. Very wise.

This is NOT vigilantism. This is settling a property destruction dispute between the parties. Absolutely nothing wrong with that, legally or morally.


30 posted on 09/26/2009 10:36:48 AM PDT by Cincinnatus
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To: Melas

He could have easily say “call the police.” He didn’t.


31 posted on 09/26/2009 10:37:35 AM PDT by Ladysmith ("A community organizer can't bitch when communities organize." Rush Limbaugh)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Duct tape. Is there anything it can’t do?
32 posted on 09/26/2009 10:40:36 AM PDT by RichInOC (No! BAD Rich! (What'd I say?))
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To: dr_who
It is not pointless nor stupid, I would assign the latter to you due to your comment. The guy broke the law, not because he burned the flag, we all know the government thinks it is just hunky dory to burn the US flag. He broke the law because he burned property he didn't own. That is stealing and destruction of private property, two laws broken, three actually if you count vandalism. He is lucky he only spent six hours duct taped up.

In my area, burning someone's flag is a good way to wind up in the hospital after being beaten by unknown assailants.

33 posted on 09/26/2009 10:42:57 AM PDT by celestron71
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To: joesjane

Bullshit. This is the sort of thuggish behavior we accuse the other side of. Flag burning isn’t illegal, and attempts to make it illegal just alienate people who might otherwise be sympathetic to the people who hate the little shits who burn our flag.


34 posted on 09/26/2009 10:43:51 AM PDT by dr_who
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To: Melas
...but I find it despicable.

Why?

35 posted on 09/26/2009 10:44:14 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Fantastic.


36 posted on 09/26/2009 10:45:01 AM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: celestron71

“Unknown assailants” are cowards.


37 posted on 09/26/2009 10:46:59 AM PDT by dr_who
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To: dr_who

It’s not illegal to burn someone else’s flag?


38 posted on 09/26/2009 10:47:01 AM PDT by nufsed (Release the birth certificate, passport, and school records.)
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To: VOA; RaceBannon
We were at a FReep in Boston, against ANSWER, with RaceBannon and a bunch of Mass FReepers. Race, who is a rather large dude, turns to this Boston Cop and says, "I they burn a flag will you arrest me before or after I beat the Sh*t out of him."

The cop just chogied down the road, working on the see no evil principle I guess.

39 posted on 09/26/2009 10:48:06 AM PDT by Little Bill (Carol Che-Porter is a MOONBAT.)
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To: Melas
but I find it despicable

Be more clear, what was despicable, the fact he was given a choice, or the fact he chose not to go through the legal process?

40 posted on 09/26/2009 10:48:21 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (If America falls, darkness will cover the face of the earth for a thousand years.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

41 posted on 09/26/2009 10:48:46 AM PDT by rawhide
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To: nufsed

That’s called vandalism, nothing more. Do you beat up vandals, or do you press criminal charges against them? How about you, do you believe in the rule of law?


42 posted on 09/26/2009 10:50:57 AM PDT by dr_who
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To: dr_who

“Flag burning isn’t illegal”

If you own the flag in question,,no it is not illegal. But he burned a flag that belonged to them,,therefore, it’s illegal as hell. They offered him a chance to siimply be arrested by the police for his crime, or take an alternate punshment they liked.

It was illegal, and they settled on a contract in lieu of prosecution. Simple.


43 posted on 09/26/2009 10:51:56 AM PDT by DesertRhino (Dogs earn the title of "man's best friend", Muslims hate dogs,,add that up.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Hahaha, too funny.


44 posted on 09/26/2009 10:54:21 AM PDT by Hexenhammer
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Burning this flag was a criminal act of vandalism by the perp. It was not political speech.

Burning the flag is a form of political speech protected by the First Amendment.

The flag is sacred to me and to many others,but it is within’s a person’s right to burn the flag of his country to protest his own government.

The First Amendment does not protect against @ss-whopping that might occur after the flag is torched.


45 posted on 09/26/2009 10:57:05 AM PDT by exit82 (Sarah Palin is President No. 45. Get behind her, GOP, or get out of the way.)
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To: dr_who

dr, it was not his flag to burn! The flag was someone else’s
property. You just can’t go around mucking up another persons stuff. He got what he deserved.


46 posted on 09/26/2009 10:59:11 AM PDT by davetex (If it's in stock, we've got it.)
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To: dr_who

Calm yourself, I was simply commenting on the use of public shaming, jeeze.


47 posted on 09/26/2009 10:59:46 AM PDT by joesjane (The strength of the pack is the wolf - Rudyard Kipling)
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To: Grunthor; Melas
> Is there a reason that we don’t just make the flag out of fire resistant materials?

Because the proper, approved, method for disposing of an American Flag which has become unserviceable (unsuitable for display) due to damage, wear, etc. is to burn it, in a proper ceremony with respect.

Not like this sh!thead in the story did, of course.

Google it, or check the American Legion site, or any of a number of sites dedicated to proper care and display of Old Glory.

US Flag Code, TITLE 4 > CHAPTER 1 > Sec. 8(k) states:

"The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning"


48 posted on 09/26/2009 10:59:47 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: Melas
+No doubt some will laud this, but I find it despicable.

Why?

49 posted on 09/26/2009 11:01:04 AM PDT by LoneRangerMassachusetts
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To: DesertRhino

I don’t think you get it. Self-righteousness over a $40 flag, probably made in China, is not a sane reason to get into fisticuffs with anybody.


50 posted on 09/26/2009 11:01:34 AM PDT by dr_who
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