Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

New World Trade Center's Chinese Glass Is Adding to Trade Furor
The Washington Post ^ | 10 Oct 2009 | Peter Whoriskey

Posted on 10/11/2009 9:37:58 AM PDT by BGHater

The new World Trade Center, now under construction, is often considered a symbol of American enterprise. But to some union members and U.S. businesses, it represents what's wrong with the nation's economy.

The contract to manufacture the blast-resistant glass wrapping the main tower's first 20 stories was awarded earlier this year to a Chinese firm that underbid U.S. competitors.

Now the trade tensions between the United States and China that have arisen recently over tires, steel and paper are spreading to glass.

"This new tower is going to be made out of subsidized Chinese glass, putting factory workers out of their jobs in America," said Scott Paul, director of the Alliance for American Manufacturing, a partnership of the United Steelworkers and some manufacturers.

On Thursday, the Alliance sent a letter to U.S. trade officials asking that they address what they see as unfair trade practices. Specifically, the group says that the Chinese government spends billions of dollars subsidizing the glass industry's energy costs.

"Our domestic glass industry is the most efficient in the world, but it cannot compete against production that is heavily subsidized by the Chinese government," according to the letter. "As a result, glass production in the U.S. has suffered in recent years, with plant closings and thousands of lost jobs throughout the country."

U.S. Trade Representative Ron Kirk and Commerce Secretary Gary Locke are slated for trade meetings in Hangzhou, China, later this month.

A Chinese spokesman on trade issues did not respond to requests for comment.

The U.S. glass industry has lost more than 40,000 jobs since 2000, according to Department of Labor figures, even as the Chinese glass industry has experienced explosive growth. Between 2000 and 2008, U.S. imports of Chinese glass have tripled.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Foreign Affairs; US: New York
KEYWORDS: bhochina; bhotrade; china; communist; economy; freedomtower; glass; onewtc; trade; worldtradecenter; wtc
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-77 next last

1 posted on 10/11/2009 9:37:59 AM PDT by BGHater
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: pissant

.


2 posted on 10/11/2009 9:38:35 AM PDT by BGHater ("real price of every thing ... is the toil and trouble of acquiring it")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

Buy American! Jobs for Americans!


3 posted on 10/11/2009 9:39:10 AM PDT by Wiz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Wiz

That phrase carries with it an exclusion for me: Non-Union American Made.


4 posted on 10/11/2009 9:40:47 AM PDT by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

Does America make anything anymore, besides financial bubbles, hot air and hype?


5 posted on 10/11/2009 9:41:00 AM PDT by quesney
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

To rebuild on THAT SITE, it should be a NO BRAINER that SUPPLIERS and LABOR be USA companies ONLY!


6 posted on 10/11/2009 9:41:44 AM PDT by RebelTXRose
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: quesney
Yes, but because we are so efficient, we don't require as many 'jobs' to do it.

The U.S.A. Is Still the World's Largest Manufacturer

7 posted on 10/11/2009 9:43:49 AM PDT by BGHater ("real price of every thing ... is the toil and trouble of acquiring it")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
The new World Trade Center, now under construction, is often considered a symbol of American enterprise.

i.e. bogged down for 8 years by idiot lawyers, politicians, and unions.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

The Empire State Building was constructed in 410 days, start to finish. What will it take to get America moving again?

8 posted on 10/11/2009 9:45:29 AM PDT by bornred
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
The new World Trade Center, now under construction, is often considered a symbol of American enterprise

It's taken years to get going, having been hung up in politics and bureaucracy, and now it's dependent on glass from communist china. Yep, I'd say that about sums up "American enterprise" in the age of Obama. At least he didn't nationalize the glass factories.

9 posted on 10/11/2009 9:45:35 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard (Truth--The liberal's Kryptonite)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: RebelTXRose
In that case, wouldn't it need to be renamed from the "World Trade Center" to something like the "American Made Center"? Little Joke
10 posted on 10/11/2009 9:46:29 AM PDT by eclecticEel (The Most High rules in the kingdom of men ... and sets over it the basest of men.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: bornred

great minds, etc...


11 posted on 10/11/2009 9:46:30 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard (Truth--The liberal's Kryptonite)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: RebelTXRose
To rebuild on THAT SITE, it should be a NO BRAINER that SUPPLIERS and LABOR be USA companies ONLY!

It is being built on a different site. The memorial is being built on the original site.

12 posted on 10/11/2009 9:47:22 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (Too many conservatives urge retreat when the war of politics doesn't go their way.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
That phrase carries with it an exclusion for me: Non-Union American Made.

Please. Like even a non-union worker in the states works for 36 cents an hour / no benefits / no pollution control / no OSHA / lives in the factory.

Not even a non-union shop can compete with the BS working conditions in China.
13 posted on 10/11/2009 9:49:48 AM PDT by mysterio
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: bornred

Yeah, your right. I’m still in awe at how fast they built The Pentagon.


14 posted on 10/11/2009 9:51:32 AM PDT by BGHater ("real price of every thing ... is the toil and trouble of acquiring it")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: mysterio

I agree, but the non-union exemption still holds. I’ll support unions when you can tell me where Jimmy Hoffa is buried.


15 posted on 10/11/2009 9:51:38 AM PDT by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
We made the samples for our bid (PPG) here in Carlisle, PA.
Our product was far superior. Prices were similar contrary to what is reported.
16 posted on 10/11/2009 9:53:19 AM PDT by AGreatPer (Impeach Obama)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
I live in a small town, and we've lost at least four non-union plants in the past five years.

Unions have very little to do with it these days.
17 posted on 10/11/2009 9:55:33 AM PDT by mysterio
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: mysterio

I support non-union manufacturing - will buy from them before anyone else. Regardless, I’ll bet you a dollar to a dime, this glass thing with the new tower(s) is union prompted. In which case, they can suck it.


18 posted on 10/11/2009 9:57:00 AM PDT by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: AGreatPer

“We made the samples for our bid (PPG) here in Carlisle, PA. Our product was far superior. Prices were similar contrary to what is reported.”

What a shame that your company didn’t get the contract. I think about the great pride your company and the members of your community would have long had when seeing the final product built and inhabited.

It is possible that this will play out many, many times in the future, in view of the fact that China is now our banker and that fact carries with it enormous power.

When all is said and done, it would be interesting to find out if the final payments made for the glass really do tally up to less than what your company bid. I doubt it will be less, but no one will ever be able to really find out.


19 posted on 10/11/2009 9:58:36 AM PDT by Happyinmygarden (Yes, actually, I have pretty much seen and heard it all before...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
I’ll support unions when you can tell me where Jimmy Hoffa is buried.

I heard he left the business and went into another line work, concrete. He's mostly in overpasses and on-ramps.
20 posted on 10/11/2009 9:59:20 AM PDT by BikerJoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

When did FR become a bastion of protectionism?

Get the best quality materials for the best price. If you think you can avoid materials from overseas, you aren’t living in the 21st Century.

The world is a big integrated market today. Protectionism is just jingoism extended to economics.


21 posted on 10/11/2009 10:06:24 AM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BikerJoe

>>I heard he left the business and went into another line work, concrete. He’s mostly in overpasses and on-ramps.<<

I thought he was in stadiums...


22 posted on 10/11/2009 10:07:11 AM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

NY State and NY City are the most over-regulated, expensive and business un-friendly places in the USA. The State has been run by progressively left-wing Democrats for the last 50 years, and we have paid for it. A declining and rapidly aging population, a loss of most of the manufacturing base, a state-budget totally reliant on Wall Street deficits as far as the eye can see.

It’s a miracle that after 8 years, anything at all is getting built on Ground Zero.

Go ahead and add another regulation, this time about glass for buildings - and watch even more jobs and people dissappear from what is the new Eastern Bloc.


23 posted on 10/11/2009 10:13:39 AM PDT by PGR88
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003
The world is a big integrated market today. Protectionism is just jingoism extended to economics.

Fine, then some questions need answered:

1) Do we have a national interest in maintaining an independent capability for ANYTHING? (I say yes, 'cause I don't think we can trust 'em, and I don't see much evidence that our importing companies or government is doing much to ensure quality or safety.)

2) Are we to become just another group of 300 million consumers who sell stuff to each other, maybe do some marketing, etc.? Might as well close down our patent office, 'cause WE won't be inventing anything anymore.

3) A big integrated market does NOT equal FAIR trade (as opposed to Free trade). As someone else pointed out, how do we compete against almost slave labor and minimal regulation?
24 posted on 10/11/2009 10:27:16 AM PDT by BikerJoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003

I haven’t seen anyone advocating the protectionism that China enjoys.


25 posted on 10/11/2009 10:27:49 AM PDT by BykrBayb (Somewhere, my flower is there. ~ Þ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: BikerJoe
1) Do we have a national interest in maintaining an independent capability for ANYTHING? (I say yes, 'cause I don't think we can trust 'em, and I don't see much evidence that our importing companies or government is doing much to ensure quality or safety.)

What do you propose?

2) Are we to become just another group of 300 million consumers who sell stuff to each other, maybe do some marketing, etc.? Might as well close down our patent office, 'cause WE won't be inventing anything anymore.

Got hyperbole? The US is still the #1 manufacturer in the world. And you conflate invention with manufacturing.

3) A big integrated market does NOT equal FAIR trade (as opposed to Free trade). As someone else pointed out, how do we compete against almost slave labor and minimal regulation?

Who said life is fair? And, whether you like it or not, the world is a big integrated market and all the kvetching in the world won't change that. Smart people learn to leverage the situation as it is to their advantage. Many smaller operations exist only because they can afford to manufacture their product overseas -- it would be impossible in the USA.

What do you propose to end this evil worldwide economy?

26 posted on 10/11/2009 10:33:35 AM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
If this puts unions out of work then I am all for it. Let them enjoy their hope and change.

Anyone who loves this country will buy Chinese, or from any other non-union supplier, then give any union any discretionary funds.

27 posted on 10/11/2009 10:35:49 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: bornred
i.e. bogged down for 8 years by idiot lawyers, politicians, and unions.

No kidding, and it took 7 years to build both of the original towers. It never ceases to amaze me how useless to society most lawyers, all politicians and all unions are. They have done nothing but hold the USA back.

28 posted on 10/11/2009 10:38:29 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
Obama promised to save jobs, he just didn't mention it was Chinese jobs.
29 posted on 10/11/2009 10:41:12 AM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama lied, the economy died)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

What a stupid thing to do.


30 posted on 10/11/2009 10:48:50 AM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BGHater
Weapon of choice for trade warriors:


31 posted on 10/11/2009 10:51:55 AM PDT by USFRIENDINVICTORIA
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003
1) Do we have a national interest in maintaining an independent capability for ANYTHING? (I say yes, 'cause I don't think we can trust 'em, and I don't see much evidence that our importing companies or government is doing much to ensure quality or safety.)

What do you propose?


As to the independent capability, I don't know what the answer is. If we subsidize it, it's inefficient and backward. Competition would be needed. I didn't say I had the answer, but my eyes are open enough to know that a problem exists.

Smart people learn to leverage the situation as it is to their advantage. Many smaller operations exist only because they can afford to manufacture their product overseas -- it would be impossible in the USA.

They're short-term smart, but long term, they may find the domestic market disappear because no-one can afford their product. And I hope the small operation getting things manufactured overseas have the intellectual property locked up and are testing everything here. It would be double-bad if the overseas manufacturer starts copying the thing and selling it everywhere but here (which is why the Germans are quietly pulling out of China) or the products start killing people (oh, we thought you'd LIKE the melamine we put in it...)

Tariffs financed the Federal Government for more than half our history. Maybe it's time to try again. ...and don't bring up Smoot-Hawley, their are just as many studies that show it DIDN'T have an effect on the depression.
32 posted on 10/11/2009 10:53:16 AM PDT by BikerJoe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

It’s not the jobs, it’s the experience we are losing.
That knowledge gained from years on the job will be lost.
Even if new jobs were somehow created, the people who
fill them will be inexperienced.
We are allowing our industry to be destroyed in a stealth
trade war. When real war comes, as it most certainly will,
we will be without the means of production needed to
secure our own defense.


33 posted on 10/11/2009 10:57:49 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003
Protectionism is just jingoism extended to economics

Good. "Jingoism" was a derisive term invented by a 19th century Secular Atheist who promoted neo-Socialism against the interests of the British nation. In other words, a Leftist radical.

And you're one too, spud.

34 posted on 10/11/2009 11:17:51 AM PDT by Regulator (Welcome to Zimbabwe! Now hand over your property....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Regulator

>>And you’re one too, spud.<<

Hey, you can be a protectionist all you want — who are they? How about UNION members.

So, spudlet, you are a Union-supporter, which makes you way to the left af anyone who understands global economics.


35 posted on 10/11/2009 11:21:10 AM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

This article is written by Peter Whoriskey?

Where’s the pun squad?


36 posted on 10/11/2009 11:22:17 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003
anyone who understands global economics

Uh-huh. Like yourself, right?

You got it all covered. The Hubris of the Liberal.

Be movin' to Shanghai real soon? I'm sure they'll just luv ya there. Maybe the mindset there would suit you better there, but I hate to tell ya....the Chinese are really racist, and if you happen to be non-Chinese, you won't get far at all.

Take lots of little green pieces of paper, maybe you can buy some "friends".

37 posted on 10/11/2009 11:41:43 AM PDT by Regulator (Welcome to Zimbabwe! Now hand over your property....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

That’s like telling a guy who was just robbed of $1 trillion dollars, that he should shut up because he still has $1 trillion left.

Yes, there’s still manufacturing in the United States. And of course the nation would be terrible damaged by doing most of our manufacturing here, right?

Running $0.8 trillion dollars worth of trade deficits isn’t a problem at all, and who needs tens of trillions in multiplier effect dollars bouncing around in our thriving economy today? Right?

I literally hate clueless free-traitor bastards.


38 posted on 10/11/2009 12:44:49 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (Deficit spending, trade deficits, unsecure mortages, worthless paper... ... not a problem. Oh yeah?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003
Get the best quality materials for the best price.

Absolutely. But when you look at the price, remember to consider the hidden costs. If you buy from someone local, they are more likely than someone remote to take some of that money and turn around and buy your product, so the local product might be a little bit better deal than it looks. I'm absolutely NOT saying always buy American, but consider more than just the price on the invoice in your purchasing decisions.

39 posted on 10/11/2009 1:04:47 PM PDT by Darth Reardon
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003

When the next big war comes, and we can’t get foreign-supplied gas or oil spare parts for our foreign-made aircraft and weapons, and our foreign-grown food supplies are cut off, and our foreign-built and foreign-ported merchant ships won’t carry our troops, I hope someone is still around to remind you of your love for the big integrated world market.


40 posted on 10/11/2009 2:08:26 PM PDT by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: B-Chan

>>When the next big war comes, and we can’t get foreign-supplied gas or oil spare parts for our foreign-made aircraft and weapons, and our foreign-grown food supplies are cut off, and our foreign-built and foreign-ported merchant ships won’t carry our troops, I hope someone is still around to remind you of your love for the big integrated world market.<<

You “argue” like a liberal. I am not professing “love” of anything. I am acknowledging the reality. You can no more uncouple the current world marketplace than you can hold back a hurricane with your finger.

And your statement is, of course, wrong to 10 decimal places. The US is still the number one manufacturer in the world and could gear up in months if the world decided to go nuts like you suggest. But I am sure you will be safe in your shelter with secret passwords and 10 years of SPAM tins and beer to use as currency.

Pie in the sky dreaming and “oh me oh my” whining accomplishes exactly nothing.


41 posted on 10/11/2009 2:36:08 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

I have never bought an American car. No desire to, either. That doesn’t make me less patriotic or less American.


42 posted on 10/11/2009 2:38:18 PM PDT by Ted Grant
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Darth Reardon

>>Absolutely. But when you look at the price, remember to consider the hidden costs. If you buy from someone local, they are more likely than someone remote to take some of that money and turn around and buy your product, so the local product might be a little bit better deal than it looks. I’m absolutely NOT saying always buy American, but consider more than just the price on the invoice in your purchasing decisions.<<

So, when you buy groceries, you always make sure they are locally grown? That is a heck of an extra investment of research to buy some rutabagas.

I live in L.A. and work in VA — what is “local” to me? Who should I support? “Support the local economy” didn’t make sense in the 20th century and is naive at best and absurd at worst in the 21st.

Nice idea, but not practical.


43 posted on 10/11/2009 2:40:21 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Regulator

>>You got it all covered. The Hubris of the Liberal<<

“So’s your old lady” — if that is the best a “Conservative” can do, we are doomed.

Your lack of understanding of economics doth not make anyone else (much less me) a liberal.


44 posted on 10/11/2009 2:42:35 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Ted Grant

>>I have never bought an American car. No desire to, either. That doesn’t make me less patriotic or less American.<<

According to the 19th century denizens of this thread, it does. It also makes you a liberal (I know, a distinction without a difference).

Correct dogmatic thinking is all that is allowed. Do not mislead with facts and the like.


45 posted on 10/11/2009 2:44:42 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: BGHater

Snopes has something to say about Chinese-made pyrex glassware and it’s not good. Just FYI.

http://www.snopes.com/food/warnings/pyrex.asp


46 posted on 10/11/2009 2:53:17 PM PDT by IM2MAD
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Regulator

Good post
Looks like the the implosion of the US economy has taught these potato heads nothing. They were advocating free trade in the face of 750 billion dollar trade deficits at the bubbles peak....down to 350 billion these days
Debt to foreigners means nothing to them even after the collapse. The Chinse have an answer to such arrogance and it is dumping US dollars or what they are doing now which is boycotting Treasury auctions

Let Wall Street run wild w derivitives and run up huge trade deficit for decades and you will be left with a dogshit currency


47 posted on 10/11/2009 2:54:15 PM PDT by dennisw (Ir's not the Wheel, It's the Carousel)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: freedumb2003

You prefer 750 billion dollar trade deficits. You prefer the financial ruin this made along with the derivatives masters of Wall Street

To stop this train wreck I would have imposed tarriffs decades ago to protect American industry from Chinese and others. I would have freed up energy expoloration in the US and greatly curbed OSHA and the EPA


48 posted on 10/11/2009 2:58:48 PM PDT by dennisw (Ir's not the Wheel, It's the Carousel)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: bornred
The Empire State Building was constructed in 410 days, start to finish. What will it take to get America moving again?

Safety lines? We don't need no stinkin' safety lines!


49 posted on 10/11/2009 3:10:03 PM PDT by ColdWater
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: dennisw
You prefer 750 billion dollar trade deficits. You prefer the financial ruin this made along with the derivatives masters of Wall Street

Trade deficits can be overcome, but not the way you envision them. As far as financial ruin, that is at the feet of barney franks and the subprime real estate loan industry (a wholly-owned subsidiary of the democratic party). You better point to me which part of international commodities trade created this financial dip.

To stop this train wreck I would have imposed tarriffs decades ago to protect American industry from Chinese and others. I would have freed up energy expoloration in the US and greatly curbed OSHA and the EPA

So, you prefer expensive, very expensive, items? And of course, the multi-trillion export industry would shut down under your closed-door policies. The worldwide hyperinflation (and concomitant potential military tension) you are proposing may be OK for you, but I wouldn't want it.

As far as energy exploration and the like, I agree completely. What does that have to do with buying Chinese glass?

50 posted on 10/11/2009 3:10:17 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (Communism comes to America: 1/20/2009. Keep your powder dry, folks. Sic semper tyrannis)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-77 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson