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The problem with naturalism, the problem with empiricism
Journal of Creation ^ | Lael Weinberger

Posted on 10/23/2009 8:51:50 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts

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To: tacticalogic
Someone might have expressed that sentiment, but you can't attribute it to all of them.

Lots of them. http://www.yecheadquarters.org/oec.html

41 posted on 10/24/2009 11:58:56 AM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater; Alamo-Girl; GodGunsGuts; metmom
You have been on these threads for years and are not aware that YEC'ers consider anyone that does not accept their YEC philosophy to be non-Christians?

Actually, that thought never occurred to me. But if what you say is true, then all I can say is they would be wrong.

But such considerations aren't scientific, they are theological. Why do you dwell on them?

42 posted on 10/24/2009 12:01:12 PM PDT by betty boop (Without God man neither knows which way to go, nor even understands who he is. —Pope Benedict XVI)
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To: betty boop
But such considerations aren't scientific, they are theological. Why do you dwell on them?

I don't dwell on them. I was reponded to your posts that quoted the article that Christians welcomed the ID movement and which you said was most likely true.

43 posted on 10/24/2009 12:02:49 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
I was reponded to your posts that quoted the article that Christians welcomed the ID movement and which you said was most likely true.

But earlier you wrote, "Not that I know that you do NOT welcome the ID movement, I will not state otherwise...." How did you get from there to your positive assertion that I embrace the "movement" as "most likely true?"

What a muddle!

44 posted on 10/24/2009 12:07:38 PM PDT by betty boop (Without God man neither knows which way to go, nor even understands who he is. —Pope Benedict XVI)
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To: betty boop

I stated that I would not state that you supported the ID movement. Isn’t that your position?


45 posted on 10/24/2009 12:12:33 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
I stated that I would not state that you supported the ID movement. Isn’t that your position?

I support science, not "movements." Having said that, I think that ID's claim that certain phenomena in nature can best be explained in terms of an intelligent cause holds water (so to speak).

46 posted on 10/24/2009 12:16:45 PM PDT by betty boop (Without God man neither knows which way to go, nor even understands who he is. —Pope Benedict XVI)
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To: betty boop
How did you get from there to your positive assertion that I embrace the "movement" as "most likely true?" What a muddle!

Ah! I see the confusion. I was not saying that you said the ID movement was true. I was saying that you said the statement 'Christians embrace the ID movement' was most likely true.

47 posted on 10/24/2009 12:18:13 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: betty boop
intelligent cause

God?

48 posted on 10/24/2009 12:19:13 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
Lots of them. http://www.yecheadquarters.org/oec.html

The problem is, anybody can register a website, throw up some content, and claim to speak for others. That doesn't make it so. It's just a valid as representing Dawkins as speaking for everyone who's not a YEC.

49 posted on 10/24/2009 12:22:57 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic
The problem is, anybody can register a website, throw up some content, and claim to speak for others. That doesn't make it so.

Show some evidence to the otherwise, please.

50 posted on 10/24/2009 12:24:38 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: tacticalogic

Are you a YEC’er?


51 posted on 10/24/2009 12:25:20 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
It was several. Give me a YECer and we can ask him.

If they "give" you one that doesn't, they then get to claim that as evidence that none of them do.

52 posted on 10/24/2009 12:27:51 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic
If they "give" you one that doesn't, they then get to claim that as evidence that none of them do.

No problem. I said anyone except GGG.

53 posted on 10/24/2009 12:31:25 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
Show some evidence to the otherwise, please.

I've talked to people who believe in YEC, but aren't evangelical. The view those beliefs as personal, and not something they require of others as a prequisite for fellowship or civil discussion of scientific issues that intersect those beliefs. Some other, not so much.

54 posted on 10/24/2009 12:35:47 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: ColdWater

Nope.


55 posted on 10/24/2009 12:37:03 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic
I've talked to people who believe in YEC, but aren't evangelical. The view those beliefs as personal, and not something they require of others as a prequisite for fellowship or civil discussion of scientific issues that intersect those beliefs.

I have a BIL that is a YEC'er. He is a civil, socialble person but cannot even conceive that anyone that believes other than his beliefs is a real Christian.

56 posted on 10/24/2009 12:39:43 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater

I’m not a YECer, and I’m not an atheist, and I’m getting really tired of people trying to tell me I have to be one or the other, or that either one is my political persuasion.


57 posted on 10/24/2009 12:40:22 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

I posted before I looked at the name of the poster. I sometimes for get to look when I am going to and fro with another.


58 posted on 10/24/2009 12:41:43 PM PDT by ColdWater
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To: ColdWater
I have a BIL that is a YEC'er. He is a civil, socialble person but cannot even conceive that anyone that believes other than his beliefs is a real Christian.

I really don't have a problem with that. Now, if he's a scientist and implies that as a matter of academics and formal methodology that nobody who's not a YEC can be a real scientist, that's a different matter.

59 posted on 10/24/2009 12:44:12 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

I understand.


60 posted on 10/24/2009 12:44:22 PM PDT by ColdWater
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