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Rafi Eitan Admits Failure, Regrets on Pollard
INN ^ | 10/29/09 | Gil Ronen

Posted on 10/29/2009 12:25:07 PM PDT by Nachum

(IsraelNN.com) Former minister Rafi Eitan, who recruited Jonathan Pollard as a spy for Israel in the US, expressed regret over the espionage debacle in an interview on Channel 2.

"I admit the failure and I regret it,” he said.

In an interview to Maariv in 2008, Eitan said that the US intelligence services made a joint decision not to permit Pollard ever to be released until the end of his life. “The reason isn't Pollard. It's Israel... It's connected to the relationship system between the American intelligence services and the state of Israel.” Eitan went on to confirm that the US intelligence services were “taking revenge” on Israeli intelligence through Pollard.

(Excerpt) Read more at israelnationalnews.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel
KEYWORDS: admits; backstabber; benedictarnold; betrayal; deathpenaltycase; eitan; failure; hangpollarhigh; israelbs; lies; pollarchinasspy; pollard; pollardspiedforchina; pos; ratbastard; totalcrap; traitor; treason

1 posted on 10/29/2009 12:25:09 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum
...“taking revenge” on Israeli intelligence...?? The guy was spying. He was caught, given a fair trial and imprisoned. Were we supposed to give him a medal and a free, one-way ticket to Tel Aviv? Or what?
2 posted on 10/29/2009 12:31:45 PM PDT by La Lydia
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To: Nachum

Rafi Eitan may have his opinions about the U.S. taking it out on Pollard to “get even” with Israel, but Eitan (the guy who recruited Pollard to spy on the U.S. - that’s also called being a traitor) is living good as a govt official and allowed a fellow Jew to suffer. Eitan should have devised an escape plan for Pollard to leave the U.S. and, to placate any hurt American feelings, Pollard could serve time in one of those weekend off jails in Israel.

As for me, I’ve got no sympathy for Pollard.


3 posted on 10/29/2009 12:32:33 PM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: BertWheeler

Those secrets Pollard gave away eventually wound up in the hands of the ChiComs. He should have been shot.


4 posted on 10/29/2009 12:33:44 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

Tell me more about that.

Are you saying that Pollard was spying for Israel, but then Israel was selling these secrets to the Chinese?

Is that what you are saying?


5 posted on 10/29/2009 12:34:56 PM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: dfwgator

Considering the number of overseas agents that were “eliminated” because they were betrayed by this rat bastard - not to mention the all the stolen military secrets - shooting would have been too nice.


6 posted on 10/29/2009 12:38:52 PM PDT by canuck_conservative
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To: BertWheeler

To clarify, Pollard was also giving those secrets to the ChiComs, it’s not clear whether Israel was aware of this or not.

The point is, he just wasn’t spying for a “friendly nation”, he was also helping a real enemy.


7 posted on 10/29/2009 12:39:47 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: BertWheeler

Israel sells weapons to the Chinese, they reverse engineer. I don’t entirely blame Israel, we force them to defend themselves with one hand behind their back and they are trying to survive in a very hostile world. The ME question could be settled now if we had let Israel settle it.


8 posted on 10/29/2009 12:42:37 PM PDT by Republic of Texas (Socialism Always Fails)
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To: dfwgator
"Pollard was also giving those secrets to the ChiComs"

COuld you please point me to some sources on that?

9 posted on 10/29/2009 12:43:49 PM PDT by TopQuark
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To: Nachum

They should have traded Pollard for some Eastern bloc spy, like MI5 routinely used to do.

Ed


10 posted on 10/29/2009 12:44:24 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: canuck_conservative

Aren’t you thinking of Aldrich Ames?

Ed


11 posted on 10/29/2009 12:45:16 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: Republic of Texas

Israel spying on us and then selling that information to the Chinese is unrelated to our alleged lack of support to them in their war against their enemies in the ME.

You’re mixing apples and oranges.

I’m not taking sides, someone else mentioned that Israel spied on us and then sold that info to the Chinese.


12 posted on 10/29/2009 12:45:16 PM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: Nachum
What do the Israelis do when they find Americans spying on them in ways they don't like. Well, looking back at the USS Liberty it seems that Israel shoots Americans conducting intelligence missions against them.
13 posted on 10/29/2009 12:48:40 PM PDT by KarlInOhio (Soon everyone will win a Nobel Peace Prize for not being George Bush...well, except for George Bush.)
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To: Sir_Ed

“At the 1998 Wye River Conference, Benjamin Netanyahu demanded Pollard’s release, and President Clinton made a public statement about reviewing the case.[49] This precipitated an “incredulous” reaction in the American intelligence community.[53] Former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, as well as six other former U.S. Secretaries of Defense (Melvin R. Laird, Frank C. Carlucci, Richard B. Cheney, Caspar W. Weinberger, James R. Schlesinger and Elliot L. Richardson) spoke out in opposition to clemency for Jonathan Pollard.[28] They were joined by several senior congressional leaders.[28]

Four past directors of Naval Intelligence, William Studeman, Sumner Shapiro, John L. Butts, and Thomas Brooks, authored a response to the talk of clemency and what they termed “the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign... aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust into Pollard, committed Israeli patriot”.[54] They asserted that Pollard passed information to three other countries before engaging in espionage activity on behalf of Israel, and that he had offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel.[54] They continued,

“We... feel obligated to go on record with the facts regarding Pollard in order to dispel the myths that have arisen from this clever public relations campaign... aimed at transforming Pollard from greedy, arrogant betrayer of the American national trust in to Pollard, committed Israeli patriot”

“Pollard pleaded guilty and therefore never was publicly tried. Thus, the American people never came to know that he offered classified information to three other countries before working for the Israelis and that he offered his services to a fourth country while he was spying for Israel. They also never came to understand that he was being highly paid for his services....”

“Pollard and his apologists argue he turned over to the Israelis information they were being denied that was critical to their security. The fact is, however, Pollard had no way of knowing what the Israeli government was already receiving by way of official intelligence exchange agreements... Some of the data he compromised had nothing to do with Israeli security or even with the Middle East. He betrayed worldwide intelligence data, including sources and methods developed at significant cost to the U.S. taxpayer. As a result of his perfidy, some of those sources are lost forever.”

“...Another claim Pollard made is that the U.S. government reneged on its bargain not to seek the life sentence. What is not heard is that Pollard’s part of the bargain was to cooperate fully in an assessment of the damage he had done and to refrain from talking to the press prior to the completion of his sentencing. He blatantly and contemptuously failed to live up to either part of the plea agreement... It was this coupled with the magnitude and consequences of his criminal actions that resulted in the judge imposing a life sentence... The appellate court subsequently upheld the life sentence.”

“If, as Pollard and his supporters claim, he has “suffered enough” for his crimes, he is free to apply for parole as the American judicial system provides. In his arrogance, he has refused to do so, but insists on being granted clemency or a pardon.”

Admiral Shapiro, who was himself Jewish, stated that he was troubled by the support of Jewish organizations for Pollard: “We work so hard to establish ourselves and to get where we are, and to have somebody screw it up... and then to have Jewish organizations line up behind this guy and try to make him out a hero of the Jewish people, it bothers the hell out of me”.[9]

Eric Margolis alleges that Pollard’s spying may have led to the capture and execution of CIA spies in the Eastern Bloc after Israel sold or bartered Pollard’s information to the Soviet Union.”

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Pollard


14 posted on 10/29/2009 12:57:27 PM PDT by canuck_conservative
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To: KarlInOhio
What do the Israelis do when they find Americans spying on them in ways they don't like. Well, looking back at the USS Liberty it seems that Israel shoots Americans conducting intelligence missions against them.

What does any military do when they find foreign spy ships giving real time intelligence and troop movements during the middle of a shooting war. Looking back at WWII, they are generally blown out of the water.

Might be one reason LBJ wanted to hush things up.

15 posted on 10/29/2009 1:06:14 PM PDT by Nachum (The complete Obama list at www.nachumlist.com)
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To: canuck_conservative

Oh my GOD! I had no idea. Thank you very much for giving me this info. I always saw Pollard as a misguided patriot for Israel, not a craven, Walker/Ames type who caused deaths.

Thanks...

Ed


16 posted on 10/29/2009 1:06:22 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: BertWheeler

It is generally known that information that Israel collected from spies in the United States was routinely transmitted to the Soviet Union for Israel’s own purposes. It is also available in the open literature that the ChiComs were/are enamored with Israel’s technical abilities.

The information that Pollard transferred to Israel cost the United States millions of dollars and hundred of thousands of technical man hours to compensate for.

Pollard should be shown no mercy as he is a man that betrayed the sacred trust that this country entrusted him with.

The sad thing is that Israel learned no lesson and continues to spy on us as you read this post. (as do virtually every other major country in the world).


17 posted on 10/29/2009 1:09:31 PM PDT by Citizen Tom Paine
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To: BertWheeler

Spying on us was wrong, and Pollard should be in jail forever, if not executed. The Israeli’s however are trying to survive, without help in a world that wants them to go away. I’d do the same thing were I them.


18 posted on 10/29/2009 1:21:05 PM PDT by Republic of Texas (Socialism Always Fails)
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To: Republic of Texas

Israel has friends, let’s stop the “nobody likes me” charade.


19 posted on 10/29/2009 2:15:34 PM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: AdmSmith; Berosus; bigheadfred; Convert from ECUSA; dervish; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Fred Nerks; ...
In an interview to Maariv in 2008, Eitan said that the US intelligence services made a joint decision not to permit Pollard ever to be released until the end of his life. "The reason isn't Pollard. It's Israel... It's connected to the relationship system between the American intelligence services and the state of Israel." Eitan went on to confirm that the US intelligence services were "taking revenge" on Israeli intelligence through Pollard.

20 posted on 10/29/2009 5:57:36 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/__Since Jan 3, 2004__Profile updated Monday, January 12, 2009)
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To: BertWheeler

Really. Who are Israel’s “friends”?


21 posted on 10/29/2009 10:33:09 PM PDT by Republic of Texas (Socialism Always Fails)
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To: Republic of Texas

Your question is the problem.

Think about it for a while.

Asking a question like that in a derogatory manner is belittling to all of the people who have aided Israel over the years. It implies the “what’s in it for me” and combines it with the “What have you done in the last five minutes for me?”

You can take it to the bank that Israel’s diplomacy corps and officials in government aren’t as cavalier about the issue as you seem to be.


22 posted on 10/30/2009 7:29:04 AM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: Nachum

Then, if your story about the USS Liberty is true, why did both of our countries play such an insulting song and dance. The Israeli fighter jets shot out lifeboats and wanted to sink the Liberty - but failed.

Israel has indeed spied on us. Have we spied on them? I’m not sure. I don’t see why since we rarely rely on their technology.

Did the Israelis think the USS Liberty was a spy ship? If so, why not have one of the thousands of American Jewish diplomats and agents contact the White House directly?

Who shoots to kill their friends?


23 posted on 10/30/2009 7:39:20 AM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: BertWheeler
Then, if your story about the USS Liberty is true, why did both of our countries play such an insulting song and dance

IF it is true, and it is one of the stories that seem to make more sense than others to me, one can only guess who gave the orders to do it. The song and dance is obvious to me, because of the fallout to both sides if it were true.

Israel has indeed spied on us. Have we spied on them? I’m not sure. I don’t see why since we rarely rely on their technology.

The suggestion wasn't about stealing technology, it was applying military pressure. Perhaps there were those who wanted Israel's defense to stall in war to extract concessions. It would be a simple matter to relay troop movements from one spy ship. If Israel got wise, throw up the US colors, say that it's international waters and keep broadcasting to Egypt and Syria.

Did the Israelis think the USS Liberty was a spy ship? If so, why not have one of the thousands of American Jewish diplomats and agents contact the White House directly?

It is all speculation, isn't it? If your small country had one benefactor and even that benefactor had elements that wanted you dead, would you poke them in the eye? I think not. The Jews of Israel are terrified that they would be at the mercy of their enemies. The diplomats and agents would never publicly talk about something that would give power to those elements. It would be viewed as suicide.

Perhaps they weren't shooting to kill their friends, but to destroy the operations center in the middle of the ship along with the antennae on the top deck. Cripple its ability to betray their locations to the enemy and then claim it was a "mistake".

24 posted on 10/30/2009 9:09:42 AM PDT by Nachum (The complete Obama list at www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Nachum

Honestly, despite all the different theories (which makes for fun reading), I think the attack on the USS Liberty was a case of mistaken identity.


25 posted on 10/30/2009 10:38:44 AM PDT by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: BertWheeler

I sure hope they aren’t. I’m a guy in Dallas, they are representing Israel. Even I know the difference in that.


26 posted on 10/30/2009 5:00:13 PM PDT by Republic of Texas (Socialism Always Fails)
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To: Nachum

bump


27 posted on 10/30/2009 5:34:13 PM PDT by VOA
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To: dfwgator; BertWheeler; TopQuark
Those secrets Pollard gave away eventually wound up in the hands of the ChiComs. He should have been shot.

My understanding is that the secrets were traded by Israel to the Soviet Union in exchange for a loosening of restrictions on Russian Jews to emigrate to Israel. It was in Israel's interest to boost immigration as much as possible to counter Palestinian birthrates, and Russia was the greatest source of likely Jewish immigrants.

Countries don't have friends, they have interests. So our "friends" handed over the massive load of secrets that Pollard had stolen, including some of the very top secret NSA info.

Of course once Israel had all these secrets, they had the leverage to use them in other ways too. They are a small country in a difficult position in the world and they play hardball.

I think it's unlikely that Pollard knew about the eventual destination of the documents. But he should at least stay in jail permanently just for stealing the secrets.

28 posted on 10/30/2009 5:59:57 PM PDT by wideminded
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To: wideminded
Thank you for the details.
29 posted on 10/31/2009 9:45:34 PM PDT by TopQuark
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To: wideminded

Without any regards to the stance of Israel, Jonathan Pollard is a traior to America.

Let him sit and stew in prison. He can lick his wounds all day long and think of himself as a martyr.

Jonathan Pollard is an American traitor. If Israeli agents used him, too bad for Jonathan Pollard.


30 posted on 11/02/2009 10:23:12 AM PST by BertWheeler (Dance and the World Dances With You!)
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To: BertWheeler
Israel seems determined to free Pollard. Since much of the classified information he learned must be out of date by now, the reason must be that Israel wants to send a signal to any other potential spies. The message is that Israel will not abandon them.

Likewise we need to send a message by keeping Pollard in prison that traitors will find no leniency.

31 posted on 11/02/2009 12:46:58 PM PST by wideminded
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