Maine split on gay marriage question (48% for,48% against,%5 undecided)

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com ^ | October 20, 2009 | www.publicpolicypolling.com

[Maelstorm]

Raleigh, N.C. – Two weeks out from election day Maine voters are divided right down the middle when it comes to whether they will reject the state’s law allowing same sex couples to marry. 48% say they will vote to over turn the law while 48% say they will vote to keep it with only 4% of the electorate still undecided. Opinion on the issue predictably breaks heavily along party lines. 74% of Republicans are planning to vote yes while only 25% of Democrats are. Independents may end up deciding which way it goes- presently 50% of them support rejecting the law with 44% in opposition. Older voters are strongest in their support of cutting off gay marriage. 54% are in support with 40% opposed. Senior citizens can often dominate the electorate in low turnout elections so the ultimate fate of this measure may lie in how many younger people get out to the polls and vote. There is a strong gender gap on the issue with 53% of men but only 43% of women wanting to reject the law. It’s also interesting to note that while white voters oppose undoing the law by a thin 47-45 margin, nonwhite voters in the state support rejection by a 55-35 margin, creating the overall tie. “The fate of Question 1 is going to be decided by which side does a better job of mobilizing their supporters to get out and vote,” said Dean Debnam, President of Public Policy Polling. “Voters in the state know where they stand on the issue and now it’s just an issue of who shows up.” PPP surveyed 1,130 likely voters from October 16th to 19th. The survey’s margin of error is +/-2.9%. Other factors, such as refusal to be interviewed and weighting, may introduce additional error that is more difficult to quantify. Complete results are attached and can be found at www.publicpolicypolling.com.

[longhorn too]

I was reading just the other day how the New England area is the least religious area of the country. This just confirms it.

[uncbob]

Wonder if those who think same sex marriages are OK would vote for polygamy

[YankeeReb]

There has never been a majority support for gay marriage or the homosexual agenda. The only time the support increases is when we quit fighting.

Agreed. I take some comfort in the fact that over the last few years the number of people who consider themselves pro-life has been slowly increasing. Maybe it's that people are educating themselves on the issue, maybe they see the radicals in power and their taking a good hard look at what abandoning traditional values ultimately gets you. Hopefully the same will hold true with this issue. Anytime the people vote on it through referendum gay marriage always loses. Remember the truth resonates with most people.

[ex-snook]

Even Alice in Wonderland could not conceive that any voter in his/her right mind would define same sex union as marriage.

[DesScorp]

I just said a prayer to defeat this abomination. Everyone else should too. The Lord will hear it.

[scripter]

Perhaps residents of Maine should watch this video of a man in Massachusetts who was fired for expressing his belief on gay marriage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWxOKOcf3zQ&

[DesScorp]

"Remember Sodom and Gomorrah's fate."

Liberal "Biblical Scholars" at the major universities have "re-interpreted" that story... now the cities weren't destroyed because of sexual immorality... oh no. They were destroyed because they weren't generous enough sharing their wealth. They were destroyed because they weren't liberal enough.

[Cboldt]

-- It looks highly likely that the law will be rejected and marriage between a man and a woman once again be the law of the land of Maine. --

I'm going to do my part to make that happen. Then the perverts will keep bringing the issue up until it passes without recourse.

[WallStreetCapitalist]

I've said it on here before and not everyone concurred, but I agree with him. The poll shows that the only reason the law would be overturned is because of older voters. Every year, older people die and more younger people enter the electorate. Ten years ago, gay marriage bans passed by 70%-30% margins. Today, we're looking at a near even split. Why? The demographic trend. You're never going to convince majority of the 18 year olds in the world today that gays getting married is going to have any influence on their life at all because they grew up watching Will & Grace on television or reading blogs like Perez Hilton where he outs (often with photographic evidence) everyone from actors such as Will Smith to NFL players. For most young people, being gay is about as different as having blond hair or blue eyes in the same way that women working wasn't a big deal for the generation before us.

I'm a conservative on 99% of issues - I believe in limited government, the unconditional right to bear arms, a balanced budget, a strong national defense including a missle defense system, am Pro-Israel, pro-life, support low taxes, vehemently oppose Unions card-checks, and support the right of parents to determine the education and religious upbringing of their children without government interference. But you are not going to get me to tell someone that the government has the right to determine their private, consensual, relationship.

As a Christian, I have my own beliefs on the matter because I believe the Bible is my authority. That's a matter for my family and church. As a citizen of the Republic, I cannot support the idea that the public is going to determine whether or not two grown adults can enter into a legally binding contract (which is what marriage is in the eyes of the law).

Here's the kicker: I'm in my mid-twenties. Most of my friends feel the same way, and most all of them are identical on political issues (pro-life, pro-guns, pro-defense, etc.) I would bet a significant sum of cash that the earlier poster hit the time table on the head - within 20 years, gay marriage will be no more controversial than interracial marriage because my generation just doesn't care. I think anyone who thinks they can convince younger voters to change their position is living in a fool's paradise.

That's why I've also said that the best way for conservatism to win is to focus on the advice of Benjamin Franklin - we must appeal to voter's interest rather than reason. We must show them that conservatism means more money in their paycheck and less government in their lives. We must convince them that conservatism means the freedom to chose their own path without interference from a nanny state. The demographic trends show that on this issue, like racism in the United States, every day that goes by the demographics shift beneath our party, just like sands in an hourglass. Time is not on the side of those who believe in one man one woman marriage as many of us Christians do. To fail to recognize that reality is to fail to rationally and objectively look at the facts.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

...you are not going to get me to tell someone that the government has the right to determine their private, consensual, relationship.

Evolution is only possible with HETEROSEXUAL relationships. This is a scientific fact...

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As a Christian,...

BULLSHIITE!

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I have my own beliefs on the matter because I believe the Bible is my authority. That's a matter for my family and church.

Religious faggotry is an insular self-referential cult.

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To fail to recognize that reality is to fail to rationally and objectively look at the facts.

REALITY is axiomatic... If you have to tell a grown man babies will not emerge from his rectum, he is mentally ill.

[MSF BU]

You of course then, would have no problem with polygamous and polyamourous marriages? In other words, the word marriage will be meaningless.

[WallStreetCapitalist]

Okay, as a Christian who believes the Jesus Christ is the son of God and the Bible is the Word of God, it really, really bothers me when people take American culture and use it as scripture without reading the text itself. God specifically, to a point, bullet-point listed all of the sins of Sodom in Ezekiel 16:46-50, told his prophet to warn the people because they were committing the same sins and that if they didn't repent, they'd be wiped off the face of the earth just like Sodom was. (BTW: This is no way supports those nut-cases that think the "sin" of Sodom was a lack of hospitality - the Bible clearly states what they were and I believe the Bible is the word of God.)

The two angels that the men of the town attempted to rape did so after they had already been sent there to take Abraham's nephew Lot out of the city so that couldn't be the sole reason the city was destroyed. It was just icing on the proverbial sin cake.

America has been violating almost everything on the "Sodom" list in Ezekiel for about 100 years now and as a Church, we have done virtually nothing to stop it. As a Christian, we have beliefs on the mortality of homosexuality but to say it was 100% responsible for the destruction of Sodom is blatantly against scripture because God spelled it out to warn his children that they were committing the same sins and would be obliterated if they didn't repent and turn back to Him.

Your elder sister is Samaria who lived with her daughters to the north of you; and your younger sister, who lived to the south of you, is Sodom with her daughters. You not only followed their ways, and acted according to their abominations; within a very little time you were more corrupt than they in all your ways. As I live, says the Lord GOD, your sister Sodom and her daughters have not done as you and your daughters have done. This was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy. They were haughty and did abominable things before me; therefore I removed them when I saw it. - Ezekiel 16:46-50

Throughout the old and new testaments, God showed tremendous mercy to His people. You're arguing that if we allow gays to get married, there will be more homosexuality in America and thus we will be more like Sodom? You realize that if someone wants to screw members of the same gender they are already doing it - the lack of "marriage" isn't going to stop them so it would have no influence on the percentage of our population that was sinning against God. Furthermore, the same percentage of people were probably screwing the same gender back in the 19th century but they hid it behind sham marriages and in back rooms. Do you think God only hates sin when its public? Or do you think he overlooks that which is in private so it doesn't count? I'm not sure I understand your logic.

I hope I said that clearly. I'm trying to read a book but thought I'd check the latest stories on here and don't feel like going back and editing.

[WallStreetCapitalist]

Thank you! A lot of the comments on here don't have a rational basis or strategy for how we can get conservatives back in control of the government. You nailed it on the head! We have a demographic problem and this is in addition to the age discussion I, and a few other posters, mentioned earlier. What is our strategy for fixing it?

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

... as a Christian who believes the Jesus Christ is the son of God and the Bible is the Word of God, ...

Blah, blah, blah...

You are in direct contempt of Genesis... You might has well throw the rest of your Bible in the trash...

[WallStreetCapitalist]

I wrote about this extensively on another post. That is a huge mistake because sociological evidence shows that people get more conservative relative to the culture not in an absolute sense as they get older. In other words, a radical liberal was one who believed in freeing the slaves in their 20's. The fact that they didn't believe in women voting in their 80's meant they were a staunch conservative because the culture had changed around them.

Today's "conservative" elderly voters are the same people that would be considered crazy liberals by their grandparents' standards. They have probably gotten divorced, accept their social security checks, gamble at the riverboat (the biggest demographic for casinos), and listen to rock 'n roll.

Society very, very rarely grows more conservative in an absolute sense. That's why I said to think otherwise is to live in a fool's paradise. The same people used that argument to believe that someday, the younger voters would realize women working was a bad idea or that blacks and whites shouldn't get married. It's faulty logic. People's beliefs get more ingrained as they get older, not less.

[WallStreetCapitalist]

I meant to have my response on the Sodom comment to go you, as well (sorry I forgot to put it in the "to" field).

I think the idea that Sodom was destroyed because it wasn't hospitable enough is idiotic and only someone who was trying to make the Bible fit his own agenda would believe that.

But I believe the Bible is the Word of God so my personal belief is that when God spelled out the reasons for Sodom's destruction in Ezekiel, providing a bullet-point list as to why it was wiped off the face of the earth and warning his children that they were coming dangerously close to committing the same sin, it's the truth. It specifically, to-the-point without exception or any wiggle room says that Sodom was destroyed because she didn't share her wealth. (I posted the verse in the other post so you could read it.)

I'm a huge capitalist. I'm also rich. I hate socialism with a deep, abiding passion. But the reality is, the verse said that (I posted it earlier). I'm not going to call God a liar even if it's inconvenient for me. If I disagree with it, that means that Ezekiel is less the word of God than Genesis and then we have a huge problem because we get to pick and chose what is right for us, as Christians. I don't believe we have that luxury because I believe we are called to a different standard than the world.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

I wrote about this extensively on another post.

Yes, evidence of that insular, self-referential cult I wrote about earlier...

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

I'm a huge capitalist. I'm also rich.

The idea of a camel passing through the eye of a needle comes directly to mind...

[WallStreetCapitalist]

1.) You're using evolution as a justification for God's will for personal relationships? No, homosexuality is a sin because God said it, not because of evolution (for instance, some scientists believe that women with gay children are statistically more fertile so homosexuality is a byproduct of female reproduction success and thus is compatible). I don't believe that. God's word alone should be enough for us to believe something is right or wrong for our own life.

2.) I believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God. I believe that He died for my sins and rose on the third day. I believe that I am accountable to Him for my sins, thoughts, and actions, and that I'm called to a different standard than the world. I believe that by His grace, and not my actions, I am saved. I also believe that I have to live holy as a testament to Him. Yes. I'm a Christian. yes, I live my life according to His standard for morality.

I have a problem with the GOVERNMENT telling people what is and what is not acceptable between consenting adults (not churches, not families, not friends) for the same reason I don't think they have a right to FORCE me to take a vaccine or FORCE me to procreate for the good of the nation. The Government must be morally neutral (as a protestant, I don't believe my divorced grandmother is going to hell but there are some Orthodox Christians who believe that with all of their heart; if we let the Government outlaw divorce, they are imposing their religious beliefs on me).

Again, your reproduction argument isn't logical either because as Christians, our only argument for our own lives should be something is immoral or moral because God said so. Period. There have been multiple posts in the past few days on Free Republic about scientists perfecting techniques that will let two women or two men biologically procreate genetic offspring together, just like an inferitble couple would. Would that suddenly make homosexuality moral? According to your logic it would. Again: Morality or immorality is determined by the Word of God and not by your opinion of scientific fact.

The reason I so strongly believe in the right of individual families and churches to make religious decisions is because I'm a student of history. Our ancestors slaughtered themselves over questions of whether Mary remained a virgin after she birthed Jesus or whether the bread literally becomes the body of Christ or is merely representative of the body of Christ. I don't want the Government to have any say, in any way, shape, or form, on any religious matter. A perfect case in point: I agree on 99% of issues with my Christian brethren but because I have pause over one issue that many in my generation do, you literally attempting to pass judgment on whether or not I'm saved (which, frankly, is a right that neither you nor any other man has).

If you can't understand the rational logic behind that, then I pardon your mental deficiency.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

You are a homo-apologist troll.

I am an atheist and I do know how to spot a cultural marxist

I reject your religious faggotry as well as your false witness of the Bible. If you deny Genesis, you deny the whole thing baby boy.

In fact I would bet, despite your fatuous fakery, you would excuse just about any perversity as long as it was beneficial to you in some way.

Sanctimonious creeps like you are the ruin of this country.