Jarno Trulli could soon be looking for another team
Posted on 11/04/2009 12:36:58 AM PST by bruinbirdman
Toyota has quit Formula One motor racing, in a move that leaves the scandal-hit sport without any participation by Japanese automakers in the coming season.
Jarno Trulli could soon be looking for another team
The decision, which was announced in Tokyo this morning, is part of Toyota’s wider efforts to slash costs after an extraordinary board meeting held at the company’s headquarters. Toyota is already rumoured to be looking for an Asian buyer for the team.
Toyota’s pullout follows a similar decision from Bridgestone, which announced three days ago that it would stop providing tyres after the 2010 season.
That, combined with Honda’s surprise exit from the sport last year, completes the trio of withdrawals by major Japanese companies: cost is understood to be the prime concern behind all three decisions, though industry insiders said that the sport’s image is increasingly of synch with the Japanese firms’ corporate emphasis on “green” technologies.
Toyota had previously asserted that it would continue to field a team until 2012 but the continuing misery in its mainstream car business has made the F1 team too heavy a cost burden.
Their decision comes despite Honda’s visible regret at its own decision to quit the sport. When Honda sold its team last year, its new owners, led by Ross Brawn delivered constructors’ championship victory for the former Honda car and drivers championship triumph for Jenson Button. Analysts have estimated that Honda may have missed out on $255 million worth of brand exposure via its absence from F1.
Toyota’s dwindling interest in F1 was apparent last month when the company withdrew its sponsorship of the Japanese Grand Prix, which was held on the Fuji Speedway circuit that the company itself owns.
(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...
Red Bull and the Brauns team kicked it out of the park but as for next year I’m looking forward to USF1!!!!
Wondering about M Waltrip and NASCAR too?
(and NASCAR in general...)
Wondering the same thing, myself.
Would serve JGR right if Toyota left 'em flapping in the wind, as far as this fan's concerned.
In related racing news, Jayski reported Fiat's dropping the entire Chrysler/Dodge line of cars in lieu of their own, re-branded under the Chrysler name. Good grief.
Exceptions being the Charger & Challenger, they say.
While I don't recall reading it, I'm guessing they'll keep the Dodge truck line.
Salient point being the company as we knew it is gone and participation in NASCAR in real doubt as evidenced by the recent RPMS switch. If Penske goes, then we'll know it's official.
Even so this move by Toyota? While it somewhat surprises me I have to say we didn't follow but a fraction of the F1A as we had in previous years. The goofy rules, the flake/owner and generally unexciting competition made watching reruns on Sunday morning of CFA via the Big10 Net more appealing.
And what of the alleged "scandal"? I knew there was a flap, but what about?? There's always some dust-up in F1A.
Big deal, what else is new. LOL
Hokey Smokes Bullwinkle... I’m sure out of the loop (NASCAR... don’t follow the open wheels).
You’re well beyond my involvement and glad that you are. The sport needs knowledgeable fans.
I kind of dropped interest when the ‘old timers’ started retiring and the cars started becoming too ‘off of the shelf’ spec’d. (worked at a GM plant where, one glorious summer, during a shutdown, we put 5 new model ‘body in white’ cars into production for NASCAR use). (no UAW funny stuff in the car either... straight clean builds!)
Sorry can’t contribute more to your post.
LOL
Well on nights ya can't sleep (not unlike this one?) try www.Jayski.com for everything NASCAR. Just click on the venue (Cup, Nationwide (formerly Busch), Trucks whatever it's called, now) and you'll get all there is. Who's doing what etc. Of course the info's purified for consumption. After all Jayski was bought out & now owned by ESPN. If ya know what I mean? LOL
"You’re well beyond my involvement and glad that you are. The sport needs knowledgeable fans."
Thanks, but if things continue to head in the direction the France brats are taking the sport? I may opt out, become a voluntarily ignorant ex-fan. ;^)
"I kind of dropped interest when the ‘old timers’ started retiring and the cars started becoming too ‘off of the shelf’ spec’d. (worked at a GM plant where, one glorious summer, during a shutdown, we put 5 new model ‘body in white’ cars into production for NASCAR use). (no UAW funny stuff in the car either... straight clean builds!)"
Excellent. My kind of times, not this COT baloney. In fact the latest flap's now that Taledega is too dangerous! Cars go too fast yadayadayada. Well for crying out loud make the designs that of "stock cars" we see in showrooms and they won't be able to GO 200MPH. Good grief. Can't fix stupid, just can't.
"Sorry can’t contribute more to your post."
You did better than anyone else. LOL!! ;^)
Re: the Formula One photo with this article:
“Over the line, Smokey, over the line!”
That doesn’t apply?
“...we see in showrooms and they won’t be able to GO 200MPH.”
anecdotal: As a youngster, worked at a Dodge/Chrysler dealership (leasing dept). The Dealership was alloted (1) each Dodge Daytona and Plymouth Superbird.
Both went to Arabian students at school in Boston (within a couple of days).
It was worth working there to see them come in. Young kids, male & female (well dressed, Americanized). Not pretentious, but aware of there status. Sometimes, almost trying to play it down.
Many other cars went out too.
Good times, thanks for reminding me of them.
Talledega:
Watched it. No bump/draft in corners? Who said it after a wreck? We’re drivers, why won’t NASCAR let us drive? Brought up past drivers (Earnhardt — Intimidater, now how did he earn that name?)(Petty, others —late, memory)
They keep trying to slow down cars but don’t listen to the drivers. (kudos for in car transmissions... got to hear drivers being told to back off — and their gripes about it)
Seems like the best action (for race fans) is the ‘in car’, or pit strategy (pseudo fans like the wrecks). Um, well, there used to be wrecks that were part of racing too, tough call except for results.
[results meaning I really would like to see Mark Martin win. He’s gone through a great personal transition... booze to a racing gentleman].
long post, sorry. thanks for the opp.
Well, they certainly could afford the gas regardless the engine option. eh? LOL
"It was worth working there to see them come in. Young kids, male & female (well dressed, Americanized). Not pretentious, but aware of there status. Sometimes, almost trying to play it down. Many other cars went out too. Good times, thanks for reminding me of them."
You're speaking with a former Dodge guy, in the day. They built some mighty fine cars. Fast. Great styling. Just WTH happened.
"Talledega: Watched it. No bump/draft in corners? Who said it after a wreck? We’re drivers, why won’t NASCAR let us drive?"
TV ratings for nearly every single race this year have been off, sometimes considerably. Go ahead & guess why, because NASCAR hasn't a clue. And they haven't had one since Bill Sr died, turning over the operation to the 2 brats & thug we unaffectionately call Mike Hellentonio. Talk about a goon. Good grief. Smacks of organized crime, possibly of the Democrat brand for all I know. LOL
"Brought up past drivers (Earnhardt — Intimidater, now how did he earn that name?)(Petty, others —late, memory)"
The day Iron Head died, so went the sport. And as nice a kid as Jr is, he ain't got the stuff of his father. No fond thoughts toward Sterling Marlin from this fan, y'know?
"They keep trying to slow down cars but don’t listen to the drivers. (kudos for in car transmissions... got to hear drivers being told to back off — and their gripes about it)...Seems like the best action (for race fans) is the ‘in car’, or pit strategy (pseudo fans like the wrecks). Um, well, there used to be wrecks that were part of racing too, tough call except for results."
Agreed, but we'll be damned if we're going to pay more than the $80 p/mo we're presently paying DircTV for the in-car. Bad enough scads of ambiguous "cautions" all for the purpose of running countless ads. And they wonder why their ratings are in the tank, eh? LOL
"[results meaning I really would like to see Mark Martin win. He’s gone through a great personal transition... booze to a racing gentleman]."
Would love to see MM win his first and only crown. Especially since he was so close with Roush only to have JGordon beat him by what, a mere 6 points.
Class guy Mark, a fading breed.
That he'd an *issue* with the juice, now that *I* didn't know. His public image is that of a gym rat. So you told me something, here. LOL
"long post, sorry. thanks for the opp."
I'll get over it. ;^)
Have a good one, y'hear?
Gonna try to get some sleep, again. LOL
A NASCAR driver did a couple over/nose/butt/flips and walked away last weekend. He has a degree.
The best engineering cheaters are employed in other countries.
They aren't designing COT cars (aerodynamics are involved and that is partly how the COT evolved).
A back east friend's son built a car from parts. A LOT of electronic innovation and a bit of nitrous for a graduation project.
He was scooped up by Ratheon before graduation.
He's keeping us safe (unless 0bama gets involved ???)
Believe your post was positive?
Mark
no great surprise, but very sorry to see this happen. I feel bad for Kobayashi. he has said he is out of money and without a ride at Toyota he will be working in his father’s sushi restaurant.
at least this lets Sauber back in. pretty cool he gave Heidfeld a car at Abu Dhabi.
another one bites the dust...
The article made me chuckle over the comment of “Honda’s visible regret at its own decision to quit the sport.” Their regret was generated by Jenson Button's dominance this year on the way to his drivers’ championship as well as Ross Brawn's win of the constructors’ championship, in a team previously owned by Honda. If only they'd toughed it out one more year!
Mind you, years ago it was not like Honda to pull out of any racing until they had the upper hand. Case in point: Their continued efforts in AMA flat-track racing in the late ‘70s through the early ‘80s. They kept at it until they unseated dominant Harley-Davidson for the championship. Honda did eventually pull out in late ‘88. They also forced out the privateers with their stunningly expensive replacement parts for their NS750.
Bottom line, the Asian auto manufacturers are feeling the economic pinch as much as the American manufacturers.
Plausible, if it's really about success BM.
OTOH what if it's about money?
Then all bets are off.
Ask yourselves this: Does Toyota really need NASCAR to sell Camrys? ;^)
"The Japanese have pulled out of F1 (and other venues) because of their lack of success."
I've had [that] very conversation with several automotive engineers I know who've worked not only for the formerly called Big 3, but, some of the Asian marques, today.
According to them racing participation's been all about R&D. One of the men who's with Lexus (& you know who owns Lexus, eh?) said they'd had planned a new "supercar"; however, with the tanked world economy the idea wasn't scrapped, it was put onto the proverbial "back burner". For now.
Nissan OTOH moved ahead with their Asian "Skyline" marketed here stateside as the gawd-awful expensive GT-R. What're sales numbers for the GT-R? Don't know. Do you? Bet they're not real *hot*. Just a notion. LOL
Of course you know all of what I wrote, already; so, just reminding you in an effort to bring some perspective to your comment. :^)
"The article made me chuckle over the comment of 'Honda’s visible regret at its own decision to quit the sport.' Their regret was generated by Jenson Button's dominance this year on the way to his drivers’ championship as well as Ross Brawn's win of the constructors’ championship, in a team previously owned by Honda. If only they'd toughed it out one more year!"
That was my take on the not so obvious spin, also. ;^)
"Mind you, years ago it was not like Honda to pull out of any racing until they had the upper hand. Case in point: Their continued efforts in AMA flat-track racing in the late ‘70s through the early ‘80s. They kept at it until they unseated dominant Harley-Davidson for the championship. Honda did eventually pull out in late ‘88. They also forced out the privateers with their stunningly expensive replacement parts for their NS750."
Fascinating insight my ol' friend, thank you kindly.
The modus operandi sounds awfully close to ordinary Honda car stealership service departments!! As I'd once heard G.Liddy say concerning Honda & their dealer network: "Honda will rip your lungs out for parts *&* service." LOL
We need to have these kinds of talks more often, BM. LOL
"Bottom line, the Asian auto manufacturers are feeling the economic pinch as much as the American manufacturers."
Yup, though the general public STH wouldn't know it unless they read pieces like this & connected the proverbial dots, eh? ;^)
Quite the statement from the guy who hung upside down until cut out of his car after 10 minutes.
And the chick interviewing him, after he emerged from the hospital tent, never followed up. She just asked a scripted question.
He'd have none of it, repeating about restrictor plates.
She asked about another subject, "How are you feeling?" He complained about NASCAR rules.
The chick was worthless during the best part of the telecast.
yitbos
Yeah, I also miss track side mic holders dressed up in their 'racing' suits' (silly to the point of pitiful)
It's amazing how composed most of the drivers are after being released from the field hospital facility. (getting in their sponsors after some of those whoopsies is amazing. Hope they don't wind up with 'football brains') In a way, I kind of miss the helmet throwing and 'in your face' confrontations.
I do have to give credit for the COT as far as survivability (and the HAHN -sp- harness, etc). NASCAR/drivers have made some proven changes (wall impact cushions especially).
[sorry for the delayed response... long election night!]
Ugh, they just happen to be the fastest superspeedways.
Then there's Indianapolis 500 where they are restricted, too. What happened to increased speeds every year? What happened to 237.498 mph / 382.216 km/h, qualifying one lap, Arie Luyendyk, 1996?
That's 1996 for crying out loud. Bring back the turbine engine!!
yitbos
dang, you're up and on!
Yup, bring them back and why not the 'hoover' vacuum car too? Car engineering at its best (well, maybe). Might negate the request of Newman (I think he said it) to cut the curved bank out which would require the drivers to slow.
IIRC, drivers have maintained that the plates also restrict their ability to drive OUT of a wreck. I'll leave that decision up to them...! Unlike 'you know who', this is definitely beyond my pay grade.
Personally, I don't know if I enjoy the short tracks. Too much roundy round (kind of like the past Saturday night demo derbies, just drawn out with too few chances to pass. I could be wrong.
The 'Glen'/road course races....ugh. Maybe they could use one of the 'closed for race day' courses that the FIM uses in the cities? Bring it back to it's origins of bootleg booze running! Let ALGORE throw the starting flag.
I go back to Ascot Park in Gardena, CA, the original demolition derby, ol' Fireball Roberts, and Sam Hanks.
We have a NASCAR race out here in LV, Bull Ring circuit, and NHRA. The track is out by Nellis AFB.
yitbos
(humbled)
Had a round track in Westboro MA to go to in my youth (so sad when it was ‘lost’ to progress, insurance costs and diminished patronage).
Then there was and still is, Epping Dragway NH (SUNDAY, SUNDAY, SUNDAY). (a near miss on my m/c by a semi led me there for awhile)
And, I’m sure you know of, Bryar Motorsports, Laconia NH (now NHMS). Was there for the riots when the National Guard was brought in during M/C week.
Now, here in MT, there are plenty of bull riding championship events, but the closest to car racing is Radio Controlled.
(the street mods are mostly buzz can exhausts... remember when it was called someone getting a gift certificate from JC Whitney?)
Well, you answered this quite well in following paragraphs (and didn't leave me much, but I'll improvise) [almost NFL/Limbaugh-esque?, but definitely UAW influenced]
Racing is jointly advertisement and R&D. Some companies also do it for prestige, or used to be able to afford to do so.
As to Toyota, when they first considered sponsoring, I recall some questioning whether they (a non US corp) should be allowed to compete. NASCAR being 'American'.
Of course, non of the competition 'cars' are actually manufacturing brands and Toyota did have US facilities (or were being built).
I thought that their ability to design and build close tolerance production cars would prove to be an asset and that their racing cars would quickly have a showing.
Drivers aside, their initial track failures were somewhat amazing, at least to me.
Guess any continuation could be considered as R&D, since as you say, they don't need the advertisement. Or, maybe they consider it as being part of the 'fraternity'?
[I think that the only part of any NASCAR 'COT' car, that is in anyway part of any car company, is the letters displaying said company name in vinyl or enamel]
>Ask yourselves this: Does Toyota really need NASCAR to sell Camrys? ;^)
"Well, you answered this quite well in following paragraphs (and didn't leave me much, but I'll improvise) [almost NFL/Limbaugh-esque?, but definitely UAW influenced]"
Great sense of humor, my friend. ;^) LOL
"Racing is jointly advertisement and R&D."
Totally agree, absolutely.
It's the necessity of either, I question.
"Some companies also do it for prestige, or used to be able to afford to do so."
Yes, in the "old days" this is very true. Certainly long before the Japanese owned Toyota (Toyoda) made the scene.
The ol' "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday" was really so, a Lee Iaccoca would've been the very first to tell anyone that much. They broke the proverbial mold when that man left the industry.
"As to Toyota, when they first considered sponsoring, I recall some questioning whether they (a non US corp) should be allowed to compete. NASCAR being 'American'."
Yes, you're communicating with one of the "somes". LOL
"Of course, non of the competition 'cars' are actually manufacturing brands..."
No, not now. OTOH my cousin (much older than I, FWIW) was an "official" in the 60s for NASCAR. At the time I never heard the acronym "NASCAR", though.
All I knew was "Andy" would come up from FL every year, park his trailer in our driveway so he could officiate at the "200 Mile Late Model Stock Car Race" at The Milwaukee Mile" on the Wisconsin State Fair Park grounds.
Got *special* privileges because of that man, long before there were to my knowledge, "Pit Passes" available to the general public for a price.
Point is: I can clearly recall in my mind's eye the likes of Fred Lorenzen, "Fireball" Roberts and a very young Richard Petty to name only a few. All today part of racing legend. And I mean up close & personal in some cases, the cars those men raced were indeed "Stock cars".
As you know.
"...and Toyota did have US facilities (or were being built)."
Assembled, huge difference.
My educational backgrounds an EE. Specialized in factory automation, ie, robotics A to Z, ring nets (old stuff, today), welding, painting ops via robotic device & on and on. I tell you this because my first internship job was with a Swedish outfit named ASEA. Look it up. My "job" was cracking open wooden shipping cases, unpacking & then assembling contents. When finished there'd be a shiny new very advanced servo motor driven, sometimes multi-axis device. Cutting edge stuff then, taken for granted, today.
FYI: None of the "value added" components were built in US foundries, forge shops, machine shops etc. *None*. The Swedish peoples got that gravy. Just as in most cases the Japanese peoples do with autos, today.
Last I'd heard same goes with Toyota et al and all the other foreign marques "assembled" here stateside. Though admittedly [that] may be changing. I've a very good pal living in Newburgh, IN. A Sr. VP for a recycling concern [read: scrap yard]. Nearly every billet of reclaimed aluminum's bought by Toyota in Princeton, Indiana. So there's obbiously *some* kind of heavy manufacturing going on today, beyond that which I was aware years ago.
"I thought that their ability to design and build close tolerance production cars would prove to be an asset and that their racing cars would quickly have a showing."
And IMO you're absolutely spot-on with your thinking because Toyota certainly has met & exceeded your expectation(s). Honda *&* Nissan while not as high profiled have also had successes, too; moreover, the automation processes are largely attributable to the Japanese manufactures were great influences with our Big 3 if only for QC.
Particularly influenced was GM, their embracing of GE/Funuc. Is why GM can build a 400# LS7 delivering 500HP @ 480lb/ft of torque *while* approaching upper 20s for mileage -- as long as one keeps their spurs outa the thing? LOL
Ford & Chrysler have achieved similar & respectable results as GM. The kind of performance in years past required sending INE components to racing motor machine shops for ops such as head work, balancing etc are now done at the factory on all autos; hence, great mileage, reliability and especially performance. Right?
Insofar as NASCAR goes, though? The cars are a light year away from "stock", so far in fact it's borders ludicrous.
Of course the venue's hardly "National" anymore too, unless one buys a distortion of the term 'national' as this generation seems so adept at doing in order they fit their dream into a template of comfort? LOL
"...aside, their initial track failures were somewhat amazing, at least to me."
In my engineering background, particularly in the beginning? "Learning Curves" were often "Learning Walls".
Didn't surprise me one iota Toyota experienced catastrophic failures in the Cup venue, and in spite of several years prep time in the truck series. Part of the process.
And even then didn't at least ONE Dodge team lose their franchise because they'd given Toyota a Dodge racing mill, perhaps even offering other aid? Yea, I think so and today that same team races, ready...Toyota. LOL Shezam.
The Japanese are if nothing else the "Reverse Engineering Kings" of the entire species. More power to 'em, just saying. ;^)
"I guess any continuation could be considered as R&D, since as you say, they don't need the advertisement."
Except Toyota who comfortably leads in the coveted mid-sized passenger car category. Soon other sizes too, I'm sure.
GM, Ford & Chrysler, OTOH, need all the help they can get. Providing, they can continue to afford participation?
"Or, maybe they consider it as being part of the 'fraternity'?"
Take your pick, my friend. I'm merely an unamused spectator these days. :^)
Even the returns on R&D's suspect --IMO-- due entirely to today's amazing computers & software employed for geometric modeling etc. As opposed to the "old days" when say a 426 cu.in Hemi or a Ford cammer 427 --also a hemi headed design tho' Mr. Jessup's the man on all things Ford-- were run at the upper edge of their perceived designed tolerances, on race tracks. If the motor failed? Engineers did their post mortem autopsy and made correction(s), accordingly. Anything we got out of the showroom were built to specs much less; hence, more reliable so the theory went.
Now consider the viability of R&D return(s), today.
The real question of whether a win on any day xlates into a sale, coupled with NASCAR's seeming reluctance to focus on winning monikers in lieu of capped teeth kid-drivers, many who don't even shave? And I for one have to wonder what's in it for the Big 3, anymore.
The cost(s) to the Big 3 have to be simply staggering and my friend, for those of us who purchase one of the Big 3's products? We're paying for the NASCAR racing programs. Racing program costs are built-in to every car & truck we purchase. Is the additional cost necessary?
How long before the usually gawd-awful smart, wily clever & cutting edge Japanese figure out everything discussed for themselves? FWIW methinks they already have, in Formula 1A.
"[I think that the only part of any NASCAR 'COT' car, that is in anyway part of any car company, is the letters displaying said company name in vinyl or enamel]"
~& I think you're one astute person because that's all it is. LOL
IF a motor, any brand including Toyota --& they're all pretty much equal-- doesn't frag during a race? It's really all about chassis and tires. Isn't it.
And NASCAR *wonders* why they're taking on water fast by the bow. LOL!!
Thanks for the wonderful conversation my friend, and to you BBM for posting this fascinating article. ;^)
Your interpretive abilities are greater (considering what I wrote and the fact that you deciphered it as I intended).
"Racing is jointly advertisement and R&D."
>It's the necessity of either, I question.
Years back, it was cheaper and achieved a greater exposure for the car companies. Now, it may be necessary to give their company the slight edge needed to gain a customer's consideration (perhaps, what was old is, not new, but needed again?)
The ol' "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday" was really so
The translation to the factory floor was get it out of the door, not dis-similar to the dealership (I worked in both). Lee Ioccococa lead a turn around that may be the last we see in the auto industry.
Yes, you're communicating with one of the "somes". LOL
Eh, so was I at the time (even though a greater percentage of the parts coming into the plant were boxed/made out of country)
Got *special* privileges because of that man, long before there were to my knowledge, "Pit Passes" available to the general public for a price.
Think that you just summed up four decades of racing.
I tell you this because my first internship job was with a Swedish outfit named ASEA. Look it up.
(chuckles...) No need to look up ASEA, had one of the first robots in our Framingham, MA GMAD plant (might have been CPC then). It was strictly for dimensional checks, but every now and then it would go off on it's own. I was among the few (non IE) to deal with the carnage.
In my engineering background, particularly in the beginning? "Learning Curves" were often "Learning Walls".
It was the same on the production floor, whether it be mechanics or people. We presumed the 14th floor was no different (which affected the engineering division and all those below... engineering IS the top tier).
I'm merely an unamused spectator these days. :^)
Me too, also two, but I suppose we should be thankful that racing is still allowed and gas made available.
Anything we got out of the showroom were built to specs much less; hence, more reliable so the theory went.
Yes and lead was an available lubricant (amongst all of the other special stuffs, such as and up to Sunoco 260?). There were engineers whose production specs made it through the process (Duntov/Shelby come to mind)
You brought up the current and future of NASCAR which made me think of the recent problems and expansion that the NFL is considering.
Ah well, at least we have some entertainment from their antics (even if it's those off course/field).
Agree that it's enjoyable 'jawin' with you and others. (lawn chairs, coolers, a grille and the smell of meat and petrol in the air would add to it though)
LOL!!
I call it right once in a while, my friend. Broken clock & all that. ;^)
>It's the necessity of either, I question. (market'g & R&D)
"Years back, it was cheaper and achieved a greater exposure for the car companies."
Yes, exactly. You've nailed the nail squarely on the proverbial head. It was fiscally feasible doing R&D *and* advertising via NASCAR and/or NASCAResque activities like the NHRA. Before TV. Before the super ego.
"Now, it may be necessary to give their company the slight edge needed to gain a customer's consideration (perhaps, what was old is, not new, but needed again?)"
Deja vu all over again? Personally I don't *think* it's the same, my friend. The people, they've changed. A lot, and by no accident. Another matter for another time; but, suffice to say the marketers are aiming at a different market using different shticks. That's where the viability of a NASCAR becomes suspect, must withstand scrutiny considering the enormous costs.
Big Bill France was at the bottom. The "track" was a public beach. Lots of growth potential fueled by all those post WWII fellas, their growing families etc. We are, frankly, bloated & hit the top. In the world according to me, anyway. LOL
>The ol' "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday" was really so
"The translation to the factory floor was get it out of the door, not dis-similar to the dealership (I worked in both)."
Right again, and "quality" not much of a consideration. We paid a dear price for the short sightedness. Still are.
"Lee Iaccoca lead a turn around that may be the last we see in the auto industry."
Sadly, I must agree.
A man leading men in a man's world.
They broke the mold, anyway.
Where're the "Chicago" bands today to sing for a savior to come as they did their great song Harry Truman?
Ain't none, no greatness a'tall.
>Yes, you're communicating with one of the "somes".
"Eh, so was I at the time (even though a greater percentage of the parts coming into the plant were boxed/made out of country)"
Yes, you're correct. Again. LOL
Guess there's a grain of truth to the ol' tome, "Last refuge of a scoundrel is patriotism" after all. Hey, I'm a victim. LOL
>Got *special* privileges because of that man, long before there were to my knowledge, "Pit Passes" available to the general public for a price.
"Think that you just summed up four decades of racing."
Perhaps, but interestingly enough NASCAR with all their MBAs et al ad naseum can't see they'd be better by being less. It simply isn't necessary to have Fox or whoever show us the colonoscopy of their favorite driver. Aside from overkill it grossly misses the point of racing: The race.
>I tell you this because my first internship job was with a Swedish outfit named ASEA. Look it up.
"(chuckles...) No need to look up ASEA, had one of the first robots in our Framingham, MA GMAD plant (might have been CPC then). It was strictly for dimensional checks, but every now and then it would go off on it's own. I was among the few (non IE) to deal with the carnage."
BWWWWWWHAAAAAA!!! Yes, in the beginning.
Man at the start of all the automation craze, approximately early 80s, the corporate daddy warbucks of the country envisioned dumping raw materials into one end of their dark facility, finished products spewing from the other into waiting trucks. Their Lincolns backed up to a loading dock filling their trunks with loot. Funny stuff.
The misapplication of automation, particularly robotics, spawned an entirely new business: Robot Brokers. LOL
Oh the stories of idiots setting up these device 500 of feet from a forge shop (w/ *big* hammers) are legion, and damned funny. The brokers "cleaned-up" on mega buck devices that'd been pushed off into the corners of grimy, dingy manufacturing operations because they just couldn't keep 'em in spec for some *reason*!! LOL!!
>In my engineering background, particularly in the beginning? "Learning Curves" were often "Learning Walls".
"It was the same on the production floor, whether it be mechanics or people. We presumed the 14th floor was no different (which affected the engineering division and all those below... engineering IS the top tier)."
Presumption's the stepchild of assumption. Often we didn't have a clue at the 14th and it got no better as we descended to the basement. LOL
Were continually up against the wall, unrealistic deadlines were the rule. Got so bad at one outfit, P&H Harnischfeger, I recall equipment suspended in the air heading for flat bed rail cars/trucks with painters walking underneath spraying the bottom of the product!!
Man, talk about shoddy. As I said we paid and still are.
>I'm merely an unamused spectator these days.
"Me too, also two, but I suppose we should be thankful that racing is still allowed and gas made available."
These days? Yes. And that we aren't required, by law, to grovel for the privilege. Yet. LOL
[That] is the A#1 reason I went out & blew the wad last spring. Snagged one of Detroit's crown gems while they're here. Because they, the supercars, sure won't be for too much longer. While racing will always live in my heart? A little *piece* will always live in the garage, too. Won't be caught regretting I'd not hung on to a L-88, 340 or whatever. Not gonna happen again. ;^) LOL
>Anything we got out of the showroom were built to specs much less; hence, more reliable so the theory went.
"Yes and lead was an available lubricant (amongst all of the other special stuffs, such as and up to Sunoco 260?). There were engineers whose production specs made it through the process (Duntov/Shelby come to mind)"
Granted, and great men to which we must add Harley Earl & Virgil Exner. ~sigh~ Those were the days.
"You brought up the current and future of NASCAR which made me think of the recent problems and expansion that the NFL is considering."
The NFL's considering *expansion*??
Good grief, as it is there aren't enough quality players to go around. Benches ridiculously thin. And the imbecile Goodell wants to dilute the pool even further? LOL!!
"Ah well, at least we have some entertainment from their antics (even if it's those off course/field)."
Y'know, T_f? After the NFL gang banged Limbaugh? Personally I couldn't care less what the NFL does or doesn't do, anymore. And mind you we live a scant 150 miles south of Green bay, too. Pro ball runs awfully deep 'round here.
That last stunt simply knocked the wind out of my enthusiasm in ways I cannot describe, never thought possible. Isn't unlike the last MLB strike. Murdered my interest in the game, to this day.
Curiously enough I've found other things to do, in short I got a life. LOL
Moreover the disinterest *infection* has now spread to my love of college ball, also.
Anyway sorry to veer --wildly-- OT, but, you mentioned it & I of weak character couldn't resist. LOL
"Agree that it's enjoyable 'jawin' with you and others. (lawn chairs, coolers, a grille and the smell of meat and petrol in the air would add to it though)"
Now you're talking.
Just one thing, my friend.
Best wait for next spring. ;^) LOL
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