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Fort Hood Soldiers Guard the Base Entrances Without Magazines in their Weapons...
Yahoo News Photos ^ | 20091110 | Unknown

Posted on 11/10/2009 11:51:56 AM PST by nckerr

Click on the photos...This is craziness. The political correctness of the military. The Army and Marines are more trained with weapons and safety than the police. Why would they embarrass our Soldiers by making them pull guard with empty weapons...

(Excerpt) Read more at news.search.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: banglist; forthood; militarybase
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1 posted on 11/10/2009 11:51:57 AM PST by nckerr
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To: nckerr

When I was there the base entrance was guarded by armed private security contractors.


2 posted on 11/10/2009 11:53:43 AM PST by Perdogg (Sarah Palin-Jim DeMint 2012 - Liz Cheney for Sec of State - Duncan Hunter SecDef)
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To: nckerr

GR-r-r-r-r-r!!!
Castrating them on duty.


3 posted on 11/10/2009 11:53:56 AM PST by Monkey Face (I wear a yellow ribbon for ForgotenKnight, my army hero grandson.)
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To: nckerr

Why not save money by giving them toy guns instead? They have to be cheaper than empty M-4s.


4 posted on 11/10/2009 11:54:16 AM PST by TChris ("Hello", the politician lied.)
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To: nckerr
Boy, it's awfully hard to tell from that picture. Do you have anything bigger?

It's even difficult to discern if they're holding M4s or MP-5s. But, it appears both may have magazines inserted in their weapons.

5 posted on 11/10/2009 11:55:06 AM PST by OldDeckHand (Obamacare - So bad, even Joe Lieberman isn't going to vote for it.)
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To: nckerr

I heard about this yesterday and had hoped that it wouldn’t go public.


6 posted on 11/10/2009 11:55:26 AM PST by armymarinemom (My sons freed Iraqi and Afghan Honor Roll students.)
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To: nckerr

Why not arm the guards with that Turkish tennis ball machine gun. I hear that’s pretty lethal.


7 posted on 11/10/2009 11:55:27 AM PST by RexBeach
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To: nckerr

Well I garantee the only loaded weapons within a mile of the president today are secret service and probably hand picked by him.


8 posted on 11/10/2009 11:55:37 AM PST by cripplecreek (Seniors, the new shovel ready project under socialized medicine.)
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To: nckerr

ONE WORD >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> INSANE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


9 posted on 11/10/2009 11:56:45 AM PST by lionheart 247365 (-:{ GLEN BECK is 0bama's TRANSPARENCY CZAR }:-)
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To: Perdogg
"When I was there the base entrance was guarded by armed private security contractors."

I just left active-duty this past summer. Most of the bases I've either been stationed at, or have visited have been guarded at least partially by civilian contractors. That's not necessarily true internationally, but it seems to be true at the domestic bases, and has been true since the military draw-down of the early '90s.

10 posted on 11/10/2009 11:57:44 AM PST by OldDeckHand (Obamacare - So bad, even Joe Lieberman isn't going to vote for it.)
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To: nckerr

I don’t disagree with you, but all the armed guards in the Army wouldn’t have stopped the Ft. Hood Terrorist. He was an insider.


11 posted on 11/10/2009 11:57:44 AM PST by frankenMonkey ("Natural Born Citizen" - US Constitution, 1787; "Words have meaning" - Barack Obama, 2009)
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To: cripplecreek

He’d have nothing to fear.

Real Americans wouldn’t dream of shooting him,
and the Muslims that would, know he’s on their side.


12 posted on 11/10/2009 11:58:50 AM PST by MrB (The difference between a humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: nckerr

I don’t think this is anything new. I served as an MP in Korea and Ft. Bragg in the late 80’s and most times I (we) was not allowed to have a loaded M-16 and/or .45 on duty. We walked patrols in the local villages and provided all kinds of security.


13 posted on 11/10/2009 11:58:56 AM PST by lesko
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To: cripplecreek
Well I garantee the only loaded weapons within a mile of the president today are secret service and probably hand picked by him.

Secret Service=Praetorian Guard
14 posted on 11/10/2009 11:58:56 AM PST by IDRATHERNOT
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To: nckerr

This has always been the case. My husband served on guard . duty at Ft Hood....his weapon was never loaded. His Sgt at Arms had ammo


15 posted on 11/10/2009 11:58:58 AM PST by DallasSun (i believe in separation of church and hate.)
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To: nckerr

How can you tell from those photos that their weapons are unloaded ????


16 posted on 11/10/2009 11:59:23 AM PST by Robe (Rome did not create a great empire by talking, they did it by killing all those who opposed them)
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To: nckerr

The weapons have their magazines inserted so unless you have x-ray eyes what are you basing your statement on?

And if you have a source for that why would you spread that publicly to put these soldiers at greater risk than their peon leaders have?

Loose lips sinks ships.


17 posted on 11/10/2009 11:59:26 AM PST by big'ol_freeper ("Anyone pushing Romney must love socialism...Piss on Romney and his enablers!!" ~ Jim Robinson)
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To: nckerr

18 posted on 11/10/2009 11:59:41 AM PST by PhiKapMom (Mary Fallin - OK Gov/Coburn - Senate 2010 ! Take Back the House/Senate! Stop ZERO!)
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To: nckerr

Wait until the ones that are in the Navy and are stationed on warships get the word to go into action.


19 posted on 11/10/2009 12:00:01 PM PST by sport
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To: nckerr

Forget the Jihad terrorists, what about protecting us and our millitary from those Gadsden Flag Tattooed, Ron Paul Bumper Sticker, Tea Party Militia member Janet Napoleon-o tells to be scared shiftless about?


20 posted on 11/10/2009 12:00:17 PM PST by GraceG
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To: nckerr

Do they have to keep the cartridges in their shirt pockets?


21 posted on 11/10/2009 12:01:32 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (The Second Amendment. Don't MAKE me use it.)
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To: big'ol_freeper

Whenever I hard guard duty at Ft Dix in the 60’s, the only guards who had live ammo were those guarding the ammo facilities. The MPs on duty at the stockade I believe had live ammo but not having had to visit it, I don’t know for sure. All others were either not armed or without ammo.


22 posted on 11/10/2009 12:03:13 PM PST by Mouton
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To: Blood of Tyrants

These are assault weapons. Let’s not make them any more dangerous than we have to.


23 posted on 11/10/2009 12:03:38 PM PST by umgud (I couldn't understand why the ball kept getting bigger......... then it hit me.)
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To: lesko

“I don’t think this is anything new. I served as an MP in Korea and Ft. Bragg in the late 80’s and most times I (we) was not allowed to have a loaded M-16 and/or .45 on duty. We walked patrols in the local villages and provided all kinds of security.”

I served in the Army in West Germany, 1969-1970.

We walked guard in our motor pool area, which included Secret Crypto comminication equipment.

We DID have ammo. (But we won that war)


24 posted on 11/10/2009 12:03:51 PM PST by truth_seeker
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To: big'ol_freeper

Looks like magazines to me.

I guess some people would “feel” better knowing the guns were not loaded. Wouldn’t want anyone to feel “uncomfortable”.

Who wrote this crap?


25 posted on 11/10/2009 12:04:21 PM PST by o_zarkman44 (Obama is the ultimate LIE!)
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To: nckerr
Click on the photos...This is craziness. The political correctness of the military. The Army and Marines are more trained with weapons and safety than the police. Why would they embarrass our Soldiers by making them pull guard with empty weapons

For as long as I can recall, this has been the case.

26 posted on 11/10/2009 12:05:12 PM PST by fso301
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To: cripplecreek

Winner of the most honest response of the day.


27 posted on 11/10/2009 12:06:26 PM PST by rocksblues (Sarah and Joe, Real Americans!)
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To: frankenMonkey

Which is why every single soldier, while on post, should be carrying a sidearm. Especially after this.


28 posted on 11/10/2009 12:06:39 PM PST by cld51860
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To: nckerr

It looks like they either lack magazines, or (improbably) have 5-round hunting magazines. No evidence of mag pouches on their web gear.

29 posted on 11/10/2009 12:06:48 PM PST by Atlas Sneezed (“Personal freedom begins when you tell Old Mrs. Grundy to go to Hell.” -Lazarus Long)
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To: IDRATHERNOT
Secret Service=Praetorian Guard

Kind of a dumb comparison.

The PG was an elite military unit. The SS is civilian.

The PG had tremendous political clout, to the point they often chose the next emperor and forced him down the throat of the Senate. The SS has none.

The PG put down riots and provided more or less police services in the capital. The SS does not.

What do you think the two organizations have in common, other than the (essential) job of protecting a head of state?

30 posted on 11/10/2009 12:07:58 PM PST by Sherman Logan ("The price of freedom is the toleration of imperfections." Thomas Sowell)
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To: big'ol_freeper

The weapons have their magazines inserted so unless you have x-ray eyes what are you basing your statement on?


The photos are rather small and fuzzy, but to this trained eye, there are no magazines protruding from the magazine wells of any of the visible rifles in either of the photos.


31 posted on 11/10/2009 12:09:35 PM PST by Atlas Sneezed (“Personal freedom begins when you tell Old Mrs. Grundy to go to Hell.” -Lazarus Long)
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To: umgud
These are assault weapons. Let’s not make them any more dangerous than we have to.

LOL, that was good.

32 posted on 11/10/2009 12:09:35 PM PST by ansel12 (Scozzafava/Romney 2012)
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To: umgud

Unloaded it no more than an expensive club.


33 posted on 11/10/2009 12:12:54 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (The Second Amendment. Don't MAKE me use it.)
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To: OldDeckHand

you’re correct...nearly all the bases and posts have civilian guards at the gates. The drawdowns plus the ongoing ops tempos with ongoing wars overseas and other military engagements have pulled the security forces personnel off the CONUS bases and pushed ‘em overseas.

Sigh...my heart is heavy today as I watch the memorial service from Ft Hood.


34 posted on 11/10/2009 12:13:01 PM PST by sassy steel magnolia (USAF life and Navy wife...God Bless the USA!)
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To: nckerr

It’s probably determined by the posted threat level. I served as a USAF Security Policeman from ‘68-’72 and we were always issued ammo for our weapons...38’s and M-16’s both overseas (Korea in my case) and stateside (Nellis AFB). We loaded up in the “Clearing Barrell” by the armory before shift and unloaded at the same place when relieved. The carrying of weapons is supposed to mainly be for deterrence, so how are you deterred if you see Security carrying unloaded weapons.


35 posted on 11/10/2009 12:15:36 PM PST by vigilence
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To: Sherman Logan

My, as you say ‘stupid’, comparison was meant as more of a slight to Obama than to the Secret Service.

The Praetorians protected “emperors” which I think kinda suits our “Dear Leader” Obama.

Contrast that with rank and file soldiers being “disarmed” here at home while even on friggin guard duty and that Secret Service are armed to the hilt - kinda evokes a “decline of Rome” analogy.

I think I win on “subtle reference” points.


36 posted on 11/10/2009 12:17:45 PM PST by IDRATHERNOT
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To: OldDeckHand

i concur with your observations as well...


37 posted on 11/10/2009 12:19:42 PM PST by tatsinfla
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To: Beelzebubba

For as long as I can remember the only armed guards at gates on AF installations are at the security areas where some of our aircraft are parked and there is an internal security gate. Last time I was in one of the areas, they are still guarded by military Security Police.

Security needs beefed up IMHO after some instances I have been privvy to in the last few months at AF Installation.


38 posted on 11/10/2009 12:20:38 PM PST by PhiKapMom (Mary Fallin - OK Gov/Coburn - Senate 2010 ! Take Back the House/Senate! Stop ZERO!)
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To: tatsinfla

The guards on the USS Cole also had no clips. That’s why they couldn’t shoot the Zodiac as it approached.


39 posted on 11/10/2009 12:21:31 PM PST by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: massgopguy
The guards on the USS Cole also had no clips. That’s why they couldn’t shoot the Zodiac as it approached.

They are magizines not clips. I sereved in Special Warefare at NAB Coronado from 91 to 96, we always had loaded 45's on watch. Plus a GM in our armory with more small arms firepower than most ships carry.
40 posted on 11/10/2009 12:41:25 PM PST by Angry_White_Man_Syndrome
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To: massgopguy
"The guards on the USS Cole also had no clips. That’s why they couldn’t shoot the Zodiac as it approached.

We they holding M1 Garands?

41 posted on 11/10/2009 12:43:42 PM PST by JD91
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To: Angry_White_Man_Syndrome

And if the Navy or USAF has loaded weapons and they are barely trained on weapons, how much more should the Soldiers and Marines be allowed to have amuunition in their weapons? The actual boots on the ground highly trained warfighters?


42 posted on 11/10/2009 12:48:44 PM PST by nckerr (www.myspace.com/ArmyKerrFamily)
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To: massgopguy
"The guards on the USS Cole also had no clips. That’s why they couldn’t shoot the Zodiac as it approached."

That's correct, at least in part. A few were armed, but only with sidearms and only with two rounds each - hardly the stuff to repel a suicidal attack. Both crew served weapons, forward and aft were unmanned as well. Lastly, even if they had been armed appropriately, the rules of engagement were such that it prohibited the sailors from firing preemptively.

While the official investigation cleared the ship's captain - he set force protection using the directed guidelines - the report clearly identified that those same force protection guidelines were woefully inadequate.

There are plenty of people for many years that have vocally stated that US service men and women should never stand watch with unloaded weapons, except of course in training, like boot-camps. But, common sense and practical responsibility continues to give way to political correctness. Command is more afraid of accidental discharge or lost weapons with ammunition than they are of actually protecting the principle - the principle in this case actually being US service men and women.

43 posted on 11/10/2009 12:51:38 PM PST by OldDeckHand (Obamacare - So bad, even Joe Lieberman isn't going to vote for it.)
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To: big'ol_freeper

i see a rear grip and a foregrip. no mags.


44 posted on 11/10/2009 12:53:48 PM PST by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt)
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To: OldDeckHand

Zooming in, looks to me like they’re empty. Not an uncommon bureaucratic response to such events.


45 posted on 11/10/2009 12:57:37 PM PST by ctdonath2 (End the coup!)
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To: OldDeckHand

I see foregrips on M4A1’s, but no mags. Army doesn’t use MP5’s unless they are SPECFOR. But I’m sure they’ve got mags with them. It only takes 1-2 seconds to pop a mag and chamber the first round.


46 posted on 11/10/2009 12:59:08 PM PST by derekr44
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To: IDRATHERNOT
Secret Service=Praetorian Guard

Hmmmmmmm, can someone tell me how Caligula met his end? I seem to have forgotten that one.

*Whistles with eyes upturned*

47 posted on 11/10/2009 1:05:35 PM PST by SengirV
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To: armymarinemom

ditto


48 posted on 11/10/2009 1:06:48 PM PST by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: OldDeckHand

I think a lot of people tend to be under the assumption that the military has enough training to carry loaded weaponry around safely all the time. This is not the case. Go to any place there are guns (shooting range, firing line, gun show, gun shop) and you will see that safety is the number one priority. Not necessarily safety from other people and/or shootings like this, but safety from accidental discharge. When you are away from the firing line, mags are out, chambers are cleared and safeties are on. It’s no different here, really. I don’t believe that it’s 100% of a PC decision... even though that may be a part of it. It’s more for a stop-gap against accidents than anything else.

We may not see mags loaded in the guns, but that doesn’t mean they are defenseless. These guys are trained to load a gun and shoot in a matter of seconds.


49 posted on 11/10/2009 1:12:09 PM PST by derekr44
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To: big'ol_freeper

Zoomed in on the pictures. Sure looks like no mags.


50 posted on 11/10/2009 1:13:20 PM PST by Eagles6 ( Typical White Guy: Christian, Constitutionalist, Heterosexual, Redneck. (Let them eat arugula!))
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