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JFK Theories; Oswald and Hasan
Pajamas Media ^ | November 22 | Ron Rosenbaum

Posted on 11/22/2009 8:32:25 AM PST by AJKauf

Any new theories? Where do you stand on the old theories? Is the Warren Report conclusion (for all the flaws in its investigation) beginning to worm its way into your heart?

Did the assassination change your life? Did it (and successive assassinations) change your vision of America? Your vision of the world? Or is it irrelevant that there’s still doubt warranted (pun intended). Irrelevant in toto? (the Latin word, not Dorothy’s dog).

I’ve been thinking about Oswald. I think he fired shots that day. I can’t be sure he was alone, although I haven’t been convinced by any of the conspiracy theories. More importantly I can’t be sure why he did it. He was somewhere on the spectrum between nutcase and ideologue, maybe a combination of both.

Like a certain other shooter of recent vintage. It’s a dangerous combination.

Anyway, I’m interested in what people think about or if they do. It is November 22nd, you know. ....

(Excerpt) Read more at pajamasmedia.com ...


TOPICS: Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: jfkassassination; presidents
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1 posted on 11/22/2009 8:32:26 AM PST by AJKauf
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To: AJKauf

I still think it was a mob hit with some high level govt types trying to clumsily trying cover their connections after the fact.


2 posted on 11/22/2009 8:34:44 AM PST by Senator Goldwater
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To: AJKauf
The president of the United States is killed on a friday. Two days later, the prime suspect is killed on national TV while in police custody. That fact has always struck me as just too weird. Add in the magic bullet, the loss of key pieces of evidence, etc. I dunno.
3 posted on 11/22/2009 8:42:07 AM PST by fhayek
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To: AJKauf

I’ve been up to the Sixth Floor and it doesn’t add up imo. Either Oswald was too nervous to take the obvious shot on Washington St. or he got a lucky last chance shot on Elm St. or there were other shooters. There is one thing for certain, we’ll never know the truth.


4 posted on 11/22/2009 8:46:30 AM PST by bgill (The framers of the US Constitution established an entire federal government in 18 pages.)
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To: AJKauf
I was in HS when Kennedy was murdered.

I've read all the books...except of course, wasting my time on the Warren Report.

No one - repeat NO ONE will every convince me that Kennedy was murdered by Oswald acting alone.

NO ONE!

5 posted on 11/22/2009 8:50:45 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got.)
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To: AJKauf

Read an anniversary article this morning which interviewed a 91-year-old former FBI agent who was present at the autopsy. He stated that he and the doctors all inspected a bullet hole in Kennedy’s left chest (in addition to the neck and head shots). I hadn’t heard of that before...


6 posted on 11/22/2009 8:52:07 AM PST by Flightdeck (Go Longhorns)
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To: Senator Goldwater
I still think it was a mob hit with some high level govt types trying to clumsily trying cover their connections after the fact.

I wouldn't preclude his recently deceased alcoholic brother's involvement...

7 posted on 11/22/2009 8:56:25 AM PST by Sir Francis Dashwood (Arjuna, why have you have dropped your bow???)
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To: AJKauf

Its America’s annual national conspiracy day!

Oswald killing Kennedy did change America. It gave us LBJ!


8 posted on 11/22/2009 8:57:49 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: Logic n' Reason
I've been a student of this assassination also and you are not alone in your belief.
9 posted on 11/22/2009 8:58:24 AM PST by mcshot (Our White Hut is not made up of the best and brightest, but they are practiced criminals.)
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To: AJKauf

I think Oswald was the lone shooter...but, his Russia connections and quick murder make me believe somebody else was behind it.


10 posted on 11/22/2009 9:03:54 AM PST by lacrew (The 274th trimester is a very late procedure)
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To: Reagan Man
Oswald killing Kennedy did change America. It gave us LBJ!

And IMO, that's exactly why he was killed. Kennedy just wasn't socialist enough.

11 posted on 11/22/2009 9:04:15 AM PST by TheThinker
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To: TheThinker
My sarcasm aside. IMO, there is no difference between JFK and LBJ, RFK and TFK. Liberalism is progressive by its nature.
12 posted on 11/22/2009 9:13:53 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: AJKauf

Though I don’t think Oswald was involved in the assassination and was merely a patsy, I see similarities between him and Obama in their extensive travel with no visible means of support.


13 posted on 11/22/2009 9:19:12 AM PST by Jack Wilson
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To: mcshot
I've been a student of this assassination also and you are not alone in your belief.

I believe that 65% of those that even care anymore have the same beliefs.

Unfortunately, beliefs are all we have at this point.

On the "good news" front....I'm old. So I'll soon die. Right after that event...I'll know for sure!!

If you send me $25 in cash...I promise to come back and let you know what I find out!!! (joke!).

Hang in...

14 posted on 11/22/2009 9:24:07 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got.)
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To: Reagan Man
Oswald killing Kennedy did change America. It gave us LBJ!

Yes it did! And that slob, that SOB sent my butt to Southeast Asia!

15 posted on 11/22/2009 9:26:22 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got.)
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To: AJKauf

We watched an interesting program last night on the History Channel - it broke down the 24 hours after JFK was killed and detailed all the infighting between the Kennedy crew and LBJ.
Attorney General RFK acted like a total a-hole of course, and Jackie received little assistance from anyone,having to lay on top of Jack’s corpse in the limo while the Secret Service was whisking Johnson to a secure room at Parkland.
The Dallas police didn’t want to release the body, and guns were drawn while the feds forced their way out of the hospital to Air Force One.


16 posted on 11/22/2009 9:38:45 AM PST by dainbramaged (If you want a friend, get a dog.)
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To: Reagan Man

“Oswald killing Kennedy did change America. It gave us LBJ!”

I’ll never forget the look on LBJ’s face when he was being sworn in. He looked like the cat that ate the canary.


17 posted on 11/22/2009 9:39:11 AM PST by Senormechanico
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To: dainbramaged

The Dallas police didn’t want to release the body, and guns were drawn while the feds forced their way out of the hospital to Air Force One.


I spent the years 81-88 at Parkland - this piece of info is dead on accurate - people still talk about this happening. The Dallas County Medical Examiner initially said - “This death occurred in Dallas County - so the autopsy will be in Dallas County”. The Secret Service with automatic weapons drawn stated that this was not how it was going to go down. People still talked about rounding a corner and some armed guy pointing a weapon at them.


18 posted on 11/22/2009 9:45:03 AM PST by 2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten
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To: Senormechanico
LBJ thought he was on course to be FDR2. Vietnam screwed up his plans. Can't wait for Obama to get his comeuppance. Paybacks are he!!!
19 posted on 11/22/2009 9:46:01 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: AJKauf

Oswald alone. He was a left wing commie radical with delusions of grandeur, when he finally came back from Russia he was expecting massive throngs of reporters, what he got was NOTHING. He tried to commit suicide the first time the Russians wanted to send him back to America.

He had tried to assassinate Right Wing General Walker a short time before he got the opportunity to shoot Kennedy.

Oswald was a bad shot MYTH, his records are available, he was a Sharpshooter, a better than average shot for a Marine and compared to the General Public, an excellent shot. His worst field performance was his last one when he was disillusioned with the Marines and trying to get out.

He was an open Communist in the Marines, the other Marines took to calling him “Oswaldski” which he took a liking to. He was regarded by most of the other Marines as a flake.

The shooting from the Texas School Book Depository was not that hard and has been recreated numerous times. The rifle was FINE, another myth.

There were 2 employees from the TSBD one floor directly below when the assassination took place. They testified to hearing BOOM, click, click BOOM, click click BOOM. They testified to the action of Oswald’s rifle long before Oswald’s rifle was found. They reported this right away, it’s part of the reason the TSBD was being swarmed after the shooting. A parade watcher who was facing the TSBD SAW the shooter in the window.

Computer recreations have proven that the shots came from Oswalds perch.

The “magic bullet” wasn’t magic at all, when placing the occupants properly in the limo the way they were at the shooting, the shots line up perfectly. Another myth.

Ruby was known as a braggard and blowhard, the absolute LAST person the mafia or anyone else would involve in a grand conspiracy to kill the POTUS. He thought he was going to be an American hero for killing Oswald, he thought no one would convict him. Oswald was delayed being moved, if he was moved on time Ruby wouldn’t have had a chance, he got there just as Oswald was being moved, pure luck. Ruby was a known CLOWN, not some mafia bigwig.

So many myths, so little time.

All these criss crossing conspiracies involving so many people.

The JFK assassination is NO DIFFERENT FROM 9/11.

There is overwhelming evidence that OSWALD and ISLAMICS both did the crimes.

Still Millions get sucked into the vortex instead of looking at it rationally, if people would take time to dissect the conspiracy theories about JFK the way they did with 9/11 conspiracy theories they would come to the same conclusion.

Oswald and the Terrorists are both obviously guilty and any other position is simply ridiculous.


20 posted on 11/22/2009 9:50:45 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: AJKauf

I do not care anymore.


21 posted on 11/22/2009 9:53:43 AM PST by verity (Obama Lies)
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To: lacrew

The bullet that made JFK’s head explode did not come from the book repository- get your facts straight


22 posted on 11/22/2009 9:55:50 AM PST by imjimbo (The constitution SHOULD be our "gun permit")
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To: Logic n' Reason

No one - repeat NO ONE will every convince me that Kennedy was murdered by Oswald acting alone.

NO ONE!

___________

Then you should change your screen name. Logic and Reason shows that Oswald did it alone. Read “Case Closed” and “Reclaiming History” and watch the numerous re-creations and documentaries that use modern forensics and science that show it could have only happened by Oswald from his perch.


23 posted on 11/22/2009 9:57:52 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: word_warrior_bob
Right on, warrior bob. Anybody who can take off the 911 Truther glasses can see there is NO evidence that anyone other than Oswald killed JFK. The sad part is many of the conspiracy theories grew from disinformation efforts of the KGB, starting with Mark Lane, and people here fall still for it.
24 posted on 11/22/2009 9:59:10 AM PST by SoCal Pubbie
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To: Reagan Man
It gave us LBJ!
Who sent over 50,000 American men to their deaths in VN and then destroyed America with his "Great Society."
25 posted on 11/22/2009 10:02:12 AM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: AJKauf

I have always thought that JFK was wacked in retaliation for the killing of Ngo Dinh Diem. Diem was no saint and had a lot of hard core followers - all very capabile of traveling to the US and shooting someone.....

In the end, JFK was gone, and LBJ began the Rape of America with the Dem majority he held in both houses.

And so today, we still pay (and pay, pay, pay) for that day.

Of course, your mileage may vary....


26 posted on 11/22/2009 10:07:22 AM PST by ASOC (Cave quid dicis, quando, et cui)
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To: imjimbo

The bullet that made JFK’s head explode did not come from the book repository- get your facts straight

__________

Yes, it did. Watch to the end where you see the results to the head from a shot from BEHIND. Unless you believe Kevin Costner in Oliver Stones JFK that the shot had to come from the front, back and to the left, back and to the left, back and to the left...LOL Leave it to Stone to get it 100% Ass Backwards.

The shot came from BEHIND, if Kennedy’s head splatter and exit wound went the OTHER way than what it did then you would have a conspiracy. Physics show a SHOT FROM BEHIND.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=745248745546892501#


27 posted on 11/22/2009 10:07:40 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: word_warrior_bob

Presidents are too important in the public’s mind to be killed by a “lone gunman” — Therefore, it has to be a conspiracy.

General officers killed in battle are killed by ‘snipers’; privates are killed by ‘random fire’. It’s a matter of the viewer’s prejudices.


28 posted on 11/22/2009 10:10:27 AM PST by Tallguy ("The sh- t's chess, it ain't checkers!" -- Alonzo (Denzel Washington) in "Training Day")
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To: word_warrior_bob
They tell us Oswald took three shots. One missed the limousine completely. Another went through Kennedy, caused two wounds to Connally, and then, very cooperatively, neatly exited Connally, saving the surgeons the trouble of having to remove it. This bullet did all this with having virtually no damaged being caused to it.

The third shot, supposedly came from the rear, yet Kennedy's head rockets backward. Mrs. Kennedy, probably in a state of shock, crawls onto the back of the limousine to retrieve parts of her husband's head. I have heard about nerve reflexes and how heads explode, but I have trouble with all of the mysterious explanations that seem to defy Occam's razor. Again, just my opinion, and I am always willing to listen to the debate.

29 posted on 11/22/2009 10:19:43 AM PST by fhayek
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To: Tallguy

You know what I find amazing and what the conspiracy crowd should take note of.

As technology increases and we have more and more tools to re-create crimes and solve them, all of the modern technology ALWAYS POINTS TO OSWALD.

Modern forensics, computer re-creations, bullet paths, wound analysis, etc., all points to OSWALD. What a coincidence.

Every time the JFK Assassination is put under scrutiny it keeps pointing AWAY from conspiracy and towards Oswald, I guess science is part of the conspiracy.


30 posted on 11/22/2009 10:22:47 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: word_warrior_bob

Yes. Another ‘conspiracy’ is the one about the lunar landings being faked. Now we’re seeing hi-res photos of the landing sites. Can’t get much better direct evidence than that. I’m waiting for those wacko’s to come up with a theory that explains away the physical evidence of the landings. Should be good for a laugh!


31 posted on 11/22/2009 10:26:19 AM PST by Tallguy ("The sh- t's chess, it ain't checkers!" -- Alonzo (Denzel Washington) in "Training Day")
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To: fhayek
This bullet did all this with having virtually no damaged being caused to it.

_______

You're repeating another MYTH, the bullet was totally consistent with the damage done.

Modern forensics have re-created the shot using cadavers models (gel and bone) and the bullets are consistent with the damage done to the "magic bullet" For the record here is the "PRISTINE BULLET"

Not so pristine is it? Nothing like the unfired bullet that was laid on the stretcher in the movie JFK.

As always, when these LIES are put under the microscope, they are proven to be lies, even when using modern science and re-creations. There is nothing "magic" nor "pristine" about the bullet, it is simply a LIE.

32 posted on 11/22/2009 10:29:15 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: word_warrior_bob
Then you should change your screen name. Logic and Reason shows that Oswald did it alone. Read “Case Closed” and “Reclaiming History” and watch the numerous re-creations and documentaries that use modern forensics and science that show it could have only happened by Oswald from his perch.

I've read them both...twice each. Along with 11 others.
I repeate (for your personal edification and enjoyment)...No one - repeat NO ONE will ever convince (read: prove) me that Oswald acted alone in the murder of the President. NO ONE!

Clear now??

BTW: your "screen name" ain't winnin' no awards either.

33 posted on 11/22/2009 10:29:28 AM PST by Logic n' Reason (If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got.)
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To: fhayek

As for the head flying backwards watch the video in post 27.

Kennedy’s head reaction is consistent with a bullet fired from BEHIND.

If only Kennedy’s head went the OTHER WAY, I would have to say it’s a conspiracy.

Every single time the evidence is analyzed, it points to Oswald.

People have been screaming for 45 years that Kennedy’s head movement MUST COME FROM FROM THE FRONT!!!!!!!!!!

They are 100% wrong, another persistent MYTH that 99% of the conspiracy crowd call a fact, never mind that PHYSICS show the shot came from behind.


34 posted on 11/22/2009 10:33:09 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: Reagan Man
Oswald killing Kennedy did change America. It gave us LBJ!

And that changed A LOT. From the Great Society to the way the War in Vietnam was fought and ultimately lost. Yes. Oswald (and any others) changed a lot, probably the whole world.

35 posted on 11/22/2009 10:37:36 AM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: Logic n' Reason

Hardcover: 1648 pages
Publisher: W.W. Norton & Co.; 1st edition (May 15, 2007)

Reclaiming History is 1648 pages, released 2 1/2 years ago and you READ IT TWICE??

If you read Case Closed and Reclaiming History twice and still believe it was a conspiracy, well, I would suggest some books on critical thinking. ; ) Read them FOUR times.


36 posted on 11/22/2009 10:38:02 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: Reagan Man
IMO, there is no difference between JFK and LBJ,

But LBJ was a "better" politician. JFK likely would not have been able to get nearly so much of the Great Society crapola passed. JFK also had first hand military experience, both in intelligence and operationally where the meat meets the metal. (LBJ was "theoretically" in the Navy, but it was very theoretical indeed, since he was already a Congress Critter at that time) It would have influenced the way Vietnam was fought, and likely would have gotten "Strange" McNamara "resigned" somewhat sooner.

37 posted on 11/22/2009 10:42:22 AM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: imjimbo

“The bullet that made JFK’s head explode did not come from the book repository- get your facts straight”

I really don’t want to go down this road....I don’t think we’ll solve a half century’s worth of argument here.

I did say that it was unlikely Oswald acted alone...just he was the only shooter. So, what difference does it make...so what if there was another trigger man? Rather than fixate on bullet trajectories, I have never understood why conspiracy theorists haven’t checked into Oswald’s phone calls, bank accounts, etc...the same goes for Jack Ruby - and add a search for what family member was threatened to blackmail Ruby...and why not investigate the ‘umbrella man’ in a similar fashion....

Or, we could argue over the physics of bullets for another 50 years.


38 posted on 11/22/2009 10:42:27 AM PST by lacrew (The 274th trimester is a very late procedure)
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To: AJKauf
Oswald. 3 shots. From the TSBD.

All else is conjecture with ZERO evidence.

Why did JFK's head snap backwards? Could have been because he was wearing this contraption to support his back.


39 posted on 11/22/2009 10:44:35 AM PST by Pistolshot (Brevity: Saying a lot, while saying very little.)
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To: lacrew

There’s nothing to argue about, every re-creation of the crime keeps pointing that the only possible conclusion are bullets fired from the 6th floor of the Texas School Book Depository, much to the chagrin of the conspiracy crowd.

I’m sure the conspiracy crowd figured 45 years later that eventually science would prove a conspiracy, instead it keeps pointing to Oswald, for anyone who’s willing to pay attention.


40 posted on 11/22/2009 10:45:39 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: Pistolshot

Check the vid in post 27, physics say the head would move backwards.

All these years the conspiracy crowd believing that the head shot proved it had to come from the front and all this time they have been 100% wrong.

If only the head moved the OTHER WAY!!! we would have to concede a conspiracy.

Over the years, even the conspiracy theorists have had to concede point after point, yet people even here still cite “facts” that have been proven to be lies.

You’re right there is ZERO evidence that it was anyone but Oswald. Every year here we have to blow up these myths.


41 posted on 11/22/2009 10:52:08 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: word_warrior_bob

Excellent synopsis Bob. Oswald acted alone.


42 posted on 11/22/2009 10:55:14 AM PST by nicksaunt
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To: Reagan Man

TFK ?


43 posted on 11/22/2009 10:55:14 AM PST by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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To: word_warrior_bob

Bob you lay out the facts but they do not want to hear them...head wound..the exit is the big hole...the exit hole is in the front ..


44 posted on 11/22/2009 10:57:12 AM PST by tophat9000 (Obama plans to fix America like he fixed his dog)
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To: word_warrior_bob

every re-creation of the crime keeps pointing that the only possible conclusion

bob.... that’s a ridiculous statement, but fits YOUR world view. you really have to guzzle kool aid by the gallon to buy the Warren report and to believe Ruby just happened to want to avenge Jackie’s pain...Puleeeeze! Sure let’s believe the PTB, they never lie to us.

may your chains rest lightly...

ymmv


45 posted on 11/22/2009 10:57:52 AM PST by ElectionInspector
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To: El Gato
Of course LBJ was a better politico. One major reason why JFK chose him as his VP running mate was based on Johnson's ability to get things done with the Congress and hopefully bring in Texas for the Dems. Which Johnson did, barely. However, I don't buy into this notion that JFK was less liberal then LBJ. That somehow JFK was a conservative. That is a total fallacy.

All one needs to do is look at the overall record of liberalism. Especially the leftward march of the entire Kennedy clan, from RFK to TFK. By 1968 RFK was moving hard left and we all know how things turned out with Ted Fat Kennedy. All progressives are alike.

46 posted on 11/22/2009 11:08:32 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: fieldmarshaldj
>>>>>>TFK?

Ted "Fat" Kennedy.

47 posted on 11/22/2009 11:09:45 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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To: ElectionInspector
Wrong, the evidence keeps pointing to Oswald, if the evidence pointed AWAY from Oswald I would say it was a conspiracy. It's not about my world view, it's about the science and the evidence, if I would like to spit in the face of the evidence and science I would be a conspiracy theorist.

The "powers that be" must have been thinking 45 years in the future to put together such a perfect conspiracy that modern science and forensics still point to Oswald. The "powers that be" are simply amazing.

It's always the conspiracy theorists with their wild-eyed theories that think others are mere sheep, just like the truther crowd think they're all geniuses.

Just by using "PTB" tells me a lot about where you're coming from, I found a picture of the "Powers That Be" that killed Kennedy.


48 posted on 11/22/2009 11:14:41 AM PST by word_warrior_bob (You can now see my amazing doggie and new puppy on my homepage!! Come say hello to Jake & Sonny)
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To: Reagan Man

Oh. I wondered if you meant him, technically his initials are EMK.


49 posted on 11/22/2009 11:18:16 AM PST by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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To: fieldmarshaldj
Who cares. Having some fun at the douche bags expense.
50 posted on 11/22/2009 11:22:54 AM PST by Reagan Man ("In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.")
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