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Pistol Blows up in Marshall County Deputy's Hand
WTRF-TV ^ | December 4, 2009 | Leigh Ann Towne

Posted on 12/18/2009 7:27:05 AM PST by Sam_Damon

A Marshall County Sheriff’s Deputy is recovering after a pistol blew up on Tuesday (November 30 -- sd) during qualifications, according to Chief Deputy Kevin Cecil.

The veteran officer was using a Glock 21 .45 caliber pistol with out of country ammunition at a shooting range outside of Moundsville, Cecil said.

It’s believed the ammunition was bad, causing the receiver to blow apart in the sergeant’s hand.

(Excerpt) Read more at wtrf.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; News/Current Events; US: West Virginia
KEYWORDS: banglist; glock; police
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Mods: posting the older article because WTRF has not updated their site with the information the deputy is now out of the hospital. IIRC what I heard on a recent newscast of theirs, the injured deputy will be off duty for a month as a result of this accident.

Questions to the banglist: any ideas what might cause the Glock 21 to fly apart like this? AFAIK, the Marshall County (WV) SD has sent the pistol and ammo in question back to Glock for analysis.

1 posted on 12/18/2009 7:27:08 AM PST by Sam_Damon
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To: Sam_Damon

+P+ ammunition? Uncleared barrel obstruction?

Without seeing the remains of the weapon its hard to say.


2 posted on 12/18/2009 7:29:43 AM PST by rahbert (If not by the power of persuasion, then by the persuasion of power - Andy Stein)
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To: Sam_Damon

I heard there were some slide failures.


3 posted on 12/18/2009 7:30:33 AM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (THE SECOND AMENDMENT, A MATTER OF FACT, NOT A MATTER OF OPINION)
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To: Sam_Damon

“with out of country ammunition”

Why are our police and sheriff’s buying ammo made outside the USA?


4 posted on 12/18/2009 7:30:45 AM PST by edcoil (If I had 1 cent for every dollar the government saved, Bill Gates and I would be friends.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Squib load followed by a live round...


5 posted on 12/18/2009 7:31:00 AM PST by MrB (The difference between a humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: rahbert

True.

AFAIK, the only pix might be at the sheriff’s department. Perhaps they might release a couple. We’ll see.


6 posted on 12/18/2009 7:31:14 AM PST by Sam_Damon
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To: Sam_Damon
My guess, if he was using cheap reloads, is that somebody at the factory double-charged the shell. With a .45 ACP, that would be enough to shatter the case and the receiver as well.

I'm not as familiar with the Glock as the 1911A1 and the Sig, but whatever the weak point of the receiver is (locking lugs, ejector mount) would blow first, and if that's in the rear of the receiver you take the brunt of it on your hand and face (hopefully he had good shooting glasses).

7 posted on 12/18/2009 7:31:35 AM PST by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: Sam_Damon

Maybe a squib??


8 posted on 12/18/2009 7:32:16 AM PST by CrappieLuck
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To: Sam_Damon

I am personally suprised a GLOCK would do that, barring barrel obstruction.

I have several .40s, and they are seriously stout weapons.

Curious if the .45 is a “hollowed out” .40 or somesuch, making thinner walled (and thus weaker) by design.


9 posted on 12/18/2009 7:32:34 AM PST by TheThirdRuffian (Nothing to see here. Move along.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Double charge.


10 posted on 12/18/2009 7:32:44 AM PST by muddler
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To: edcoil

“Why are our police and sheriff’s buying ammo made outside the USA?”

Maybe because it was available.


11 posted on 12/18/2009 7:33:02 AM PST by Busywhiskers ("Once you have wrestled, everything else in life is easy" -Dan Gable)
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To: MrB
With a .45 you ought to hear the squib. Unless he was in rapid fire mode and had already pulled the trigger while going "Huh?"

Usually everybody who hears the < ploop > yells "CEASE FIRE!" at the top of their lungs.

12 posted on 12/18/2009 7:33:14 AM PST by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: Sam_Damon

Don’t think you are supposed to shoot unjacketed lead rounds in those due to the rifling technique used. Cheap reloads with lead foul the barrel to the point this can happen.


13 posted on 12/18/2009 7:33:29 AM PST by DesertRhino (Dogs earn thi title of "man's best friend", Muslims hate dogs,,add that up.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Loading error -— double powder charge ...


14 posted on 12/18/2009 7:33:43 AM PST by Tarpon ( ...)
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To: edcoil

Taget practice?


15 posted on 12/18/2009 7:34:13 AM PST by TheThirdRuffian (Nothing to see here. Move along.)
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To: Eaker; humblegunner; Bacon Man; Hap

Yikes ping!


16 posted on 12/18/2009 7:34:43 AM PST by Xenalyte (Yes, Chef!)
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To: Sam_Damon

Bullet stuck in the barrel from a squib load and subsequent failure when the deputy fired the next round. You said he was using questionable ammo so it’s possible. With a squib load the gun doesn’t go bang like it would normally and the slide won’t feed the next round so you’ve got 2 warning signs that something is wrong. I have had a squib load in my .45 (I reload so the fault was all mine) but I knew to check the barrel for an obstruction. Of course, it may not have been a squib load but it’s one possibility.


17 posted on 12/18/2009 7:35:28 AM PST by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: Sam_Damon

Interesting post and thread. Thanks to all contributors.

What is the root cause? How many time has that ever happened? What is the probability of that happening? What variables need to be addressed?


18 posted on 12/18/2009 7:35:39 AM PST by PGalt
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To: Sam_Damon

There is a difference between 45ACP & 45AGP.


19 posted on 12/18/2009 7:35:49 AM PST by Deaf Smith
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To: Sam_Damon
"Guns don't kill people - ammunition kills people!"
20 posted on 12/18/2009 7:35:49 AM PST by headsonpikes (Genocide is the highest sacrament of socialism - "Who-whom?")
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To: rahbert
+P+ ammunition?

didn't know .45 auto came in +p or +p+ ... thought that was only for .38 special

21 posted on 12/18/2009 7:37:05 AM PST by TheRightGuy (I want MY BAILOUT ... a billion or two should do!)
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To: edcoil
Why are our police and sheriff’s buying ammo made outside the USA?

0bama's fault

22 posted on 12/18/2009 7:38:12 AM PST by TYVets (Let's Roll!!! The leadership of the GOP has no spine and no guts, but we conservatives do)
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To: Deaf Smith
There is a difference between 45ACP & 45AGP.

It should read 45GAP.

Glock Automatic Pistol


23 posted on 12/18/2009 7:38:30 AM PST by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your law is my delight.)
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To: Sam_Damon

IIRC from the first story that I read on one of the gun boards, Was that it was the first round fired from a brand new Glock....


24 posted on 12/18/2009 7:39:03 AM PST by muddler
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To: TheRightGuy

I have .45 ACP in +P, but I have not seen +P+ in that caliber.

Had a friend who bought a .380 used and found a .32 round stuck in the barrel, but it sounds like he has had this weapon for awhile.


25 posted on 12/18/2009 7:43:05 AM PST by catman67
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To: UriÂ’el-2012
Got it.

I don't shoot glocks...what is the difference in the specs?

*I have also observed LEO's trying to shoot their 'well oiled' firearms. All that gas had to go somewhere.

26 posted on 12/18/2009 7:43:29 AM PST by Deaf Smith
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To: Sam_Damon
I'm not a glock hater but if you do “bing” (I'm not using google anymore) on “glock kaboom” you will come up with quite a few hits.

The rifling in glock’s pistol barrels are what is commonly referred to “polygonal” type and while there are advantages in both manufacturing and application they do foul with lead easier. When fouled they can actually cause a kaboom.

27 posted on 12/18/2009 7:43:35 AM PST by Durus (The People have abdicated our duties and anxiously hopes for just two things, "Bread and Circuses")
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To: Sam_Damon

No doubt he was using Wolf ammo from russia. I used it once and had lots of trouble with 45 acp. 9mm no problem. Its cheap but not worth it.


28 posted on 12/18/2009 7:46:29 AM PST by Stray Gator
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To: Sam_Damon
The feed ramp on a .40 Glock is oversized so the case is not fully supported. Because the .40 S&W is a high pressure round, brass weakened by repeated reloading will sometimes result in a catastrophic head separation. That shouldn't happen with the lower pressure .45 ACP, but I'm not familiar with the .45 GAP -- if that was the caliber.

I shoot a Springfield XDM myself.

29 posted on 12/18/2009 7:46:51 AM PST by old3030 (I lost some time once. It's always in the last place you look.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Glock tells you to use only fully jacketed ammo and absolutely no re-loads. There is also a problem with the cartridge being unsupported on the .40SW Glocks due to the geometry of the infeed ramp. Might be a similar thing with the .45ACP, but I don’t know.

Google ‘Glock KaBoom’ and you’ll get all the dope.


30 posted on 12/18/2009 7:47:57 AM PST by Tallguy ("The sh- t's chess, it ain't checkers!" -- Alonzo (Denzel Washington) in "Training Day")
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To: Deaf Smith
I don't shoot glocks...what is the difference in the specs?

*I have also observed LEO's trying to shoot their 'well oiled' firearms. All that gas had to go somewhere.

It is analogous to a 10mm and 40S&W
same bullet shorter case

It allows a 45bullet in a 9mm frame pistol.

Been around for years.


31 posted on 12/18/2009 7:49:20 AM PST by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your law is my delight.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Examples and Info, not the event in question;

“She was shooting Wolf .40 S&W ammo”
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-139656.html

The issue...
http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/kb-notes.html#a5

Info...
http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html

A pretty good discussion...
http://glocktalk.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-1050290.html


32 posted on 12/18/2009 7:49:40 AM PST by TLI ( ITINERIS IMPENDEO VALHALLA)
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To: TheThirdRuffian

Actuall, the .40SW Glocks have earned somewhat of a reputation for the “KaBOOM!”. Mostly attributed to the unsupported case on the factory chamber.

I have two .40 Glocks, and have never had these problem, but numerous instances are documented.

And remember the only “stout” portion of the Glock is the slide and barrel. With a case-head separation under pressure, everything goes into the polymer frame and down the magazine well.


33 posted on 12/18/2009 7:49:52 AM PST by SJSAMPLE
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To: TheRightGuy

9 mm luger comes in both, fwiw


34 posted on 12/18/2009 7:50:59 AM PST by tgusa (Gun control: deep breath, sight alignment, squeeze the trigger ....)
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To: TheRightGuy

9mm also - I have some +P+ that I’ve yet to shoot.

Not sure my Ruger P95 is up to it...


35 posted on 12/18/2009 7:52:00 AM PST by green iguana
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To: TheRightGuy

Quick Google search:

Federal 185 grain .45 ACP +P Hydra-Shok Ammunition
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/AMM517-5.html


36 posted on 12/18/2009 7:52:16 AM PST by rahbert (If not by the power of persuasion, then by the persuasion of power - Andy Stein)
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To: edcoil

There’s a lot of cheap stuff being dumped from the Czech Republic. Those who have budget issues might be using this stuff. Not me. Case in point.


37 posted on 12/18/2009 7:53:39 AM PST by Obadiah (Obama: Chains you can believe in!)
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To: Stray Gator

I agree. I used Wolf when that was all I could get. Now that the market is opening up, I’m down to my last box of Wolf. Don’t like it, their QC appears off, too many ‘fliers’ compared to domestic ammo. But it’s better than nothing.


38 posted on 12/18/2009 7:53:40 AM PST by tgusa (Gun control: deep breath, sight alignment, squeeze the trigger ....)
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To: MrB
Squib load followed by a live round...

I came a split second to having that same exact thing almost happen to me once with an old ruger. I thought I was just totally off the mark and missed the target completely. Praise God my friend next to me was smarter and had me check down the barrel. Saved me a trip to the hospital and probably my life.

39 posted on 12/18/2009 7:54:43 AM PST by PureSolace (Trust in God)
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To: Deaf Smith

The .45GAP was another answer to a question nobody asked.

A shorter .45 case to allow for a smaller frame, while allowing .45ACP-like specs. The thought is that modern powders will allow it to perform like the .45ACP.

Unfortunately, nobody was really bitching about the size of a standard or hi-cap .45ACP frame that much.


40 posted on 12/18/2009 7:55:19 AM PST by SJSAMPLE
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To: Tallguy
There's a small portion of the case that isn't well supported in the 1911A1, but it's at the strongest part of the case, where it meets the base.

If you really load up with a fast burning powder and you use often-reloaded cases, you'll find a bulge at the base of your shells to match the side of the receiver.

But I have never had one blow there. Plenty of cracked case mouths when I used a hull once too often . . .

I had heard all the reports (no pun intended) of Glock "kabooms" myself, so when I was looking for a DA pistol I went with the Sig instead. Just comparing the two, I thought the fit and finish on the Glock were inferior. That of course doesn't necessarily mean the working parts are bad, but it indicates to me a lack of attention to detail that might carry over into design and/or manufacture.

41 posted on 12/18/2009 7:56:59 AM PST by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: TLI; All

Thanks for the links. Educational. Thanks to all posters.


42 posted on 12/18/2009 7:57:12 AM PST by PGalt
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To: SJSAMPLE
Unfortunately, nobody was really bitching about the size of a standard or hi-cap .45ACP frame that much.

If a little suburban matron like me has carried a 1911A1 for 30 years with no problems, what's to complain about?

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Sometimes it's just the marketing geniuses trying to promote a product.

43 posted on 12/18/2009 7:58:58 AM PST by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: tgusa

You could always reload . . . then you’d have exactly what you want and you can stock up on components for cheap.


44 posted on 12/18/2009 8:00:35 AM PST by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: PureSolace

squib load?


45 posted on 12/18/2009 8:05:09 AM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: longtermmemmory

yup. The bullet was stuck right there in the barrel. Apparently there wasn’t enough powder or pressure or something to push it all the way out...

A cleaning rod was able to push it out... loaded a new round, and the gun worked fine.

It does happen... it’s rare. But it does happen.

(This happened over 10 years ago back when we treated guns as toys. I’m glad we’ve come to learn to treat and respect things differently now without loss of life and limb.)

Peace.


46 posted on 12/18/2009 8:07:37 AM PST by PureSolace (Trust in God)
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To: Stray Gator

“No doubt he was using Wolf ammo from russia. I used it once and had lots of trouble with 45 acp. 9mm no problem. Its cheap but not worth it.”

I use it quite often in my RI and have had no problems at all, probably 300 rounds of Wolf .45 acp without a hitch. What did you shoot it with?


47 posted on 12/18/2009 8:07:56 AM PST by antisocial (Texas SCV - Deo Vindice)
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To: MrB

How does a squib cycle the slide and chamber the next round?


48 posted on 12/18/2009 8:08:44 AM PST by Tijeras_Slim (Live jubtabulously!)
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To: Tijeras_Slim

Good point - you should be looking at a jam there.
Others have said it’s possible, though -

let’s get others’ comments on it.


49 posted on 12/18/2009 8:11:10 AM PST by MrB (The difference between a humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: Sam_Damon

Gee....I’ve never seen a Glock “revolver”.


50 posted on 12/18/2009 8:12:13 AM PST by dtrpscout (A bad dog is better than most good people.)
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