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'Naked machines' headed for airports
Oklahoma Watchdog ^ | January 5, 2010 | Andrew W. Griffin

Posted on 01/05/2010 8:30:13 PM PST by SoonerStorm09

OKLAHOMA CITY – Will Rogers World Airport will get full body scanners like the one at Tulsa International, though at least one area resident says the “naked machines” will be enough to keep her from flying.

Following the attempted Christmas Day bombing of Northwest flight 253, the federal Transportation Security Administration has ramped up plans to make sure airline travelers are thoroughly searched and even scanned in new machines.

Some travelers are not thrilled with the idea of having to go through the body scanners, or “naked machine,” as Norman resident and activist Kaye Beach calls them.

“The way I understand it, they have capability to record (the image), though they say they don’t. I’m sorry, but the ‘trust us’ route doesn’t work.”

“The airport route has gotten to be such a hassle and uncomfortable that I will pretty much not fly, unless there’s an emergency,” Beach said. “I will never go through a naked machine and my daughter will not go through a naked machine. It’s definitely altered my habits. I used to like to fly and liked going to airports. Not any more. I feel like a criminal going through there.”

Beach said that she is suspicious of people like former Department of Homeland Security head Michael Chertoff who advocate body scanners and have interests in a company, the Chertoff Group with a client that makes the machines, according to The Washington Post.

A report out of Britain’s Guardian newspaper notes that detail may break child pornography laws there.

(Excerpt) Read more at oklahoma.watchdog.org ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Oklahoma
KEYWORDS: body; imaging; naked; oklahoma
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1 posted on 01/05/2010 8:30:15 PM PST by SoonerStorm09
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: SoonerStorm09

3 posted on 01/05/2010 8:33:33 PM PST by gaijin
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To: SoonerStorm09

This whole strategy will become completely different once scans of young teenage girls hit the internet. In fact, those are precisely the scan examples they are refusing to release or even discuss right now, because the visuals would so outrage the country.

And remember, every scan is linked to the person’s complete ID information.


4 posted on 01/05/2010 8:37:27 PM PST by Talisker (When you find a turtle on top of a fence post, you can be damn sure it didn't get there on it's own.)
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To: Morgana
Don't worry, they'll probably excuse Muslims from going through it because it violates their religious standards of modesty or some such idiocy.

I wish I could say that's a joke, but I'd actually give it a non-zero chance of happening with odumber in charge.

5 posted on 01/05/2010 8:37:40 PM PST by ThunderSleeps (obama out now! I'll keep my money, my guns, and my freedom - you can keep the change.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

Personally I think every fifth scan
should be sent to a public monitor
in the terminal.
It would make waiting a snap.


6 posted on 01/05/2010 8:39:43 PM PST by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

Just thought about pregnant women and how this would affect the baby? Also other health concerns with this technology.


7 posted on 01/05/2010 8:44:38 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

As an executive pilot I do not fly commercial. I’ll take AMTRAK home or rent a car if I have to if it’s a one-way flight.


8 posted on 01/05/2010 8:50:42 PM PST by SkyDancer (I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice)
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Comment #9 Removed by Moderator

To: SoonerStorm09

Punishing Americans for Muslim terrorist actions. The ways of the politically correct never cease to disgust me.


10 posted on 01/05/2010 8:57:46 PM PST by Jeb21 (www.jewsagainstobama.com)
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To: tet68
Personally I think every fifth scan should be sent to a public monitor in the terminal.
It would make waiting a snap.

Although it sounds like a great idea, my first thought is that "Aren't most people a bit fat?"

Well, I did an Internet search for "Millimeter wave scanner images" and trust me, not only are most people carrying a roll of fat around their middle, even the images of the ladies don't look very good without their hair and makeup.

11 posted on 01/05/2010 8:59:05 PM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: gaijin
The attempted bombing of Delta/Northwest 253 on Christmas Day was not the first from the Islamic terrorists nor will it be the last. Since I am a pilot, I have had people ask what can a passenger do onboard an airplane to help thwart a terrorist attack. Having personal experience with a few events myself, as well as reading articles and hearing stories from other crewmembers, I can give you some information which might assist you in dealing with a suspicious passenger or situation.



As Robert Novak said - "Always love your country - but never trust your government"
How to Recognize and Fight a Terrorist on a Plane

Click Here

to read this possible life saving advice from an airline pilot.

"de omnibus dubitandum"
doubt everything (especially from our government)



The Name is
"Zero"
Not Zorro!



12 posted on 01/05/2010 9:01:31 PM PST by B-Cause (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

I am sooo terribly hoping that there is a TON of these “naked” images of Muslims hacked and distributed across the internet.

Maybe then it will get through their indoctrinated dead fish eyed minds that...

You
Are
Not
Welcomed
Here!


13 posted on 01/05/2010 9:05:07 PM PST by Eye of Unk (Phobos, kerdos, and doxa, said the Time Traveler. “Fear, self-interest, and honor.”)
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To: SoonerStorm09

An Airliner is nothing more than a glorified flying Greyhound bus. I will not be subjected to being treated like a potential terrorist and scanned just to travel. I have driven clear across the U.S.A. and back. I will do it again if I have to.


14 posted on 01/05/2010 9:09:47 PM PST by Inyo-Mono (Had God not driven man from the Garden of Eden the Sierra Club surely would have.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

The screeners are offering to give up their health care plan and take a massive pay cut in exchange for putting Helen Thomas on the no-fly-list.


15 posted on 01/05/2010 9:11:43 PM PST by death2tyrants
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To: SoonerStorm09

Sales of Spanx have quadrupled.

The “pinch” and “peel” process is known to be laborious and painful.

Add 25 minutes per Spanx removal.

All airports should have copious amounts of of Advil and, in cases of extreme emergency, lots of Body Glide Skin Lubricant.

Delta 441 has been delayed 3.25 hours.


16 posted on 01/05/2010 9:14:34 PM PST by carolina71
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To: antceecee

Word from those working on such systems is that the radiation levels involved are significantly less than the radiation exposure of the flight itself.


17 posted on 01/05/2010 9:16:09 PM PST by ctdonath2 (Virtue is to be apologized for. Depravity commands respect. - Galt)
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To: SoonerStorm09

Dumbasses are scanning for things. We are playing catchup as the terrorists constantly change their MO. And we’ll never overcome this.

Dumbasses need to be scanning for people.

I know that’s not politically correct, but consider that continuing this PC crap is gonna get another bunch of us killed.


18 posted on 01/05/2010 9:17:32 PM PST by upchuck (The horse is in the pasture. The barn door is wide-open. Obama wants to know who made the hinges.)
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To: upchuck
We are playing catchup as the terrorists constantly change their MO.

That's it in a nutshell. We just react instead of thinking ahead. I keep seeing people on news reports standing in airports saying they "feel safer". Do you FEEL safer or ARE you safer?

The issue isn't being seen naked on a screen, it is that it is a reactionary move. Will the people who submit to it and "feel safer" take the same attitude after a terrorist is caught with explosives in a body cavity and the TSA has stirrups and a mammography machine at check-in?
19 posted on 01/05/2010 9:28:31 PM PST by LostInBayport (When the riders in the cart outnumber those pulling the cart, the cart stops moving. My back hurts.)
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To: SoonerStorm09
Just imagine all the fat, geeky TSA screeners getting an eye full of naked women passing by. They will probably record the good ones for viewing later. Cute girls may resist air travel.


20 posted on 01/05/2010 9:30:42 PM PST by garjog (Used to be liberals were just people to disagree with. Now they are a threat to our existence.)
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To: upchuck; SoonerStorm09
Dumbasses are scanning for things. We are playing catchup as the terrorists constantly change their MO. And we’ll never overcome this.

Dumbasses need to be scanning for people.

I know that’s not politically correct, but consider that continuing this PC crap is gonna get another bunch of us killed.

Absolutely. Thank you. Yes.

21 posted on 01/05/2010 9:31:53 PM PST by thecodont
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To: B-Cause
Hope you don't mind I copied and pasted the info from the link... (Edited by me a bit for brevity):

How to Recognize and Fight a Terrorist on a Plane

Since I am a pilot, I have had people ask what can a passenger do onboard an airplane to help thwart a terrorist attack.... I can give you some information which might assist you in dealing with a suspicious passenger or situation.

The first thing to realize is that there are a few different scenarios which the terrorists could be using on your particular flight... Options include testing TSA and law enforcement personnel, testing passengers and crewmembers, observation, dry run/practice, and actual execution of an attack. Of course it is hard to differentiate which scenario is playing out until after your flight lands, but it might assist you in recognizing the threat and knowing how serious your reaction should be if you know all of the options. In most of these instances, their job is to also scare you. Terrorists create terror. If you stop flying, they win. So be pro-active. Maybe something you do will cause them to call off the attack.

As a passenger you must be observant and vigilant. Most often someone notices some unusual activity or behavior. It doesn’t have to be just a person either. Suspicious bags, luggage, packages, notes, pillows, and electronic devices have been found on planes. One of the biggest advantages you have is the ability to profile. TSA refuses to do the obvious thanks to political correctness. Everyone knows who is committing these attacks -- Muslim, Middle-Eastern men between 18 and 40. Maybe al Qaeda is trying to recruit others than don’t fit this profile but it sure fits the mold right now.

Some things to look for: groups or pairs of men, a passenger talking to themselves, speaking Arabic, watching crewmembers (this is different than looking), staring at the cockpit door, long stays or multiple trips to the lavatory, reading a book but not turning any pages, nervousness, being unusual by trying to fit in, taking pictures/videos, not making eye contact. When you are at the boarding area and on the plane if you notice a suspicious passenger, look for others. How many? If it is one or two then they could be planning on bombing the aircraft or just making observations of crew procedures. 6 or more? Then this cell’s objective would be hijacking the plane by brute force. Also remember that there are sleepers that try to blend in with the other passengers and could be very hard to notice. A website reports a well-dressed man in custody that was also a passenger on Delta Flight 253. After an incident, your entire plane might be delayed for security and they will treat everyone as suspects. Also expect the government and airline to try to cover up parts or all of an event.

A recent example of a possible test occurred on Nov 17 with an Airtran flight from Atlanta to Houston. Eleven Muslim men got on the plane and caused a big disturbance and ended with passengers assisting the flight attendants in the commotion. TSA was called, they took the men off, talked to them, and put them back on. The crewmembers walked off the plane refusing to fly it, and then passengers walked off as well. The terrorists tested the TSA and passengers but probably also threatened lawsuits to the government and Airtran. This could be setting up a later mission with hopes the TSA and airline would be afraid to take them off the plane. Just like the Delta flight, the final layer of security, the crewmembers and passengers, are the ones who might have prevented an attack, nothing the government did was successful.

The best time to do something is prior to boarding and before the aircraft pushes back from the gate while the door is still open. This is when you have some control in the situation and easier for the captain to get involved. Before you board you can talk to a TSA employee or gate agent and explain your concerns. The gate agents are usually very busy and might give you the brush off. Talk to other passengers. While on the plane you will have to find a flight attendant, which could prove difficult because at times the boarding process can be quite chaotic. If one flight attendant seems to ignore you then talk to the other one. Maybe ask to see the captain. Write a note. If you are really scared, grab your bags, say you are sick, and get off the plane. Some crewmembers can be just as ignorant about the serious nature of the threat as our government officials...

While seated look for able-bodied men, military personnel, or deadheading crew to assist you. Maybe you notice a suspicious passenger but do not feel it warrants a visit with TSA/Flight Attendant or it happens inflight . Volunteer yourself or change seats on your own to sit next to or right behind any suspicious passengers. A recent crew moved a soldier to sit next to a nervous Middle-Eastern passenger before pushback. Once while I was deadheading in coach during a flight, the captain told the flight attendant to move me next to a suspicious passenger.

Once airborne there are limited options. Talking to the flight attendants and moving seats is basically all you can do. A divert takes time and would be a major emergency...

If an actual attack occurs, then all bets are off. Take Action! DO NOT wait for crewmember instruction! This is a life or death situation. The terrorists will be hoping for the element of surprise. You will probably die anyways if the terrorists are successful so you might as well die giving them a fight. If it is a hijacking, block the aisles and do not let them get to the cockpit. For a bombing, jump on the passenger and separate him from the ignition source. For a suspicious package, box, etc. there is a place on the plane to move it to, but do not move it until necessary and with guidance from the crew.

The airlines are doing their best just to stay in business with the recession, bad weather, tough competition, and low fares. The employees are very frustrated with pay cuts, long hours, full planes, grumpy customers and poor morale. The commercial aviation system wasn’t designed to fight terrorists. And don’t necessarily blame the TSA and law enforcement agencies. They have some really hard working personnel trying to protect us. It is the policies implemented by people working in the U.S. government that is the problem...

22 posted on 01/05/2010 9:35:41 PM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: upchuck
Here is a graphic from at pro TSA blog. It is used to show that they are not spying on large numbers of people on the "watch list". But, it also illustrates how crazy it is to make two million people suffer indigities following near useless "safety policies".

Why not focus on Islamic extremists and those who have a record of sympathizing with them (liberals) and let the rest of go free.


23 posted on 01/05/2010 9:39:24 PM PST by garjog (Used to be liberals were just people to disagree with. Now they are a threat to our existence.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

Have they shipped the cases of Depends to be issued as we get on the airplanes? That way we can urinate and defecate in our Depends during the hour we’re not allowed to use the lavatories. Anyone ask about the radiation they’re dosing you up with when shoving you through their machines?


24 posted on 01/05/2010 9:50:36 PM PST by ExTexasRedhead (Clean the RAT/RINO Sewer in 2010 and 2012)
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To: ctdonath2

Somehow I don’t quite trust or believe them.


25 posted on 01/05/2010 9:54:36 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: Screaming_Gerbil
How to spot a terrorist?

Look for hidden weapons.


26 posted on 01/05/2010 9:59:58 PM PST by garjog (Used to be liberals were just people to disagree with. Now they are a threat to our existence.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

First of all these scans are designed to detect metal - the eunuch bomber’s ‘package’ was not metallic. So, as usual they react with ineffective, privacy invading non-sense.

Nothing short of following the Israeli model will keep us safe. Pols do not have the nads to profile. They’d better stop worrying about offending muzzies that no one wants in this country anyway and start worrying about the American people.

We are now very close to considering ‘our’ leaders our enemies.


27 posted on 01/05/2010 10:06:59 PM PST by Let's Roll (Stop paying ACORN to destroy America! Cut off their government funding!)
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To: garjog

Ha Ha - Looks like a cute little armed gerbil :-)


28 posted on 01/05/2010 10:08:07 PM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: Inyo-Mono
I predict Triple A, Motel 6, Flying J Truck Stops and other motor travel businesses will see increased business. I never liked flying in the first place, and now have yet another reason to drive wherever I go.

Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!

29 posted on 01/05/2010 10:21:59 PM PST by wku man (Who says conservatives don't rock? Go to www.myspace.com/rockfromtheright)
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To: Talisker

children too watch the perverts come out to get a job to peek..dog sniffing bombs at every gate will do a lot since the terrorist will be stuffing bombs up the wazoo and profiling does work if the idiots will just do the job and not worry about rights. ask the 9/11 victims about their rights!


30 posted on 01/05/2010 10:22:34 PM PST by FreeperFlirt
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To: SoonerStorm09

Notice the lack of outrage?

The conditioning is working.

Ten years ago they wouldn’t have considered this.

For those who think bad things can’t happen here.

Oh, and keep in mind that the process of enslavement gets faster as it goes.

Imagine what it will be like in twenty years.

But don’t worry, another election cycle will save us. NOT!


31 posted on 01/05/2010 10:29:55 PM PST by Boucheau
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To: SoonerStorm09
I flew out of Tulsa last week. The procedure used was "step into the machine, please. Put your hands up and make like a reindeer. " No explanations. No choices. No alternatives.

It was great. I felt very safe flying out of Tulsa.

32 posted on 01/05/2010 10:34:03 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Talisker
The contents of your post are total imaginary bull crap.

No recording is made. The person seeing the back scatter image does not see a normal image of the person. The guy looking at you from the machine image could not pick you out in line up. Your disinformation is more a representation of your warped imagination than any reality.

33 posted on 01/05/2010 10:38:56 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: antceecee

More BS. The radiation you get from this machine is less than you get from your cell phone.


34 posted on 01/05/2010 10:40:05 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Jeff Gordon

Sorry, but there are conflicting reports about cell phone radiation as well. It amazes me that extensive testing is done on just about everything in this country that is sold to the public, but where is the testing on this? Present it to the public. True scientific tests not Al Gore fantasies.


35 posted on 01/05/2010 10:48:31 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: Jeff Gordon

After answering your post to me I saw this one as well... do you have a vested interest in selling this technology?


36 posted on 01/05/2010 10:49:46 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: Screaming_Gerbil
Talk to your Sensei about the best way to take down a terrorist in a crowed air plane. Mine says to get him in choke hold and hold it until he passes out. That should take less than ten seconds. It is usually less than 5 seconds. You may kill him but that is better than the him killing you. This was the technique used by a 70 year old American to kill a robber of his tour buss in Costa Rica.


37 posted on 01/05/2010 10:54:55 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: antceecee
do you have a vested interest in selling this technology?

Nope. I am retired. I know no one who works in that arena. I have not investments in the arena. I do, however, value the lives of my family and myself. I am not willing to sacrifice them to the alter of political correctness.

38 posted on 01/05/2010 10:58:32 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Jeff Gordon
I felt good about it, too, until they said "You can step out now, Miss".

My feelings is hurt.

39 posted on 01/05/2010 11:05:34 PM PST by MARTIAL MONK (I'm waiting for the POP!)
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To: Screaming_Gerbil
Before you board you can talk to a TSA employee...l

Uh-huh. That makes me feel real confident. Do I have to wait until they've swallowed their french-fries?

40 posted on 01/06/2010 5:01:58 AM PST by Sarajevo (You're jealous because the voices only talk to me.)
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To: Jeff Gordon; Talisker; antceecee
Your disinformation is more a representation of your warped imagination than any reality.

OK, JG- Don't just shill for a governmental agency whose prime objective is to strip dignity from decent people, Prove it!

41 posted on 01/06/2010 5:06:57 AM PST by Sarajevo (You're jealous because the voices only talk to me.)
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To: Jeff Gordon
Talk to your Sensei about the best way to take down a terrorist in a crowed air plane. Mine says to get him in choke hold and hold it until he passes out. That should take less than ten seconds. It is usually less than 5 seconds. You may kill him but that is better than the him killing you. This was the technique used by a 70 year old American to kill a robber of his tour buss in Costa Rica.

Thank you for mentioning the effectiveness of the figure-four choke-hold / strangle-hold.

I wondered about how an older guy was able to take out a younger guy, but since you told me that it makes sense now.

I know some of the "older guys" are WW2, Korean war, or Vietnam vets and have killed an enemy in close combat before and could do it again if they had to.

Chokehold (wikipedia)

Here is a link to a Youtube video of a pretty cool demonstration of the technique used to put an opponent to sleep performed here by Cris Cyborg...

Reporter regrets interviewing Cris Cybor

42 posted on 01/06/2010 5:53:15 AM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: Sarajevo

Prove it? The procedures and capabilities of the scanners are easily found with a Google search. None of your imaginary issues are fact based.


43 posted on 01/06/2010 1:33:03 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Screaming_Gerbil

I noted that the guy in the image you proved was not doing the hold properly. He did not have an effective left arm lock.


44 posted on 01/06/2010 1:36:44 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Jeff Gordon
I noted that the guy in the image you provided was not doing the hold properly. He did not have an effective left arm lock.

You are correct - he doesn't have a good figure four lock with the palm of his hand on the back of his opponent's head pushing forward, so his opponent could turn his head and neck to oppose the chokehold.

Good call.

At least Cris Cyborg gets it right and shows us how it's done here:

Cris Cyborg Chokes Out Reporter

(I was surprised that they guy went unconscious that fast).

45 posted on 01/06/2010 4:27:16 PM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: Jeff Gordon
I noted that the guy in the image you provided was not doing the hold properly. He did not have an effective left arm lock.

You are correct - he doesn't have a good figure four lock with the palm of his hand on the back of his opponent's head pushing forward, so his opponent could turn his head and neck to oppose the chokehold.

Good call.

At least Cris Cyborg gets it right and shows us how it's done here:

Cris Cyborg Chokes Out Reporter

(I was surprised that they guy went unconscious that fast)

And since I am posting on this stuff, might as well post the link to this video also:

Gina Carano Also Chokes Out A Reporter, And Makes It Look Sexy - Gina Carano chokes out tv host")

(At about the 4 minute mark after the punches and kicks, it goes into a demonstration by Gina Carano using the tv host as a test dummy - and a more scientific explanation of what is happening when someone is choked into unconsciousness).

46 posted on 01/06/2010 4:43:26 PM PST by Screaming_Gerbil (Luke 22:36 "Then said he unto them...he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.")
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To: Jeff Gordon

How is the assault on personal freedom and a virtual strip search of persons who are completely NOT likely terrorists protecting your family? Are you capable of seeing the BS we are being fed? I think not. Whatever they tell you just say okay and do it. Lemming.


47 posted on 01/06/2010 9:31:49 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: SoonerStorm09

It woould be a lot cheaper and more effective if eceryone had to fly nude!!!!


48 posted on 01/06/2010 9:34:56 PM PST by dalereed
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To: dalereed

Well if “eceryone” wants to fly .. fine with me.


49 posted on 01/06/2010 10:22:16 PM PST by antceecee (Bless us Father.. have mercy on us and protect us from evil.)
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To: antceecee

go to hell!

If you don’t like the spelling tough shit!

i’m sure you got the meaniong!


50 posted on 01/06/2010 10:27:54 PM PST by dalereed
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