Speed sensors on red-light cameras could raise money fast

The Slimes ^ | January 9, 2010 | Shane Goldmacher

[Navy Patriot]

However, they do not generate revenue, and that is the real point of all this.

There! It needed saying again.

[Fresh Wind]

...they could dial in a one and a half second delay between the red lite and your green lite.

We have that around here. Drivers know they have that much extra time to run the light, and they do with great consistency.

[Navy Patriot]

If you live where a photo ID is required, here’s what to do.

Some of the local kids have computer printed life size masks of the local officials. They cut out the eyes and wear 'em driving around town.

[pnh102]

Hey California - when you get the ticket in the mail, throw it away! You have not been legally served. We have the same red light and speeding cameras scam in AZ. It’s not raising the promised funds because people here know that unless you are served by a process server, you don’t have to voluntarily give your hard earned cash to the government.

I am surprised AZ and CA haven't gotten with the program in this regard. Where I live in Maryland, if you do not pay a speed or red light camera ticket, you are not able to renew the registration on your car. Additionally though you do not receive any points on your license and you are not assessed a moving violation either. Also as far as I know there are no insurance-related consequences to receiving such violations either.

Is that how it works in AZ?

[Navy Patriot]

Drivers know they have that much extra time to run the light, and they do with great consistency.

Possibly, but nationwide the T-bone accident rate statistics, for delayed light intersections,don't support your theory.

This gets into human behavior, and learned human behavior, which, for yellow lite timing, supports your contention (to the delight of the government tyranny).

However, the red-green delay often requires the individual to be in two different places to detect and learn it for driver behavior causality.

[denydenydeny]

Red-light cameras are for “public safety” in the same sense that Mafia enforcers are about “protection.”

[Fresh Wind]

However, the red-green delay often requires the individual to be in two different places to detect and learn it for driver behavior causality.

If you use a given intersection regularly, it's easy to infer light timing from the actions of other drivers. Drivers often abuse the impending red light to avoid stopping, but almost never start before the light turns green. At many intersections, as you wait for the green, you can see the lights that control the cross street. In those cases, it's easy to observe the delay.

I don't doubt your statistics, but I know that if I enter just about any intersection in my area just as the light turns red, I can get through without a problem from cross traffic. (Disclaimer-I don't do this, and I don't recommend that anyone else do it.) The real danger is to turners who are trying to exit the intersection. You have to use up the delay waiting to complete your turn because of the threat of light runners, and end up having to deal with cross traffic anyway.

All that said, I agree that the delay helps more than it hurts.

[Molon Labbie]

Government has got to learn how to do more with less, especially in these times. Taxing the hail out of motorists, en masse, is disingenous.

[Navy Patriot]

If you use a given intersection regularly, it's easy to infer light timing from the actions of other drivers. Drivers often abuse the impending red light to avoid stopping, but almost never start before the light turns green. At many intersections, as you wait for the green, you can see the lights that control the cross street. In those cases, it's easy to observe the delay.

All true.

Bear in mind that how humans learn and how they apply that knowledge, and their awareness of learning and application is critical for further discussion of the details of this subject.

For instance: it's easy to infer light timing from the actions of other drivers.

Sort of, it is more accurate to say that this person is learning to read and predict the other drivers more than the light timing.

This is confirmed by the fact that almost all recent and new (plus retrofitted) intersection signal lites are computer controlled and can (and do) change sequence according to pre programmed time of day and traffic load, without warning. In the old days, you could learn the lite sequence and be ready, no more.

Additionally, these same computers can adjust lite duration and lite delay times without warning. You are learning the other drivers, not the lites.

This discussion could get long and detailed. Long story short, the government is the bad guy in this, and they will never promote safety and liberty at the cost of revenue and control.