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Judge Cites Discrimination in N.Y. Fire Dept. [Discriminatory Testing Procedure]
NYTimes ^ | January 13th 2010 | Al Baker

Posted on 01/13/2010 9:21:43 PM PST by Steelfish

Judge Cites Discrimination in N.Y. Fire Dept.

By AL BAKER January 13, 2010

A federal judge ruled on Wednesday that New York City intentionally discriminated against black applicants to the Fire Department by continuing to use an exam that it had been told put them at a disadvantage. It was not a “one-time mistake or the product of benign neglect,” wrote the judge, Nicholas G. Garaufis of Federal District Court in Brooklyn. “It was a part of a pattern, practice and policy of intentional discrimination against black applicants that has deep historical antecedents and uniquely disabling effects.” A remedy will be decided on later.

In his decision, the judge highlighted how “black and other minority firefighters have been severely underrepresented,” characterizing that as a “persistent stain on the Fire Department’s record.” City officials said that they intended to appeal the decision, but could not do so until the judge had determined what damages the city might face.

Legal experts, as well as lawyers for the plaintiffs and city officials, said the decision was the first in recent memory in which a court had found that the city had intentionally discriminated against a large group of people — racial minorities or women, for instance — in the workplace.

“I can’t recall there ever being a finding of intentional racial discrimination in a pattern-and-practice case against the city,” said Elise C. Boddie, a professor of constitutional law at New York Law School who formerly litigated employment discrimination cases. “I would say this is pretty big.” In July, Judge Garaufis — acting on a claim being pushed by the United States Justice Department — ruled that the Fire Department used a test in 1999 and 2002 that had a discriminatory effect on black applicants.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bellcurve; firemen; nyc

1 posted on 01/13/2010 9:21:44 PM PST by Steelfish
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To: Steelfish

I call BS...this is New Haven all over again.


2 posted on 01/13/2010 9:23:24 PM PST by ConservativeNewYorker (FDNY 343 NYPD 23 PAPD 37)
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To: Steelfish

Cutting to the chase...
Yes, Garaufis is a Clinton scumbag, and therefore must be presumed to be corrupt to the core.
A real piece of sh%%.


3 posted on 01/13/2010 9:27:40 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Steelfish

“A federal judge ruled on Wednesday that New York City intentionally discriminated against black applicants to the Fire Department by continuing to use an exam that it had been told put them at a disadvantage.”

I don’t get it. Just what kind of test could that be? Where are those details? Give me a break.


4 posted on 01/13/2010 9:30:09 PM PST by Revel
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To: ConservativeNewYorker
I call BS...this is New Haven all over again.

I wuz thinkin' the same thing ...

And just HOW is it discriminatory - does not say in the article ...

5 posted on 01/13/2010 9:31:40 PM PST by Lmo56
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To: Steelfish; ConservativeNewYorker
Yeah, BS. In these cases I have never seen the supposedly racist questions. Maybe they were something like this:

Buffy and Chip's house burned down after a dinner party with a Mediterranean theme in which candles were placed too close to the drapes.

What wine was served with the entree?

6 posted on 01/13/2010 9:33:05 PM PST by Eagles6 ( Typical White Guy: Christian, Constitutionalist, Heterosexual, Redneck.)
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To: Steelfish

I wonder if those same black applicants would do any better if the tests were all written in ebonics? Ahh... I suspect that the “remedy” will end up being separate tests, one for whites and a very different one for blacks.

What’s ironic is that every time a judge makes a pandering, idiotic, racial preference ruling like this one, a few scattered Democrats take notice and finally pull their heads out of their behinds. The cumulative effect can only help save decent, traditional America in the long run.


7 posted on 01/13/2010 9:34:22 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: Revel

I’m not a firefighter myself, but I knew several in EMT school. It sounded like the tests were essentially “the theory of fire”...how will it react, what can you do to make it do what you want, what makes what kind of fire and how do you safely put it out. I can’t see any way it could have been discriminatory, except against non-studiers.


8 posted on 01/13/2010 9:34:52 PM PST by Fire_on_High (One Big Ass Mistake America!)
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To: Lmo56
"And just HOW is it discriminatory...?"

One has to know (guess) 30% of the correct answers to pass.

9 posted on 01/13/2010 9:35:33 PM PST by zerosix (native sunflower)
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To: Lmo56
"And just HOW is it discriminatory...?"

One has to know (guess) 30% of the correct answers to pass.

10 posted on 01/13/2010 9:35:34 PM PST by zerosix (native sunflower)
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To: Lmo56

The dirty little secret that the media is afraid to report..In order to have an FDNY job, you cannot have a criminal record and must be able to pass a drug screen. In the minority neighborhoods they want applicants to come out of, this presents a pretty big obstacle.


11 posted on 01/13/2010 9:37:34 PM PST by ConservativeNewYorker (FDNY 343 NYPD 23 PAPD 37)
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To: Lmo56
And just HOW is it discriminatory - does not say in the article ...

You have to understand how scumbag liberals "think" - - they "think" backwards.

The test itself is irrelevant. The results (ie., blacks didn't score as well as whites) PROVE that the test MUST BE discriminatory. That is all that matters to the scumbags. The fact that EVERY test is "discriminatory" by this standard is also irrelevant.

Liberal backwards "thinking"...
Don't worry about it - - your head will explode if you try to figure it out.

12 posted on 01/13/2010 9:40:42 PM PST by Lancey Howard
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To: ConservativeNewYorker
The dirty little secret that the media is afraid to report..In order to have an FDNY job, you cannot have a criminal record and must be able to pass a drug screen. In the minority neighborhoods they want applicants to come out of, this presents a pretty big obstacle.

Let the FDNY train some of these failed applicants, then lock the judge and the family in their house, then set the house on fire ...

The failed applicants would then be on duty at the local fire house when the call comes in ...

Lets see how the judge grades their ability as they try to rescue the judge and his family ...

13 posted on 01/13/2010 9:41:46 PM PST by Lmo56
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To: Lmo56; ConservativeNewYorker

Excellent post.


14 posted on 01/13/2010 9:46:16 PM PST by thecodont
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To: Steelfish

Back in the 70’s in the Northeast the civil service written exam consisted of a test that had all questions coming out of book on Firefighting that the applicant had in his possession to study months before the exam. That was ruled not fair to minorities! The answers are in the book you were given. The test material was on the job you were applying for, Firefighting. Do we test doctors on how to run electrical wires in a commercial building??? No, we test them on their medical knowledge. This country is so screwed up it is beyond repair.


15 posted on 01/13/2010 9:46:24 PM PST by pietraynor (Government does not solve problems; it subsidizes them. Ronald Reagan)
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To: Steelfish
"used a test in 1999 and 2002 that had a discriminatory effect on black applicants."

How can a test be discriminatory? Maybe it was not given in a oral fashion with the questions read to the applicants and the applicants giving oral answerer's? Thus not requiring them to be able to read and write?

16 posted on 01/13/2010 9:47:36 PM PST by guitarplayer1953 (Rebellion to Tyrants is Obedience to GOD! Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Lmo56

PERFECTISSIMO!


17 posted on 01/13/2010 10:01:49 PM PST by Yehuda (Land of the free, THANKS TO THE BRAVE!)
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To: Steelfish

I’d like to see a copy of the exam !


18 posted on 01/13/2010 10:08:55 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (THE SECOND AMENDMENT, A MATTER OF FACT, NOT A MATTER OF OPINION)
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To: Steelfish
What I find amazing is that in all the years that "discriminatory tests" have been found, complained of, and revised, no one has ever found that a test discriminated against whites.

Now think about this for a minute.

If it is easy to develop a test where blacks score lower, even if one tries hard not to, and almost impossible to devise a test where whites score lower, this tells us a lot about the populations we are testing.

19 posted on 01/13/2010 10:57:32 PM PST by CurlyDave
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To: Steelfish

Did the city insist on long form birth certificates?


20 posted on 01/13/2010 11:20:12 PM PST by Gator113 (Obama is America's First FAILED "light skinned African American [Pres-dent] with no Negro dialect..")
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To: Revel

Study harder! Period.


21 posted on 01/13/2010 11:23:57 PM PST by boop (Democracy is the theory that the people get the government they deserve, good and hard.)
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To: Revel

“I don’t get it. Just what kind of test could that be? Where are those details? Give me a break.”

I was wondering the same thing. Maybe they have questions about polo or slave ownership (such as how many slaves it takes to clear 5 acres of land in a week). Those would be questions that only Whites would be able to answer, and thus the test would be biased. But I doubt those were the questions that bothered him.


22 posted on 01/13/2010 11:31:31 PM PST by BobL (When Democrats start to love this country more than they hate Republicans, good things might happen.)
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To: ConservativeNewYorker

Thank you for telling the truth, this nonsense goes on ALL over the US.


23 posted on 01/14/2010 3:12:39 AM PST by Molon Labbie
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To: Steelfish

The test required applicants to read the questions.

Reading is discriminatory.

#
0
I=
L

Above is a picture of a man with his hair on fire. As a firefighter, your reaction should be:

1) :-)
2) :-(
3) :-?
4) :-0
5) ;-/


24 posted on 01/14/2010 5:41:08 AM PST by sergeantdave
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To: Revel
I don’t get it. Just what kind of test could that be? Where are those details? Give me a break.

Agreed, Wonder why they never print the questions that have been judged to be racist?

25 posted on 01/14/2010 6:16:24 AM PST by dearolddad
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To: Steelfish

“had a discriminatory effect on black applicants”

The money quote.

An unbiased test is irrelevant to these scam artists.

Outcome is everything.


26 posted on 01/14/2010 12:21:39 PM PST by SharpRightTurn (White, black, and red all over--America's affirmative action, metrosexual president.)
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