Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Scientologists 'heal' Haiti quake victims using touch
Breitbart ^ | 01/23/10

Posted on 01/23/2010 8:25:23 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814

Amid the mass of aid agencies piling in to help Haiti quake victims is a batch of Church of Scientology "volunteer ministers", claiming to use the power of touch to reconnect nervous systems.

Clad in yellow T-shirts emblazoned with the logo of the controversial US-based group, smiling volunteers fan out among the injured lying under makeshift shelters in the courtyard of Port-au-Prince's General Hospital.

A wealthy private donor provided his airplane to fly in 80 volunteers from Los Angeles, along with 50 Haitian-American-doctors, in a gesture worth 400,000 dollars, said a Parisian volunteer who gave her name as Sylvie.

"We're trained as volunteer ministers, we use a process called 'assist' to follow the nervous system to reconnect the main points, to bring back communication," she said.

(...)

Some doctors at the hospital are skeptical. One US doctor, who asked not to be named, snorted: "I didn't know touching could heal gangrene."

When asked what the Scientologists are doing here, another doctor said: "I don't know."

Do you care? "Not really," she said, wheeling an unconscious patient out of the operating room to join hundreds of others in the hospital's sunny courtyard.

(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs
KEYWORDS: bargainwithsatan; haiti; healing; pseudoscience; roundthemup; scary; scaryscarypeople; scientology
What an utter waste of time and money. $400,000 that could have gone to real aid rather than pseudoscientific nonsense.
1 posted on 01/23/2010 8:25:23 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
The Cult of $cientology needs to get their collective butts kicked off the island. They're evil and destructive.

- Traveler

2 posted on 01/23/2010 8:40:56 AM PST by Traveler59 (Truth is a journey, not a destination.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
So who's more delusional: the idiots who believe scientology is real or the Haitians who put their stock in voodoo?

Not much difference. Too bad the money couldn't have been spent on something that would actually help the people who are suffering.

3 posted on 01/23/2010 8:50:52 AM PST by Pablo64 (Political Correctness is a DISEASE. <==> TRUTH is the CURE.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
A wealthy private donor provided his airplane to fly in 80 volunteers from Los Angeles

That would be Travolta.

4 posted on 01/23/2010 9:01:10 AM PST by humblegunner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
just being out in the sun has more beneficial healing powers than they do...
5 posted on 01/23/2010 9:11:01 AM PST by Chode (American Hedonist *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Pablo64
So who's more delusional: the idiots who believe scientology is real or the Haitians who put their stock in voodoo?

Six of one/half a dozen of the other. I'll give Pat Robertson a little credit; as idiotic as his comments were, at least he didn't have the gall to send a bunch of faith "healers" down to Haiti.

6 posted on 01/23/2010 9:17:03 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

They could use the soothing balm of the greenback poultice, as well as some property rights law reform, knowledge of science, engineering and economics. They need a complete makeover.


7 posted on 01/23/2010 9:19:16 AM PST by Wally_Kalbacken
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

8 posted on 01/23/2010 9:20:30 AM PST by bornred
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: humblegunner

I believe Travolta lives in Florida. I would bet it is Tom Cruise, who sometimes lives in Hollywood and sometimes make a movie there.


9 posted on 01/23/2010 9:20:48 AM PST by supermop (Somebody has to clean up the mess he will leave)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

From voodoo to scientology.

From one cult preying on the uneducated to another.


10 posted on 01/23/2010 9:23:11 AM PST by airborne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: supermop

Travolta.

http://news.ph.msn.com/entertainment/article.aspx?cp-documentid=3797375


11 posted on 01/23/2010 9:24:50 AM PST by humblegunner
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
What a tragedy!

Scientologists have NO “healing power”.

Scientologists are not Christians.

ANY True healing only comes through believers in Christ.

You might as well offer them more VOODOO for all the good it is.

12 posted on 01/23/2010 9:58:00 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

Did you bother to read the article, the part that said: “...along with 50 Hatian-American doctors...” If I was being pulled out of the rubble in Haiti, I wouldn’t mind another 50 doctors on the job, French speaking at that. The donor of the plane was probably John Travolta.

for the knee-jerkers on Free Republic, anyone can visit their website and read source material on their aims and methods. You just instruct your fingers to go click.


13 posted on 01/23/2010 9:58:12 AM PST by Yollopoliuhqui (consciousness is a heads up display)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: humblegunner

“That would be Travolta. “

Yeah, that would make sense.


14 posted on 01/23/2010 9:58:38 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: airborne

It’s UGLY exploitation.

Any human being deserves better and the best - Christ.


15 posted on 01/23/2010 9:59:18 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: supermop

Travolta has a home on a private airstrip about 2 hours north of me where he keeps several airplanes.

I think he also has a home in CA and probably flew out there to pick up the kool aid drinkers.


16 posted on 01/23/2010 10:11:42 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: nmh
ANY True healing only comes through believers in Christ.

Doctors who practice legitimate medicine are the ones are in the business of "true healing", regardless of their religious affiliation.

17 posted on 01/23/2010 10:25:37 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Yollopoliuhqui
Did you bother to read the article, the part that said: “...along with 50 Hatian-American doctors...” If I was being pulled out of the rubble in Haiti, I wouldn’t mind another 50 doctors on the job, French speaking at that. The donor of the plane was probably John Travolta.

I was speaking strictly of the Scientologist "healers", but please allow me to clarify: While the article mention 50 doctors, nowhere does it say anything about these doctors performing legitimate medicine in lieu of Scientologist pseudoscience. If they are in fact practicing legitimate medicine than Travolta should be applauded for this portion of his donation.

I do, however, stand by my comment regarding the 80 "volunteer ministers" pretending to magically heal people by touching them. They're making the situation worse, if anything.

18 posted on 01/23/2010 10:35:18 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

“Doctors who practice legitimate medicine are the ones are in the business of “true healing”, regardless of their religious affiliation.”

LOL!!!

It is GOD that is in control.

All ANY dcotor can offer is their OPINION.

It is God that has the final and ultimate say on whether a patient is healed or not. Truly, you relly don’t believe that MAN is in control with their FINITE OPINIONS? LOL!

Many times a doctor doesn’t understand the ROOT cause. Take cancer, if man was so brilliant, we’d know what to do and cure everyone. Sometimes chemo and radio therapy works and other times it doesn’t regardless of what stage it is at. A good doctor prays for his patient and there are many that do. Wise up!


19 posted on 01/23/2010 11:10:58 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: nmh
All ANY dcotor can offer is their OPINION.

Along with setting bones, stitching wounds, transplanting organs, prescribing antibiotics, and other such trivialities...

A good doctor prays for his patient

While I have no objection to a doctor praying for me on his own time (whatever his faith), I would prefer that when treating me he stick to whatever medical science has uaght him thus far. If you want to go to a shaman, witch doctor, or faith healer that is of course your business.

I'm diabetic, mind you. The only reason I can live a normal lifestyle is because of modern medicine, so I'm understandably biased towards medical practices that actually work.

20 posted on 01/23/2010 11:23:22 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
All ANY dcotor can offer is their OPINION.

“Along with setting bones, stitching wounds, transplanting organs, prescribing antibiotics, and other such trivialities... “

They can physically stitch you up or do transplants but did you ever wonder WHY some are more successful than others or WHY things don't work out for some? Do you really DENY that God is in control of any outcome? Really? A trained monkey can stitch someone up. Prescribing antibiotics is not the sign of a mental genius. Transplanting organs is NOT always successful and REJECTION is a major concern of doctors. ADULT stem cell research has had more success with many medical diseases than all the glorious OPINIONS that you hold do highly.

A good doctor prays for his patient

“While I have no objection to a doctor praying for me on his own time (whatever his faith), I would prefer that when treating me he stick to whatever medical science has aughts him thus far. If you want to go to a shaman, witch doctor, or faith healer that is of course your business.”\

Ah but not all gods are equal ... so you give yourself away again. Those who make real progress in the medical field have been humble Christians and the same is true of those that made breakthroughs in Science. It is a shame that all you library books have left out that nasty little fact. You see, those that seek true knowledge don't have to depend on pragmatism, or the EVOLVING of “truth”. You don't need to be uppity over how you would like to view your secular world.

“I'm diabetic, mind you. The only reason I can live a normal lifestyle is because of modern medicine, so I'm understandably biased towards medical practices that actually work. “

I have M.S. and take NO medicine as well as Graves’ disease. Dad is a diabetic and takes no medicine. He controls it with diet. I'd have no problem if he took medication. I am not “biased” to chemical drugs. I am not “biased” against God as you are. Diabetics is not exactly rocket science and is often treatable without drugs. So your praising of fallible mortals doesn't impress me. The Ultimate One, God, is the ONLY ONE that heals and decides when your time is up or if you are to be “healed” or not.

I see you have no comment on those that have say, cancer. Some survive and some don't. You could have identical patients with the same type and stage of cancer. God may take both, allow one to live or allow both to live. It is at His disgression not that of a secular doctor that only offers chemicals as his ultimate opinion that may or may not work.
So you can argue all you like that God doesn't exist or doesn't know more than fallible mortals. It is separate from me. I KNOW better. I've seen His miracles in action when secular doctors give up on patients and God pulls them through and they don't understand WHY the person lived.

21 posted on 01/23/2010 11:53:49 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

I HATE NEW AGE ANTI-CHRIST LIES. What a waste indeed!~ J.S.


22 posted on 01/23/2010 12:00:47 PM PST by JSDude1 (www.wethepeopleindiana.org (Tea Party Member-Proud), www.travishankins.com (R- IN 09 2010!))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

True spiritual healing comes through Christ,

while I believe God has given the doctors the knowledge to heal other people (thank God, and then them..),

God can preform miracles as well..however it is up to HIS will to determine when and where to do this, and for His glory, not ours!

~J.S.


23 posted on 01/23/2010 12:03:40 PM PST by JSDude1 (www.wethepeopleindiana.org (Tea Party Member-Proud), www.travishankins.com (R- IN 09 2010!))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

What is being referred to is a Scientology technique known as a “touch assist”. It is not healing as in miraculously knitting bones and wounds, nor is it claimed by Scientologists to be a replacement for medicine. From what I gather, it is more of a psychological operation in which a frightened and injured person is brought out of a state of withdrawal and vulnerability into a state of engagement and optimism, potentially helping with lessening the effects of PTSD. Attempting to do this is a legitimate part of good nursing, no matter what the applied technique.

People have got to stop knee jerking over Scientology and educate themselves independently rather than succombing to group think. They share many conservative values- to them homosexuality is an aberration, abortion is the destruction of life, the human mind is sacrosanct and the use of drugs or invasive therapies to treat depression, hyperactivity, etc. is not acceptable, the use of “recreational” drugs is not acceptabel, patriotism is desireable, mental pathologies are to be cured not adjusted to and so on. Their root philosophy is based upon becoming a success in the workaday world, to function as an effective and relevant citizen, not withdrawing from it

Scientology continues to grow in the face of strong opposition because it’s methods of coping with life seem to result in productive practitioners who are financially capable of underwriting Scientology’s expansion, much like the early Mormons in the midwest, who became so successful in farming and business that they aroused the jealousy of their neighbors and were persecuted for it.


24 posted on 01/23/2010 12:10:00 PM PST by Yollopoliuhqui (consciousness is a heads up display)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Yollopoliuhqui

Wow, thanks for the info on Scientology. I am really going to have to rethink my abhorance and disgust associated with that really, really awesome religion. Could you please get me in touch with someone who could help me to join and become just as awesome? Money is no object either. So awesome.


25 posted on 01/23/2010 12:35:08 PM PST by tupac
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: nmh
They can physically stitch you up or do transplants but did you ever wonder WHY some are more successful than others or WHY things don't work out for some?

Because not everyone is in the same state of health, and because there remains more medical discoveries, science, and technique to be discovered.

Do you really DENY that God is in control of any outcome? Really?

Since you can't prove a negative, I deny no such thing. As the the person making the assertion, it is up to you to provide evidence supporting it.

A trained monkey can stitch someone up

Really? You'd have no objection to a rhesus monkey performing surgery on you?

Prescribing antibiotics is not the sign of a mental genius.

When did I say that it was? You said "All ANY dcotor can offer is their OPINION." (which reminds me, you're still yelling, a violation of basic netiquette). My pointing out that doctors can prescribe antibiotics does not invalidate my point.

Transplanting organs is NOT always successful and REJECTION is a major concern of doctors.

Did I say it wasn't? This hardly invalidates medical science.

ADULT stem cell research has had more success with many medical diseases than all the glorious OPINIONS that you hold do highly.

Please. Stop. Yelling.

Stem cell research, adult or otherwise, is a subset of medical science. That's what I'm supporting. You're undermining your own argument.

Ah but not all gods are equal ... so you give yourself away again.

Give myself away? What am I trying to hide?

Those who make real progress in the medical field have been humble Christians and the same is true of those that made breakthroughs in Science.

Absolutely, look at Christians like Albert Einstein, Alan Turing, and Richard Feinman!

Er, waitaminute...

It is a shame that all you library books have left out that nasty little fact. You see, those that seek true knowledge don't have to depend on pragmatism, or the EVOLVING of “truth”. You don't need to be uppity over how you would like to view your secular world.

You're accusing me of being uppity?

I have M.S. and take NO medicine as well as Graves’ disease. Dad is a diabetic and takes no medicine. He controls it with diet. I'd have no problem if he took medication.

My, that's big of you.

I am not “biased” to chemical drugs. I am not “biased” against God as you are. Diabetics is not exactly rocket science and is often treatable without drugs.

And sometimes it's not, belief in God(s) notwithstanding. I freely admit to being biased against faith healers, shamans, and other witch doctors.

So your praising of fallible mortals doesn't impress me. The Ultimate One, God, is the ONLY ONE that heals and decides when your time is up or if you are to be “healed” or not.

God is the only one who decides whether or not you're healed, doctors don't have anything to do with it?

I see you have no comment on those that have say, cancer. Some survive and some don't. You could have identical patients with the same type and stage of cancer.

Cancer is an incredibly complex disease, and we still don't have the technology to reliably defeat it. Consider it "commented".

God may take both, allow one to live or allow both to live. It is at His disgression not that of a secular doctor that only offers chemicals as his ultimate opinion that may or may not work.

So when someone dies of cancer it's because God chose not to allow them live?

I find your worldview baffling.

So you can argue all you like that God doesn't exist

I have made no such argument. I simply don't believe that God exists...not the same thing.

or doesn't know more than fallible mortals.

I certainly haven't argued that. How can I argue about the characteristics of a being in which I have no belief?

It is separate from me. I KNOW better. I've seen His miracles in action when secular doctors give up on patients and God pulls them through and they don't understand WHY the person lived.

You are free to ascribe anything you wish to the supernatural. I choose to do otherwise.

26 posted on 01/23/2010 12:39:46 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Yollopoliuhqui
What is being referred to is a Scientology technique known as a “touch assist”. It is not healing as in miraculously knitting bones and wounds, nor is it claimed by Scientologists to be a replacement for medicine.

From the original article:

"One hour ago he had no sensation in his left leg, so I explained the method to him, I touched him and after a while he said 'now I feel everything'," said Sylvie.

"Otherwise they might have had to amputate his other leg."

So he touches him, and now a leg that might have had to have been amputated no longer has to be. You bet.

27 posted on 01/23/2010 12:51:30 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
I don't know enough about scientology to have an opinion on it. Nothing to do with scientology, but I firmly believe that caring and love makes a difference. We are 90 something percent water, and if you ever saw how water reacts to moods (Masaru Emoto), it makes you think why a mother's PBJ made with love is better than a steak served by a stranger.

I'm just sayin.
(you may now resume throwing rocks at each other :-)
28 posted on 01/23/2010 12:53:26 PM PST by domeika
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: domeika
We are 90 something percent water, and if you ever saw how water reacts to moods (Masaru Emoto)

Posting that link was rather cruel of you; I felt brain cells dying one by one as I looked at it.

Here's a link with a more rational look at mister Emoto's theory that water looks pretty when you say nice things to it, and ugly when you say words like "Adolph Hitler". Yeesh...

http://www.randi.org/jr/052303.html

29 posted on 01/23/2010 1:21:53 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
I'm just trying to be in a good mood today, and i hope you are too.
By GL, is that indicitive of "Open GL"?
30 posted on 01/23/2010 1:46:23 PM PST by domeika
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: domeika
I'm just trying to be in a good mood today, and i hope you are too.

I am actually, pseudoscience is just a pet peeve of mine. I have a few days off and I'm inventorying (is that a word?) my library. Tedious, but I'll be glad when it's done!

By GL, is that indicitive of "Open GL"?

Obscure comic book in-joke. GL stands for "Green Lantern". There are 7200 Green Lanterns (they're sort of Galactic Policemen), and Earth is in Sector 2814.

As you can see, I'm using the word "joke" rather loosely :-)

31 posted on 01/23/2010 1:54:06 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: Yollopoliuhqui

There are cases of people being healed by such powers, however, one needs to recognize the Adversary can heal many physical ailments as well as Christ. Unfortunately, such healing by methods other than within the domain of man or through the authority of Christ can lead to demonic involvement.

Scientology is well known for dabbling in the occult and has an obsessive preoccupation with angelic assitance in their worldly power systems.

From voodoo to Scientology is correct, but it is not going in the right direction of seeking legitimate healing. Instead it is a counterfeit system leading the followers astray into much more degenerate thinking and possibly even demon possession.

I suspect Scientology was led there in part due to the infamous history of voodoo within the Haitian culture, indicating fallen angels or evil familiar spirits are in the area more than willing to mislead as many humans as possible in the area.

They likely will not reveal themselves to the medically qualified professionals, and agnostics or human secularists, because those groups pose no spiritual challenge to the fallen. But they will be very interested in those seeking help from ANY source, opening a door for their involvement in human affairs. Such is a slave market which many who are raised in a Judeo-Christian culture have not directly identified, because other worldly systems provide for their needs without placing faith in anything but human systems of problem solving.


32 posted on 01/23/2010 1:57:46 PM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
Pseudo-science, for me, is a fringe relief from what I know what is, as opposed to what could, or might, (orrrr not) be (like hope and change).
Open GL?
No, Open GL is programming lingo. Thought you might be one of us uber-geeks (you're better off not being one).
Please keep having a nice day and orgamatize that libary!

PS: The liberal books go in the round filing cabinet.
33 posted on 01/23/2010 2:12:51 PM PST by domeika
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: domeika
Please keep having a nice day and orgamatize that libary!

Well, it's going to take more than one day; I want to do this right, so I'm listing every book in my computer by title, author, and value (if it's particularly valuable). I should get through paperback fiction today, but that still leaves all the graphic novels, roleplaying books, and nonfiction. Might have it done it 2 or 3 more days.

PS: The liberal books go in the round filing cabinet.

That part's long done!

34 posted on 01/23/2010 2:28:20 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: Yollopoliuhqui
So you have questions about Scientology...
35 posted on 01/23/2010 3:07:38 PM PST by null and void (We are now in day 367 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: Cvengr
Scientology ... has an obsessive preoccupation with angelic assitance in their worldly power systems.

Simply totally and unequivocally false.

Instead it is a counterfeit system leading the followers astray into ... even demon possession.

Nope. FAR worse than that.

They likely will not reveal themselves to the medically qualified professionals,

Usually they do. Even the docs who don't think it does any good are glad to have someone keeping the less critically injured from getting in the way.

36 posted on 01/23/2010 3:19:08 PM PST by null and void (We are now in day 367 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: nmh
Truly, you relly don’t believe that MAN is in control with their FINITE OPINIONS

Better my finite opinions than your evil fantasy god.

37 posted on 01/23/2010 6:25:24 PM PST by Salman
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: tupac

I got that 5 X 5, Tu! You can just mosey down to the Org on Main St. in any sizeable city and in more countries that we can feel easy about! Hi five, d%d!


38 posted on 01/23/2010 10:13:02 PM PST by Yollopoliuhqui (consciousness is a heads up display)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: null and void

Scientology is a bad idea all around.


39 posted on 01/23/2010 10:34:54 PM PST by txhurl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: txhurl
Scientology is a bad idea all around.

Nope. Although it would be far less dangerous if that were even vaguely true.

The really big problem with scientology it the simple fact that so much of it actually does work.

Although Hubbard did create some new techniques, and did provide an internally consistant philosophical framework, mostly he collected workable stuff from all over, and re-branded it as his own.

The only reasons scientology hasn't taken over the world is diminishing returns, organizational abuse, and that the upper levels undo the much good the lower levels manage to accomplish.

40 posted on 01/23/2010 11:45:56 PM PST by null and void (We are now in day 367 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Salman

Truly, you relly don’t believe that MAN is in control with their FINITE OPINIONS

“Better my finite opinions than your evil fantasy god. “

Guess we won’t be in eternity together!

I really look forward to not being around people like you.


41 posted on 01/24/2010 7:11:47 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

As one of those doctors, I freely admit and shout it from the rooftops - any ability I have comes from Christ.

He is the one that gave me my brain, senses, and capacity to learn. In addition, the body is the one that heals, not me. I merely assist. Think about it - I can set bones and give antibiotics in a corpse all I want and no healing will take place.

This fact gives me tremendous peace when I treat people. I do what I can with what I am given. It is up to God who lives and dies. Some of my colleagues who have committed suicide or have shattered lives or families missed this lesson. It is too much responsibility and hubris for an individual to think that they truly have the power of life and death - that belongs only to God.


42 posted on 01/24/2010 7:19:59 AM PST by Mom MD (Jesus is the Light of the world!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814
“Because not everyone is in the same state of health, and because there remains more medical discoveries, science, and technique to be discovered.”

Ah, so you admit mere fallible mortals don't know all with their finite knowledge and opinions.

Do you really DENY that God is in control of any outcome? Really?

“Since you can't prove a negative, I deny no such thing. As the the person making the assertion, it is up to you to provide evidence supporting it.”

Many miracles happen all the time due to prayer. Studies have been done that those prayed for do better and still you deny all of it. He could tap you on the shoulder and you'd still deny Him.

A trained monkey can stitch someone up

“Really? You'd have no objection to a rhesus monkey performing surgery on you?”

Considering some of the doctors we have as fallible humans, I don't see where a monkey couldn't do as good of a job. In fact, when it comes to behavior animals appear to be more compassionate than many human beings to their fellow animals.

Prescribing antibiotics is not the sign of a mental genius.

When did I say that it was? You said “All ANY doctor can offer is their OPINION.” (which reminds me, you're still yelling, a violation of basic netiquette). My pointing out that doctors can prescribe antibiotics does not invalidate my point.

You try to imply that prescribing antibiotics is a sign of brilliance. It isn't and meither am I "yelling". As for etiquette, you might want to check the rules for your snotty replies. Heck, I find it amusing but you don't need to be a hypocrite in touting rules when you don't keep the rules yourself..

BTW, I am NOT yelling. Using upper case is MY style. If yelling could get through to you, I probably would, however I am NOT doing that in my replies.

Transplanting organs is NOT always successful and REJECTION is a major concern of doctors.

“Did I say it wasn't? This hardly invalidates medical science.”

You imply brilliance again and still can't give a rational reason as to WHY it works with some and NOT all the time with identical situations. God allows some to live and takes others, regardless of how brilliant YOU believe they are.

ADULT stem cell research has had more success with many medical diseases than all the glorious OPINIONS that you hold do highly.

“Please. Stop. Yelling.”

Again, I am NOT yelling. It appears you have little to stand on so little things, such as using upper case intimidate you. You already know I am NOT yelling so stay focused. I give you no o pity points for lame complaints or hypocrisy.

“Stem cell research, adult or otherwise, is a subset of medical science. That's what I'm supporting. You're undermining your own argument.”

No, I am not. I am indicating since you may not know ... that embryonic stem cell research hasn't worked and never will. My God doesn't approve of killing little human beings for self gain in this way. It is by using ADULT stem cell research that progress has been made. BTW your "logic" needs work too!

Ah but not all gods are equal ... so you give yourself away again.

“Give myself away? What am I trying to hide?”

Your ignorance is something you are pleased with.

Those who make real progress in the medical field have been humble Christians and the same is true of those that made breakthroughs in Science.

Absolutely, look at Christians like Albert Einstein, Alan Turing, and Richard Feinman!

LOL! Albert Einstein was a practicing Jew and believed in God. He was an impressive man. YOU do know that Christ was Jew?

The only reason Alan Turing is noticed as a foot note in history is because he is a homosexual. Are you also an expert in “gay” studies. Truly Alan Turing is not the caliber of people I refer to as making a major contribution to society. Perhaps to “gay” people he is important but to normal people he isn't worth mentioning. I take it you've never heard of Isaac Newton? That is the caliber I am thinking of.

Richard Feinman is another idiot. He's so egotistical, that he's trying to redefine science concepts to give his metabolism nonsense credibility. LOL!! For example, he's busy trying to redefine why a calorie is not a calorie. Apparently stored and potential energy don't’ fit well into his godless,leftist world.

“Er, waitaminute...”

It is a shame that all you library books have left out that nasty little fact. You see, those that seek true knowledge don't have to depend on pragmatism, or the EVOLVING of “truth”. You don't need to be uppity over how you would like to view your secular world.

“You're accusing me of being uppity?”

I hate to break the bad news to you but you certainly try to be “uppity” and as to why befuddles me. I find it amusing.

I have M.S. and take NO medicine as well as Graves’ disease. Dad is a diabetic and takes no medicine. He controls it with diet. I'd have no problem if he took medication.

“My, that's big of you.”

Ah, are we trying to sneak in a low personal attack? I have found that to be very typical of people like you. Don't worry about it, I judge the sources. Some people would upset me with your lack of compassion but YOU, don't bother me at all. Don't fret or even apologize. From people like you, I expect it. Your huge ego and unrestrained emotions are what fuel your replies. In this situation you despise me, because I have a God that is superior to all mere fallible mortals and KNOW He is real. I don't know why people like you, hate people like me so much. You could have Him as the focal point of your life too but instead you chose to hate Him and others that follow Him. Oh well!

...

You are free to ascribe anything you wish to the supernatural. I choose to do otherwise.

I have to say, you are a stubborn one.

So be it!

43 posted on 01/24/2010 7:51:56 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: nmh
Guess we won’t be in eternity together!

You sure feel good about yourself while threatening me with torture on behalf of the demon you call "God".

Your "God" is a fantasy of infinite evil.

44 posted on 01/24/2010 10:59:44 AM PST by Salman
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: nmh
Ah, so you admit mere fallible mortals don't know all with their finite knowledge and opinions.

I never said otherwise.

Many miracles happen all the time due to prayer.

You are free to assert this, but that hardly makes it so.

Studies have been done that those prayed for do better and still you deny all of it. He could tap you on the shoulder and you'd still deny Him.

http://skepdic.com/prayer.html

Considering some of the doctors we have as fallible humans, I don't see where a monkey couldn't do as good of a job.

I don't know what more I can say to someone who appears to be arguing in all sincerity that a rhesus monkey can perform surgery as well as a human doctor. You do realize that this undercuts your credibility in this discussion just a wee bit, don't you?

You try to imply that prescribing antibiotics is a sign of brilliance.

I have said nothing from which one could reasonably draw such an inference.

It isn't and meither am I "yelling".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netiquette

"Another rule is to avoid typing in all caps or grossly enlarging script for emphasis, which is considered to be the equivalent of shouting or yelling."

As for etiquette, you might want to check the rules for your snotty replies. Heck, I find it amusing but you don't need to be a hypocrite in touting rules when you don't keep the rules yourself..

Please document that a "snotty reply" violates netiquette (not that I agree with your characterization in the first place). If you fail to do so, then you have not supported your accusation of hypocrisy.

BTW, I am NOT yelling. Using upper case is MY style.

If yelling could get through to you, I probably would, however I am NOT doing that in my replies.

"Another rule is to avoid typing in all caps or grossly enlarging script for emphasis, which is considered to be the equivalent of shouting or yelling."

I wouldn't yell at you, of course. That would be rude.

You imply brilliance again

Where? Please be specific.

and still can't give a rational reason as to WHY it works with some and NOT all the time with identical situations.

False assumption. The situations are not identical, therefore your point is invalidated.

God allows some to live and takes others,

An assumption on your part. Unwarranted, in my opinion, but your worldview is quite different from mine.

regardless of how brilliant YOU believe they are.

Please document where I characterized "them" as being brilliant. Be specific.

Again, I am NOT yelling.

"Another rule is to avoid typing in all caps or grossly enlarging script for emphasis, which is considered to be the equivalent of shouting or yelling"

It appears you have little to stand on so little things, such as using upper case intimidate you. You already know I am NOT yelling so stay focused.

"Another rule is to avoid typing in all caps or grossly enlarging script for emphasis, which is considered to be the equivalent of shouting or yelling."

No, I am not. I am indicating since you may not know ... that embryonic stem cell research hasn't worked and never will. My God doesn't approve of killing little human beings for self gain in this way. It is by using ADULT stem cell research that progress has been made. BTW your "logic" needs work too!

It doesn't work because it's supernaturally prevented from working? Um, ok...

LOL! Albert Einstein was a practicing Jew and believed in God. He was an impressive man.

You said "Those who make real progress in the medical field have been humble Christians and the same is true of those that made breakthroughs in Science."

You then point out that Einstein was not a Christian. "LOL", indeed.

As for him be a "practicing Jew", let's hear from the man himself: "My position concerning God is that of an agnostic. I am convinced that a vivid consciousness of the primary importance of moral principles for the betterment and ennoblement of life does not need the idea of a law-giver, especially a law-giver who works on the basis of reward and punishment."

YOU do know that Christ was Jew?

No. Really?

The only reason Alan Turing is noticed as a foot note in history is because he is a homosexual.

Never heard of the Turing test?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_turing

Alan Mathison Turing was an English mathematician, logician, cryptanalyst, and computer scientist. He was influential in the development of computer science and providing a formalisation of the concept of the algorithm and computation with the Turing machine, playing a significant role in the creation of the modern computer.

During the Second World War, Turing worked for the Government Code and Cypher School at Bletchley Park, Britain's codebreaking centre. For a time he was head of Hut 8, the section responsible for German naval cryptanalysis. He devised a number of techniques for breaking German ciphers, including the method of the bombe, an electromechanical machine that could find settings for the Enigma machine. After the war he worked at the National Physical Laboratory, where he created one of the first designs for a stored-program computer, the ACE.

Are you also an expert in “gay” studies. Truly Alan Turing is not the caliber of people I refer to as making a major contribution to society. Perhaps to “gay” people he is important but to normal people he isn't worth mentioning. I take it you've never heard of Isaac Newton? That is the caliber I am thinking of.

You asserted that those who make breakthroughs in science are by definition Christians. Einstein alone invalidates that point.

Richard Feinman is another idiot.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_feynman

Richard Phillips Feynman was an American physicist known for his work in the path integral formulation of quantum mechanics, the theory of quantum electrodynamics and the physics of the superfluidity of supercooled liquid helium, as well as in particle physics (he proposed the parton model). For his contributions to the development of quantum electrodynamics, Feynman, together with Julian Schwinger and Sin-Itiro Tomonaga, received the Nobel Prize in Physics in 1965. He developed a widely used pictorial representation scheme for the mathematical expressions governing the behavior of subatomic particles, which later became known as Feynman diagrams. During his lifetime and after his death, Feynman became one of the best-known scientists in the world.

He assisted in the development of the atomic bomb and was a member of the panel that investigated the Space Shuttle Challenger disaster. In addition to his work in theoretical physics, Feynman has been credited with pioneering the field of quantum computing, and introducing the concept of nanotechnology (creation of devices at the molecular scale). He held the Richard Chace Tolman professorship in theoretical physics at the California Institute of Technology.

He's so egotistical, that he's trying to redefine science concepts to give his metabolism nonsense credibility. LOL!! For example, he's busy trying to redefine why a calorie is not a calorie.

Since he died over 20 years ago, he must not be trying very hard.

You'll forgive me if I don't take you description of him as an "idiot" seriously.

Ah, are we trying to sneak in a low personal attack? I have found that to be very typical of people like you. Don't worry about it, I judge the sources. Some people would upset me with your lack of compassion but YOU, don't bother me at all. Don't fret or even apologize. From people like you, I expect it. Your huge ego and unrestrained emotions are what fuel your replies. In this situation you despise me, because I have a God that is superior to all mere fallible mortals and KNOW He is real. I don't know why people like you, hate people like me so much. You could have Him as the focal point of your life too but instead you chose to hate Him and others that follow Him. Oh well!

Wow, you only yelled twice in one long paragraph. Well done!

As for the rest, please be assured that I don't hate you in any way. Frankly, I don't think you can imagine a number small enough to describe how little your opinion of me matters.

I'm going to leave it that. While it's been amusing to play with you, there isn't the slightest chance that anything one of us says is going to change the mind of the other one. I'll leave it to the studio audience to determine the reasons why.

45 posted on 01/24/2010 8:36:31 PM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: GL of Sector 2814

You are hoplessly twisted.

Matt.7:6

[6] Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.


46 posted on 01/25/2010 8:40:47 AM PST by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: nmh
You are hoplessly twisted.

Matt.7:6

[6] Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Weren't you complaining in your last post that I'd made a "low personal attack"? Hm...well, if nothing else you have illustrated that when all else fails it's easier to attack your opponent's character than to answer his arguments.

Oh, well.

47 posted on 01/25/2010 9:01:09 AM PST by GL of Sector 2814
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson