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History of England starts at 1700, says university
The Telegraph ^ | 2/11/2010 | Graeme Paton

Posted on 02/11/2010 3:19:42 PM PST by bruinbirdman

Academics have attacked a decision by a top university to scrap research into English history before 1700.

It was claimed that the move by Sussex University risked jeopardising the nation’s understanding of the subject and “entrenching the ignorance of the present”.

Under plans, research and in-depth teaching into periods such as the Tudors, the Middle-Ages, Norman Britain, the Viking invasion and the Anglo-Saxons will be scrapped, along with the Civil Wars.

The university will also end research into the history of continental Europe pre-1900, affecting the study of the Napoleonic wars and the Roman Empire.

The university said it was “reshaping” its curriculum and research following a £3m cut in Government funding.

Last week, universities across the country were told their budgets were to be slashed by £449 million next year, including a £215m reduction in teaching funding, with threats of further cuts in the future.

Lord Mandelson, the Business Secretary, has claimed that institutions can use the opportunity to focus resources on their strongest areas.

But in a letter to The Daily Telegraph, 17 leading historians said the move was short-sighted and risked undermining the public’s understanding of the past.

“To cut everything but the most modern puts in peril the public function of history, entrenching the arrogance of the present and making a mockery of the claim by the

minister behind these cuts that 'we also wish to keep this country civilised',” said the letter.

The academics, who all trained at Sussex, said that the decision to sever ties with European history before 1900 was a particularly retrograde step.

“For a university which has long prided itself on its European links to abandon the serious study of such pivotal areas of modern history as the French Revolution will mean depriving Sussex graduates of the mental furniture of educated

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: godsgravesglyphs; worldhistory
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1 posted on 02/11/2010 3:19:42 PM PST by bruinbirdman
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To: bruinbirdman

Making it all the more easy to be overrun by the muzzies.


2 posted on 02/11/2010 3:22:02 PM PST by Drill Thrawl (Another day, another injury, another step closer. Are you prepared?)
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To: bruinbirdman

Do they have no private universities? All are at the mercy of government? Well, hopefully they have some independent historians.


3 posted on 02/11/2010 3:22:08 PM PST by Old_Grouch (62 and AARP-free)
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To: Old_Grouch

As long as 1776 was included in limey history, I have no problems with it.


4 posted on 02/11/2010 3:23:16 PM PST by max americana
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To: bruinbirdman

Yes, English history begins roughly with the establishment of the Bank of England.


5 posted on 02/11/2010 3:25:44 PM PST by Ozone34 ("There are only two philosophies: Thomism and bullshitism!" -Leon Bloy)
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To: max americana

1215 is candidly more imporant for us all.


6 posted on 02/11/2010 3:27:04 PM PST by Jewbacca (The residents of Iroquois territory may not determine whether Jews may live in Jerusalem.)
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To: bruinbirdman

In the beginning there were hot lumps.


7 posted on 02/11/2010 3:29:39 PM PST by Nick Danger (Free cheese is found only in mousetraps)
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To: bruinbirdman

1700 Marked the end of the monarchy as such and the beginning of Government by the people. The concepts of Socialism were being debated in France and England late in the 1700’s. I wonder if that has anything to do with it?


8 posted on 02/11/2010 3:29:51 PM PST by Ben Mugged (Unions are the storm troopers of socialism.)
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To: bruinbirdman

In South Carolina it starts in 1877. heh


9 posted on 02/11/2010 3:30:52 PM PST by GeronL (Dignity is earned from yourself. Respect is earned from others.)
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To: GeronL

No King Canute

No Magna Carta.

No Richard the Lion-Heart.

No Crusades.

No Robin Hood.

No Simon de Montfort.

No Elizabeth I

No Spanish Armada


10 posted on 02/11/2010 3:33:53 PM PST by CondorFlight (I)
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To: Jewbacca

Ah yes!

A document or a law recognizing basic rights and privileges.

From Latin magna carta (great charter). After Magna Carta, a charter of political and civil liberties that King John of England was forced to sign on June 15, 1215. It was revised several times over the years, and it became an important symbol, establishing for future generations that there were limits to royal power


11 posted on 02/11/2010 3:33:53 PM PST by sodpoodle (Despair - Man's surrender. Laughter - God's redemption.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Gotta erase that pesky Medieval Warm Period...


12 posted on 02/11/2010 3:34:55 PM PST by Snickering Hound
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To: Snickering Hound

England, circling the bowl...

You must know where you come from. I guess no one’s gonna crack open some Churchill in British academia?


13 posted on 02/11/2010 3:39:30 PM PST by DesertConservative
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To: Ben Mugged

The Glorious Revolution of 1689 virtually ended personal rule by the monarch, although George III made an effective end run around that. But the real power now lay with the aristocracy, and it was pretty autocratic. The number of people voting in parliamentary elections feel during the 18th Century, and “democracy” did not comes until Parliamentary Reforms in the 1830s, but certainly in 1867 when Disraeli extended the ballot beyond the Middle class.


14 posted on 02/11/2010 3:45:22 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: CondorFlight

No Cromwell. Yet there he stands outside the House of Parliament.


15 posted on 02/11/2010 3:46:54 PM PST by RobbyS (Pray with the suffering souls.)
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To: bruinbirdman

So it begins. Eliminate everything Christian and western about England and jump right into the “Age of Imperialism.”


16 posted on 02/11/2010 3:50:01 PM PST by LS ("Castles made of sand, fall in the sea . . . eventually." (Hendrix))
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To: bruinbirdman

Insanity!


17 posted on 02/11/2010 3:51:05 PM PST by rdl6989 (January 20, 2013 The end of an error.)
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To: rdl6989

They can rewrite history books but they can’t make history go away.


18 posted on 02/11/2010 3:53:31 PM PST by ully2 (ully)
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To: RobbyS; Ben Mugged
The problem is you can't understand the Glorious Revolution if you don't understand the Tudor/Stuart history, and you can't understand that if you don't understand the Late Medieval and the Wars of the Roses, and you can't understand that if you don't understand the Angevins, including Magna Carta, and you can't understand that unless you understand the Norman invasion and the Norman Kings, and you can't understand that . . . .

An understanding of history is central to our institutions, our freedom, and our ability to make good decisions in the future. I'd junk all the ethnic studies, sociology, political science and the like curricula to keep history.

19 posted on 02/11/2010 3:58:12 PM PST by colorado tanker
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To: GeronL
In South Carolina it starts in 1877. heh

That's North Carolina, you mean.

20 posted on 02/11/2010 3:59:35 PM PST by thulldud
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To: thulldud

Oops!


21 posted on 02/11/2010 4:02:42 PM PST by GeronL (Dignity is earned from yourself. Respect is earned from others.)
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To: bruinbirdman
"William the first, the first of our kings (not counting Ethelreds, Egberts and things), had himself crowned, annointed and blessed, in 1060 (you needn't worry the rest.).

But, being a Norman king, William the first, by the Saxons he conquered, was hated and cursed, so he rang the curfew, a sort of a bell, that if any Saxon was caught out of bed afer eight o'clock sharp, it was off with his head."

From a childhood book of English Kings.

Abandoning history is prelude to national suicide.

22 posted on 02/11/2010 4:06:27 PM PST by Jimmy Valentine (DemocRATS - when they speak, they lie; when they are silent, they are stealing the American Dream)
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To: RobbyS
No Cromwell. Yet there he stands outside the House of Parliament.

Most of the Tower would be similarly erased, yet there it is...

23 posted on 02/11/2010 4:06:46 PM PST by Charles Martel ("Endeavor to persevere...")
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To: CondorFlight

“No Robin Hood.”

Tell the lefties that he stole from the rich and gave to the poor. That ought to drive ‘em nuts!;)


24 posted on 02/11/2010 4:13:15 PM PST by Frank_2001
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To: bruinbirdman

Can we assume their drama dept. threw out all their Shakespeare as well?


25 posted on 02/11/2010 4:13:24 PM PST by bgill (The framers of the US Constitution established an entire federal government in 18 pages.)
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To: Jimmy Valentine

In 1060?


26 posted on 02/11/2010 4:14:32 PM PST by OldPossum
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To: bruinbirdman
In Brideshead Revisited Evelyn Waugh writes about the coming "Age of Hooper" when his beloved aristocrats would be replaced by the common man, whose education didn't extend to kings and battles but only to industrial inventions and reform acts. Waugh was snobbish to be sure, but it looks like he wasn't far off the mark for today's British universities.

Up till now, though, you could always count on Britons to take an interest in history -- and the more obscure the era the better. There's always somebody who has a diorama of Roman Britain or the Siege of Naumur in the basement or a model of Nelson's Victory in the den, just like there's always somebody who will stand for hours in the rain trainspotting. That won't die out any time soon.

27 posted on 02/11/2010 4:21:30 PM PST by x
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To: bruinbirdman
No Spanish Armada? No Edward Pokerbutt? No Liz I? No Horny Henry? No Guy Fawkes? No Brother Cadfael? NO BLACKADDER?!??

History just got lots less fun.

28 posted on 02/11/2010 4:21:38 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: bruinbirdman

NO MONTY PYTHON AND THE HOLY GRAIL???!!!!??? I expected a lesson plan, not the Spanish Inquisition!


29 posted on 02/11/2010 4:24:55 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: bruinbirdman

If no English History pre-1700; and no European History pre-1900, then the Napoleonic Wars will occur in a vacuum, with England sending ships under Nelson, and troops under Wellington somewhere not mentioned, for a purpose not explained, with an unknown result, and no explicable future consequences?


30 posted on 02/11/2010 4:25:15 PM PST by ApplegateRanch (I think not, therefore I don't exist!)
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To: Charles Martel

This is all a political maneuver. Our teachers over here in the U.S. practice the same baloney. Whenever their funding is cut back, they choose to cut those subjects that are guaranteed to gall the public the most. Usually, music, physical education, the arts, or after school programs, or whatever. So, this University chose to eliminate a group of courses that was going to make the biggest splash in the MSM and have the greatest negative effect, in order to draw “attention” to their financial plight. All in hopes of getting their full funding back, or some of it. A political ploy, as simple as that.


31 posted on 02/11/2010 4:26:02 PM PST by flaglady47 (Dems days are numbered; it's Tea Party Time.....)
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To: bruinbirdman

Newsflash: funding cuts lead to ignorance.

I’m sure they will keep gay studies, women’s studies, black history, Mohammet, etc... ad nauseum.

Still witnessing the Death of Western Civilization from a front row seat. Nothing has changed there. The west has its head in the noose and is jumping.


32 posted on 02/11/2010 4:28:24 PM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Depression Countdown: 48... 47... 46...)
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To: bruinbirdman

Question:

Is communist infiltration in British schools even further along than US schools?


33 posted on 02/11/2010 4:29:12 PM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Depression Countdown: 48... 47... 46...)
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To: bruinbirdman

removing the Magna Carta from British history would remove one of the main pillars from the foundation.


34 posted on 02/11/2010 4:30:04 PM PST by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-Qaeda" and its allies.)
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To: rdl6989

No, not insanity in the least. It is a deliberate plan to eliminate western freedom and institute communism. The communists are not insane. They know precisely what they are intending to do.


35 posted on 02/11/2010 4:30:34 PM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Depression Countdown: 48... 47... 46...)
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To: LS

True that. I would not say “so it begins. It seems to have begun here and in Europe at least by the 1960s if not back to before WWII. Hardly a beginning, it has been going on for decades. This is merely the latest salvo.

Look how long we have been emphasizing Dr. King and Caesar Chavez over George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, except to note their slave-owning.

How “gay” is good, and how little boys should behave like little girls.


36 posted on 02/11/2010 4:32:58 PM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Depression Countdown: 48... 47... 46...)
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To: ully2

Yes they can. Those who control the books and minds of the young can do exactly that. They can create history from whole cloth. It is easy. Suppress the truth and substitute what you want children to think is true.

Oh, there are cracks at the seams, but overall, you can control the minds of an entire generataion, just as President Lincoln said.

No, they can absolutly make history go away by re-writing the history books. That is the goal. Freedom never happend. Democracy never happened. The contributions of the old white guys of the West never happened. That is the goal.


37 posted on 02/11/2010 4:35:24 PM PST by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Depression Countdown: 48... 47... 46...)
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To: max americana

“As long as 1776 was included in limey history, I have no problems with it.”
Good One!!!


38 posted on 02/11/2010 4:35:57 PM PST by sueuprising
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To: bruinbirdman

North Carolina public schools to cut 400 years out of US History (Freep article 2-11-10)

Coincidence? Things like these are called tells. Using a different tack to get to the same goal, destroy Western Civilization. Ultimately going for the jugular- Christianity, the only truth. Yes, we are in a spiritual fight. It’s great being the good guys!


39 posted on 02/11/2010 4:40:14 PM PST by Doulos1 (Bitter Clinger Forever)
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To: flaglady47

“This is all a political maneuver. “
I think you are right, but the way things are going over there, you never can tell if trashing the history of the English people is imminent.


40 posted on 02/11/2010 4:40:37 PM PST by sueuprising
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To: Jimmy Valentine
"Abandoning history is prelude to national suicide. "

That would be the Lisbon/Treaty Constitution.

Nations are so passe.

yitbos

41 posted on 02/11/2010 4:50:36 PM PST by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: bruinbirdman
No English history before 1700 and no European history before 1900 means getting rid of all the interesting parts. Instead of studying history, they'll be studying current events.

Supposedly someone asked Chou En-lai his opinion of the French Revolution, and he answered, "It's too early to tell." You need to let some time pass before passing judgments.

John Derbyshire in his book We are doomed quotes from the old classic 1066 and All That about the English Civil War--it was " a struggle between the Cavaliers (Wrong but Wromantic) and the Roundheads (Right and Repulsive)."

Certainly more interesting than reading about the corn laws and the Chartists and the like.

42 posted on 02/11/2010 4:52:42 PM PST by Verginius Rufus
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To: bruinbirdman

I’m surprised they aren’t scraping history before 1960. That’s when most Libs in the US think it starts. Everything before St. John’s electionis simply an evil Dark Age.


43 posted on 02/11/2010 4:54:57 PM PST by Opinionated Blowhard
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To: bruinbirdman

idiots

The history of england begins with the history of the english language...ie anglo-saxon/old frisian and the futhark alphabet.

That means is begins circa AD400.


44 posted on 02/11/2010 5:01:36 PM PST by mamelukesabre (Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum (If you want peace prepare for war))
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To: Billthedrill

Dr. Who?


45 posted on 02/11/2010 5:16:17 PM PST by wally_bert (It's sheer elegance in its simplicity! - The Middleman)
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To: CondorFlight

No Guy Fawkes Day either...and why that is important. No Reformation, no Henry VIII, no William Wallace, No Edward the Longshanks, No Robert the Bruce, no Shakespeare
In short, nothing of the learnings from all of these events and people which shaped the Empire and rest of the world. Absolute nuts. And why can’t they damned well assign reading from very widely available texts on this history as a way of cost cutting. In order to institute the dialectic one must first erase history. 1700 forward begins the puritan/progressive political movement and eventual downfall of the age of imperialism. And they so neatly avoid any discussion of Mohammed or Jesus or even Genghis Khan! Nice work. So how would they handle Stalin?


46 posted on 02/11/2010 5:28:52 PM PST by John S Mosby
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To: bruinbirdman

They are doing the same thing with American history. So now I will start to copy and hand out to young people I meet history stories and facts to keep the interest and chain of man going with full historical facts.


47 posted on 02/11/2010 5:38:19 PM PST by Pilated
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To: bruinbirdman

The amazing thing is one can not begin to understand why wars occur or country boundries are disputed without knowledge of history prior to 1700. In Europe & Mid-East, many of the problems today are results of things that occurred over 500 years ago.


48 posted on 02/11/2010 11:30:03 PM PST by theelephantway
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To: Nick Danger

History is written by the victors ... unless they are illiterate.


49 posted on 02/11/2010 11:32:50 PM PST by who_would_fardels_bear (These fragments I have shored against my ruins)
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To: OldPossum

1066 of course, the author was working the rhyme. ;^)


50 posted on 02/12/2010 3:20:08 AM PST by Jimmy Valentine (DemocRATS - when they speak, they lie; when they are silent, they are stealing the American Dream)
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