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Civics class: Where is the House-Senate health care conference committee?
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com ^ | March 7 2010 | Byron york

Posted on 03/07/2010 3:44:03 PM PST by Para-Ord.45

Today's Washington Post Outlook section gives featured lefty blogger Ezra Klein another shot at the supposedly dysfunctional workings of the Senate. "As the minority becomes less responsible with the filibuster (and oh boy, have minority Republicans become less responsible with the filibuster), the majority needs to use reconciliation more often," Klein writes.

The article begins:

"Ask a kid who just took civics how a bill becomes a law and she'll explain that Congress takes a vote and, if a majority supports the bill, the bill goes to the president. That's what we teach in textbooks, but it's not what we practice in Washington."

Now, if you did in fact ask a kid who just took a civics class, she -- could be he! -- might explain that the House and Senate pass bills, and if there are differences between them, the bills usually go to a House/Senate conference committee, where lawmakers appointed by the leaders of both parties resolve the differences between the bills and come up with one final bill, which the House and Senate pass and which then goes to the president's desk for signature into law. (Wasn't that the method used for the 2001 and 2003 Bush tax cuts, the 1996 welfare reform bill and other legislation often cited by Klein and his allies today?) Isn't that what a kid who just took a civics class would say? Isn't that what we teach in textbooks? And is that what's being practiced in the case of the national health care bills?

The answer, of course, is no, because Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Majority Leader Harry Reid, who in the past have been strong advocates of conference committees, decided to skip conference for the health care bill. Why? Because it might be troublesome -- and public. Better to bypass it altogether, assured that Klein and others will devote their energies to attacking Republican irresponsibility.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
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1 posted on 03/07/2010 3:44:03 PM PST by Para-Ord.45
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To: Para-Ord.45
You either have the filibuster or you do not. Using it when you disagree with a law is not being less responsible, it is being more responsible.

The problem is that it wasn't use often enough for the right reasons before.

We have the same problem with impeachment: it should have been used often and early to show its importance. Unfortunately for us now, we had men cut from better cloth at that time, and it wasn't necessary. By the time it was necessary, there was sufficient precedent of it being an "extreme" measure.

2 posted on 03/07/2010 3:49:48 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: Para-Ord.45

Senator DeMint (R-SC) insisted that Senator McConnell object to the appointment of the House-Senate Conferees, thus preventing a Conference on the bill.


3 posted on 03/07/2010 3:50:32 PM PST by thethirddegree
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To: Para-Ord.45

Not being racial but it does seem the Jews are always the liberals. Why in the world is that? No profiling means turning a blind eye to demographics.


4 posted on 03/07/2010 3:56:04 PM PST by Beowulf9
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To: Beowulf9

Maybe because the last time they didn’t agree with a radical leftist, 6 million ended up dead? Just sayin’ ...


5 posted on 03/07/2010 3:57:47 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: kosciusko51
Maybe because the last time they didn’t agree with a radical leftist, 6 million ended up dead? Just sayin’ ...

Except that Hitler was more on the radical right.

6 posted on 03/07/2010 3:59:03 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray
Myth. Read the book "Liberal Fascism". Hitler was a National Socialist, and was loved by the Communists until he attacked the USSR.
7 posted on 03/07/2010 4:00:53 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: kosciusko51

Well, congresscritters now do not usually duel one another on the floor, nor do they beat one another with their canes. They’ve found it much kinder and more civil to trade favors with the taxpayer’s dollars.


8 posted on 03/07/2010 4:03:23 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (I am in America but not of America (per bible: am in the world but not of it))
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To: kosciusko51

Guess Adolph got a mite too crazy for the Rooskies to tolerate. This is like Jonah purposing to swallow the whale.


9 posted on 03/07/2010 4:04:54 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (I am in America but not of America (per bible: am in the world but not of it))
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To: HiTech RedNeck

I wouldn’t mind seeing a good beat-down on C-SPAN. It would do wonders to their ratings, too. ;-)


10 posted on 03/07/2010 4:07:46 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: kosciusko51
He was also a National Fascist, appealing to the traditional “Right” values of God, Guns and Country, not necessarily in that order. He made strong appeals to straight morality, marriage, and was totally against homosexuality. I do somewhat agree about the socialist part, though. However, he did not make wholesale seizure & control of industry, especially war material, a priority.
11 posted on 03/07/2010 4:09:34 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Beowulf9

Jews have seen liberals as more open than conservatives, which prefers the liberals when they (the Jews) are looking for a port in a storm, which they seem to do a whole lot because they really get hated on all over the world. There were a few ugly incidents during WWII where the government (well, FDR was a big fat liberal, but he seemed conservative enough to the Jews at that time) wouldn’t let in Jewish refugee ships, preferring to send them back to lands where they would be fed to the Nazis.


12 posted on 03/07/2010 4:10:47 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (I am in America but not of America (per bible: am in the world but not of it))
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To: kosciusko51
Myth. Read the book "Liberal Fascism". Hitler was a National Socialist, and was loved by the Communists until he attacked the USSR.

Having only read reviews of the book and not the book itself, it appears to concentrate on Mussolini (even in the subtitle) and not Nazi's per se. I would be interested to see why you state that the Russians "loved" Hitler and the Nazi movement. They were not allies, they just had a treaty.

13 posted on 03/07/2010 4:16:42 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray
National == Deutchland Uber Alles

He hated God and the Christian Church.

He restricted gun ownership to the average citizen. In fact, it has been documented that many of our current gun laws are similar to the one in Nazi Germany

He was no more right-wing than Obama is a centrist. He was just right of Lenin/Stalin.

14 posted on 03/07/2010 4:20:41 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray

No, I said communists, especially American communist. I suggest you read the book. It is very enlightening.


15 posted on 03/07/2010 4:22:00 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray
He was also a National Fascist, appealing to the traditional “Right” values of God, Guns and Country

Guns? When did Hitler make a pitch to gun rights? I never heard that before. Please specify. As to God, I suppose that Nazis made some general appeal to religion but I don't this was too important. Hitler was not particularly religious, nor were his advisors. Also, I don't recall reading that he emphasized this in his speeches. His big issues were the "stab in the big," high unemployment. and pride in the German "race," not particularly German Lutheranism or Catholicism.

16 posted on 03/07/2010 4:22:57 PM PST by Captain Kirk
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To: Beowulf9

It would be helpful for you to read

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203440104574402591116901498.html

he can answer this better than any of us.


17 posted on 03/07/2010 4:23:29 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: jimmyray

that’s “stab in the back”


18 posted on 03/07/2010 4:23:44 PM PST by Captain Kirk
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To: jimmyray

Need to get your facts straight

NAZI = National SOCIALISTS


19 posted on 03/07/2010 4:24:26 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: jimmyray
Hitler was a National Socialist, and was loved by the Communists until he attacked the USSR.

NAZIs and Communists both have the same goal...TOTAL GOVERNMENT CONTROL of the citizens lives.

20 posted on 03/07/2010 4:24:58 PM PST by Don Corleone ("Oil the gun..eat the cannolis. Take it to the Mattress.")
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To: Ouderkirk

Good article. My original comment was tongue-in-cheek, not meant to be taken seriously, just to emphasize the left does not really like Jewish people.


21 posted on 03/07/2010 4:28:33 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: Ouderkirk

Hey, thanks for the article. Yes I’m familiar with some of this, but not all. Very informative article.


22 posted on 03/07/2010 4:35:14 PM PST by Beowulf9
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To: Para-Ord.45
Oh Ezra, whatever will you say when Republicans take control and do the same thing to repeal it.
23 posted on 03/07/2010 4:43:57 PM PST by TornadoAlley3 (Obama is everything Oklahoma is not.)
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To: Ouderkirk
Need to get your facts straight NAZI = National SOCIALISTS

And what makes you think I don't know that? I was pointing out that Hitler was a National Fascist, which is somewhat redundant, now that I think of it...

It would be polite to give someone the benefit of the doubt before you call them out. Thanks for being so helpful.

24 posted on 03/07/2010 4:45:25 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Captain Kirk
An interesting statement from the Wiki article on National Socialism:

Nazism is a politically syncretic variety of fascism, which incorporates policies, tactics and philosophic tenets from left and right-wing politics. As such, Italian Fascism and German Nazism reject liberalism, democracy, and Marxism, as practical forms of government. Usually supported by the far right (military, business, Church), fascism also is historically anti-communist, anti-conservative, and anti-parliamentary.

Hitler did capitalize on the common man's belief in God, and got the aquiescence of some mainline churches, include the Catholics, from what I've read. He killed of many of those that did not go along.

As far as the guns part, I was referring to the fact that Hitler did not confiscate guns from German citizens, but he did from conquered territories and Jews.

25 posted on 03/07/2010 4:53:17 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Para-Ord.45

Much better to pass a bill that is known to be flawed. In the hope of it’s reconciliation.


26 posted on 03/07/2010 5:04:17 PM PST by Mike Darancette (You know Obama is in trouble when the MSM mentions that he is half white.)
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To: Beowulf9
It was shown on Beck last week that during the 1930's the Republican party had a Nazi group who were registered Republicans. Beck noted that this was a fringe group and not mainstream. He said this is why the far left refer to the far right as Nazi's even though they were socialists.
The Democrats had a large constituency of communists.
27 posted on 03/07/2010 5:09:48 PM PST by orinoco
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To: Captain Kirk
His big issues were the "stab in the big," high unemployment. and pride in the German "race," not particularly German Lutheranism or Catholicism.

While true prima facia, Anti-Jewsih sentiment was supported by the writings of Luther, especially "On the Jews and their Lies", which Julius Streicher, the editor of Der Stürmer, described as the most radically anti-Semitic tract ever published.

28 posted on 03/07/2010 5:10:25 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray

jimmyray, can I interest you in a replacement pair of asbestos long johns ... the ones you’re wearing look to be just about burned through.


29 posted on 03/07/2010 5:12:05 PM PST by tx_eggman
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To: jimmyray; orinoco
Utter nonsense! Wiki is not reliable, and the references are from particularly left-leaning sources, which have done a fabulous job of denying the truth about the Nazis.

For instance, the church in Germany was told to acquiesce or be done in. Those who valued their position gave in; those who did not paid the ultimate price. Read about Dietrich Bonhoeffer, and you will understand.

The same is true for German industry. Get on board or lose your factory.

If I remember correctly, the Kennedy patriarch seemed to have an affinity for Hitler as well, at least in the beginning.

30 posted on 03/07/2010 5:12:51 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray

This assertion that many use that Hitler was on the political right has gotten on my last nerve.

So if you knew that, why did you say Hitler was on the right?


31 posted on 03/07/2010 5:14:42 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: tx_eggman
jimmyray, can I interest you in a replacement pair of asbestos long johns ... the ones you’re wearing look to be just about burned through.

You have me at a disadvantage, for I know not of what you type. Why would my britches be burned?

32 posted on 03/07/2010 5:16:40 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Para-Ord.45

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33 posted on 03/07/2010 5:18:38 PM PST by GailA (obamacare paid for by cuts & taxes on most vulnerable Veterans, disabled,seniors & retired Military)
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To: Ouderkirk
So if you knew that, why did you say Hitler was on the right?

Read the entire thread, including my other comments, and perhaps the answer will be come apparent. Incidentally, Hitler despised the communists. I think it would be more telling to learn why you think he was on the far left, other than some recent tome that has presented arguments to that end.

34 posted on 03/07/2010 5:22:22 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: orinoco

Meanwhile, Senator Byrd, a Democrat, was in the KKK...


35 posted on 03/07/2010 5:23:11 PM PST by Beowulf9
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To: Para-Ord.45

The Senate without a fillibuster, is just a smaller version of the House.


36 posted on 03/07/2010 5:30:52 PM PST by Lou L
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To: jimmyray

I am fully aware of Hitler’s attitudes towards the communists, slavs, and jews. How his opinions changed over time.

I have grown to expect more from the folks here at FR. This epithet thrown about by the left in this country that anyone/everyone is a nazi/fascist. Where they have no understanding that nazism, fascism, and communism are simply just different shades of the same RED.


37 posted on 03/07/2010 5:32:00 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: Ouderkirk
Many view the political spectrum, from far left to far right, as follows:

Communist, Socialist, Democrat, Center, Republican, Nationalist (aka Nazi), Fascist

While arguments to the contrary can be made, this is the way I have generally understood it. What is interesting, however, is that methods of governing, including "democracies", "republics", "dictatorships" et al can be dominated by any of the aforementioned political ideologies.

38 posted on 03/07/2010 5:38:24 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: Ouderkirk
Where they have no understanding that nazism, fascism, and communism are simply just different shades of the same RED.

It is also generally accepted that Hitler adopted many "pro-labor" Socialistic policies simply to garner votes and support, and to AVOID a communist revolution! The same could be argued for some of Roosevelt's policies in the 30's.

39 posted on 03/07/2010 5:41:36 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray
How about this quote from Theodore Able, Why Hitler Came Into Power, Harvard University Press, 1938 (as quoted in "Liberal Fascism", p. 74, since it was the easiest place for me to find it):

"... a coal miner ... was 'puzzled by the denial of race and nation implicit in Marxism. Though I was interested in the betterment of the workingman's plight, I rejected [Marxism] unconditionally. I often asked myself why socialism had to be tied up internationalism--why it could not work as well or better in conjunction with nationalism.' A railroad worker concurred, 'I shuddered to the thought of Germany in the grip of Bolshevism. The slogan "Workers of the World Unite!" made no sense to me. At the same time, however, National Socialism, with its promise of a community ... barring all class struggle, attracted me profoundly.' A third work wrote that he embraced the Nazis because of their 'uncompromising will to stamp out the class struggle, snobberies of caste and party hatreds. The movement bore the true message of socialism to the German workingman.'"

They hated the communist because of their internationalism, not their socialist policies.

40 posted on 03/07/2010 5:42:09 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray
Actually, the order should be:

Communist, National Socialist, Fascist, Socialist, Democrat, Center, Republican, libertarian.

Increasing order of freedom and personal responsibility as one moves left to right. The list does not circle back.

41 posted on 03/07/2010 5:49:20 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray
Why would my britches be burned?

To start with, sourcing wiki to buttress your view of the world is like trying to put out a grease fire by squirting it with a water hose.

42 posted on 03/07/2010 5:52:55 PM PST by tx_eggman
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To: thethirddegree
-- Senator DeMint (R-SC) insisted that Senator McConnell object to the appointment of the House-Senate Conferees, thus preventing a Conference on the bill. --

I believe this is false. Until the House advises the Senate that the differences between the bills can't be reconciled via amendment, the bill just sits in the House.

HR 3590, and a link to all congressional actions: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:HR03590:@@@X

I know that Byron York's assertion that differences are usually resolved via conference is incorrect. Differences are usually resolved by ping-pong amendments. However, ping-pong amendments would not be appropriate for this sort of legislation, so his ultimate question, "Where's the call for a conference?" is sensible.

43 posted on 03/07/2010 5:54:22 PM PST by Cboldt
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To: jimmyray
Communist, Socialist, Democrat, Center, Republican, Nationalist (aka Nazi), Fascist

Politics 101 Photobucket

44 posted on 03/07/2010 5:55:27 PM PST by Ouderkirk (Democrats: the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy and Sedition)
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To: kosciusko51
The premise that National Socialism resulted in the "barring all class struggle" is off the mark. One could still achieve wealth and fame from his own effort in Nazi Germany. In fact, Hitler stated "“I absolutely insist on protecting private property ... we must encourage private initiative”

Source: Hitler, A.; transl. Norman Cameron, R. H. Stevens; intro. H. R. Trevor-Roper (2000). "March 24, 1942". Hitler’s Table Talk, 1941–1944: His Private Conversations. Enigma Books. pp. 162–163.

Hitler was against internationalism, be cause he asserted the Jewish bankers controlled the financing of the same.

45 posted on 03/07/2010 5:56:45 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray

Are you sure this is not Hitler adopting a capitalist policy simply to garner votes and support, as he did for the pro-labor movement?


46 posted on 03/07/2010 5:59:45 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: kosciusko51

After all, this sound an awful lot like Obama’s comment on capitalism after the JP Morgan Chase bonuses.


47 posted on 03/07/2010 6:01:52 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: jimmyray
Not to mention, the Nazi party platform was against private industry. See Points 13, 14, and 25.
48 posted on 03/07/2010 6:07:24 PM PST by kosciusko51
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To: Ouderkirk
In regards to citizens rights, allegiance to the state, and economic models, fascism and communism inhabit opposite ends of the spectrum. In fact Knapp and Wright in The Government and Politics of France, assert that in France, where the terms (left and right) originated, the Left is called "the party of movement" and the Right "the party of order".

Fascism derives it's name from Latin word fasces. The fasces, which consisted of a bundle of rods that were tied around an axe, was an ancient Roman symbol of the authority of the civic magistrate. The symbolism of the fasces suggested strength through unity: a single rod is easily broken, while the bundle is difficult to break.

As such, Fascism rejects and resists autonomy of cultural or ethnic groups who are not considered part of the fascists' nation and who refuse to assimilate or are unable to be assimilated. Fascist are strong nationalists, and resists outside influences that would weaken the national identity, i.e. illegal immigration, foreign religions, outside cultural influences, etc. As such, this is identified with the Right in the US, which promotes Christianity, national sovereignty, and the stoppage of illegal immigration, whereas the left takes the opposite tact.

49 posted on 03/07/2010 6:22:56 PM PST by jimmyray
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To: jimmyray
According to Gilbert Allardyce concerning the term Fascism, "we have agreed to use the word without agreeing on how to define it." American Historical Review 84, No. 2 (April 1979), p. 367.

However, there is some consensus on socialism, which is the term the Nazis used. Fascism was originally linked to Mussolini, and not the Nazis.

50 posted on 03/07/2010 6:35:51 PM PST by kosciusko51
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