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FBI agents conduct raids in Mich., Ohio, Ind.
AP ^ | 3-28-10 | By MIKE HOUSEHOLDER

Posted on 03/28/2010 4:18:34 PM PDT by CincyRichieRich

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Looks Like Obama Has Started to Take Away Arms; Patriotic groups are illegal, Islamic groups are free to do as they please. Oh my, it has started. Don't tell me this wasn't orchestrated by Eric Holder and Obama. What's next?
1 posted on 03/28/2010 4:18:34 PM PDT by CincyRichieRich
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To: CincyRichieRich
This looks like the Hutaree website: www.hutaree.com

Looks like they might be a mite on the flake and nut side.

2 posted on 03/28/2010 4:20:44 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (I am in America but not of America (per bible: am in the world but not of it))
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To: CincyRichieRich
Looks Like Obama Has Started to Take Away Arms; Patriotic groups are illegal, Islamic groups are free to do as they please.

This isn't a patriotic group. Watch their YouTube videos. They don't fly the American flag.

3 posted on 03/28/2010 4:21:10 PM PDT by Caesar Soze
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To: CincyRichieRich

From one of the other threads supposedly someone was trying to sell pipe bombs. If so a warrant and arrest probably legitimate.

However, several States and several agencies is way overkill and designed to provoke a reaction.


4 posted on 03/28/2010 4:21:21 PM PDT by Domandred (Fdisk, format, and reinstall the entire .gov system.)
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To: CincyRichieRich
"Oh my, it has started. Don't tell me this wasn't orchestrated by Eric Holder and Obama. What's next?"

Be very afraid!

5 posted on 03/28/2010 4:21:50 PM PDT by Mad Dawgg (If you're going to deny my 1st Amendment rights then I must proceed to the next one...)
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To: CincyRichieRich
"They said they were under attack by the ATF and wanted a place to hide," Lackomar said. "My team leader said, 'no thanks.' "

I'm really starting to wonder if this Hutaree group isn't an FBI front group. What better way to search legitimate Militia property than to chase a wanted group onto that property.
6 posted on 03/28/2010 4:25:17 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin! (look it up))
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To: CincyRichieRich

I wish they’d tackled illegal immigration or Islamic terrorist camps here is the US with just as much zeal.


7 posted on 03/28/2010 4:25:29 PM PDT by rbosque (11 year Freeper! A true American is an armed American.)
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To: CincyRichieRich
.
I hate to sound stupid but -- I read the article twice and can't see why they are being raided.
8 posted on 03/28/2010 4:25:31 PM PDT by Touch Not the Cat (Where is the light? Wonder if it's weeping somewhere...)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

I’m unclear on what the crime was.


9 posted on 03/28/2010 4:25:32 PM PDT by Brilliant
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To: Mad Dawgg

What crimes are they being charged with? No mention of that.
It’s not illegal to be a crackpot! Are the charges trumped up or were they planning something illegal?


10 posted on 03/28/2010 4:26:23 PM PDT by Mr. Right Now
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To: CincyRichieRich

Question: You’re in a re-education camp along with idiots who actually voted for Obama and now sit and complain. You have an escape plan. Would you let them join you?

Or you stage an uprising and take over the camp. You are going to execute the guards. Would you also execute the the cause of this camp?


11 posted on 03/28/2010 4:26:58 PM PDT by Terry Mross ("God, please send Pat Leahy to Murtha's house.")
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To: CincyRichieRich

Calm down and wait to see what the people arrested are charged with.


12 posted on 03/28/2010 4:27:21 PM PDT by popdonnelly (I'm so old, I remember when free enterprise was praised, and communism was shunned.)
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To: Caesar Soze
"This isn't a patriotic group. Watch their YouTube videos. They don't fly the American flag."

hmmm OK how do you know they don't fly the American Flag? How does one prove such a statment? AND if one does not fly the American flag does this prove one is not patriotic? I have not flown the American flag once in 2010. Am I branded a non-patriot now?

13 posted on 03/28/2010 4:28:28 PM PDT by Mad Dawgg (If you're going to deny my 1st Amendment rights then I must proceed to the next one...)
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To: Domandred
From one of the other threads supposedly someone was trying to sell pipe bombs. If so a warrant and arrest probably legitimate.

...probably a lot like Randy Weaver was trying to by that illegal, sawed off shotgun.

These types of groups will get nailed first and always. It's the ones without websites that the goons should be worrying about.
14 posted on 03/28/2010 4:28:43 PM PDT by hiredhand
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To: CincyRichieRich

“Sandra Berchtold said there had been activity in two southwest Michigan counties”

No, the counties are in southeast Michigan.


15 posted on 03/28/2010 4:28:46 PM PDT by Kenny500c
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To: cripplecreek

“I’m really starting to wonder if this Hutaree group isn’t an FBI front group. What better way to search legitimate Militia property than to chase a wanted group onto that property. “

Exactly.

COINTELPRO is an acronym for a series of FBI counterintelligence programs designed to neutralize political dissidents. Although covert operations have been employed throughout FBI history, the formal COINTELPRO’s of 1956-1971 were broadly targeted against radical political organizations

http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/cointel.htm


16 posted on 03/28/2010 4:29:56 PM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: CincyRichieRich

“Federal warrants were sealed, but FBI spokeswoman Sandra Berchtold said there had been activity in two southwest Michigan counties near the Ohio state line.”

Activity? What’s that mean? They were cooking hotdogs, singing campfire songs or getting ready to bomb something? Sounds like a crock to me and intentionally vague.


17 posted on 03/28/2010 4:30:13 PM PDT by WKUHilltopper (Fix bayonets!)
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To: CincyRichieRich; Eaker; AK2KX; Ancesthntr; An Old Man; ApesForEvolution; aragorn; archy; ...
CW2 Ping


18 posted on 03/28/2010 4:30:35 PM PDT by Travis McGee (---www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com---)
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To: CincyRichieRich

Is it just me or is it that our federal agencies don’t even know their geography? SW MI borders IN and SE MI borders OH

“but FBI spokeswoman Sandra Berchtold said there had been activity in two southwest Michigan counties near the Ohio state line”


19 posted on 03/28/2010 4:30:51 PM PDT by ebersole
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To: CincyRichieRich
" Lackomar said he heard from other militia members that the FBI targeted the Hutaree after its members made threats of violence against Islamic organizations "

So they raided them for thought crimes against diaper-heads?

20 posted on 03/28/2010 4:30:54 PM PDT by Mr. K (This administration IS WEARING OUT MY CAPSLOCK KEY!)
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To: rbosque
I wish they’d tackled illegal immigration or Islamic terrorist camps here is the US with just as much zeal.

Not in this parallel universe.

21 posted on 03/28/2010 4:31:27 PM PDT by Travis McGee (---www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com---)
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To: CincyRichieRich

This is Napalitanos “system”.
It’s ‘working”.
Don’t you trust her?


22 posted on 03/28/2010 4:33:23 PM PDT by nkycincinnatikid
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To: CincyRichieRich

I know the real reason why they were raided.

THEY WERE BIRTHERS!

I can already hear the trumpet calls to the redcoat trolls rushing to muster on this thread.


23 posted on 03/28/2010 4:33:42 PM PDT by Eye of Unk ("In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act" G.Orwell)
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To: hiredhand

You don’t buy a sawed off shotgun. You make it.


24 posted on 03/28/2010 4:33:43 PM PDT by Gaffer ("Profling: The only profile I need is a chalk outline around their dead ass!")
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To: popdonnelly

Calm down and wait to see what the people arrested are charged with.


My only worry is the usual MSM will label ALL Christians as wackos and gun totin’ idiots...burning the UN flag will really set Obama off.


25 posted on 03/28/2010 4:34:35 PM PDT by CincyRichieRich (Keep your head up and keep moving forward!)
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To: KeyLargo

The 6 that were arrested coming from Ohio may have been morons who took the bait and came running.

What we in Michigan call the “legitimate militia” have had enough dealings with the feds over the years to avoid doing anything illegal or stupid....like letting people wanted by the FBI hide on their property.


26 posted on 03/28/2010 4:35:01 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin! (look it up))
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To: WKUHilltopper

Wonder if Holder/Obama would waste a couple of minutes looking into AQ training camps in the US, especially since there is one right here in my freaking backyard.


27 posted on 03/28/2010 4:35:44 PM PDT by MotherRedDog
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To: Travis McGee
Up...
28 posted on 03/28/2010 4:36:13 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Gaffer
You don’t buy a sawed off shotgun. You make it.

No sir! According to the FBI, Randy Weaver WANTED to buy a sawed off shotgun from them. The seller (representing the ATF or FBI - can't remember) pleaded with him on the grounds of needing the money so Randy bought it. The rest is history...just as is being made in MI now.
29 posted on 03/28/2010 4:37:03 PM PDT by hiredhand
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To: hiredhand

I believe his point was you’re better off making it than buying it. That way, only one person is aware of it.


30 posted on 03/28/2010 4:44:02 PM PDT by edpc (Those Lefties just ain't right)
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To: Mad Dawgg; Caesar Soze

>>”This isn’t a patriotic group. Watch their YouTube videos. They don’t fly the American flag.”

hmmm OK how do you know they don’t fly the American Flag? How does one prove such a statment? AND if one does not fly the American flag does this prove one is not patriotic? I have not flown the American flag once in 2010. Am I branded a non-patriot now?
***

Well, they burned the UN flag. That’s pro-American in my book..


31 posted on 03/28/2010 4:46:36 PM PDT by max americana
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To: Touch Not the Cat

“I read the article twice and can’t see why they are being raided.”

Me, too. Does this have to do with illegal liquor, stills? Is this that part of the landscape?

Or is it more like Waco? Can’t fig it out.


32 posted on 03/28/2010 4:46:38 PM PDT by Beowulf9
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To: edpc
I understand that...and my point was that the charges are likely to be just as those with Randy Weaver and his purchasing of the illegal shotgun. ...only made possible through provocation and entrapment.
33 posted on 03/28/2010 4:48:48 PM PDT by hiredhand
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To: hiredhand
Randy wasn't "buying" a sawed off shotgun. He cut a barrel down to 18". What he forgot to do was check length over all. Someone had hacked an extra inch off the buttstock making AOL too short.

For that, Vicky Weaver was shot in the head...

34 posted on 03/28/2010 4:49:12 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: hiredhand
For the last time, Randy didn't buy those shotguns. He was paid to shorten the barrels. He maintains he cut them to 18". Min legal length. Over all though, the length was too short making it a "Short Barreled Shotgun".

When Randy refused to turn stoolie for the Feds, they raided him.

Get your facts straight.

35 posted on 03/28/2010 4:53:09 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: Dead Corpse; hiredhand

That is my understanding. He was “urged” to cut the barrel down by an undercover spook posing as a buyer, they busted him and pressured him to inform on neo-nazi groups he didn’t belong to.


36 posted on 03/28/2010 4:53:36 PM PDT by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: hiredhand

The way I remember the story is that the FBI (ATF?) conned him into sawing-off a shotgun, which he was originally reluctant to do but ended up doing because he needed the money.

Once he delivered, he was trapped.


37 posted on 03/28/2010 4:53:37 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: Dead Corpse
For that, Vicky Weaver was shot in the head...

...by the murderer and FBI agent Lon Horiuchi while she was holding her baby son in her arms.
38 posted on 03/28/2010 4:54:04 PM PDT by hiredhand
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To: Gaffer; hiredhand
You don’t buy a sawed off shotgun. You make it.

Exactly right! Unless you are a Fed agent and want to have some bogus charge on a guy trying to sell a shotgun. That is what happened to Weaver. He cut off the barrel where the "buyer" said to.

The point is that these guys probably weren't trying to sell pipe bombs. My guess is that this is another case of entrapment.

39 posted on 03/28/2010 4:55:05 PM PDT by magslinger (Cry MALAISE! and let slip the dogs of incompetence.)
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To: Beowulf9
From what I've heard, plotting against the Government and attempting to sell "pipe bombs".

Who in their right f*cking mind "BUYS" someone elses improvised munitions? Most people recommend against buying reloaded ammo from gun shows, much less "pipe bombs".

40 posted on 03/28/2010 4:55:09 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: cripplecreek

Actually, they just look more like a very extreme religious group. This appears to have made them vulnerable to certain reactionary christophobic elements of the current regime. The current operation may have been intended as a provocation or some kind of a test, in which case we are probably participating and our reactions are being assessed. To Big Sis just believing in Christ and owning guns makes you an extremist.

They don’t seem to have been on anybody’s radar previously and they were operating openly as their videos and web site show. Other than bad taste in background music I didn’t see much wrong with the one video I watched but I don’t plan to take the time to screen the entire opus.

It will be interesting to see what kind of crimes they are charged with.


41 posted on 03/28/2010 4:55:50 PM PDT by InABunkerUnderSF (California -- Ya es como Mexico)
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To: CincyRichieRich

Janet Reno the 2nd


42 posted on 03/28/2010 4:56:04 PM PDT by Stymee
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To: HiTech RedNeck

Why do you call them flakes and nuts? They say the end times are near. and because they are a Militia styled group, They are organized Militarily. Are is it that you believee that no way would Obama attact Christians Groups or try to confiscate fire arms, or even pass a very unpopular medical legislation. Watch out for gun control legislation.
The christian flakes will pray for our country, and keep our firearms out of sight.
Are the “end times” near? I or no one else knows.


43 posted on 03/28/2010 4:56:08 PM PDT by barb-tex (Obama Care ls spending part of the Half trillion on Logans Merry-Go-Round)
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To: hiredhand
That much, you got right.

Why Lon isn't in jail yet is one of the reasons most of us feel the system is irrevocably screwed...

44 posted on 03/28/2010 4:56:09 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: DuncanWaring; MileHi; Dead Corpse
My story is off... but what I'm driving at here is that the authorities need no reason to arrest any one of us...least of all, a bunch of Christian Militia members. They'll do something in order to get us across that line, whether it's ethical or not.
45 posted on 03/28/2010 4:56:19 PM PDT by hiredhand
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To: magslinger
Two criteria for a SBS (short barreled shotgun) classification. Barrel length and length over all. Either one of which will make it an SBS subject to the additional registration requirements for the TAX stamp.

Randy supposedly cut the barrels to 18". Someone else shortened the stocks... Instant Felony for Randy.

I'm betting on Tannerite. You can make it home with an old blender and powders you can buy off ebay. Looks impressive on film and the general public won't know the difference.

46 posted on 03/28/2010 4:59:01 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Oathkeeper)
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To: Dead Corpse
Who in their right f*cking mind "BUYS" someone elses improvised munitions?

You mean even if the improvised munitions are certified safe and effective by the national council of improvised ordnance manufacturers? (It's a five second fuse really.:-)

47 posted on 03/28/2010 4:59:41 PM PDT by InABunkerUnderSF (California -- Ya es como Mexico)
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To: cripplecreek

A few miles from me in Over the Rhine tons of weapons are in the hands of common criminals.
Usually the victims are just serfs like you and me.
If the city police threaten that status quo, the Federal Goverment comes down hard on the city police.
If an unlucky aristocrat going to the opera house is killed then County Sheriff clamps down a bit, nothing more.
These murderers are the bread and butter of the federal government and therby a protected class.
A few more miles from me, in the outlying ‘burbs where I grew up, a neighbor, a white Vietnam Vet, farmer, living with his parents, no criminal record, had his home surrounded by an ATF SWAT TEAM, because they believed he had an altered shotgun.
He fit the profile, he was thought by his etnicity and location a THREAT to larger Government, instead of in the case of downtown murderers an excuse for larger Government.
At least that is what I make of it.


48 posted on 03/28/2010 4:59:50 PM PDT by nkycincinnatikid
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To: hiredhand
...least of all, a bunch of Christian Militia members.

I posted this on another thread:

Probing tacticts. Will the sheep graze while the fedgov, with a willing media, slanders and destroys Carl Drega, or will they rise to his defence?

That is the object here.

49 posted on 03/28/2010 5:00:02 PM PDT by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: DuncanWaring
I'm just amazed that their is a minimum length for a shotgun? Who came up with that rule? Doesn't that conflict with the 2nd amendment??
50 posted on 03/28/2010 5:00:43 PM PDT by RushingWater
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