Roeder defends his killing of George Tiller at sentencing

Mcclatchy ^ | 4.1.10

[trumandogz]

WICHITA, Kan. — The judge considering the sentence of Scott Roeder, convicted of murdering abortion provider George Tiller, on Friday stopped Roeder from continuing to read a written statement after 40 minutes, saying "It is your opportunity to convince me you need a lesser sentence. It is not a soapbox for your political views."

[trumandogz]

I hope the weather is nice when Roeder gets his first look at the parole board on April 1, 2060.

[MsLady]

I don’t think it’s right to take a life. I do however have trouble feeling sorry for Tiller. I don’t think the man that killed him should get 50 years. That’s what I heard today they were trying for. Can you imagine if Tiller had to serve 50 years for every person he killed?

[SoldierDad]

Hey Judge, as much as I disagree with murder, there is no soapbox for people who believe that abortion, especially late term abortion, is murdering children.

[nmh]

“Give me liberty to defend the unborn or give me death,” Roeder said.

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/04/01/91489/roeder-defends-his-killing-of.html#ixzz0jtHPLtEs

[Sacajaweau]

When our own government didn't protect the unborn, this man was brave enough to put an end to Tiller's WRONG.

Sorry, it's what I truly believe.

[DoughtyOne]

If the guy was reading, I would have directed him to submit the document for the record.

[trumandogz]

Or, “Relax, you will have plenty of time over the next 50 years to write.”

[jesseam]

Two wrongs do not make a right, but there is no doubt his action saved innocent lives.

[DoughtyOne]

Yes, true...

Do you know if they ever reopened that clinic?

[trumandogz]

Thankfully, it is closed.

[Las Vegas Ron]

When our own government didn't protect the unborn, this man was brave enough to put an end to Tiller's WRONG.

Amazing isn't it?

With the stroke of a pen you can decide who is and who isn't a murderer.

[DoughtyOne]

Being the late term type, I very much lean in your direction. Still, as much as I’d like, I can’t get behind this guy.

IMO, the physician was a disgusting SOB, for doing what he was. I still don’t approve of someone gunning him down in church. To be honest, I don’t know how that doctor could stand being in a church in light of what he was doing.

Did the guy have no conscience left at all?

[DoughtyOne]

Well, the man seems prepared to pay the penalty for having done what he did. This is one I’m glad God will be judging.

I don’t approve of gunning the guy down, but I sure as hell don’t approve of late term abortions either.

I too am quite glad the clinic is closed.

[muawiyah]

Tiller understood there was a high probability of his being killed when he took the job.

At the moment he's probably being apprised of his "release date" ~ NEVER!

[skeeter]

It is not a soapbox for your political views.

No, the government makes that particular accommodation for muslim terrorists only.

[trumandogz]

What makes a late term abortion worse than a first trimester abortion?

[Jack Wilson]

I am against cold-blooded murder whether it’s an infant or an adult. I think this is reasonably consistent. I ask liberals why they are against one but not the other.

[DoughtyOne]

For me it’s the realization that the baby could be taken from the mother’s womb and live. I firmly believe that aborting after conception is morally indefensible, but after the seventh month (and I haven’t studied this in a while, and might actually deem it that way for a period less than seven months), I lean towards it being premeditated murder.

I have very strident objections to an abortion after the third month, in addition to my thought that is morally indefensible.

If society is going to charge a guy with murder, if he causes a fetus to be non viable after a certain point, then the act of termination of that life by a physician is just as indefensible.

Murder is murder...

[DallasSun]

I am so glad the judge gave him the hard 50. Why he thought he could justify what he did is beyond explanation.

[HANG THE EXPENSE]

As far as I am concerned,Roeder got rid of the current Dr.Mengele.I wonder what the number is now for all the children saved?

[mkjessup]

Roeder made his decision to shoot Tiller, the Judge made his decision on sentencing. God will have the final Say on who was, and who wasn’t in the right.

And I kindly direct everyone to my tagline.

[marron]

What makes a late term abortion worse than a first trimester abortion?

Nothing. Just the pretense is gone.

[Psalm 144]

Agreed.

[skeeter]

Well said.

[pyx]

The Judge interrupted the convicted man and said, "It is your opportunity to convince me you need a lesser sentence. It is not a soapbox for your political views."

I have two (2) questions;

What is the AVERAGE sentence for a first time offender convicted of first degree murder in Kansas ?

Why is someone given a greater sentence for making a political statement with which the Judge does not agree ? Conversely, is the Judge given the sentencing latitude to give Scott Roeder a lesser sentence, if Scott Roeder had made a political statement with which the Judge agreed or approved ?

[PLMerite]

“Tiller understood there was a high probability of his being killed when he took the job.”

“You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred.” - Super Chicken

[Jerry Attrick]

Murder is murder. However, killing someone that is trying to kill another human being is,IMHO, defensible. No-one would think twice about someone who took out a person trying to choke a child to death (for instance).

Problem with our society is, the definition of “human being” is all screwed up.

[Secret Agent Man]

It totally destroys the libtards “viability” issue they raise quite often as to justify abortions.

[trumandogz]

The question of abortion is not about viability, but us rather about life and the fact that life begins at conception.

And that being the case, you cannot say that a third trimester abortion is worse than a first trimester abortion.

[trumandogz]

Roeder showed no remorse.

However, he will have a chance to show remorse when he goes before the parole board right before his 103rd birthday.

[pyx]

Please note, you didn't answer the two specific questions I asked.

[GGpaX4DumpedTea]

“...he will have a chance to show remorse when he goes before the parole board right before his 103rd birthday.”

He will be standing speechless when he appears before the Judgement Seat.

[Rome2000]

The unborns John Brown

Today's retarded society notwithstanding.

GOD bless the INNOCENTS

[trumandogz]

I do not have such data at my disposal. However, Kansas is a law and order state and I doubt they typically give light prison sentences to those who commit premeditated murder and Roeder got what he deserved.

[marron]

you cannot say that a third trimester abortion is worse than a first trimester abortion.

In terms of the effect on the victim, no.

But early in the pregnancy people convince themselves that its juts a lump of cells.

If you can pull a baby out onto a table and kill it, though, you are a special kind if cold-blooded evil. Tiller could do what very few people could do, and go sit in church afterward. He was a very special piece of work, that guy.

[doc1019]

Hey Judge, as much as I disagree with murder, there is no soapbox for people who believe that abortion, especially late term abortion, is murdering children.

Been pondering your statement (for hours) and have yet to understand your position on abortion. Could you please explain your position. Are you pro abortion? Just wondering. Mix interpretation in my mind. A comma her, a period there makes a difference. Gosh, I wish I wasn't so ignorant.

Thanks in advance. Not looking to argue, just wishing I understood your posting a little better.

[Secret Agent Man]

Friend, reread the post. No kidding. I was answering him as to why THE LEFT has an issue with late term abortions re: viability.

[SoldierDad]

In my post (#4) I didn’t lay down my position regarding the issue of abortion. I was commenting on the judge’s retort to Roeder that the courtroom was not a place for him to stand on his “soapbox” and give his political position regarding abortion. My comment was aimed at pointing out that people who are against abortion, especially late-term abortion, have not been given a “soapbox” in which to present arguments against abortion.

As for my position? I am against the use of abortion as a means of birth control. And, I am stridently against the use of late-term abortion as IMHO this is nothing short of murder. The doctors who perform this “procedure” should be arrested, tried, and convicted of murder, as should be the women who allow the procedure to performed upon them. I can understand what Roeder did, and why. But, I do not condone the taking of another’s life through murder.

[SoldierDad]

What makes a late term abortion worse than a first trimester abortion?

While I am against the use of abortion as a means of birth control, I'd have to say that a late term abortion is worse in that the fetus, if not murdered and allowed to be completely birthed, would survive (if not for their brain being destroyed and sucked out with a vacuum hose). The destruction of human life, whether during the 1st trimester or 3rd trimester is wrong. The late-term abortion is just, IMHO, a more heinous method.

[Lurker]

I am personally opposed so shooting people who make their living by murdering unborn children.

But, I also don’t feel it’s right to impose my morality on others.

[doc1019]

Thank you for your response. Now your comment makes sense to me. Again, thanks for taking the time to explaining it to me.

Not that it would matter to you, coming from a drive by questioner, but I agree with you 100%.

[SoldierDad]

You’re welcome. And, your opinion does matter, whether you agree or not.

[Melas]

It’s really all academic. The judge didn’t really have a lot of practical discretion here. The minimum he could have given Roeder was 25 years to life, and instead he gave him 50 years to live. The truth is that at his age going in, he wasn’t coming out alive anyway.

[tacnuke]

If you believe late term abortion is murder, you can't be critical of the actions taken by Scott Roeder. You can't be critical any more than you can be critical of John Brown and his passionate desire to snuff out the scourge of slavery. Some day the grandchildren of our grandchildren will look back at us and wonder how we could allow unborn children to be discarded like trash. If slavery was America's original sin, what is abortion?

[pyx]

I do not have such data at my disposal. However, Kansas is a law and order state and I doubt they typically give light prison sentences to those who commit premeditated murder and Roeder got what he deserved.

This now twice you have not given straightforward answers to my specific questions. I appreciate you don't have the data at your disposal. However, the sentencing difference of 25 years for what appears to be an unsatisfactory political opinion makes me wonder if its reasonable for the judge in this particular case, to have that amount of latitude in his decision making authority. The sentencing options seemed to be 25 years or 50 years.

Incidentally, unless I am mistaken, a convicted felon typically has 2/3 of his sentence reduced for good behavior. That would mean Scott Roeder would actually serve a bit more than 16 and a 1/2 years of a 50 year sentence if he gets good behavior. If I am correct about the 2/3 time reduced, then this would mean a 53 year old Scott Roeder may be paroled when he is close to 70 years old and not 103 years old as you state. Therefore, Scott Roeder may not die in jail.

[trumandogz]

If Roeder had walked into a church in my home state of Texas and with premeditation killed someone, they would be strapping him to a gurney and jamming a needle in his arm.

And your view that people convicted of First Degree Murder and Aggravated Assault should only serve 16 1/2 years is a bit troubling.

[trumandogz]

If you believe late term abortion is murder, you can't be critical of the actions taken by Scott Roeder.

Not only do I believe that late term abortion is murder, but I believe that any type of abortion that takes place after the moment of conception is also murder. And I am not willing to say that one murder is worse than another murder simply based on the age of the baby.

So according to you, if the murder of Tiller was justified, than one could also justifiably murder a doctor who performs first trimester abortions, a doctor who implants IUD's, a doctor who prescribes birth control pills, a pharmacist who dispenses the Abortion Pill, the UPS driver who delivers abortion pills to women's homes or a woman who is about to have an abortion.

[pyx]

And your view that people convicted of First Degree Murder and Aggravated Assault should only serve 16 1/2 years is a bit troubling.

Either you're a bit thick or you're purposefully twisting what I've asked and stated. I don't set sentencing guidelines. I don't set time served in prison. I don't calculate served time and good behavior. I don't work for the government nor am I a lawyer. If you re-read my questions and statements thus far, I've only requested information and stated what I have been told.

I haven't stated what people should and should or should not serve when they are convicted of first degree murder. Clear now ?

[rwfromkansas]

It’s still murder, a capital crime in Scripture.

It would be difficult to give him 50 years because of my feelings on Tiller, but I can understand the jury doing so.

The ends don’t justify the means.