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Indiana School Not Canceling Graduation Prayer Without Judge Order
Associated Post through Fox News ^ | 04/02/2010 | Staff

Posted on 04/02/2010 11:18:58 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman

A central Indiana district isn't calling off a planned high school graduation prayer unless a federal judge orders it. GREENWOOD, Ind. -- A central Indiana district isn't calling off a planned high school graduation prayer unless a federal judge orders it. Greenwood School Board president Joe Farley says the district wants the judge to decide the merits of a lawsuit filed by the school's top-ranked senior. Greenwood High School student Eric Workman is asking a federal judge to stop a student-led prayer that the senior class voted to approve. The lawsuit filed by the American Civil Liberties Union of Indiana on the 18-year-old's behalf claims that the prayer and class vote unconstitutionally subject students to religious practice. The school district has until April 16 to respond to the lawsuit, and a court hearing is scheduled for April 30. The district's attorneys didn't immediately return telephone messages seeking comment Friday.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events; US: Indiana
KEYWORDS: aclu; arth; commencements; graduation; moralabsolutes; prayer; purge
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1 posted on 04/02/2010 11:18:58 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: Outlaw Woman

Given the quality and lack of integrity of our federal judges, even if he/she/it banned the prayer, it’s time we started replying, “Shove it up your Obama.”


2 posted on 04/02/2010 11:20:35 AM PDT by Da Coyote
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To: Outlaw Woman

Mr. Workman needs to get a temporary restraining order, citing the distinct possibility of irreparable harm, should he be exposed to prayer.


3 posted on 04/02/2010 11:22:20 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (The naked casuistry of the high priests of Warmism would make a Jesuit blush.)
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To: Da Coyote

Absolutely.


4 posted on 04/02/2010 11:22:38 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Da Coyote

Agree whole heartedly.


5 posted on 04/02/2010 11:22:46 AM PDT by jesseam (Been there, done that)
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To: Outlaw Woman
Amendent 1A - Freedom of religion (not FROM RELIGION)
Amendent 1B - Freedom of speech
Amendment 2 - Freedom to carry a gun to insure 1A & 1B remain intact.
6 posted on 04/02/2010 11:24:31 AM PDT by newfreep (Palin/DeMint 2012 - Bolton: Secy of State)
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To: Outlaw Woman

If the order to shut them up does come down, what would the Feds do (local police do) if most of the graduating students (and even spectators) decide to say it out loud in unison?


7 posted on 04/02/2010 11:25:15 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine
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To: Jack Hydrazine
If the order to shut them up does come down, what would the Feds do (local police do) if most of the graduating students (and even spectators) decide to say it out loud in unison?

Most police I know would join in for the prayer. As for this tool of the ACLU, I hope he can handle being shunned.

8 posted on 04/02/2010 11:27:34 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

did you forget the /s?


9 posted on 04/02/2010 11:27:40 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Pollster1

But then you have the cops who will blindly follow orders and start arresting and tasing people. Maybe throw in a K9 unit or two to get the jaws of justice to take a bite out of crime. More people would resist, riot breaks out, riot police called, and on and on.


10 posted on 04/02/2010 11:30:36 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

If this student does file for such an order, someone needs to submit to the court the scientific studies that indicate prayer helps those who are sick.


11 posted on 04/02/2010 11:31:24 AM PDT by Notwithstanding (Wer glaubt ist nie allein. Who believes is never alone.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
I don't know what would happen but that is exactly what we must start doing. It's time to start asserting, more firmly, our Constitutional rights
12 posted on 04/02/2010 11:33:32 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

Funny. So if a federal judge issues a restraining order then how could local police be expected to enforce it? After all, isn’t this one of those “federal issues” that we continue to be told that only the federal government can enforce?


13 posted on 04/02/2010 11:35:12 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: Outlaw Woman

Maybe another response to this would be for parents to organize private graduation ceremonies. The official one at the school isn’t necessarily a required event.


14 posted on 04/02/2010 11:39:44 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: Outlaw Woman

If the Judge does go against them then maybe the parents should break out into the Father’s Prayer at the Graduation at a pre-set time. Good luck trying to get an injuction against that.


15 posted on 04/02/2010 11:40:41 AM PDT by GraceG
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To: Outlaw Woman
Go to the judges court. Pray for him

Rinse and repeat.

16 posted on 04/02/2010 11:42:43 AM PDT by magslinger (Cry MALAISE! and let slip the dogs of incompetence.)
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To: pnh102
I can see those headlines now... LOCAL POLICE STAND BY WHILE FBI, CIA, ATF, IRS, & SS STORM HIGH SCHOOL PROM FOR VIOLATION OF FEDERAL ORDER
17 posted on 04/02/2010 11:46:05 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
Not totally sure. There is no cause of action against a private individual for a violation of constitutional rights (in other words, I, private citizen, cannot violate your constitutional rights, and you therefore can't sue me for that). Might be a suit against the district for something like not doing more to stop it, but I can't think of a way that could be proven off hand...
18 posted on 04/02/2010 11:47:05 AM PDT by Grn_Lantern (Let's go to work....)
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To: Outlaw Woman
the 18-year-old's ... claims that the prayer and class vote unconstitutionally subject students to religious practice...

Which part of "abridging the freedom of speech..." in the constitution, or "with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence" in the declaration will they hang their argument on?

19 posted on 04/02/2010 11:47:35 AM PDT by C210N (A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you have)
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To: pnh102
Interesting thought.
20 posted on 04/02/2010 11:48:20 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: pnh102

So have the parents spend their money because one loon decides to sue? I don’t know about you but I am sick of the small minority dictating what the larger majority does and says, especially when it’s unconstitutional. Our freedom of religion is protected as is freedom of speech. I applaud the school administration for sticking to their guns.


21 posted on 04/02/2010 11:50:07 AM PDT by GlennBeck08
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To: Outlaw Woman
Interesting thought.

Thanks! I've lately been giving more thought to us recognizing what I am calling the "right to NOT participate." A lot of people are pissed off that judges are ruining their school events on the account of objections of a small group of, or in many cases even just one student who seeks to ruin everything for everyone else.

From a legal perspective, there isn't really much we can do to fight such rulings, especially given the costs and time involved. So I think the alternative of a private graduation ceremony would be the most ideal one.

22 posted on 04/02/2010 11:54:32 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: GraceG
A stand must be made. This will be interesting to follow.

From memory (which isn't always great) the SCOTUS ruled in favor of prayer as long as it was student led some years back. It cannot be compelled by a school but if the students decide to have prayer...

I don't know what happen to that ruling or why it is discounted in these cases.

23 posted on 04/02/2010 11:55:04 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

When I graduated in the 70’s we always has prayer at graduation, even in little Berkeley NY. We alternated a rabbi, a protestant minister, and a Catholic priest - the major religions each year.

The year I graduated we got the rabbi. Now I am not Jewish but I had no problem with this.


24 posted on 04/02/2010 11:55:29 AM PDT by I still care (I believe in the universality of freedom -George Bush, asked if he regrets going to war.)
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To: I still care

Whoops always had prayer.


25 posted on 04/02/2010 11:56:15 AM PDT by I still care (I believe in the universality of freedom -George Bush, asked if he regrets going to war.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

I wouldn’t cancel it EVEN IF a judge ordered it.


26 posted on 04/02/2010 11:56:30 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (The US will not die with a whimper. It will die with thundering applause from the left.)
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To: GlennBeck08
So have the parents spend their money because one loon decides to sue? I don’t know about you but I am sick of the small minority dictating what the larger majority does and says, especially when it’s unconstitutional.

I agree entirely. But I also think telling these people "Screw this; we'll have our own private ceremony where we can have a prayer" also sends a very powerful message.

27 posted on 04/02/2010 11:56:51 AM PDT by pnh102 (Regarding liberalism, always attribute to malice what you think can be explained by stupidity. - Me)
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To: I still care

Yes, I remember well.

This is a contrived case. Some 18 year old snot nosed, wet behind-the-ears idiot kid is a useful and convenient tool for the ACLU. This is all about destroying and they ‘search’ out possible plantiffs and then file the suit.


28 posted on 04/02/2010 12:01:42 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
I can see those headlines now... LOCAL POLICE STAND BY WHILE FBI, CIA, ATF, IRS, & SS STORM HIGH SCHOOL PROM FOR VIOLATION OF FEDERAL ORDER

Except those headlines wouldn't read quite like that. Instead it would be something like:

FBI (et al.) Quells Violent Right Wing Christian Militia Tea Party Event at High School

And the first paragraph would refer to spitting, egg-throwing, and use of the N-word.

29 posted on 04/02/2010 12:02:42 PM PDT by mbarker12474 (If thine enemy offend thee, give his childe a drum.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

That’s where the people who don’t want to listen to the prayer bring air horns and sound them during the prayer. Everybody goes home happy. The prayer was said but no one hears it.


30 posted on 04/02/2010 12:06:29 PM PDT by Locomotive Breath
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To: pnh102
It's a great idea. But (and this is just imo) instead of always being the ones who uproot our lives or try to find alternatives, we need to stand firm and say NO. We have compromised enough. We have bent over backwards for these maniacs and enough is enough. It's time to 'push back' (again imo). No longer will we capitulate and if you are offended, then you do the moving, you do the uprooting, you find an alternative because we are finished with it. If someone doesn't want to 'hear' the prayer, I have one word: LEAVE
31 posted on 04/02/2010 12:08:30 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants
Right.
32 posted on 04/02/2010 12:10:52 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: mbarker12474

No doubt


33 posted on 04/02/2010 12:13:01 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

To quote Satchmo when asked to define jazz, “If you gots ta axe the question, ya wown unnerstan da answer.”

;)


34 posted on 04/02/2010 12:21:35 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (The naked casuistry of the high priests of Warmism would make a Jesuit blush.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
Of course the solution to all of these endless citizen fights over government school policies is to have complete separation of school and state. Close down the government schools!

Let's examine the two possible decisions that a government school worker can make, and hopefully conservatives will see that a religiously neutral position is impossible:

1) The government school could allow school prayer. Well...Any government powerful enough to allow Christian prayer at a government graduation is also powerful enough to allow Muslim or Wiccan prayer. It might even allow equal amount of time for the atheist to expound on the nonexistence of God. Would any thinking conservative be surprised if this happens?

2) It can forbid school prayer. This isn't religiously neutral either because it teaches the students that religion is so controversial ( or shameful) that it must be hidden away from polite society as if it were a bathroom activity. This is hardly religiously neutral either.

Fundamentally, prayer at graduation is merely one example among thousands in which government schools must make a binary decision. One group of citizens has their First Amendment Rights trashed and the other has government using tax dollars to establish their religiously non-neutral worldview.

Axiom: It is impossible to have a religiously neutral education. It is impossible to have a religiously neutral government education. ALL government schools promote and establish the religious worldviews of some citizens and trash those of others.

35 posted on 04/02/2010 12:21:38 PM PDT by wintertime
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

lol! The reason I mentioned it is because everyday, I’m completely astonished at some answers that people give to things..even on here. And they are serious! So...you never know if the poster is series or not unless the heavy /s is mentioned. And I’m series about that :)


36 posted on 04/02/2010 12:26:27 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

We pray before basketball games in southern Indiana.


37 posted on 04/02/2010 12:26:35 PM PDT by wordsofearnest (Job 19:25 As for me, I know my Redeemer lives.)
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To: Da Coyote
“Shove it up your Obama.”

Classic. My vote for post of the day.

“Ouch, my Obama hole is swollen & raw from ‘free’ healthcare and subsidizing others’ defaulted mortgages and student loans.”

38 posted on 04/02/2010 12:26:36 PM PDT by Mengerian
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To: Outlaw Woman

Yeah, I get taken in a few times a week myself, but this is HUGE!


39 posted on 04/02/2010 12:28:44 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (The naked casuistry of the high priests of Warmism would make a Jesuit blush.)
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To: wordsofearnest

That’s wonderful; it’s great to hear accounts of people continuing in spite of the rhetoric and anti-Christian rants.


40 posted on 04/02/2010 12:37:20 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: bamahead; 2Jedismom; 6amgelsmama; AAABEST; aberaussie; Aggie Mama; agrace; AliVeritas; AlmaKing; ...

ANOTHER REASON TO HOMESCHOOL

This ping list is for the “other” articles of interest to homeschoolers about education and public school. This can occasionally be a fairly high volume list. Articles pinged to the Another Reason to Homeschool List will be given the keyword of ARTH. (If I remember. If I forget, please feel free to add it yourself)

The main Homeschool Ping List handles the homeschool-specific articles. I hold both the Homeschool Ping List and the Another Reason to Homeschool Ping list. Please freepmail me to let me know if you would like to be added to or removed from either list, or both.

Greenwood School Board president Joe Farley says the district wants the judge to decide the merits of a lawsuit filed by the school's top-ranked senior. Greenwood High School student Eric Workman is asking a federal judge to stop a student-led prayer that the senior class voted to approve.

Sounds like another liberal in the making. Doesn't like what he was outvoted on so he's suing everyone to force them to comply with what HE wants. There's a position in the obama administration for this kid.

41 posted on 04/02/2010 12:37:58 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: pnh102

HE can have his own prayer free graduation ceremony set up by his own parents.

Why should he have it his way and make everyone else submit to his wishes?


42 posted on 04/02/2010 12:41:18 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

What is huge? This story?

and did you mean hugh? lol!


43 posted on 04/02/2010 12:42:14 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: pnh102
I agree entirely. But I also think telling these people "Screw this; we'll have our own private ceremony where we can have a prayer" also sends a very powerful message.

NO. It doesn't send a powerful message, other than that they capitulated and others can now be encouraged to do the same thing.

44 posted on 04/02/2010 12:43:54 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

I misspelled hugh!


45 posted on 04/02/2010 12:44:19 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (The naked casuistry of the high priests of Warmism would make a Jesuit blush.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

THANK YOU!!!


46 posted on 04/02/2010 12:44:40 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

Ummm seems to me they shouldn’t give up the prayer even IF a Fed Judge orders it.


47 posted on 04/02/2010 12:47:09 PM PDT by theDentist (fybo; qwerty ergo typo : i type, therefore i misspelll)
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To: metmom
HE can have his own prayer free graduation ceremony set up by his own parents. Why should he have it his way and make everyone else submit to his wishes?

You are so right metmom. A stand must be made. And your previous post about this punk was equally on target. btw...thank you for pinging others on this.

48 posted on 04/02/2010 12:47:12 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

You have made my day! lmao!


49 posted on 04/02/2010 12:49:02 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Control the American people? Herding cats would be easier.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
how about hold the 'ceremony' and let the lone idiot play w/ himself...everybody else can meet at a local hotel for a 'private' party...

kinda the same thing with the lezbo scum and their prom...

50 posted on 04/02/2010 12:58:09 PM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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