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US Stocks Tumble After S&P Cuts Greece, Portugal; DJIA Off 128
Marketwatch ^ | 4/27/2010 | Donna Kardos

Posted on 04/27/2010 11:17:01 AM PDT by SeattleBruce

NEW YORK (MarketWatch) -- U.S. stocks tumbled Tuesday, sending the Standard & Poor's 500 index back below the key 1200 level following credit-rating downgrades from S&P on Greece and Portugal.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average dropped 128 points, or 1.2%, at 11079 in recent trading. Alcoa was the measure's worst performer with a drop of 3.2%. Caterpillar, which is particularly sensitive to the global economy, was also weak with a drop of 3.1%. Chevron was off 1.8% as crude-oil futures fell.

The declines came as the dollar strengthened against the euro after S&P lowered its sovereign-issuer credit ratings on Portugal and Greece. In downgrading Portugal, S&P said it expects the Portuguese government "could struggle to stabilize its relatively high debt ratio over the outlook horizon until 2013." The ratings agency's cut to Greece "results from our updated assessment of the political, economic, and budgetary challenges that the Greek government faces in its efforts to put the public debt burden onto a sustained downward trajectory," S&P said.

(Excerpt) Read more at marketwatch.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy; Foreign Affairs; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: debt; deficit; economy
Oh boy - sovereign debt crisis - who does this remind us of?
1 posted on 04/27/2010 11:17:01 AM PDT by SeattleBruce
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To: SeattleBruce

Anyone who believes S&P or Moody is pretty lame.


2 posted on 04/27/2010 11:18:21 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (i)
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To: SeattleBruce

3 posted on 04/27/2010 11:18:41 AM PDT by OB1kNOb (When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: screaminsunshine

“Anyone who believes S&P or Moody is pretty lame.”

But the debt crisis in Europe - you think that’s real, correct? Or debt levels here?


4 posted on 04/27/2010 11:21:25 AM PDT by SeattleBruce (God, Family, Church, Country - 11/2010, 11/2012 - Tea Party like it's 1773 & pray 2 Chronicles 7:14!)
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To: screaminsunshine

Well, true. They’re way late to the game.

Still, there are a lot of funds who have to sell the Greek debt now, because they’re not allowed to own junk paper. So while late, S&P’s announcement has ramifications in the market.


5 posted on 04/27/2010 11:21:35 AM PDT by NVDave
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To: SeattleBruce

Sure. I just do not think the rating agencies are nuetural. The government Plunge Protection Team will have to work hard this afternoon to get the market back up.


6 posted on 04/27/2010 11:24:25 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (i)
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To: SeattleBruce

S&P and Moody’s are known liars.


7 posted on 04/27/2010 11:24:30 AM PDT by Frantzie (McCain=Obama's friend. McCain & Graham = La Raza's favorite Senators)
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To: NVDave

I just flipped CNBC but they have that ridiculous hearing on.


8 posted on 04/27/2010 11:26:38 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (i)
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To: SeattleBruce

“American International Group tumbled 8.9% after a Wall Street stock analyst said the company has no net earnings per share in the conventional sense, and also set a bearish $6 target price for the stock.”

Shocking...’no net earnings’. Hmmm...was our bailout of AIG a good use of taxpayer $$? Part of the ‘too big to fail’ mantra...:(


9 posted on 04/27/2010 11:26:45 AM PDT by SeattleBruce (God, Family, Church, Country - 11/2010, 11/2012 - Tea Party like it's 1773 & pray 2 Chronicles 7:14!)
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To: screaminsunshine

They haven’t cut the US credit rating yet??

Its junk but the agencies can’t admit it.


10 posted on 04/27/2010 11:29:42 AM PDT by GeronL (http://libertyfic.proboards.com << Get your science fiction and fiction test marketed)
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To: SeattleBruce

Nothing to worry about....Der Leader pays no attention to the daily movement in the stock market....


11 posted on 04/27/2010 11:29:56 AM PDT by AngelesCrestHighway
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To: Frantzie
S&P and Moody’s are known liars.

Hey, they offer the best ratings money can buy. :)

12 posted on 04/27/2010 11:30:40 AM PDT by Mr. Jeeves ( "The right to offend is far more important than any right not to be offended." - Rowan Atkinson)
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To: GeronL

AAAA no doubt.


13 posted on 04/27/2010 11:31:37 AM PDT by screaminsunshine (i)
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To: SeattleBruce

Interesting to look at commodities...

Oil down slightly (expectations for continued recession...)

Gold steady

BUT, copper, after months of rambling and slight up trend, now tumbling... -16 cents


14 posted on 04/27/2010 11:32:00 AM PDT by C210N (A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you have)
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To: C210N

Oil down slightly (expectations for continued recession...)

Gold steady

BUT, copper, after months of rambling and slight up trend, now tumbling... -16 cents

Yeah, copper is a critical commodity if you think you are in a recovering market. Noticed both FCX and VALE are both down 5%, so there is no currency angle to it, just nobody wants copper all of a sudden. Given the Greek thingy and strengthing dollar you would expect VALE to be down more than FCX. Strange.


15 posted on 04/27/2010 11:43:52 AM PDT by equalitybeforethelaw
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To: C210N
And I would imagine the price of copper is tied, somewhat, to the prospects for renewed building activity, no?

In other words, the traders don't think there is going to be great demand for copper pipe in the immediate future.

Or is there another big use of copper I'm not thinking of?

16 posted on 04/27/2010 11:45:51 AM PDT by In Maryland ("Impromptu Obamanomics is getting scarier by the day ..." - Caroline Baum)
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To: SeattleBruce
the company has no net earnings per share in the conventional sense,

". . . in the conventional sense, . . . " Huh? I thought earnings per share just had one meaning, not varying by "conventional" and -- I guess -- "unconventional"! Does this mean something I'm not sophisticated enough to get?

17 posted on 04/27/2010 11:50:23 AM PDT by maryz
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To: equalitybeforethelaw

I’m not certain copper is the reliable indicator it used to be. Five years or so ago, aggressive Chinese stockpiling of copper (among other commodities) drove demand for copper higher than it would normally have been given the business cycle. That (one of the largest players in the market behaving differently than traditional buyers of copper) and the boom in construction fueled by the housing bubble seemed to decouple the price of copper from the business cycle.

I’m sure things have changed in the last couple years, but I’m not sure they’ve changed in such a way as to return the copper market to its traditional behavior. Could be something to look into.


18 posted on 04/27/2010 12:09:34 PM PDT by The Pack Knight (Duty, Honor, Country)
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To: SeattleBruce

WooHoo!
It was 14.94P% this morning!


19 posted on 04/27/2010 12:11:57 PM PDT by griswold3
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To: In Maryland
Or is there another big use of copper I'm not thinking of?

.....building is correct.....

.....but the biggy is "wire".....

.....building and manufacturing.....

20 posted on 04/27/2010 12:14:29 PM PDT by cyberaxe (....Uuuummpphhhh.....)
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To: OB1kNOb

The P.I.I.G.S are starting to squeal one by one.

My bet is one of the ‘I’s in the acronym survive ( i.e. Ireland ).


21 posted on 04/27/2010 12:20:34 PM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: SeattleBruce

22 posted on 04/27/2010 12:47:16 PM PDT by Deo volente (God willing, America will survive this Obamination.)
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To: SeattleBruce

If S&P or Moody were credible, the US wouldn’t have a AAA rating.


23 posted on 04/27/2010 12:55:58 PM PDT by Psycho_Bunny (The Quran and Mein Kampf: if you've read one you've read them both.)
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To: SeattleBruce

Dow off 213 and is below 11,000. Also S & P 500 is below key 1200 level.


24 posted on 04/27/2010 12:58:44 PM PDT by SeattleBruce (God, Family, Church, Country - 11/2010, 11/2012 - Tea Party like it's 1773 & pray 2 Chronicles 7:14!)
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To: maryz

“unconventional” = Bailout $$?


25 posted on 04/27/2010 1:00:59 PM PDT by SeattleBruce (God, Family, Church, Country - 11/2010, 11/2012 - Tea Party like it's 1773 & pray 2 Chronicles 7:14!)
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To: SeattleBruce
I wondered about that -- but bailout $$ isn't "earnings" in any sense -- should be listed with bribe money (is that a line item anywhere?)! Maybe accountants and stock analysts just need some new vocabulary; the "conventional" just ain't doin' it . . . ;-)
26 posted on 04/27/2010 1:06:31 PM PDT by maryz
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To: stephenjohnbanker; sickoflibs
Dow off 213 and is below 11,000. Also S & P 500 is below key 1200 level.

I wonder if this is related to Lindsey Graham threatening to drop crap and trade? Some of the megabanks were hoping to make money on the CCX.

27 posted on 04/27/2010 1:18:04 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Pat Caddell: Democrats are drinking kool-aid in a political Jonestown)
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To: SeattleBruce

socialism only works until you run out of other peoples money.

The socialist dominoes are about to start falling world wide.

And make no mistake it will be children and minorities hardest hit.


28 posted on 04/27/2010 1:20:05 PM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Epic Fail)
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To: ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker

banking reform?


29 posted on 04/27/2010 1:20:56 PM PDT by sickoflibs ( "It's not the taxes, the redistribution is the federal spending=taxes delayed")
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To: sickoflibs
banking reform?

Deform.

30 posted on 04/27/2010 1:26:14 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Pat Caddell: Democrats are drinking kool-aid in a political Jonestown)
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To: sickoflibs
banking reform?

Deform.


31 posted on 04/27/2010 1:28:07 PM PDT by ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas (Pat Caddell: Democrats are drinking kool-aid in a political Jonestown)
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To: screaminsunshine

the only way for the MSM to actually report anything on bozo truth fully is if the get hit in their own pocket and see their 401k’s and retirements go down

sad to say but it’s the only way I see the corrupted media reporting fairly


32 posted on 04/27/2010 4:15:59 PM PDT by manc (WILL OBAMA EVER GO TO CHURCH ON A SUNDAY OR WILL HE LET THE MEDIA BE FOOLED FOR EVER)
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To: manc

Thwy are socialists and are certain that Obozo will bail them out.


33 posted on 04/27/2010 4:45:44 PM PDT by screaminsunshine (i)
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To: C210N
Oil down slightly (expectations for continued recession...)

More than likely that price change was based on currency fluctuations - increasing dollar strength typically results in lower oil prices.

As you note - copper is the interesting one to watch. Silver is another. Commodities such as these - which have vastly more industrial uses than gold, are more valuable indicators of industrial activity, though I think they are a bit slower to respond to global demand than what can or should occur from a Greek debt downgrade (non-professional opinion). And as always - the variation in dollar strength has to be factored in...

My guess - today's news Greece, Portugal, congress looking for more blood money, etc., were just an excuse for profit taking after months of low volume trade driving prices up more quickly than appropriate. None of the news today should have been unexpected.

There is always money to be made...

34 posted on 04/27/2010 5:38:32 PM PDT by !1776!
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To: screaminsunshine

Why leave the DOW out? Has no value anymore except as another propaganda tool for The Marxist Onada.


35 posted on 04/27/2010 6:04:17 PM PDT by dools007
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