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Why did ATF suddenly redefine firearm transfers?
Gun Rights Examiner ^ | 31 May, 2010 | David Codrea

Posted on 06/01/2010 5:15:08 AM PDT by marktwain

"ATF Reverses Interpretation of GCA; Redefines 'Transfers' of Firearms," reads the May 27 post on the National Shooting Sports Foundation's NSSF Blog.

Reversing an interpretation of the Gun Control Act that has been on the books for more than four decades, ATF today posted a ruling declaring any shipment of a firearm by a manufacturer (FFL) to any agent or business (e.g., an engineering-design firm, patent lawyer, testing lab, gun writer, etc.) for a bona fide business purpose to be a "transfer" under the Gun Control Act of 1968.

As NSSF observes:

In many instances, these requirements will force shipments to a third party, thereby lengthening the process and the time that the firearm is in transit.

The thing is, ATF has been operating under a completely different interpretation without incident:

There is simply nothing in the Brady Act or is there any other legal reason that compels ATF to now reject 40 years of precedent...

ATF is unable to identify a single instance during the past 40 years where a single firearm shipped in reliance upon ATF's rulings was used in a crime.

Here's the May 20 ruling, issued under "authority" of Deputy Director Kenneth E. Melson:

(Excerpt) Read more at examiner.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Extended News; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: atf; banglist; batfe; bhobanglist; bootthebatfe; codrea; examiner; gun; rule
There is no apparent reason for this change in the rules except that the current administration wishes to make life harder for the gun business.
1 posted on 06/01/2010 5:15:08 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

That’s the point of gun regulations.


2 posted on 06/01/2010 5:18:56 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (+)
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To: marktwain

I tried to go to the site and read the reg., but dial up isn’t my friend. Takes forever, and I don’t have that much time. ;)

Logic tells me that as the previous law was established in the ‘60’s, and has been without necessity to change for such a long period of time that something recently is not suiting the agenda of the current usurpers of freedoms in the government. The anti gun Socialist Tyrranists afraid we the people will turn our 2nd Amendment on them as it is designed.

The only thing that comes to mind right now is the multiple states flipping the bird to the Fed gun control laws with the manufacture in State, stays in State does NOT qualify Fed. control bills.

Wondering if this new regulation I was unable to read addresses that in either a direct, or roundabout way?


3 posted on 06/01/2010 5:32:47 AM PDT by rockinqsranch (The Left draws criminals as excrement draws flies. The Left IS a criminal organization.)
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To: ctdonath2

Take your guns.
Take OUR guns.
Take ALL guns.
Take ALL OUR guns.
Take ‘em, take’em, TAKE THEM ALL!!!!

What’s so hard to understand?


4 posted on 06/01/2010 5:32:57 AM PDT by Flintlock
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To: marktwain

There is one obvious reason for trying to disarm the people - to protect evil men who want to grab power from free men and women.

5 posted on 06/01/2010 5:37:01 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: marktwain

“legal reason?” I need no legal reason. I am the ATF. I fart in the general direction of your legal reason.


6 posted on 06/01/2010 5:37:38 AM PDT by flowerplough (Damn the middle-class social conventions that require me to mow all those violets and buttercups!)
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To: Pollster1

That was the goal of original gun control legislation as well - to protect oppressors. In the original cases, it was the Klan that was being protected.


7 posted on 06/01/2010 5:46:16 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: marktwain
Why did ATF suddenly redefine firearm transfers?

Because they can and nobody will do a thing about it. Another out of control federal beauracracy that should have been shut down long ago

8 posted on 06/01/2010 6:05:55 AM PDT by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: rockinqsranch
The only thing that comes to mind right now is the multiple states flipping the bird to the Fed gun control laws with the manufacture in State, stays in State does NOT qualify Fed. control bills.

Wondering if this new regulation I was unable to read addresses that in either a direct, or roundabout way?

I'd say that is a pretty good guess. This new policy allows the ATF to know when firearms are shipped out of their states of origin, even for minor gunsmithing.

More proof that the 4473 / NICS system is effectively a registration database, despite bullshit denials to the contrary. This policy change enables ATF to cast a wider registration net.

9 posted on 06/01/2010 6:06:27 AM PDT by Charles Martel ("Endeavor to persevere...")
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To: marktwain

So basically now a gun owner shipping a gun back to the manufacturer for repair or inspection must go through a third party (FFL) to do the shipping and receiving if I’m reading this correctly.


10 posted on 06/01/2010 6:34:03 AM PDT by headstamp 2 ("No Good Deed Goes Unpunished")
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To: marktwain

A large majority of the reason for the ATF should be illegal. This is just one more injustice heaped upon many others... A useless federal organization designed to grab power for the government and limit the citizens freedom...


11 posted on 06/01/2010 6:36:37 AM PDT by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: marktwain
I despise the BATF. However, I have had prior experience that makes me slightly understand this rules change:

I shipped a Glock back to the company for a recall/upgrade. They did the work, then did a UPS shipment back to me. The shipment was 'signature of adult'. My apartment neighbor, a shifty character, signed for it. For three days, I attempted to track this guy, and my firearm, down.

A 4473 transfer would have prevented all this, and the possibility of losing my firearm, or it falling into the hands of a felon.

12 posted on 06/01/2010 6:44:49 AM PDT by Lazamataz ("We beat the Soviet Union. Then we became them." -- Lazamataz, 2005)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

“...A large majority of the reason for the ATF should be illegal. This is just one more injustice heaped upon many others... A useless federal organization designed to grab power for the government and limit the citizens freedom...”

Amen to that!
Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms needs to be the corner store, NOT another out of control Federal bureaucracy.


13 posted on 06/01/2010 6:49:15 AM PDT by lgjhn23
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To: Lazamataz

I agree in your case, but most firearm thefts from firearms being mailed are stolen by postal/shipping workers while in transit. Usually an empty box arrives.


14 posted on 06/01/2010 7:40:52 AM PDT by melkor
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To: harpseal; TexasCowboy; nunya bidness; AAABEST; Travis McGee; Squantos; Shooter 2.5; wku man; SLB; ..
I keep saying it...

The power to regulate is the power to destroy.

Something the Chicago mobsters currently inhabiting the White House know all too well.

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

15 posted on 06/01/2010 7:55:36 AM PDT by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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To: Lazamataz
A 4473 transfer would have prevented all this, and the possibility of losing my firearm, or it falling into the hands of a felon.

So would a requirement that it must be signed for by you.

I find it hard to believe the regulation has to be reinterpreted in order to prevent the rare theft of a package by a neighbor on delivery.

16 posted on 06/01/2010 8:14:38 AM PDT by untrained skeptic
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To: marktwain

My gut wonders if this has something to do with a possible institution of a transfer tax, as there is precident (NFA 34) - might be a wild guess, but just a thought.


17 posted on 06/01/2010 8:16:36 AM PDT by robertwalker62
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To: marktwain

The BATFE has made rule changes prior to going after certain entities in the past. I suspect that this is an example of such a rule change. There will be an ATF raid conducted within the next few weeks using this “reinterpretation” as the basis for the raid.

Basically, someone has tinkled in the BATFE’s cheerios and they want to get payback.


18 posted on 06/01/2010 8:23:54 AM PDT by BCR #226 (07/02 SOT www.extremefirepower.com...The BS stops when the hammer drops.)
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To: mrreaganaut

Ping.


19 posted on 06/01/2010 8:34:09 AM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: BCR #226

Following that upcoming raid,
the “raiders” need to face some local law enforcement that halls them off to the slammer.


20 posted on 06/01/2010 8:35:23 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: marktwain

Are you sure there is no apparent reason for this? Are you sure this is not to go after Montana and other states who say the Interstate Commerce Laws do not apply to their in-state firearms companies selling firearms only within state boundaries.

I’m not sophisticated enough to conclude that, I’m just asking the question. Could this be the way the ATF plans to regulate Montana gun makers selling guns that never cross state lines to Montana residents? The use of the word “any” makes me wonder if this is the case.

Is this a possibility or does it seem unrelated to the handful of states that have passed these laws?


21 posted on 06/01/2010 8:55:49 AM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (Liberal are like termites eating away our cultural foundations.)
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To: Joe Brower

Those Chicago mobsters are not inhabiting the WH. Like the cockroaches they are, they’re INFESTING it!

When we finally rid ourselves of them, we’ll need to seal up every opening and pump the place full of insecticide gas.


22 posted on 06/01/2010 8:57:16 AM PDT by Dick Bachert
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To: marktwain
One word: "NUDGE"
23 posted on 06/01/2010 8:58:51 AM PDT by shezza (Blue star wife - God bless and keep safe our troops in harm's way.)
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To: Joe Brower

It’s all about control!

Be Ever Vigilant!


24 posted on 06/01/2010 9:03:21 AM PDT by blackie (Be Well~Be Armed~Be Safe~Molon Labe!)
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To: marktwain

The BATF is a group of thugs, and anti-civil rights goons. It should be shut down. Any other government agency with their history of discrimination and FUBAR would have been closed years ago. Liberals over look the actions of these scum bags because the agency is trying to tear town the Second Amendment.


25 posted on 06/01/2010 9:07:05 AM PDT by SUSSA
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To: marktwain

The reason is to make the gun owner database (the one they claim not to have) more complete.


26 posted on 06/01/2010 9:15:15 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (The US will not die with a whimper. It will die with thundering applause from the left.)
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To: Freedom_Is_Not_Free; Lazamataz; reaganaut

Both of you have a point; national registration of guns helps both legitimate law enforcement and the future ability to confiscate. Unfortunately, the legit reason will probably trump the Montana statute under the ‘right’ judges.


27 posted on 06/01/2010 9:17:28 AM PDT by mrreaganaut (In practice, the 'social gospel' always violates the commandments against stealing and coveting.)
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To: marktwain

“Stroke of the pen, Law of the land. Kinda cool!”
Paul Begala

By unelected bureaucrats none the less.


28 posted on 06/01/2010 9:19:45 AM PDT by listenhillary (You might be a modern LIBERAL if you read 1984 & said "YEAH! That's the world that I want!")
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To: marktwain

Actually, over on Sipsey Street the buzz is that this was a setup on the part of a faction within ATF that is looking to see the current acting director thrown out on his ass.


29 posted on 06/01/2010 9:24:36 AM PDT by jdege
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To: Lazamataz

Your delivery method was the problem, Laz. Rights of individuals should not be taken because of a mistake on the part of the delivery service and Glock. That firearm should have been sent to delivery to a named individual (You).

I have a gunshop and stand to benefit financially from this interpretation of this law (via transfers). However, this law sucks, and will just drive up the costs to the consumer without accomplishing a damned thing. What a waste of productive people’s time.


30 posted on 06/01/2010 9:26:08 AM PDT by ExpatGator (I hate Illinois Nazis!)
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To: ExpatGator

In Calif, each transfer also requires another background check. Even to get your pawned gun back. If you don’t pass, you don’t get it back.

And I read that there may be new reasons to fail a check, such as minor ‘mental’ conditions. And returning soldiers and vets that ask for counseling can be classified as ‘mental’, etc.

Not to mention X number of days wait. And in Calif, there is 30 days wait between purchases (don’t know how this relates to transfers of own gun such as return from repair).


31 posted on 06/01/2010 9:38:54 AM PDT by Scrambler Bob (If you could read my mind ... just count up the felonies!)
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To: Flintlock

Like I said.

They won’t “come and take them”. Of course they won’t, they’ll get shot.
They will just regulate them into oblivion via a third party: subject business to slow, growing, crushing weight of regulation, so eventually you’re left with old guns you can’t fix and can’t feed because there’s nobody left to do the work. (And no, you won’t do or make it yourself. You don’t make bullets or primers or brass on your own, nor make receivers or other hard parts - at least nowhere near a rate or quality able to keep up with deep-pockets government.)
And you won’t know what hit you.


32 posted on 06/01/2010 10:03:23 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (+)
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To: robertwalker62

Handguns were the center of NFA before they were axed to get the bill thru.


33 posted on 06/01/2010 10:06:05 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (+)
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To: Lazamataz

Did you ever get your Glock from the thief?


34 posted on 06/01/2010 10:08:58 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (The US will not die with a whimper. It will die with thundering applause from the left.)
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To: marktwain
BATFE. Another useless agency (like the depts of Education, energy and infernal revenue) that needs to be dissolved and it's agents summarily fired (or retired) so that they can't spread more of their brand of tyranny to other segments of the government.
35 posted on 06/01/2010 11:59:46 AM PDT by ExSoldier (Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.)
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To: Joe Brower

“We’re going to hammer guns on the anvil of relentless legislative strategy! We’re going to beat guns into submission!”
~Senator Charles Schumer, 1993


36 posted on 06/01/2010 1:10:10 PM PDT by Travis McGee (---www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com---)
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To: MrB

No, the ‘raiders’ need to be shot dead...


37 posted on 06/01/2010 6:15:05 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: Joe Brower
Something the Chicago mobsters

Mark Levin commented today that it is a slur against Chicago to label them as such. These are Soviet Socialists we are dealing with and there are many examples to confirm this. Their Stalin-like handling of everything from Health Care (crammed down your throat) to Cap and Trade via the EPA (soon to be crammed down your throat), taking Arizona to task for a wildly popular act, and the "job offers" for those willing to do their bidding at election time, make it obvious. The People don't matter, the State does, and they'll do whatever it takes to "rule" over us.

To predict where things are going, one has only to study the communist's love for armed citizens. There wasn't any. And, if November doesn't come soon enough and hard enough, we'll soon feel the 'love'.

38 posted on 06/02/2010 7:52:15 PM PDT by budwiesest (It's that girl from Alaska, again.)
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To: budwiesest
True enough. We need to always bear in mind the fact that politicians desire unarmed peasants just as criminals prefer unarmed victims.

They are much more like than unlike...

39 posted on 06/03/2010 4:08:48 AM PDT by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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