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This is the age of war between the generations (Retiring Baby Boomers Threaten us with Bankrupcy)
The Times Online ^ | 06/03/2010 | Anatole Kaletsky

Posted on 06/03/2010 11:15:13 AM PDT by SeekAndFind

Yesterday was my 58th birthday. If I were a Greek worker I could retire. Although pension payments in Greece normally start around 61, special provisions allow anyone to retire at 58 if they have been in employment for 35 years. That, as it happens, is how long I have been at work. My index-linked pensions from the Greek Government would be worth 75 to 90 per cent of the average salary in the country, guaranteed for the rest of my life by the State.

If you want to know why Greece is going bankrupt and why the euro seems to be on the verge of disintegration, look no farther. The best argument I have ever heard for a break-up of the euro was this observation in a German newspaper: “The Greeks go on to the streets to protest against an increase of the pension age from 61 to 63. Does this mean that Germans should extend the working age from 67 to 69, so Greeks can enjoy their retirement?”

This, however, is not another article about self-indulgent Greeks and self-righteous Germans. The battle over bailouts in Europe is only a sideshow compared with the great social conflict that lies ahead all over the world in the next 20 years. This will not be a struggle between nations or social classes, but between generations — and it is a conflict that, in Britain, begins in earnest this year. The end of the Second World War in May 1945 marked the start of the baby boom, which lasted until the mid-1960s. Now, 65 years later, the corresponding retirement revolution is about to shake up our society, economy and political institutions.

(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: babyboomer; bankrupcy; generation; moralabsolutes; prolife
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1 posted on 06/03/2010 11:15:13 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: SeekAndFind
It's really Conservatives vs. 'Rats.

If the gov'ts (and corps) fully funded pensions on a year by year basis using the Fed's LT interest rates all should be well unless the Fed screws up.

What are the chances of the FED screwing up?

3 posted on 06/03/2010 11:19:46 AM PDT by Paladin2
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To: SeekAndFind
Can The Second Amendment And Social Security Coexist?

- Aaron Zelman and Claire Wolfe

4 posted on 06/03/2010 11:22:57 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: SeekAndFind
Uh, no. It's insane government politics that is threatening us with bankruptcy.
I'm a baby boomer and I fully expect to work until I can afford to retire on my own dime.
I figured out a long time ago that I could not rely on the social security pyramid scheme.

5 posted on 06/03/2010 11:23:14 AM PDT by BitWielder1 (Corporate Profits are better than Government Waste)
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To: Paladin2

100%


6 posted on 06/03/2010 11:23:47 AM PDT by Jim Robinson (JUST VOTE THEM OUT! teapartyexpress.org)
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To: SeekAndFind

I don’t know about England but here in the States, it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world. Look at the country now. It’s not the Baby Boomers that are running it and tearing it down.


7 posted on 06/03/2010 11:24:20 AM PDT by RC2
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To: Jim Robinson

Sorry, I forgot the /sarc.


8 posted on 06/03/2010 11:25:30 AM PDT by Paladin2
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To: SeekAndFind

The boomers were held hostage by Social Security like everyone else:

When did Social Security start?

The Social Security Act was signed by FDR on 8/14/35. Taxes were collected for the first time in January 1937 and the first one-time, lump-sum payments were made that same month. Regular ongoing monthly benefits started in January 1940.


9 posted on 06/03/2010 11:27:24 AM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids and political correctness.)
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To: RC2
I don’t know about England but here in the States, it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world

OK, let's look at history. First, lets ask ourselves, between what years were babies who were born considered, BABY BOOMERS?

Then, we ask ourselves -- what were the years that actually MADE America the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nation in the world...

Next, we ask ourselves, can America sustain this prosperity and economic soundness in the future ?
10 posted on 06/03/2010 11:27:46 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: BitWielder1

As one of those “boomers” who has been forced to pay in to that society all my life, if I’m now told to “get lost” I would have to reply,
“Oh, I’ll get something but lost won’t be it!”


11 posted on 06/03/2010 11:28:13 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: BitWielder1
Uh, no. It's insane government politics that is threatening us with bankruptcy. I'm a baby boomer and I fully expect to work until I can afford to retire on my own dime. I figured out a long time ago that I could not rely on the social security pyramid scheme.

Are you telling us you won't be accepting social security? After being forced into the system?

12 posted on 06/03/2010 11:29:16 AM PDT by rhombus
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To: SeekAndFind

How much of the current new ongoing debt is related to the baby boomers? Good grief.

We have a nine year old who hates the United States with a passion, and is running around with the national credit card running up the balance to an unserviceable total. What more needs to be said?


13 posted on 06/03/2010 11:31:43 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (J. D. Hayworth, the next Senator, the Great State of Arizona - Sen. Poopdeck, Panama is calling...)
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To: RC2

*it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world.*

Uh, no.


14 posted on 06/03/2010 11:31:53 AM PDT by j-damn
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To: BitWielder1
Uh, no. It's insane government politics that is threatening us with bankruptcy.

Such as flooding the country with 20 - 40 million illegal aliens (who liberally partake of the safety net while depressing salaries and keeping law enforcement busy), currently bringing in 125,000 new legal workers (green cards and guest workers) per month (add this to home grown new entrants to the labor force (per wsj)and it will take 225,000 new jobs net each month to keep even on the unemployment rate), 'free trade' treaties which pit American companies and workers against global corporations and workers who are not burdened with onerous level of regulation and taxation, bringing in third world immigrants who are immediately plopped on SSI, Disability, etc. ...
15 posted on 06/03/2010 11:34:38 AM PDT by algernonpj (He who pays the piper . . .)
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To: RC2
I don’t know about England but here in the States, it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world. Look at the country now. It’s not the Baby Boomers that are running it and tearing it down.

Maybe I missed the /sarc tag, but the Boomers have been actively destroying this country since they were teenagers and young adults.

Their mass retirements, along with their self-absorbed entitlement mentality--present from the start--are just going to be the sturm und drang of their final act.
16 posted on 06/03/2010 11:35:36 AM PDT by Goldsborough
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To: j-damn

If not....how did you get here and inherit such a great country? Just look at the work ethics then and now. Look at what they produced. Look at how they protected this country for you and others so you could pick up and carry on. Now look at the younger generation and what they have done to our country. The Baby Boomers made their share of mistakes.........after all they are human, but.......they did their best and when you compare that today, the peoples best doesn’t even come close to being good. Just look at the people in Washington DC.


17 posted on 06/03/2010 11:36:49 AM PDT by RC2
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To: SeekAndFind
The article's comments mention 'forced retirement.' It is not so much that retirement is forced, it is the absolute impracticability of work after 'retirement age.'

Consider the insurance premium exacted from the employer for aging employees.
Consider the very real effects of declining health.
Consider the financial & tax impact of 'double income.'
Consider the attitude of 'Bright Young Things' towards older people.
Consider the current unemployment rate.

Consider a previous Corporate Officer taking a job as a Walmart Greeter or McDonalds Counter Assistant!
.... .... or maybe as a Legislator - but that means being an incumbent!

18 posted on 06/03/2010 11:36:52 AM PDT by I am Richard Brandon
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To: ErnBatavia

Damn’d old boomers anyway.


19 posted on 06/03/2010 11:37:13 AM PDT by Graybeard58 (No Romney,No Mark Kirk (Illinois), not now, not ever!)
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To: SeekAndFind

For the past 60 years, everyone has said “Social Security is an inviolable compact between the generations.”

Well, the compact got broken this year when SS recipients didn’t get their increase in ‘cola’ because of inflation.

I think the government employees unionists and Congress got theirs however. Apparently the compact with themselves is more sacred.


20 posted on 06/03/2010 11:37:55 AM PDT by wildbill (You're just jealous because the Voices talk only to me.)
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To: Goldsborough
but the Boomers have been actively destroying this country since they were teenagers and young adults.

Damn! I never get credit for anything. I was born June 29, 1945, a little too old to be a boomer.

21 posted on 06/03/2010 11:39:17 AM PDT by Graybeard58 (No Romney,No Mark Kirk (Illinois), not now, not ever!)
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To: Goldsborough

No no. It was very clearly enunciated by Glenn Beck: there were the guys who went to the moon; and there were the guys and gals who went to Woodstock.


22 posted on 06/03/2010 11:39:32 AM PDT by I am Richard Brandon
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To: tet68

I totally agree. If they want me out of the Social Security system, pay me back all the money I had to pay into it, all my life, with interest.


23 posted on 06/03/2010 11:40:07 AM PDT by RC2
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To: rhombus
Are you telling us you won't be accepting social security? After being forced into the system?

Well, of course! Principles, you know.

24 posted on 06/03/2010 11:40:46 AM PDT by Graybeard58 (No Romney,No Mark Kirk (Illinois), not now, not ever!)
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To: Graybeard58

I qualify, suckah.....spring of 1947; proudly suckling for a year now.

25 posted on 06/03/2010 11:41:03 AM PDT by ErnBatavia (It's not the Obama Administration....it's the "Obama Regime".)
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To: donna
Taxes were collected for the first time in January 1937

My dad paid in from inception until he died in 1974 and never received a dime.

26 posted on 06/03/2010 11:42:28 AM PDT by Graybeard58 (No Romney,No Mark Kirk (Illinois), not now, not ever!)
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To: Graybeard58

Well if that’s the case, you should be able to deduct your FICA as a tax deductible contribution to the Gov. And from one baby boomer to another... thanks.


27 posted on 06/03/2010 11:42:38 AM PDT by rhombus
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To: Goldsborough

I would guess that you have no respect for your parents or grandparents or any others. Social Security was forced on the people and they have been taxed for it ever since its been around.


28 posted on 06/03/2010 11:43:33 AM PDT by RC2
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To: SeekAndFind

and, Shazasm, we have just instituted Nationalized Health Care, complete with Death Panels. What a coincidence!


29 posted on 06/03/2010 11:46:17 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: RC2
It’s not the Baby Boomers that are running it and tearing it down.

Eh? What is that you say? Baby boomers are usually defined as people born between 1946 and 1964, meaning the people between ages 45 and 64 today. Right now they are in the prime age range for power and influence- they have as much now as they ever will have and . Like it or not it is members of the boomer generation making all the big decisions that are running the country to the ground.
30 posted on 06/03/2010 11:46:59 AM PDT by Flying Circus
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To: tet68
I am a Boomer myself payed in the Max all of my working career, along with my employers, I need 12 years of Socialist Security to get that back without interest.

As the Man said F me now I will definitely F you later, my Platoon Sgt.

31 posted on 06/03/2010 11:47:52 AM PDT by Little Bill (Harry Browne is a poofter)
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To: Flying Circus

>> 1946 and 1964

I thought it was 1945-1955


32 posted on 06/03/2010 11:49:06 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Your Hope has been redistributed. Here's your Change.)
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To: Flying Circus

Not to worry. They’ll all be gone soon and you and yours can tear this country apart. But remember, there’ll be no one around to ask what to do.


33 posted on 06/03/2010 11:51:27 AM PDT by RC2
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To: RC2

I don’t blame the Boomers. Rather, I blame our irresponsible government who allowed the liabilities to become massively underfunded.

I also don’t begrudge Boomers taking their share of SS. However, it should be acknowledged that the Boomers’ kids (of which I’m one) will have a much lower standard of living as their FICA payments will have to increase dramatically to fund their parents SS payments. This whole situation is a real mess and speaks volumes to the incompetency of government.


34 posted on 06/03/2010 11:51:48 AM PDT by VegasCowboy ("...he wore his gun outside his pants, for all the honest world to feel.")
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To: RC2
The issue of what and what not the boomers are is way bigger than social security. You were the vector of cultural rot.

The "ME" generation has forever asked "What's in it for me?" Why would that change now? Sacrifice is an alien concept to the vat majority of your cohort and always has been.
35 posted on 06/03/2010 11:53:25 AM PDT by Goldsborough
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To: VegasCowboy

Yep, I agree. If you offered the children of the Boomers double or triple the payments, I bet they would be the first ones in line to collect it.


36 posted on 06/03/2010 11:55:43 AM PDT by RC2
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To: SeekAndFind; 185JHP; 230FMJ; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; An American In Dairyland; ..
This author overlooks one very important problem:

The United States, the industrialized European nations (UK, France, Germany, etc.), Japan, South Korea and Australia have combined to kill OVER 130 MILLION babies in abortuaries since the end of the Baby Boom. This is the reason that these programs are going broke, they were all designed based on the presumption of normal population growth and when that didn't happen the entire model started to collapse and we are just now seeing it.

Moral Absolutes Ping!

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37 posted on 06/03/2010 11:55:51 AM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: Goldsborough
vat=vast

Then again, a certain percentage of your number want a VAT too.
38 posted on 06/03/2010 11:56:47 AM PDT by Goldsborough
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To: SeekAndFind

Did they tell you 1 in 3 Greeks are government employees?


39 posted on 06/03/2010 11:58:00 AM PDT by dragnet2
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To: Goldsborough

Man, you are really full of hate for the older generation aren’t you? Too bad......you’ll miss them and you’ll find out one day what it’s like to be in their shoes.


40 posted on 06/03/2010 11:58:39 AM PDT by RC2
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To: Goldsborough; All

The United States Supreme court ruled to have prayer removed from schools in 1962; Roe was in 1973, Sodomy laws in 2003...

We should put the blame where is belongs: socialists who want to replace God and family with big government.


41 posted on 06/03/2010 12:00:38 PM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids and political correctness.)
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To: RC2

I won’t be shedding tears over very many of you passing. Please get on with that already. The ways you have collectively twisted this country into a libidinous, licentious, perverted and financially screwed semi-Mexican wasteland are innumerable.


42 posted on 06/03/2010 12:05:36 PM PDT by Goldsborough
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To: VegasCowboy

How dare you speak like an adult? It is more fun and much easier to blame boomers who never participated in the Woodstock culture.

You know, those folks who worked hard, were responsible and conservative.

It is always foolish to blame a whole generation. It is smart to blame those who really are to blame.


43 posted on 06/03/2010 12:05:46 PM PDT by dforest
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To: SeekAndFind

“Since no such reforms are ever likely, I look forward to the Greek Government being forced to sell the Parthenon — and to Oxford and Cambridge being turned into luxury old people’s homes.”

I’m good with the stuff about Oxford and Cambridge. Why don’t we throw in the Ivy League and Berkeley also.


44 posted on 06/03/2010 12:10:46 PM PDT by ModelBreaker
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To: Graybeard58
Damn! I never get credit for anything. I was born June 29, 1945, a little too old to be a boomer.

Actually, if you read Megatrends 2000, those authors attribute the start of the 'babyboom' generation to 1942. Because that is just after when the first wave of WW2 soldiers went off to war.

45 posted on 06/03/2010 12:11:12 PM PDT by Parmy
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To: indylindy
You know, those folks who worked hard, were responsible and conservative.

You just described my parents and the many great people who have provided me employment since I graduated from college 15 years ago.

No generation is inherently better or worse than any other. Our problem isn't any one generation, it's a political system that encourages short-term actions to ensure election with no thought given to the ultimate day of reckoning. Well guess what. That day of reckoning is staring us in the face, and our collective anger should be focused where it belongs: on our incompentent and gutless "leaders."
46 posted on 06/03/2010 12:11:30 PM PDT by VegasCowboy ("...he wore his gun outside his pants, for all the honest world to feel.")
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To: I am Richard Brandon

None of the men who walked on the moon were Baby Boomers. IIRC, the youngest of those guys was born in 1943.


47 posted on 06/03/2010 12:12:33 PM PDT by meadsjn (Sarah 2012, or sooner)
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To: RC2

“I don’t know about England but here in the States, it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world. Look at the country now. It’s not the Baby Boomers that are running it and tearing it down.”

I’m pretty sure youngsters, minorities, lawyers, quants, bankers and public employee union members elected the Obaminator. No doubt some were boomers. But the yutes went disproportionately for the bad guy who wants to make all of these inter-generational problems worse.


48 posted on 06/03/2010 12:13:53 PM PDT by ModelBreaker
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To: RC2
I don’t know about England but here in the States, it was the Baby Boomers that built this country and made it one of the most powerful, must economically sound and most peaceful Nations in the world. Look at the country now. It’s not the Baby Boomers that are running it and tearing it down.

I have to agree because millions of 'babyboomers' have paid into the system and have been employed for all of their lives.

The problem actually began under Johnson because he, with a democrat Congress, changed the 'trust fund' from being that and moved it into the 'general fund'.

Why? Because there was a big pot of money accumulated and they wanted to spend it. Also, every year since then Congress, both parties, have spent the surpluses that SS generated. All the while they have been telling us SS need to be 'reformed'. Code word for screwing all of us.

49 posted on 06/03/2010 12:15:05 PM PDT by Parmy
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To: I am Richard Brandon

“No no. It was very clearly enunciated by Glenn Beck: there were the guys who went to the moon; and there were the guys and gals who went to Woodstock.”

They not only went to Woodstock, they went into politics, journalism and education. That odious lot from the boomers is resposible for most of the mess we are in today.


50 posted on 06/03/2010 12:16:05 PM PDT by ModelBreaker
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