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Ready for the truth about "The Shack"?
WorldNetDaily ^ | 6/7/2010 | WorldNetDaily Exclusive

Posted on 06/07/2010 6:51:41 AM PDT by Jim 0216

Shocker! "Burning Down 'The Shack,'" [is] a hard-hitting, no-holds-barred biblical critique of the book by someone who knew author Paul Young well and understands what's behind its strange theology. "It's often said that one can understand a book better by knowing the author," James De Young offers in "Burning Down 'The Shack,'" which he wrote to "expose the greatest deception to blindside the church in the last 200 years!" De Young isn't only a New Testament language and literature professor at Western Seminary in Portland, Ore., he holds multiple degrees from respected seminaries including Dallas Seminary, Talbot Theological Seminary and Moody Bible Institute. In addition, and possibly most important, De Young is a former longtime colleague of Paul Young, and was his Portland-area neighbor when Young wrote "The Shack." In 1997, De Young and Young co-founded a Christian think tank, called M3 Forum, and for the next seven years they discussed and probed topics, doctrine and problems facing the church as it approached the New Millennium. Then, in April 2004, Young submitted a surprising 103-page paper in which he embraced universal reconciliation and said, "He was putting aside his earlier evangelical paradigm." Less than two years later, Young asked friends to read the early draft of a novel he was writing as a Christmas gift for his children. Though highly impressed by the manuscript's potential, the friends were opposed to the universal reconciliation they found in it and acknowledged publicly that they spent over a year trying to remove that message. Mainline Christian publishers declined interest in publishing what became "The Shack," so Young and his friends formed their own publishing company to self-publish. "When I carefully read 'The Shack' in January 2008, I was dismayed to find universalism still embedded, deeply and subtly, in it," De Young recalls.

(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: christian; reconciliation; redemption; shack
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This is a long post, but I wanted to get my thoughts in before everyone jumps into the fray. FYI, a theological issue is addressed referencing Oswald Chambers in point #6:

If Mr. Young has embraced a view that somehow there's no hell, this is a shame for a number of reasons.

1. The Shack is full of the reality of intimacy with God’s family, the Trinity. It tracks very closely and vividly with the book and Bible study by Dr. David Eckman, Becoming What God Intended, A Study for Spiritual Transformation, which made its way around the churches and home Bible studies a few years ago with great success.
2. The Shack is a helpful and effective metaphor for healing among God’s people. Many of us have an inner “shack”, a place where we hide the sadnesses and lonelinesses from hurts and abuse of the past. It is a place in believer’s hearts where God is waiting to help and heal us. The difficult part is our willingness to return to our “Great Sadnesses” that so often we have safely hidden away from our own conscience for years.
3. If there is a “no hell” idea here, it is neither a major point nor a necessity for the main ideas of the book, but it’s enough for the Pharisees and “heretic hunters” in our midst to have a field day with the “relationship over religion” concepts in the book.
4. The idea in therapy and recovery programs and meetings ofttimes is “Take what you want and leave the rest.” One should take the good that’s in “The Shack” and if there is an idea of no hell in “The Shack”, one should leave it. I think this can be done without throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
5. I hope for Paul Young’s sake that he does not embrace this “no hell” idea, because it is clearly unscriptural. God’s Word always trumps our “good ideas.” Other well-known and respected Christian leaders have fallen and become of no effect because of this heresy, a prime example being Carlton Pearson.

6. There’s a subtle but important distinction here that is and almost certainly will be the subject of much confusion. The article references “universal reconciliation” but the idea of no hell should be called “universal salvation.” This is an important distinction. I have heard Paul Young quote 2 Corinthians 5:19 and John 1:29, but these along with other scripture, speak of the “universal redemption” that Christ’s death on the cross has afforded all men.

There is a critical distinction between Redemption and salvation. There is no “universal salvation” taught in the Bible. Heaven and Hell (there are 54 references to hell in the Bible) are scriptural and real. The issue between us and God is no longer sin – God has taken care of that issue by Jesus on the cross. The only issue now is Jesus himself who has bone our sin. The question now is: WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO WITH JESUS? The issue between us and God is no longer sin but believing in Jesus Christ.

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. John 3:18-19.

Notice it doesn’t say the condemnation is sin, but that men did not believe in Jesus who took our sin. A masterful treatment of this is found in Oswald Chambers’ My Utmost For His Highest October 7th devotion: http://www.myutmost.org/10/1007.html

1 posted on 06/07/2010 6:51:42 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: Jim 0216

I don’t shop at the Shack anymore, since they insist on having my phone number to sell me two batteries.


2 posted on 06/07/2010 6:55:32 AM PDT by Xenalyte (Yes, Chef!)
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To: Jim 0216

And here I was expecting a shocking expose into the inner workings of the eeeevil Radio Shack! Windfall profits on overpriced component cables! Shock! :D


3 posted on 06/07/2010 6:56:13 AM PDT by perfect_rovian_storm (The worst is behind us. Unfortunately it is really well endowed.)
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To: Xenalyte

Different Shack, unless that was the joke...


4 posted on 06/07/2010 6:57:17 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: Xenalyte

People let me tell you about a place I know
To get in it don’t take much dough
Where you can really do your thing, oh yeah
It’s got a neon sign outside that says
Come in and take a look at your mind
You’d be surprised what you might find, yeah
Strobe lights flashin’ FROM SUN UP TO SUN DOWN
People gather there from all parts of town
Oh yeah, RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER
You know it’s just across the track
People I’m talking about the psychedelic shack


5 posted on 06/07/2010 6:57:29 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Jim 0216
It's what itching ears want to hear. Every new wind of doctrine. I was in a Sunday morning Bible class that lost half its members because the guy down the hall was starting a class on The Shack. Cool!

6 posted on 06/07/2010 6:57:48 AM PDT by Genoa (Luke 12:2)
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To: Jim 0216

It’s a novel, just like the Left Behind series was a novel. Read it for entertainment, not theology, and all will be fine.


7 posted on 06/07/2010 6:58:05 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Jim 0216

Great read ! It says it is fictional on the cover so what if it makes ya think.

Fiction (Latin: fictum, “created”) is any form of narrative which deals, in part or in whole, with events that are not factual, but rather, imaginary and invented by its author(s). Although fiction often describes a major branch of literary work, it is also applied to theatrical, cinematic, documental, and musical work. In contrast to this is non-fiction, which deals exclusively in factual events (e.g.: biographies, histories). Semi-fiction is fiction implementing a great deal of non-fiction,[1] e.g. a fictional description based on a true story.


8 posted on 06/07/2010 7:03:45 AM PDT by Tigen (I shall raise you one .)
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To: MEGoody
Read it for entertainment, not theology

You are what you eat.

9 posted on 06/07/2010 7:04:13 AM PDT by Genoa (Luke 12:2)
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To: Jim 0216

I guess I missed something, I thought it sucked and it was a struggle to even finish ....but that’s just me.


10 posted on 06/07/2010 7:08:57 AM PDT by ladyvet (WOLVERINES!!!!!)
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To: Xenalyte

Don’t you hate that? I am paying with cash, so you do not need my phone or zip code. I refuse to shop where they do that too.


11 posted on 06/07/2010 7:09:27 AM PDT by esquirette ("Our hearts are restless until they find rest in Thee." ~ Augustine)
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To: MEGoody
Read it for entertainment, not theology, and all will be fine.

If it was just a novel, it would avoid theology. It clearly was pushing a misrepresentation of the nature of God. Are you now in favor of pro-Muslim novels?

12 posted on 06/07/2010 7:09:40 AM PDT by aimhigh
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To: MEGoody
It’s a novel, just like the Left Behind series was a novel. Read it for entertainment, not theology, and all will be fine.

That would be good advice if some people could see the difference. Case in point "The Da Vinci Code"

13 posted on 06/07/2010 7:11:50 AM PDT by mckenzie7 (Democrats = Trough Sloppers!)
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To: mckenzie7

AAAAAAAAH you just had to mention that wretched piece of crap! ;p

What a hideous excuse for writing that was. Dan Brown makes John Grisham look fluent.


14 posted on 06/07/2010 7:13:38 AM PDT by Xenalyte (Yes, Chef!)
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To: ladyvet
I think this book is meant for maybe two types of people:

1 - Born again Christians who believe in the Trinity (Father Son and Holy Ghost)

2 - People who have "a great sadness" from abusive or hurtful backgrounds.

15 posted on 06/07/2010 7:13:57 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: ladyvet
I guess I missed something, I thought it sucked and it was a struggle to even finish ....but that’s just me.

No, it was me too. I kept fighting through his quaternian-universalist-heresy to get to the good part everyone was raving about, but there never was one. Maybe that chapter got left out of my copy.

16 posted on 06/07/2010 7:15:14 AM PDT by nina0113
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To: Xenalyte

THIS guy makes Dan Brown look fluent.


17 posted on 06/07/2010 7:17:18 AM PDT by nina0113
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To: Xenalyte

I started reading the book but felt more and more uneasy with it. The message is subtle. I liked some of the story line, but then it just got weird. I truly felt the HS tell me to quit reading the book, to put it down. I did not finish, never picked it up again.


18 posted on 06/07/2010 7:18:10 AM PDT by Shery (in APO Land)
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To: Jim 0216

http://www.calvarybiblechurch.org/articles.aspx/2009/01/1


19 posted on 06/07/2010 7:21:30 AM PDT by Nea Wood (Silly liberal . . . paychecks are for workers!)
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To: Shery
"I started reading the book but felt more and more uneasy with it. The message is subtle. I liked some of the story line, but then it just got weird. I truly felt the HS tell me to quit reading the book, to put it down. I did not finish, never picked it up again."

That was pretty much my reaction, although I managed to finish it.

20 posted on 06/07/2010 7:23:25 AM PDT by Think free or die
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To: MEGoody

This is how approached the book. It is a good story. For me it posed, everybody does have their own idea of what God looks like etc..

Just take it for what it is a good Novel.


21 posted on 06/07/2010 7:23:39 AM PDT by waxer1 ( "The Bible is the rock on which our republic rests." -Andrew Jackson)
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To: aimhigh
"You are what you eat."

The adversary isn't stupid. He's more brilliant than a thousand stars.
He appears as the angel of light, Lucifer.
I read "The Shack", and was dumbfounded.
How people who believe they are Christians, could not see the evil deception
in that piece of trash, is beyond me.
That absolute lack of discernment explains ALL of the corruption in the "church" today.
The root of the word church, eklesia, means "called out, or "seperate".
The "church" in America today is nothing of the kind.

22 posted on 06/07/2010 7:24:59 AM PDT by trickyricky
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To: Nea Wood

Many of us who have a great sadness very much need to go to our “shack” where God is waiting to heal us.


23 posted on 06/07/2010 7:29:58 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: Xenalyte
...I don’t shop at the Shack anymore, since they insist on having my phone number to sell me two batteries...

Circuit City did that too. I just always gave them 867-5309

24 posted on 06/07/2010 7:33:49 AM PDT by FReepaholic (The problem is they do not fear us.)
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To: trickyricky

I am a devout and long time Christian.....I read The Shack and took it for just another story on the way some people believe.....it was fiction and I took it as that.


25 posted on 06/07/2010 7:34:08 AM PDT by maeng ( l)
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To: Xenalyte

http://www.theonion.com/articles/even-ceo-cant-figure-out-how-radioshack-still-in-b,2190/


26 posted on 06/07/2010 7:38:14 AM PDT by Doohickey (I try to take my days one at a time, but occasionally several days attack me at once.)
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To: trickyricky
The adversary isn't stupid. He's more brilliant than a thousand stars.

'The adversary' is a creature of pride. He LOVES to hear how great he is. He declared he wanted to be like the 'Most High'. Too many times, he gets 'worship' from those within the camp of the Most High. Sad...

27 posted on 06/07/2010 7:39:04 AM PDT by LearnsFromMistakes (Yes, I am happy to see you. But that IS a gun in my pocket.)
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To: trickyricky

Lack of discernment is ENCOURAGED by the political left, who are either actively working for the enemy or they are just useful idiots.

And to those who think you’re Christians and yet assert there are “many ways to God”, you’re not Christians. Being a Christian inherently assumes that Christ is the only way to salvation (unless you’re perfect, eh).


28 posted on 06/07/2010 7:39:52 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a (de)humanist and a Satanist is that the latter knows who he's working for.)
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To: Jim 0216

Professional jealousy is a terrible thing, don’t you think?


29 posted on 06/07/2010 7:40:25 AM PDT by Walrus (My congressman is toast in 2010 --- how about yours?)
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To: Jim 0216

Jim - I think your comments are great. So here’s another “long post”.

Wayne Jacobsen ( www.lifestream.org ), author of “He Loves Me” (a solid theological book and a “must read” after The Shack) and other works was the editor/publisher of The Shack and the one who encouraged Paul to publish The Shack. Wayne is a good friend of mine, and with Wayne and others I had the joy of spending a day with Paul Young, Wayne, and Brad Cummings who also helped edit The Shack.

I saw an interview of Paul where he clearly disavowed believing in universal salvation/no hell. Wayne has stayed in our home several times, the last one when we had literally hundreds gathering to discuss the “issues” that critics had with the book. Wayne is solid theologically and quite well answered every issue. The questions were quite pointed, especially as one time we were using the facilities of an SBC church near us and the pastor was firing questions at Wayne in every area. Wayne so well explained things that this pastor asked him to come back and speak in the future.

The Shack does have “issues”, but people miss the point. The point is the incredible depth, width, height and breadth of God’s love and His redemptive sovereignty over all that happens to us in our damaged lives. Having served in ministry for over 40 years, I know of no other book that has drawn damaged, hurting people back into the grace of God, loving and walking with Him than The Shack.

I brought the main message at the memorial service for Rachael Hill ( www.rachaelhill.org ) - one of the kids killed at the Virginia Tech shootings, as I have been close with her family all of her life. She has played my wife’s Yamaha grand piano many times.

After reading The Shack, I strongly felt led to give a copy to Rachael’s father. I wrestled with this for about a month. “How can I give a man whose daughter has just been murdered a book about a man whose daughter is murdered?!?!” Eventually, I did it.

Rachael’s father - a man of God who knows scripture well - called me every day to say only one word: “Wow!” until he finished the book, when he said, “This is the best book I’ve ever read other than the Bible.” He has since given away hundreds of copies, and led many to Christ - many who otherwise would have no contact with any church. He has seen many deeply-hurting people come into rest and comfort and trust in God.

So have I. It’s the only book I know in my life where most readers don’t recommend it to their friends. They go buy copies and give them away.

No, we cannot get theology from the book, and should not. I have been one to strongly oppose all “Christian” novels. But this one changed my mind. I have seen too many brought to Christ, and too many who totally rejected the “Christian religion” come back to a walk and trust in God - and who continue in it today.

Thanks for your post.

arlis


30 posted on 06/07/2010 7:42:09 AM PDT by Arlis (- Virginia loghome/woods-dweller/Jesus lovin'/Bible-totin'/"gun-clinger")
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To: dfwgator

It’s at the . . . sugar shack! Yeah baby at the, sugar shack.


31 posted on 06/07/2010 7:43:04 AM PDT by LS ("Castles made of sand, fall in the sea . . . eventually." (Hendrix))
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To: secret garden

didn’t you try to read this and find yourself unable to finish it?


32 posted on 06/07/2010 7:44:26 AM PDT by xsmommy
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To: Walrus
Professional jealousy is a terrible thing, don’t you think?

I'm sure that's in there too.

33 posted on 06/07/2010 7:51:22 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: Arlis
"Wow." Thanks for sharing this. The Shack is an ongoing blessing to me in dealing with issues in my own life and my wife's as well. I'll have to check out that other book you mentioned.

I hope you're right about Young and "universal salvation." I saw some taped interviews with Young that left me wondering, but I don't see this as "dispositive" to the book itself.

34 posted on 06/07/2010 7:59:15 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: xsmommy

Yes. I could not stand it.


35 posted on 06/07/2010 8:04:06 AM PDT by secret garden (Why procrastinate when you can perendinate?)
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To: Arlis

“Having served in ministry for over 40 years, I know of no other book that has drawn damaged, hurting people back into the grace of God, loving and walking with Him than The Shack.”

The Word of God will always out-perform any pulp-fiction “best seller”.


36 posted on 06/07/2010 8:06:19 AM PDT by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
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To: ladyvet
Same here, worst book I ever tried to read. That’s right I didn’t finish it. Now I avoid the person who recommended it to me as well.
37 posted on 06/07/2010 8:12:10 AM PDT by Ditter
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To: MEGoody
It’s a novel, just like the Left Behind series was a novel. Read it for entertainment, not theology, and all will be fine.

It really wasn't good entertainment.

38 posted on 06/07/2010 8:15:23 AM PDT by Ol' Sparky (Liberal Republicans are the greater of two evils)
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To: aimhigh
If it was just a novel, it would avoid theology.

My understanding is that the author wrote it as a novel, so I don't see the issue.

Are you now in favor of pro-Muslim novels?

I wouldn't read one, and I might criticize it's content. I'm not in favor of book banning as a whole. I do have issues about some books put into public school libraries using my tax dollars. But I wouldn't say that the book couldn't be sold in bookstores.

39 posted on 06/07/2010 8:24:34 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: fishtank

Of course. Forgive me for not re-stating what Rachael’s father said, “other than the Bible.” I should have clarified “book published in the last 40 years.”

I promised myself I would never write a book because the great need of 99.9% of all Christians is to be in the scripture and know it intimately - and that the sad state of Christendom is so few Christians - so few PASTORS - really know the Word of God. And believers so quickly run to books - and 99.9% of their beliefs come not from knowing scripture - but what some man (or woman) said. Their knowledge is mostly “2nd hand”, sadly.

I’m not a book pusher.

arlis


40 posted on 06/07/2010 8:25:45 AM PDT by Arlis (- Virginia loghome/woods-dweller/Jesus lovin'/Bible-totin'/"gun-clinger")
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To: mckenzie7
That would be good advice if some people could see the difference. Case in point "The Da Vinci Code".

Unfortunately, I know exactly what you mean. I have a friend who thinks what is said in that novel could have happened. I told her, "You know it was just a novel, right?" She just gave me that deer-in-the-headlights stare.

41 posted on 06/07/2010 8:25:54 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Genoa
You are what you eat.

That depends on how one approaches what is read for entertainment.

I certainly wouldn't support a Christian reading porn novels and the like. However, I did read the Left Behind series and have actually moved farther from the ideas presented in those books than I was before I read them. I knew they were novels, of course, and as I've continued to study the scriptures, I've come to a new understanding of some biblical prophesies.

42 posted on 06/07/2010 8:32:08 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Shery

Bingo! I had the exact same reaction to it! I couldn’t get over the feminization of the Godhead and the casualness of the relationships. The Lord is a wonderful Savior but he is still deserving of all praise, worship, and adoration.


43 posted on 06/07/2010 8:33:54 AM PDT by 2nd Amendment
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To: Jim 0216

I had Dr. James De Young as a professor at Western Seminary for a number of courses... outstanding man of God who really knows the Word of God. I am sure he has done a tremendous job in exposing the lie that is “The Shack”.


44 posted on 06/07/2010 8:54:34 AM PDT by Jmouse007 (Heavenly Father, deliver us from evil and from those perpetuating it, in Jesus name, amen.)
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To: MrB
"And to those who think you’re Christians and yet assert there are “many ways to God”"

There are many wolves among the sheep.
In wanting to give people the benefit of the doubt, we attribute their lack of discernment
to ignorance or stupidity, when in reality they are well aware of the deceptions of Satan.

The Lord Himself tells us how He will deal with pseudo-christians in Matthew 7:22.

45 posted on 06/07/2010 9:05:06 AM PDT by trickyricky
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To: Jmouse007
Have you read The Shack? I think you'll find that De Young's concern derives mostly from his personal experiences with Paul Young, who may adhere to this universal salvation thing, although there seems to be some argument about that.

If you have not read The Shack and decide to read it, you'll find, as many have, that this theological issue doesn't have much to do with the book's main "touchstone(s)."

46 posted on 06/07/2010 9:29:30 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: Arlis; fishtank
Right - nothing replaces God's Word, and I don't think this was meant to. I've been a Christian for 40+ years and have studied the Bible pretty diligently. I find little to object to here, except maybe one or two peripheral things. The Shack isn't for everyone (it was originally written by a man to his kids using a metaphor to describe his life and experiences).

There's a lot to like in it but as they say, "Take what you want and leave the rest."

47 posted on 06/07/2010 9:44:53 AM PDT by Jim 0216
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To: MEGoody
But I wouldn't say that the book couldn't be sold in bookstores.

I have no problem with selling the Shack in bookstores. I do have a problem with churches promoting a book to warps the nature of God.

48 posted on 06/07/2010 10:33:56 AM PDT by aimhigh
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To: aimhigh
I do have a problem with churches promoting a book to warps the nature of God.

I would agree that it is not the business of a church to promote novels.

49 posted on 06/07/2010 11:32:04 AM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: ladyvet

You didn’t miss anything. It was boorish, emotionally manipulative, and wholly self serving. Gag.


50 posted on 06/07/2010 11:51:19 AM PDT by daisy mae for the usa
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