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McCain Did the Same Thing As McChrsytal
NBC ^ | June 27, 2010 | Meet the Press

Posted on 06/27/2010 11:57:18 PM PDT by Brown Deer

MR. GREGORY: Did the president do the right thing?

SEN. McCAIN: Yes, he did, and he took the appropriate steps, in my view. I would like to say, in General McChrystal's behalf, that he played a key role in Iraq in the efforts against al-Qaeda. A lot of this is not known and will--may never be known. But General McChrystal did a great job there. The president took appropriate action, and we wish General McChrystal well in the future.

...

SEN. McCAIN: First of all, there's no excuse for it, OK? There's no excuse for it. But part of it, some of it was frustration. Part of it was a group of officers who find themselves with a night off which they did not expect, having been working 24/7 in Kabul. They went out in a social environment. And I must tell you that as a young Navy pilot that on occasion at happy hour some things were said about our commanding officer that maybe we wouldn't want to be held responsible for. But that does not excuse anything. But it certainly maybe understands the--makes people understand the circumstances a little better. But, overall, you just, you just can't do those things, and we expect our officer corps to have the maturity to realize that.

(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.msn.com ...


TOPICS: Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: mccain; mccaintruthfile; mchrystal; meetthepress; obama
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McCain admits he did the same thing as McChrystal, but that's no excuse.
1 posted on 06/27/2010 11:57:25 PM PDT by Brown Deer
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To: Brown Deer

McChrystal knew it would go very public and go over like a lead balloon.

It’s possible that McChrystal wanted to distance himself from Obama and the ROE (maybe) and knew this would do it. McChrystal might be fed up with the CIC and finally got tired enough to go ahead and call him on the carpet publicly.

Assuming that at his rank, McChrystal knows what one publicly says and does not say about their superiors.


2 posted on 06/28/2010 12:07:10 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: Brown Deer

FUJM!


3 posted on 06/28/2010 12:07:27 AM PDT by rabscuttle385 (Live Free or Die)
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To: F15Eagle

WAKE UP AMERICA




4 posted on 06/28/2010 12:14:39 AM PDT by BobP (The piss-stream media - Never to be watched again in my house)
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To: BobP

how (unfortunately) true...


5 posted on 06/28/2010 12:19:53 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: Brown Deer

Well there is actually a big difference. John McCain is a Senator, and holds no current military position. McChrystal is a general. If you are in the military, you aren’t exactly as free to say what you want, especially about a senior officer. McCain say the dumbest things imaginable, and it amounts to nothing. Not the same for someone in the military, whether a private or a general.


6 posted on 06/28/2010 12:30:22 AM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: Brown Deer

Discretion in front of the press was his point.


7 posted on 06/28/2010 12:32:42 AM PDT by des
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To: nickcarraway
Well there is actually a big difference. John McCain is a Senator, and holds no current military position.

Really, what's the difference? John McCain was a U.S. Naval officer at the time he made his comments about his senior officers.

Are you saying that this will not matter anymore in a few years when McChrystal retires?

btw, McChrystal did not make any comments about a senior officer, unlike McCain.
8 posted on 06/28/2010 12:56:15 AM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for Obama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: F15Eagle
I think you are thinking exactly my own sentiments.

I can fantasize what would have been said to Zer0's face if McChrystal could have been summoned instead to a Beer Summit. I could imagine the salty language and an arm wrestling match. Zer0 would have learned more than what was written in anyRolling Stone Magazine. For a president who is mostly learning on the job, this would have been a time of frank talk and a teaching moment from one of his best generals.

Too bad that Zer0 is just Zer0, Zip, Nada. The only thing he will ever learn is what was drilled into him from his communist mentors from his earliest years. Too bad that this country's greatness hangs on the outcome of a wrestling match between Rolling Stone Magazine and a Beer Summit.

9 posted on 06/28/2010 1:28:17 AM PDT by jonrick46 (We're being water boarded with the sewage of Fabian Socialism.)
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To: nickcarraway

Now the Gen was totally crazy to trust any reporter. We all know that.

Make no mistake that in war/combat zone some ripe words are said. Officers are often four letters as I still like a few Ret NCO’s to call me whatever they want. Humor is needed in a combat area. There is not a man who ever served in combat who cannot recall some funny events that were a riot then.


10 posted on 06/28/2010 2:54:45 AM PDT by Lumper20
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To: Brown Deer
"...young Navy pilot that on occasion at happy hour..."

Fact: John Sidney McCain has lost more combat aircraft than any other United States Senator.

Conclusion: He was a lousy aviator.
11 posted on 06/28/2010 3:38:48 AM PDT by mkjessup
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To: Lumper20

McCrystal is a liberal who voted for OBOZO and probably felt safe with a Rolling Stone reporter.


12 posted on 06/28/2010 3:43:57 AM PDT by newfreep (Palin/DeMint 2012 - Bolton: Secy of State)
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To: newfreep

Bingo.

He threw out Yon because Yon is the most knowledgeable mil reporter, because McCrystal and company wanted a uneducated, ignorant reporter from a fluff magazine more noted for it’s glossy covers and photos......and kept the Rolling Stones reporter around for weeks!

What a maroon.


13 posted on 06/28/2010 4:13:56 AM PDT by Leisler ("Over time they create a legal system that plunders and a moral code that glorifies it." F. Bastiat)
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To: mkjessup

And husband, student and Senator.

So, he’s consistent.


14 posted on 06/28/2010 4:15:13 AM PDT by Leisler ("Over time they create a legal system that plunders and a moral code that glorifies it." F. Bastiat)
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To: Brown Deer

If McCain’s comments were broadcast outside of that barroom, you better believe he would be reprimanded. The further and wider the broadcast, the more he would have been reprimanded.

It’s never ok to trash your superior while you wear the uniform, but the bigger and wider the audience, the more you will be held accountable. And the higher your rank, the more you will be held accountable.

A couple of privates complaining outloud to each other about their seargent while cleaning the latrines will be told to shut up and get back to work.

The seargent moaning about his captain in the bar will be called in and asked if he remembers the military code.

The general who consistantly complains about his superiors in front of an imbedded reporter for an entertainment magazine will be removed from his position.

It’s that simple.


15 posted on 06/28/2010 4:17:22 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: mkjessup
Fact: John Sidney McCain has lost more combat aircraft than any other United States Senator.
Conclusion: He was a lousy aviator.
Question:
Who held the major league record for the most home runs given up as a pitcher until this year?
Answer:
Robin Roberts, ace of the Phillies' staff in the 1950s, elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame in 1976. (Recently departed, RIP).
Roberts' record for home runs allowed can largely be attributed to his durability and his tendency to pitch inside the strike zone. Roberts threw 4688 innings over the course of his 19-year career, good for 21st on the all-time innings pitched list. Moreover, Roberts challenged hitters to put the ball in play, issuing relatively few walks (1.7 per 9 innings pitched) and strikeouts (4.5 per 9 innings pitched).

wikipedia


16 posted on 06/28/2010 4:19:36 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion ( DRAFT PALIN)
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To: conservatism_IS_compassion

I do not see the relevance.


17 posted on 06/28/2010 4:34:21 AM PDT by mkjessup
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
The general who consistantly complains about his superiors in front of an imbedded reporter for an entertainment magazine will be removed from his position.

Did you read the article? If so, show me the quotes from McChrystal about Obama. I can't find one.

18 posted on 06/28/2010 4:35:47 AM PDT by raybbr (Someone who invades another country is NOT an immigrant - illegal or otherwise.)
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To: raybbr

So the only superior Obama had was Obama?


19 posted on 06/28/2010 4:39:42 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius; raybbr

Way too early in the morning for me. Let me try that again.

So the only superior McChrystal had was Obama?


20 posted on 06/28/2010 4:41:04 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Lumper20

“Now the Gen was totally crazy to trust any reporter.”

Since “the Gen” is a social/politial liberal, voted for Obama, forbade Fox News for his troops, etc., he most likely DID trust the MSM. One more example of questionable discernment. His replacement might actually be a patriot instead of a whiny metrosexual liberal who forced troops to ask, “Mother, may I?” before attacking the enemy. IMHO...


21 posted on 06/28/2010 4:42:44 AM PDT by MayflowerMadam (Every time a liberal whines, an angel gets his wings.)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
So the only superior McChrystal had was Obama?

I didn't see ANY quotes from McC other than one about Biden. Did you see more?

22 posted on 06/28/2010 4:45:05 AM PDT by raybbr (Someone who invades another country is NOT an immigrant - illegal or otherwise.)
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To: mkjessup

I think Tom Harkin lost more, actually.


23 posted on 06/28/2010 4:45:40 AM PDT by tanknetter
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius

Re: 15 — Thank you.


24 posted on 06/28/2010 4:48:22 AM PDT by MozarkDawg
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To: raybbr

I’ll have to read it again to see the direct quotes attributed to him.


25 posted on 06/28/2010 4:48:32 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
I’ll have to read it again to see the direct quotes attributed to him.

Again? You never read it or else you would have already known that there were none.
26 posted on 06/28/2010 4:56:22 AM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for Obama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: tanknetter
I think Tom Harkin lost more, actually.

No kidding? Well that DOES establish that Harkin and McCain are certainly in the same class, lol
27 posted on 06/28/2010 5:12:37 AM PDT by mkjessup
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To: newfreep

McCrystal is a liberal who voted for OBOZO and probably felt safe with a Rolling Stone reporter.

Very good point!

I was wondering if, perhaps, that McCrystal played this one the only way he could. Let’s assume that if he wanted out of that hell hole - he has 2 options, guit or be removed. If he quits, he is bad and gets dragged through the press in a worse way. If he says something like he did and gets relieved of his duties, obama looks like a hawk (that hurt to say) for 20 seconds and the general doesn’t look so bad. Maybe the general saw pending failure and this was his way of getting out without being made the scapegoat by the administration. We all know how well this administration places blame onto others.


28 posted on 06/28/2010 5:23:51 AM PDT by Cyclone59 (I ROCK, Guitar Hero said so........)
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To: F15Eagle

I do not give a crap about the ROE...any general that will allow marines to be slaughtered without giving air or artillery support to them, because of the silly assed ROE, should suffer the same fate as the marines he let die...maybe his consience got the best of him, and he wanted to be fired...he deserved far worse


29 posted on 06/28/2010 5:33:02 AM PDT by joe fonebone (They will get my Fishing Rod when they pry it from my cold dead fingers)
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To: MayflowerMadam
"His replacement might actually be a patriot instead of a whiny metrosexual liberal."

You do know that the new guy was the old guys boss?

Both being patriots.

30 posted on 06/28/2010 6:03:08 AM PDT by anglian
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To: joe fonebone
"any general that will allow marines to be slaughtered without giving air or artillery support to them,,,"

Got a link to that?

Didn't think so.

31 posted on 06/28/2010 6:05:19 AM PDT by anglian
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To: raybbr
At one point on his trip to Paris, McChrystal checks his BlackBerry. "Oh, not another e-mail from Holbrooke," he groans. "I don't even want to open it." He clicks on the message and reads the salutation out loud, then stuffs the BlackBerry back in his pocket, not bothering to conceal his annoyance.

...............................

"I like Karl (Eikenberry), I've known him for years, but they'd never said anything like that to us before," says McChrystal, who adds that he felt "betrayed" by the leak. "Here's one that covers his flank for the history books. Now if we fail, they can say, 'I told you so.' "

Both of these quotes, directly attributed to McChrystal, are problematic. Combined with all of the "Senior Aide" quotes, they show a disdain for the administration, not just in policy, but for particular people in the chain of command.

It's ironic, because it seems the reporter was trying to create a "liberal warrior" out of McChrystal and ended up trashing the administrations strategy in Afghanistan.

32 posted on 06/28/2010 6:11:37 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: joe fonebone

Yes, that’s all fine and well, in theory. There’s nothing worse than idiots getting good men killed. Like Lyndon Johnson in Vietnam.

In reality, since violating ROE amounts to an unlawful order in regards to ROE, violations are punishable by the UCMJ.

Getting people to support violating direct orders, especially involving air assets, is rather difficult.

I don’t disagree with your sentiment in theory; but in reality a lone general is never going to able to set his own ROE and have it carried out for very long. Patton maybe, but not today.

I just got done yesterday watching the Afghan outpost that some idiot put at the bottom of a mountain valley; giving all the high ground to the enemy. And a lot of good men got killed because of sheer stupidity.


33 posted on 06/28/2010 6:14:51 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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McChrystal Stone Rolled http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3-a3GKyMm0&feature=player_embedded


34 posted on 06/28/2010 6:16:33 AM PDT by anglian
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To: F15Eagle
key graf from the RS story:

The rules handed out here are not what McChrystal intended - they've been distorted as they passed through the chain of command - but knowing that does nothing to lessen the anger of troops on the ground. when I came over here and heard that McChrystal was in charge, I thought we would get our gun on," says Hicks, who has served three tours of combat. "I get COIN. I get all that. McChrystal comes here, explains it, it makes sense. But then he goes away on his bird, and by the time his directives get passed down to us through Big Army, they're all f***** up - either because somebody is trying to cover their ass, or because they just don't understand it themselves."

35 posted on 06/28/2010 6:17:27 AM PDT by anglian
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
More on EIKENBERRY - the ANTI-MORALE ambassador to Afghanistan. From a very Sr. Sergeant Major that was serving with him at the time up at Camp Eggers I heard the following “he is considered the anti-morale device on the camp”. What this Sergeant Major was talking about was the fact that whenever “E3″ was around on the camp, nobody laughed, or joked or anything. E3 was known for leading by fear and intimidation rather than respect according to this senior leader I talked to. Whenever E3 was away from the camp, the morale went up considerably among the officers and NCOs that were the primary residents on the camp. It was probably a good thing that we didn’t talk to him, because on his visit to the PRT and our ANA FOB he pretty much yelled at and degraded every US soldier he encountered, to include several O6s. The rule of thumb was; if you had “US” on your name tape then be prepared to be disrespected and screamed at, but if you were Afghan then you could do no wrong. As a result of his visit, the Senior officer (the Brigade Team Chief) on our FOB, an O6 Colonel, his Executive Officer (O5-LT. Colonel) and the Command Sergeant Major of the Brigade were all relieved on the spot. He fired all of them after a 30 minute one way yelling match. Match may not be the right word, because it was one way, from him to them. As you may be able to tell, I am not a big fan of E3 and was not happy to see the President pick him as ambassador to Afghanistan. I mean, he is a good choice for the fact that he has Afghanistan experience. Even though O.J knows a little something about knives I still would not pick him to be a door to door cutlery salesman. http://www.bouhammer.com/2009/04/5-billion-unspent-by-the-anti-morale-device/
36 posted on 06/28/2010 6:21:44 AM PDT by anglian
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
Fair enough. Do either of those quotes remotely represent the backlash McC's gotten?

There is something about this whole episode that bothers me. Conservatives/hawks are over reacting and the libs are only looking at how McC' "offended" Obama. The reaction doesn't jibe with the quotes.

If he had called Obama a bungling fool (which is, of course, the truth) there would be a justified reaction.

Most of the quotes are attributed to aides and soldiers. I really don't get the reaction from the right.

It's ironic, because it seems the reporter was trying to create a "liberal warrior" out of McChrystal and ended up trashing the administrations strategy in Afghanistan.

Yes, I got THAT too. The reporter tried, I think, to make McC look like a bit of a maverick a la McStupid hoping to elevate him in the eyes of the libs but it backfired.

37 posted on 06/28/2010 6:21:54 AM PDT by raybbr (Someone who invades another country is NOT an immigrant - illegal or otherwise.)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
Yes, I got THAT too. The reporter tried, I think, to make McC look like a bit of a maverick a la McStupid hoping to elevate him in the eyes of the libs but it backfired.

I tried to stop that post.

I meant to say "The reporter tried, I think, to make McC look like a bit of a maverick a la McStupid hoping to elevate him in the eyes of the libs the conservatives because McC has always supported Obama but it backfired.

38 posted on 06/28/2010 6:24:06 AM PDT by raybbr (Someone who invades another country is NOT an immigrant - illegal or otherwise.)
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To: anglian

Yep, it sounds rather bad over there.


39 posted on 06/28/2010 6:25:35 AM PDT by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: Brown Deer

Was McCain a 4-star commander? Did he do it in front of a reporter?


40 posted on 06/28/2010 6:54:34 AM PDT by Fundamentally Fair (Bush: Mission Accomplished. Obama: Commission Accomplished.)
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To: raybbr

I’m a military brat. Wanted to serve, but developed asthma during my late teen years and back in the 80’s, that was enough to keep you out. My dad was an E-9. Just background to give you my point of view on this.

You respect the chain of command, and if you don’t, and if the chain of command loses their trust in you, you are removed from your position.

Lincoln and McClellan.
Truman and MacArthur.
Obama and McChrystal.


41 posted on 06/28/2010 7:00:55 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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To: anglian

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2342812/posts

here is one of many articles on this occurance and loss of life due to spineless officers and generals putting their politcal careers ahead of the troops they command...if you wish to do further research, here on FR, go ahead...and try to be nice once in a while....


42 posted on 06/28/2010 7:28:11 AM PDT by joe fonebone (They will get my Fishing Rod when they pry it from my cold dead fingers)
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To: F15Eagle

thank you for your kindly worded reply....you are correct in practicality, but I do know that if soldiers were being slaughtered, career or not, I would provide them with support...I guess this is what happens when you into the upper ranks, politics come before command


43 posted on 06/28/2010 7:30:30 AM PDT by joe fonebone (They will get my Fishing Rod when they pry it from my cold dead fingers)
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To: mkjessup
Fact: John Sidney McCain has lost more combat aircraft than any other United States Senator. Conclusion: He was a lousy aviator.

Cheep shot. How many US Senators flew off a aircraft carrier into combat?

44 posted on 06/28/2010 7:45:54 AM PDT by Ditto (Nov 2, 2010 -- Time to Clean House.)
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To: anglian

“You do know that the new guy was the old guys boss?”

Of course I know that. I doubt if Petraeus voted for Obama, though, as McChrystal did.


45 posted on 06/28/2010 8:50:00 AM PDT by MayflowerMadam (Every time a liberal whines, an angel gets his wings.)
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To: Ditto
Fact: John Sidney McCain has lost more combat aircraft than any other United States Senator. Conclusion: He was a lousy aviator.
Cheep shot. How many US Senators flew off a aircraft carrier into combat


You bet it's a cheap shot. And McCain deserves every one of 'em. He is the master of taking cheap shots at his conservative adversaries (NEVER his 'Rat buddies) and the fact I cited is correct (with the possible exception of that pinko Tom Harkin).

To Hell with McCain, he deserves everything he gets, and more.
46 posted on 06/28/2010 8:52:24 AM PDT by mkjessup (Do you support John McCain? If so, you're an effin' IDIOT!)
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To: Anitius Severinus Boethius
Both of these quotes, directly attributed to McChrystal, are problematic.

You said that he constantly complained about his superiors. Neither Holbrooke or Eikenberry were McChrystal's superiors.
47 posted on 06/28/2010 9:05:20 AM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for Obama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: mkjessup

” You bet it’s a cheap shot. And McCain deserves every one of ‘em. He is the master of taking cheap shots at his conservative adversaries (NEVER his ‘Rat buddies) and the fact I cited is correct (with the possible exception of that pinko Tom Harkin). “

McCain is such an EVIL FRAUD I wouldn’t care if he was “framed”

LOL!


48 posted on 06/28/2010 9:06:22 AM PDT by stephenjohnbanker (Support our Troops, and vote out the RINOS!)
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To: Fundamentally Fair
Did he do it in front of a reporter?

I don't know if McCain did it in front of a reporter, but he admitted doing it on national television.

What exactly did McChrystal say about his superior officers in front of a reporter?
49 posted on 06/28/2010 9:09:18 AM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for Obama. Psalm 109:8)
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To: Brown Deer
He wasn't quoted, but it was clear from the story that he did. I don't know why Conservatives are trying to defend this behavior. It's inappropriate under Obama, it would have been inappropriate under Bush. It's simply inappropriate.
50 posted on 06/28/2010 9:18:20 AM PDT by Anitius Severinus Boethius
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