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EXCLUSIVE: Arizona's Closed Federal Parkland is a No-Man's Land
fox news ^ | 7/2/10 | Joshua Rhett Miller

Posted on 07/02/2010 3:16:37 PM PDT by Nachum

BUENOS AIRES NATIONAL WILDLIFE REFUGE, Arizona – The number of illegal immigrants and drug smugglers crossing through this magnificent national parkland in southern Arizona has "decreased significantly" in the last four years, park officials say.

But there's a dark cloud to this silver lining: To make it happen, the refuge had to close a sliver of this slice of heaven to the quarter-billion American taxpayers who own it -- essentially creating a no-man's-land on which only drug smugglers, gun-runners, human traffickers and the Border Patrol agents who track them down dare to tread.

And with rival Mexican drug gangs gunning each other down less than 50 miles away, the chance that the closed portion of the wildlife refuge will reopen in the foreseeable future appears to be between slim and none. For the time being, officials say, this public land will be closed to the public.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; arizonas; closed; federal; parkland

1 posted on 07/02/2010 3:16:41 PM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum

Question: Why can’t Arizona send in a swat team and clear the area? I know this is a federal issue but if the federal government isn’t doing their job why doesn’t Arizona do it?


2 posted on 07/02/2010 3:20:33 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Nachum

OK Freepers - it’s time to plant a flag in that abandoned or surrendered territory and create a new nation.

We shall call it FREEREPUBLIC!!!!!


3 posted on 07/02/2010 3:21:06 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Despair - Man's surrender. Laughter - God's redemption)
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To: Nachum
Posting signs like these has legal implications that go straight to the heart of American sovereignty. 0baMao has asserted that southern Arizona has been ceded to Mexico.

Gov. Brewer to President Obama ...(Must see video)

Look what they found near the Texas and Mexico border (See pix)


4 posted on 07/02/2010 3:27:19 PM PDT by TigersEye (Greenhouse Theory is false. Totally debunked. "GH gases" is a non-sequitur.)
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To: Nachum

Sounds like a great place to go huntin with a long gun sighted in to about 1000 yards.


5 posted on 07/02/2010 3:27:19 PM PDT by Candor7 (Obama .......yes.......is fascist... ...He meets every diagnostic of history)
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To: Nachum

And it is not just in Arizona that federal “parkland” is being used by the drug and human traffickers. Almost every national wildlife refuge has no police with jurisdiction and no regular police patrols. I live near a national wildlife refuge that is crawling with people after hours. I don’t want to sound racist, but most of the people I have seen in the refuge are of the dark skined persuasion who either run or fire weapons when they see me.

Where do I live you ask? About thirty-five miles west northwest of Boston.


6 posted on 07/02/2010 3:34:12 PM PDT by MIchaelTArchangel (Obama makes me miss Jimmah Cahtah!)
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To: Nachum

“The signs went up on Oct. 3, 2006. A year later, construction of an 18-foot-tall pedestrian fence was completed, replacing the porous vehicle barriers and barbed-wire fences that had stood there before. This public area was officially closed to the public. The result, says Gall, is that the number of border-crossers has been reduced to a “couple hundred” a day — or roughly 1/20th of what it was.”

I think that’s the real interesting part of the story. Despite the jokes about ladders, this shows that a fence really will work to dramatically reduce illegal immigration. Imagine if it was a double fence covering the length of the border and it was actually patrolled.


7 posted on 07/02/2010 3:43:08 PM PDT by Boogieman
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To: Nachum

Declare open season and pay a bounty for scalps to pay for the ammo.


8 posted on 07/02/2010 3:53:04 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, A Matter Of Fact, Not A Matter Of Opinion)
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To: Boogieman
THIS is the fence we need:

No reason to discuss amensty, a "pathway to citizenship" or anything else until this is built.
9 posted on 07/02/2010 3:53:14 PM PDT by upchuck (Don't let freedom slip away. After America, there is no place to go ~ Kitty Werthmann - Google her.)
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To: 1_Inch_Group; 2sheep; 2Trievers; 3AngelaD; 3pools; 3rdcanyon; 4Freedom; 4ourprogeny; 7.62 x 51mm; ..

Ping!


10 posted on 07/02/2010 3:58:16 PM PDT by HiJinx (John 10:1 - He who enters not by the gate...)
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To: upchuck

Nice! Maybe we can sell it to Obama as a new version of FDR’s Public Works, to help reduce unemployment :)


11 posted on 07/02/2010 3:59:43 PM PDT by Boogieman
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To: Boogieman

Full employment for illegals - they build it from the inside out and stay on the other side once it’s finished;)


12 posted on 07/02/2010 4:06:19 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Despair - Man's surrender. Laughter - God's redemption)
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To: Nachum

The Army/Navy should use the area as a practice bomb areas that they had to give up in Puerto Rico a few years go.


13 posted on 07/02/2010 4:07:10 PM PDT by Citizen Soldier ("You care far too much what is written and said about you." Axelrod to Obama 2006)
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To: upchuck

That’s right.
You can’t have a door without a wall.


14 posted on 07/02/2010 4:15:34 PM PDT by calljack (Sometimes your worst nightmare is just a start.)
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To: Nachum

had to close a sliver of this slice of heaven “

Anyone know how big this “sliver” is?


15 posted on 07/02/2010 4:22:13 PM PDT by philetus (Keep doing what you always do and you'll keep getting what you always get.)
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To: Nachum

From a couple of weeks ago, but it shows the area that is closed off in question on a map of the state of AZ.

http://radioviceonline.com/portion-of-national-park-on-border-closed-to-americans-due-to-violence/


16 posted on 07/02/2010 4:27:47 PM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: philetus

Please see post number 16, thanks!


17 posted on 07/02/2010 4:30:18 PM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Boogieman

I know the area and Gall is crazy. His figures would indicate that nearly a million illegals crossed yearly before changes were made. The enrironmental degradation there, and in nearby Arivaca Creek region, is bad. Very bad. But throwing around wild figures doesn’t help.


18 posted on 07/02/2010 5:16:05 PM PDT by Melchior
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To: MIchaelTArchangel

WTF IS GOING ON IN OUR COUNTRY?????

WHERE IS OUR GOVT TO SECURE OUR SAFETY!!


19 posted on 07/02/2010 5:18:06 PM PDT by Recovering Ex-hippie (Ok, joke's over....Bring back Bush !)
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To: Biggirl
From a couple of weeks ago, but it shows the area that is closed off in question on a map of the state of AZ.

Here's the REAL area that's closed off:

(Thank you pookie18)

20 posted on 07/02/2010 5:22:04 PM PDT by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: Oatka

Oh my goodness, that puts it in much better words. We Americans are dealing with our own “Gaza Stripe”.


21 posted on 07/02/2010 5:34:37 PM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Steve Van Doorn

It’s federal land about the size of Connecticut.


22 posted on 07/02/2010 5:46:15 PM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids.)
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To: Nachum

As the Cartel War in Mexico heats up the smugglers are more dangerous- completely ruthless and our Border Patrol is simply not able to deal with what they are encountering in many areas not just this one. Border Patrol agents are quietly avoiding some areas and the media is not reporting what is going on. There will be increasingly violent incidents with locals, the public, Border Patrol, and other law enforcement in these areas. The head of the Border Patrol union has stated that he does not feel the agents can safely patrol areas actually on the border without having armored vehicles. I think it will take military action to secure the worst areas of the border and take back the land from the cartels.


23 posted on 07/02/2010 6:27:13 PM PDT by Tammy8 (~Secure the border and deport all illegals- do it now! ~ Support our Troops!~)
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To: Steve Van Doorn
Question: Why can’t Arizona send in a swat team and clear the area? I know this is a federal issue but if the federal government isn’t doing their job why doesn’t Arizona do it?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ We are already paying all the illegals expenses. Stop with the benefits for illegals and we could put the money to work at the border.

24 posted on 07/02/2010 6:33:03 PM PDT by Irish Eyes
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To: Nachum; sodpoodle; Candor7
MAD MAX right here in America!

The only thing that actually WOULD get the Feds back into the area: a large group of well-armed American Patriots on a mission to take their country back.

25 posted on 07/02/2010 6:42:54 PM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: Oatka

This is a heck of a lot mor than 3,500 acres as indicated by the Fed notification, It is way more than 35,000; perhaps 3,500,000.


26 posted on 07/02/2010 7:29:41 PM PDT by Lion Den Dan
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To: Steve Van Doorn
Question: Why can’t Arizona send in a swat team and clear the area?

Because it's something like 10,000 square miles of some of the most inhospitable terrain in the American Southwest. Do you seriously expect an 8 man SWAT team to secure that?

27 posted on 07/02/2010 7:34:33 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Lurker
"Do you seriously expect an 8 man SWAT team to secure that?"

My question is why can't the governor mobilize the AZ National Guard? I heard her being interviewed this afternoon and she said the Fed Gov't won't let her. Is this because we're talking about federal land? Otherwise why would she have to play "mother may I" with the Feds?

28 posted on 07/02/2010 7:44:14 PM PDT by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: Flag_This
My question is why can't the governor mobilize the AZ National Guard?

Because Obama "Federalized" them. She no longer has any legal authority over her own State's NG.

Is this because we're talking about federal land?

That's another reason. Governor Brewer is falling into the Fed trap of "It is because we say so." What she should do is call up te regular and irregular State Militia and use them to defend the citizens of her fair State.

L

29 posted on 07/02/2010 7:49:15 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Lurker
"That's another reason. Governor Brewer is falling into the Fed trap of "It is because we say so." What she should do is call up te regular and irregular State Militia and use them to defend the citizens of her fair State."

You know if some motivated ex-military types got organized and decided to "go hiking" every so often the FBI would be all over them in 15 seconds flat, but a hostile foreign invasion is just peachy. What a country.

30 posted on 07/02/2010 7:56:39 PM PDT by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: Lurker; Irish Eyes; donna
The worst area is obviously the 3,500 acres 8 men can secure 2.5 mile square area and that would be a good start.

Looking at the map there is a small town called Sasabe right there at the refuge that they have closed off. What did they do with the people in the town? There has got to be a lot more to this story.

31 posted on 07/02/2010 8:13:59 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Steve Van Doorn

Sasabe: Population 130, border town. Who knows who or what runs the place.


32 posted on 07/02/2010 8:21:41 PM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids.)
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To: Lurker; Irish Eyes; donna
Arizona should play political games with the federal government. They could start by securing that 2.5 mile square area and claim that it is safe. Then the federal government will have to close a different area.

Work it like a shell game.. until the feds have to claim how much area is really closed off.

33 posted on 07/02/2010 8:24:49 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: donna
It would seem the area in question was closed in 2006 but crime has gone down in that area:
http://www.fws.gov/southwest/refuges/arizona/buenosaires/
34 posted on 07/02/2010 8:35:12 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Steve Van Doorn
but crime has gone down in that area

Reported crime has gone down.

35 posted on 07/02/2010 8:45:02 PM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids.)
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To: donna
i feel stupid sometimes. it is one of those DUH moments.

Of course crime has gone down no citizen are allowed to be in that area. So all crimes that do take place would be fatalities or as you said not reported.

36 posted on 07/02/2010 9:49:41 PM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Nachum
Jimbaro at The People's Cube writes:

This is a glorious brilliant move by the Dэaя Lэadэя, who has begun to relinquish American Soil to LA ЯAZA. That is the way to whittle America down to size, by yielding a few thousand acres at a time to drug lords and 'Coyotes' (the human traffickers of undocumented workэяs).

37 posted on 07/02/2010 9:55:00 PM PDT by Brugmansian
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To: Recovering Ex-hippie
Quit waiting for the government to save you because they will do little to nothing to stop the invasion. Not Obama, nor Brewer, nor many of the local sheriffs. It is up to the people to protect our country from this invasion.

There are American patriots currently working to secure this land which has been ceded to Mexico. Support them with supplies, money, and ,where feasible, manpower. We are conservatives, not liberals and we shouldn't be dependent on the government to do anything, not even that which it is required to do by law.
38 posted on 07/02/2010 10:22:37 PM PDT by Grandma Conservative (Quit settling for the lesser of two evils and support conservatives in the primaries.)
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To: Steve Van Doorn

Don’t feel stupid - they say it that way so people will accept it. I finally decided that I’m glad my mind doesn’t work that way. I’d rather get played now and then and retain my better outlook on life.


39 posted on 07/03/2010 12:02:53 AM PDT by donna (The fruits of Feminism: Angry fathers, bitter mothers, fat kids.)
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To: Steve Van Doorn
I vaguely recall that the destruction of Sasebe occurred around 1985 when the ranch was sold to the Feds for an exorbitant amount of money. About 11 million I think.

I believe a prominent Arizona family was involved in the transaction. The Pulliam newspaper gave it a lot of press and were opposed to the deal. Some people thought it was done to establish a drug route through Arizona because the border had no demarcation between Mexico and the States. Others thought it was to permit easy access for immigrants to cross the border unimpeded. Whatever the objective it seemed highly suspect.

The last stupid unenforced Immigration legislation was passed at approximately the same time. I think every legislator that signed that last bill who is still alive,either active or retired should lose their pension and the money should accrue to Arizona where it should be used to secure the border. In fact,I think all legislation which goes sour should result in the cancellation of the legislators' pensions. They might start paying attention to what they are doing.

40 posted on 07/03/2010 12:24:40 AM PDT by saradippity
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To: saradippity
They are part of the elites what would force them out of office?
The 'informed' public?

Why would the rich elites that own the papers and our news inform the public? What do they have to gain?

41 posted on 07/03/2010 1:34:47 AM PDT by Steve Van Doorn (*in my best Eric cartman voice* 'I love you guys')
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To: Grandma Conservative

your points are well taken and the whole thing is depressingly scairy and well, sad.


42 posted on 07/03/2010 5:23:06 AM PDT by Recovering Ex-hippie (Ok, joke's over....Bring back Bush !)
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To: Lurker

I think we are going to end up with another Mexican/American war before it is all said and done.


43 posted on 07/03/2010 6:17:59 AM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Tammy8

Please see post number 43.


44 posted on 07/03/2010 6:18:42 AM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Nachum; All

A border war in other words between the USA and Mexico. Please see posting number 45 as well.


45 posted on 07/03/2010 6:20:13 AM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Lurker

Well do not the governors have leadership over the NG? Just wondering.


46 posted on 07/03/2010 6:22:39 AM PDT by Biggirl (AZ Is DOING THE JOB The Feds Should Be Doing, ENFORCING The Southern Border! =^..^=)
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To: Biggirl

I agree, our government has allowed the border to get so bad- the only option to clean out the smugglers will be full military action.


47 posted on 07/03/2010 7:43:14 AM PDT by Tammy8 (~Secure the border and deport all illegals- do it now! ~ Support our Troops!~)
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To: Lion Den Dan
This is a heck of a lot mor than 3,500 acres as indicated by the Fed notification, It is way more than 35,000; perhaps 3,500,000.

That was just a sarcastic cartoon of what our AZ border is rapidly becoming.

The latest Hanas-like trick is the drug cartels predicting they will assassinate a Border Patrol agent on July 4th.

48 posted on 07/03/2010 9:31:20 AM PDT by Oatka ("A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves." –Bertrand de Jouvenel)
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To: Biggirl

Unfortunately, we’ll probably end up fighting “our” own government before we ever get around to dealing with Mexico.


49 posted on 07/03/2010 2:09:18 PM PDT by Grandma Conservative (Quit settling for the lesser of two evils and support conservatives in the primaries.)
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